Thaksin Poised To Become Adviser For Sri Lanka

[Sparkles]

I can't understand why Mugabe hasn't snapped him up as economic advisor in light of the shape Zimbabwe is in. Imagine the portfolio Khun Taksin could put together if he really made an effort

[geriatrickid]

Allegedly,the tamil Tiger terrorists laundered a large amount of its funds via Thailand. As well, many of the terrorists have hid out in Thailand. The current Thai government is going to be walking a thin line if it thinks it has any leverage with the current Sri Lankan government. ( I am not saying the Thai government helped the terrorists, just that the laws may not have been enforced effectively. Canada is in the same predicament as it is both a major source of funding and a place of refuge for the terrorists.)

When he becomes financial advisor to China or India, I will be really worried! I wonder what it costs to become a financial advisor to these countries? I have an MBA backed by twenty years corporate experience as financial manager in health care, real estate, and insurance industries...even a short stint in cruise industry, so I would have a lot to offer these developing countries BUT ALAS I HAVE NO POLITICAL CONNECTIONS NOR GREAT WEALTH TO SPREAD OR BRIBE WITH....

Key word is manager. If you had been an entrepreneur or had started successful companies or perhaps even been active in financial rehabilitation activities,you might have a chance.

Edited December 30, 2009 by geriatrickid

[rkidlad]

Love him or hate him you have to admire this guy, he is larger than life.

And the biggest thorn in the side of the current government by far.

A fossilized brontosuarus turd is larger than life too,

can't say i want it visiting me either.

He is motivated by 'appearances of being of great importance',

and is willing to spend foolishly to gain that appearance.

I was speaking to some very well educated chinese businessman in kuala lumpur and they said their network of friends followed the thaksin/PAD saga and that they actually backed thaksin more than this government as thaksin was more open and did alot more for the country and the poor and realised that problems were thai not blame on others like farang. Also they stated that PAD seemed to want thailand to be same as china with very strict human rights etc.. etc.. They actully felt the pad was no better than the BNP in england the only difference being BNP are racist working class <deleted> and PAD are middle class racist <deleted>. Would like to hear view of other nations in asia and not the usual farangs on here!

Ok this was just one group of businessman from china but maybe these feeling are more widespread???

Very strict on implementing human rights, or very strict on not?

[rainman]

Astonishing, just what is the motivation for this?

Maybe to make money? Or what is your motivation when you go to work in the morning?

I assume he's not working for free in either Sri Lanka or Cambodia.

Word on the street was that the weapons that were apprehended coming from North Korea were really heading to Sri Lanka. I kid you not. Scary. Simply Scary. Now this news....... Oh my.....

The only thing people should be scared of is your nonsense logic. Just because Thaksin works in Sri Lanka and an arms shipment went to Sri Lanka doesn't mean that they're connected. It's like connecting Robin Williams (the comedian) to drug trafficking - just because he visited Afghanistan and they happen to grow opium there. Do you see that your logic makes absolutely no sense?

Thaksin obviously has business skills that other countries want. He's providing a service and gets paid in return (I would think). There's no conspiracy. Move on people.

Edited December 30, 2009 by rainman

[elcent]

Love him or hate him you have to admire this guy, he is larger than life.

And the biggest thorn in the side of the current government by far.

A fossilized brontosuarus turd is larger than life too,

can't say i want it visiting me either.

He is motivated by 'appearances of being of great importance',

and is willing to spend foolishly to gain that appearance.

I was speaking to some very well educated chinese businessman in kuala lumpur and they said their network of friends followed the thaksin/PAD saga and that they actually backed thaksin more than this government as thaksin was more open and did alot more for the country and the poor and realised that problems were thai not blame on others like farang. Also they stated that PAD seemed to want thailand to be same as china with very strict human rights etc.. etc.. They actully felt the pad was no better than the BNP in england the only difference being BNP are racist working class <deleted> and PAD are middle class racist <deleted>. Would like to hear view of other nations in asia and not the usual farangs on here!

Ok this was just one group of businessman from china but maybe these feeling are more widespread???

Very strict on implementing human rights, or very strict on not?

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs under Kasit still shows the 1997 constitution on it's website. Nothing mentioned about about a change, lol http://www.mfa.go.th/web/24.php - enjoy

[rainman]

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs under Kasit still shows the 1997 constitution on it's website. Nothing mentioned about about a change, lol http://www.mfa.go.th/web/24.php - enjoy

You can't hang around airports and update your website at the same time!

