Thaksin Refused £20million In Tsunami Relief Aid

[Andrew K Fletcher]

Did you know that Thaksin has refused £20 Million in Tsunami aid, which should have been destined for the Tsunami survivors? Thaksin said: We do not want the world to think we have a bad economy and we can look after our own people.

The programme then went on to show how the Thai Government has handed out their own form of aid, ranging from £30 - £100. They have refused to offer any assistance to those requiring structural building work, and the programme mentioned that Thaksin and Co was actively removing or causing to be removed the people that live and work on Phi Phi in order to offer the prime coastal land for the development of high-rise hotels.

Many of the people were forced to abandon their businesses, and despite losing everything they owned, they were being pursued by the banks for the loans they took out prior to the wave, and forced to take menial work in Bangkok.

They also mentioned, that The charities have failed to mention that Thailand has refused the £20 million offered. This is perhaps even more disconcerting than Thailand refusing the aid, as I suspect much of the donated money is already being siphoned off by people hiding behind charitable status.

Talk about opportunism riding on the backs of the already downtrodden!

1:55 Surviving The Wave: A Thailand Story

Documentary about the aftermath of the Boxing Day tsunami by TV producer Amanda Murray, who was on the island of Koh Lanta when the disaster struck. While she escaped unscathed the neighbouring island of Koh Phi Phi was decimated, and 1,500 people died. The film follows a collection of Thais and foreigners as they attempt to put the tragedy behind them and rebuild their lives

http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/tv/surviving_the_wave.shtml

Documentaries & ArtsSurviving the Wave: A Thailand Story

Television producer Amanda Murray was caught up in the catastrophic events of 26th December 2004 while holidaying on the paradise Thai island of Koh Lanta. Surviving the Wave: A Thailand Story is her personal account of the tsunami tragedy, exploring the human side of the event and its ongoing aftermath.

The film follows a handful of Thais and foreigners who survived the disaster. We see what the future really holds for them once the cameras have gone and media interest has faded. As the long-term recovery process begins to unfold, we hear how their feelings swing between optimism and despair.There has been much coverage of the huge scale of the tsunami and its destructive force; this documentary looks at the tragedy at a much more intimate level, putting a human scale on the sometimes incomprehensible statistics.Moving between the neighbouring islands of Koh Lanta and Koh Phi Phi on the west coast of Thailand, we see how the aftermath of the disaster threatens the survival of both communities in entirely different ways.

Koh LantaBoth islands rely on tourism to survive but in Lanta, where the journey begins, it looks like the tourist season is over before it has even started. Lanta is right in the middle of the disaster zone but, despite being in the path of the wave, it was spared much of the horrendous devastation that was suffered by Phi Phi. In a matter of days the island is back on its feet... but the streets are empty of tourists.After a mass exodus in the first 24 hours, the international media and foreign offices do nothing to help the situation and, despite local protests, the advice is to stay away.How will the locals survive? When should tourists return? What can the locals do to get them back? And are there alternative ways of providing aid?

Koh Phi PhiFor Phi Phi, made famous by Hollywood's The Beach, it’s a tragically different story – this massively overdeveloped but beautiful island was decimated. The loss of life reached well over 1000 and the islanders immediately evacuated. Here is a story of displacement and opportunism. Many of the survivors have lost family and friends and most have lost their businesses but nearly all want to return as soon as possible. But with the infrastructure destroyed and a lack of clarity in the government plan for rebuilding, the islanders are forced further apart as they search for new ways to make a living.Will the big businesses move in? Will the islanders ever be able to go back? What is being done to support people who’ve lost everything? And when will Phi Phi re-open for business?

[udon]

Typical Toxin, it'all about (his) FACE.

Old news though.

[The_Eye_Of_Sauron]

Thaksin has since won a landslide election victory with an electorate who approved of his handling of the tsunami.

His Goverment has to handle the problems of poverty, drought, health, education and ethnic reconciliation around the rest of the country.