May as well link the new constitution to the Disney.com website.

[Publicus]

Love him or hate him you have to admire this guy, he is larger than life.

And the biggest thorn in the side of the current government by far.

A fossilized brontosuarus turd is larger than life too,

can't say i want it visiting me either.

He is motivated by 'appearances of being of great importance',

and is willing to spend foolishly to gain that appearance.

I was speaking to some very well educated chinese businessman in kuala lumpur and they said their network of friends followed the thaksin/PAD saga and that they actually backed thaksin more than this government as thaksin was more open and did alot more for the country and the poor and realised that problems were thai not blame on others like farang. Also they stated that PAD seemed to want thailand to be the same as china with very strict human rights etc.. etc.. They actully felt the pad was no better than the BNP in england the only difference being BNP are racist working class <deleted> and PAD are middle class racist <deleted>. Would like to hear view of other nations in asia and not the usual farangs on here!

Ok this was just one group of businessman from china but maybe these feeling are more widespread???

Very strict on implementing human rights, or very strict on not?

There are only one kind of strict human rights in the PRC. Absolutely prohibited.

The poster relates that the PRChinese businessmen considered the PAD "no better than the BNP in england [sic]" which is pretty clear since the poster relates the PRChinese businessmen's view of the BNP as "racist working class <deleted> and the PAD middle class racist <deleted>." Racist BNP working class "<deleted>" would not have human rights as their strong suit either. (No doubt the poster added some of his own choice words to the statements by the PRChinese businessmen.)

Either way, I don't think there's any doubt as to the meaning here.

[elcent]

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs under Kasit still shows the 1997 constitution on it's website. Nothing mentioned about about a change, lol http://www.mfa.go.th/web/24.php - enjoy

You can't hang around airports and update your website at the same time!

May as well link the new constitution to the Disney.com website.

quote of the last day in 2009

[britadders28]

[

Very strict on implementing human rights, or very strict on not?

There are only one kind of strict human rights in the PRC. Absolutely prohibited.

The poster relates that the PRChinese businessmen considered the PAD "no better than the BNP in england [sic]" which is pretty clear since the poster relates the PRChinese businessmen's view of the BNP as "racist working class <deleted> and the PAD middle class racist <deleted>." Racist BNP working class "<deleted>" would not have human rights as their strong suit either. (No doubt the poster added some of his own choice words to the statements by the PRChinese businessmen.)

Either way, I don't think there's any doubt as to the meaning here.

Sorry for the confusion was trying to do too many things at same time as well as only receiving a free education!! I meant very strict rules and no human rights or no strict human rights, whichever way you want to look at it and where i come from <deleted> can mean ignorant, stupid any many other things in different context or of course george bush if you can work that out as dont like to use real swear words here!!!!!!

Yes did use my own words maybe they used xenophobic and racist, oh and they were not living in china, live in KL!!

[Publicus]

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs under Kasit still shows the 1997 constitution on it's website. Nothing mentioned about about a change, lol http://www.mfa.go.th/web/24.php - enjoy

You can't hang around airports and update your website at the same time!

May as well link the new constitution to the Disney.com website.

quote of the last day in 2009

You guys quite crack yourselves up, which is allowed on New Year's Eve. 

Gotta agree the Disney.com thing does at least crack a smile when read.   

[trogers]

Looks like Sri Lanka is going to have a new popular name for boys - Thathilak Shingram

[SpoliaOpima]

Wonder what he's advising on? IF insurgency, he failed miserably in Thailand's case and in fact did everything he could to destablise the situation in the south, after it had gradually been calmed by strategies put in place by Gen Prem and maintained by every PM until Thaksin.

If on economics, I supposed he will deliver the same message as he did in Cambodia:

"After failing at every business I tried to establish, I finally found the secret of economic success. Marry the national police chief's daughter, establish a telecom monopoly through ministry connections and hold on to it until everyone wises up. Then get out of Dodge as fast as you can."

[airplane]

One by one countries rally around the man slapping the faces of the elite. It's a beautiful morning to be alive!

[caf]

Love him or hate him you have to admire this guy, he is larger than life.

And the biggest thorn in the side of the current government by far.

A fossilized brontosuarus turd is larger than life too,

can't say i want it visiting me either.

He is motivated by 'appearances of being of great importance',

and is willing to spend foolishly to gain that appearance.

I was speaking to some very well educated chinese businessman in kuala lumpur and they said their network of friends followed the thaksin/PAD saga and that they actually backed thaksin more than this government as thaksin was more open and did alot more for the country and the poor and realised that problems were thai not blame on others like farang. Also they stated that PAD seemed to want thailand to be same as china with very strict human rights etc.. etc.. They actully felt the pad was no better than the BNP in england the only difference being BNP are racist working class <deleted> and PAD are middle class racist <deleted>. Would like to hear view of other nations in asia and not the usual farangs on here!

Ok this was just one group of businessman from china but maybe these feeling are more widespread???

I was in KL recently and there certainly is an undercurrent of feeling that Thailand should grow up and deal with its problems rather than blame the farang or Thaksin as automatic responses. A feeling also that the Thai will never take resonsibilty for his action. I am not saying that there is no corruption in Malaysia but it is Thailand's biggest problem and the cause of its many other ills. And what is being done ?

[Dakhar]

When he becomes financial advisor to China or India, I will be really worried! I wonder what it costs to become a financial advisor to these countries? I have an MBA backed by twenty years corporate experience as financial manager in health care, real estate, and insurance industries...even a short stint in cruise industry, so I would have a lot to offer these developing countries BUT ALAS I HAVE NO POLITICAL CONNECTIONS NOR GREAT WEALTH TO SPREAD OR BRIBE WITH....

Yea, and you are missing the doctorate degree along with real experience of running a country....

MBA's think they are qualified for everything..... including surgery

[Dakhar]

One by one countries rally around the man slapping the faces of the elite. It's a beautiful morning to be alive!

agree

[Dakhar]

Love him or hate him you have to admire this guy, he is larger than life.

And the biggest thorn in the side of the current government by far.

A fossilized brontosuarus turd is larger than life too,

can't say i want it visiting me either.

He is motivated by 'appearances of being of great importance',

and is willing to spend foolishly to gain that appearance.

I was speaking to some very well educated chinese businessman in kuala lumpur and they said their network of friends followed the thaksin/PAD saga and that they actually backed thaksin more than this government as thaksin was more open and did alot more for the country and the poor and realised that problems were thai not blame on others like farang. Also they stated that PAD seemed to want thailand to be same as china with very strict human rights etc.. etc.. They actully felt the pad was no better than the BNP in england the only difference being BNP are racist working class <deleted> and PAD are middle class racist <deleted>. Would like to hear view of other nations in asia and not the usual farangs on here!

Ok this was just one group of businessman from china but maybe these feeling are more widespread???

I was in KL recently and there certainly is an undercurrent of feeling that Thailand should grow up and deal with its problems rather than blame the farang or Thaksin as automatic responses. A feeling also that the Thai will never take resonsibilty for his action. I am not saying that there is no corruption in Malaysia but it is Thailand's biggest problem and the cause of its many other ills. And what is being done ?

Doubly agree, and nothing is being done.... it is the Thai way.

[geriatrickid]

Wonder what he's advising on? IF insurgency, he failed miserably in Thailand's case and in fact did everything he could to destablise the situation in the south, after it had gradually been calmed by strategies put in place by Gen Prem and maintained by every PM until Thaksin.

Unfortunately the facts and history are quite different from your claim. Your position assumes that the governments all had control over the military and that the military followed orders. I believe that with the exception of the recent military junta that ran Thailand, the military has followed its own strategy in the south. It doesn't matter if it was Thaksin or Abhisit, the army decides. I don't think you have much to go on if you are going to argue that the army listens to the civilian government as the army says it answers to a higher power. I suggest you read up on that.

Mr. Thaksin's role will be to assist in the rebuilding of a battered nation and to deliver social services to a battered population. Based upon his past actions in Thailand, I think he knows a thing or to about building support amongst the poor, which is what the Sri Lankan government needs to do now. As well, he has business contacts that will not be influenced by the hypocritical EU stance on Sri Lanka. The European position on terrorism has been to kiss ass, pay ransoms and beg & plead. The only nation that had the backbone to stand up to terrorists was the UK and even then that had to be tempered because of the terrorist supporters ethnic populations in the UK.Sri Lanka has lived for decades with the horrors of the Tamil Tigers during which time the EU did little to help. Today, the EU has threatened sanctions and economic punishments. In order for a deprived Sri Lanka to survive it must reach out to alternative assistance. Once again, the west cowers in fear of its tamil populations and China moves in along with others to build a strategic ally.

[brahmburgers]

Is this the same Thaksin who made promises of great wealth generation to Nicaragua, a few west African states, at least one Pacific island, Montenegro, and Cambodia - in exchange for investing tubs of his personal money? Incidentally, the gambler known as Thaksin recently lost bucketfuls on oil investments that went sour - and is world renown for filching on paying taxes - the same Thaksin who purports to be an economic guru.

The main reason these countries, including Sri Lanka, are playing chums with Thaksin is they hope he and at least parts of his family might choose to set up a base, or keep a mansion there. A rich person residing in a country means lots of money getting spent, and that money circulates.

For decades, the US has had an open door policy for despots for the same reason. The rich guy and his entourage bring beaucoup money and spend it lavishly.

[Dakhar]

Wonder what he's advising on? IF insurgency, he failed miserably in Thailand's case and in fact did everything he could to destablise the situation in the south, after it had gradually been calmed by strategies put in place by Gen Prem and maintained by every PM until Thaksin.

Unfortunately the facts and history are quite different from your claim. Your position assumes that the governments all had control over the military and that the military followed orders. I believe that with the exception of the recent military junta that ran Thailand, the military has followed its own strategy in the south. It doesn't matter if it was Thaksin or Abhisit, the army decides. I don't think you have much to go on if you are going to argue that the army listens to the civilian government as the army says it answers to a higher power. I suggest you read up on that.

Mr. Thaksin's role will be to assist in the rebuilding of a battered nation and to deliver social services to a battered population. Based upon his past actions in Thailand, I think he knows a thing or to about building support amongst the poor, which is what the Sri Lankan government needs to do now. As well, he has business contacts that will not be influenced by the hypocritical EU stance on Sri Lanka. The European position on terrorism has been to kiss ass, pay ransoms and beg & plead. The only nation that had the backbone to stand up to terrorists was the UK and even then that had to be tempered because of the terrorist supporters ethnic populations in the UK.Sri Lanka has lived for decades with the horrors of the Tamil Tigers during which time the EU did little to help. Today, the EU has threatened sanctions and economic punishments. In order for a deprived Sri Lanka to survive it must reach out to alternative assistance. Once again, the west cowers in fear of its tamil populations and China moves in along with others to build a strategic ally.

Got to say AMEN with you on that one GK. I wish him the best, and as Thailands neighbors progress, who is Thailand going to blame? Pretty soon, I will not be able to afford Cambodian maids!!! I wish him all the best.

[Scott]

Please stay on topic.

[beammeup]

He could teach those countries a thing or 2 about vote buying.

[dacron]

Daily Mirror (Sri Lanka)

December 31, 2009

Thaksin to come as adviser to Lanka?

The Sri Lankan government is preparing to appoint former Prime Minister of Thailand Thaksin Shinawatra its economic adviser, another former Prime Minister of Thailand Somchai Wongsawat was quoted as saying by the Bangkok Post.

Somchai, Thaksin's brother-in-law had said that the Thai government should not worry about the appointment because Thaksin's role as adviser to Sri Lanka, as well as to Cambodia, would do no harm to Thailand.

The news report comes amidst claims that Thaksin is seeking asylum in Sri Lanka. (See Daily Mirror of 30.12.09)

Political observers say that KP’s arrest soon after the news report of the former Prime Minister Thaksin seeking political asylum in Sri Lanka, may be two connected events.

Thailand government adheres to stringent policies as regards countries, which are providing political asylum to Thaksin. Because of this, finding political asylum for Thaksin is a complicated issue, they say.

Thaksin has already been appointed economic adviser to the Cambodian government and Prime Minister Hun Sen.

Sri Lanka is one of the countries where Thaksin was reported to have visited while on the run after being sentenced to a two-year jail term in the Ratchadapisek land case, the Bangkok Post said.

Thaksin entered politics in 1994 and founded the populist Thai Rak Thai (TRT) party in 1998. After a landslide election victory in 2001, he became prime minister, the country’s first to serve a full term. Thaksin introduced a range of partly effective and highly popular policies to alleviate rural poverty.

The Shinawatra government also faced allegations of corruption, authoritarianism, treason, conflicts of interest, acting non-diplomatically, and muzzling of the press. Thaksin was accused of tax evasion, lèse majesté and selling national assets to international investors. Independent bodies, including Amnesty International, criticized Thaksin's human rights record.

In April 2009, Thaksin-supported protests by the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship against the Abhisit Vejjajiva government, demanding Thaksin be allowed to return free from all the earlier corruption charges

On 21 October 2008, the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Positions ruled that Thaksin, while prime minister, abused his power to help his wife buy public land at auction, and sentenced him to two years in jail.

Thaksin had reportedly considered sanctuaries such as China, the Bahamas, Nicaragua, and several other countries in South America and Africa. Reports said the Shinawatras were granted Bahamas honorary citizenship and Nicaragua honorary citizenship and was building a £5.5 million home in China.

Last month, Thaksin Shinawatra had been appointed a special advisor to the Cambodian government and to Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen. Cambodian state television said Cambodia would refuse to extradite Thaksin because it considered him a victim of political persecution, despite his criminal conviction corruption charges.

On 5 November 2009, Thailand recalled its ambassador from Cambodia in protest. Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva stated this was the "the first diplomatic retaliation measure".

He said Cambodia was interfering in Thailand's internal affairs and as a result all bilateral cooperation agreements would be reviewed. The mutual withdrawal of ambassadors is the most severe diplomatic action to have occurred between the two countries.

When Daily Mirror spoke to Deputy Finance Minister Dr. Sarath Amunugama about the Bangkok Post report, the Minister said he is not aware of any such move.

“I don’t know about such a move” he said adding that “such a move would be unlikely taking into consideration his background.”

[Publicus]

Wonder what he's advising on? IF insurgency, he failed miserably in Thailand's case and in fact did everything he could to destablise the situation in the south, after it had gradually been calmed by strategies put in place by Gen Prem and maintained by every PM until Thaksin.

Unfortunately the facts and history are quite different from your claim. Your position assumes that the governments all had control over the military and that the military followed orders. I believe that with the exception of the recent military junta that ran Thailand, the military has followed its own strategy in the south. It doesn't matter if it was Thaksin or Abhisit, the army decides. I don't think you have much to go on if you are going to argue that the army listens to the civilian government as the army says it answers to a higher power. I suggest you read up on that.

Mr. Thaksin's role will be to assist in the rebuilding of a battered nation and to deliver social services to a battered population. Based upon his past actions in Thailand, I think he knows a thing or to about building support amongst the poor, which is what the Sri Lankan government needs to do now. As well, he has business contacts that will not be influenced by the hypocritical EU stance on Sri Lanka. The European position on terrorism has been to kiss ass, pay ransoms and beg & plead. The only nation that had the backbone to stand up to terrorists was the UK and even then that had to be tempered because of the terrorist supporters ethnic populations in the UK.Sri Lanka has lived for decades with the horrors of the Tamil Tigers during which time the EU did little to help. Today, the EU has threatened sanctions and economic punishments. In order for a deprived Sri Lanka to survive it must reach out to alternative assistance. Once again, the west cowers in fear of its tamil populations and China moves in along with others to build a strategic ally.

India's equivocating over Sri Lanka has come to its end as India now finds the island nation on its front doorstep dominated by the PRC to include a well underway strong PRC naval presence as well as another strong PRC naval presence being established in Burma. India now will exert pressure against PRC sponsored economic development in Sri Lanka but, more importantly, has a population of Sri Lankan Tamil immigrants and refugees who are demanding action against the Sri Lankan government.

With the Tamil operations in Thailand now severely curtailed thanks apparently to Dr. Thaksin, India now will be more open to becoming an active center of Tamil resistance against the PRC supported government. In a modification of PRC policy, the PRC is trying to court India but only to try to get India to its side in negotiations and other dealings with the US, an approach that bore some fruit at Copenhagen. However, India's now beginning to feel hemmed in by an encircling PRC because, among other factors, the PRC leadership are also great pals of the ayatollahs of Iran who constantly are trying to create problems among the many Muslims in India.

If Thaksin's going to help bring business and economic development to Sri Lanka, he's going to have to do it in conjunction with the PRC and he's going to have to reach out to the sort of business operatives few respectable governments want. 

[geriatrickid]

To Publicus comment I would add, please remember that India and China have had border conflicts in the past, so there is the potential friction. However, I do not share the doom and gloom of Publicus in respect to the PRC. I suggest that Mr. Thaksin might even be able to bridge the gap between India and China. Both India and China face a problem arising from a certain religious group. When there is a common interest they can act together, as was demonstrated by the blocking of progress at the climate talks. It can be argued that India's decision to crack down on the Tamil Tigers in India helped turn the tide of war on Sri Lanka. Remember that that the Tamil Tigers have killed Indian officials and tried to set up a state within a state in India. Mr. Thaksin does have contacts with the highest levels of the indian government and it is worth mentioning that India did not approve of the military coup that toppled the democratically elected government of Mr. Thaksin. India has its flaws but it is the world's largest functioning democracy with little love for military coups.

The current Sri Lankan government was elected. It may not be to our liking and the leadership may be borderline despot, but it is a legitimate government. Unfortunately, the military and the government are joined at the hip. Sri Lanka had previously depended upon Indian assistance in many way and had to play nice with India. If Mr. Thaksin can bring in an alternative like China, it does alter the balance of power, so yes indeed I can see why some Indians will feel nervous. However, at the end of the day, I have a hunch the Sri Lankans will leverage the Chinese to get more out of India. When it comes to business dealings, the Indians will look the other way, as is demonstrated by India being one of the largest investors in Burma, despite international sanctions.

Profits can make even hostile neighbours become amorous bedmates.

[george]

Update:

Sri Lanka not aware of plan to appoint Thaksin as adviser

Sri Lanka on Thursday denied a report that the government planned to appoint fugitive ex-Thai PM Thaksin Shinawatra as an economic adviser.

Thaksin's brother-in-law Somchai Wongsawat claimed on Wednesday that Colombo will name Thaksin as an adviser to the government.

Colombo-based Daily Mirror online quoted Sri Lanka's Deputy Finance Minister Sarath Amunugama as saying that he is not aware of any such move.

-- The Nation 2009-12-31

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[dacron]

Gosh... who could have imagined. The PR machine churned out a lie. That's never happened before.

[caf]

Wonder what he's advising on? IF insurgency, he failed miserably in Thailand's case and in fact did everything he could to destablise the situation in the south, after it had gradually been calmed by strategies put in place by Gen Prem and maintained by every PM until Thaksin.

Unfortunately the facts and history are quite different from your claim. Your position assumes that the governments all had control over the military and that the military followed orders. I believe that with the exception of the recent military junta that ran Thailand, the military has followed its own strategy in the south. It doesn't matter if it was Thaksin or Abhisit, the army decides. I don't think you have much to go on if you are going to argue that the army listens to the civilian government as the army says it answers to a higher power. I suggest you read up on that.

Mr. Thaksin's role will be to assist in the rebuilding of a battered nation and to deliver social services to a battered population. Based upon his past actions in Thailand, I think he knows a thing or to about building support amongst the poor, which is what the Sri Lankan government needs to do now. As well, he has business contacts that will not be influenced by the hypocritical EU stance on Sri Lanka. The European position on terrorism has been to kiss ass, pay ransoms and beg & plead. The only nation that had the backbone to stand up to terrorists was the UK and even then that had to be tempered because of the terrorist supporters ethnic populations in the UK.Sri Lanka has lived for decades with the horrors of the Tamil Tigers during which time the EU did little to help. Today, the EU has threatened sanctions and economic punishments. In order for a deprived Sri Lanka to survive it must reach out to alternative assistance. Once again, the west cowers in fear of its tamil populations and China moves in along with others to build a strategic ally.

Your very perceptive post shows you are far from being geriatric.

If thaksin sticks with social reforms and humane help, all to the good

The worry is any political involvement particularly with China hovering around

Have sanctions ever worked? The Uk can not go it alone. Given the possible future scenarios this is an area that europe and america could and should sensibly get concerned about. ( and i dont mean militarily)

[animatic]

Gosh... who could have imagined. The PR machine churned out a lie. That's never happened before.

Welcome perceptive newbie!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Gosh... who could have imagined. The PR machine churned out a lie. That's never happened before.

Catch yer later Jacko.