The problems of those affected by the tsunami are regrettable nonethless, and we thank you for your concern, which has been duly noted.

[udon]

An educated population would never have voted for him.

An educated population is considered dangerous in this neck of the jungles.

[Nickerelastic]

I saw the above mentioned documentary and was shocked to discover The Thai government refused international aid.

The generosity of folk here in Scotland and elsewhere in the world was astounding. people are still donating.

That money raised was for the people of Thailand affected by the Tsunami, one wonder what has happened to the millions of pounds which has been raised.

[Andrew K Fletcher]

This is exactly why I did not give a single penny to any charity for the Tsunami victims! I knew what was going to happen to the money! The same as happened to the missing Oxfam Millions in India! The locals did get some plastic sheets to waterproof their roof, and it did have oxfam printed in bold on it, but it did not quite cut it for me.

I did give my son some money to give to people directly affected, and so did other friends and family!

I detest charities that line their own pockets, but what goes around comes around. Khama

[The_Moog]

My ex-Business Partner in Indonesia stole all the Turkish tsunami donations to Aceh.

His wife now shopping for jewels in Plaza Indonesia.

bagus bagusnya !

[Nickerelastic]

The Tsunami had a profound effect on the generosity of ordinary people. Individuals are still going to great effort to raise money. My son "he lives on Switzerland" is at this moment jumping through beaurocratic hoops trying to set up a small aid charity.

I noticed in the docu' one belgian guy managed to organise aid directly to villagers. Even whilst typing this I feel deeply saddened that those who suffered are not being given all the financial support which is available.

[The_Moog]

The Tsunami had a profound effect on the generosity of ordinary people. Individuals are still going to great effort to raise money.

Please send money direct to my ex business partner in Jakarta, who really was a crook, whilst telling me ad infinitum how honest he was.

Tank you velly velly much.

[Nickerelastic]

]Please send money direct to my ex business partner in Jakarta, who really was a crook, whilst telling me ad infinitum how honest he was.

Tank you velly velly much.

[roscoe]

Most, not all though,of these guys raiseing money for charity in the west are paid

by results .Which could be described as laudable,as it encourages them to to raise as much as possible for the nominated charity.

However you can almost see the gleam in their eyes as a disaster happens ,more fund raiseing,higher gross receipts=larger paypacket+larger pension contributions.

And yet they still sleep well and are lauded by the great and good, on behalf of the rest of us?

Come back Rob Roy ,Ned Kelly,Billy the Kid ect.At least they were honest about it.

[Nickerelastic]

Most, not all though,of these guys raiseing money for charity in the west are paid

by results .Which could be described as laudable,as it encourages them to to raise as much as possible for the nominated charity.

I agree. However my son is just an ordinary Joe Blogs, who, feels, as he is living in a very rich western country and is also a migrant worker. He should make the effort to help the Tsunami victims.

In this instance I'm talking about the fundraising efforts of ordinary everyday people.

[Mr Helper]

Where the money has gone............

Maybe this could be the clue. Sitting in Brazil watching BBC world's 'HardTalk', back in March, they had, I think, was the interior Minister from Sir Lanka. He stated on the show his disapointment at the UN, and Unicef, and some Major World Charities, that when all the money was collected in, they sat on it in the bank, and still were sitting on at least 80% of the money donated, and wern't going to distribute it until 1st May!!! He protested about all the millions, hundereds of millions that had been donated by people all over the world, yet these organisations were just sitting on all the cash, in high intrest accounts. The laws regarding charitys, are that they only have to distribute a percentage of the cash (in the UK that is 30%) that was donated to the cause, and they can keep if they want, the intrest earned in accounts!!! Many charitys are huge profitable businesses!

It would seem that some people/companys have got considerably wealthy through the Tsunami

Edited June 15, 2005 by Mr Helper

[opothai]

An educated population would never have voted for him.

An educated population is considered dangerous in this neck of the jungles.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

one 100% agree

on the subject of charity monies, in the uk i run a joinery business.

8 to 9 years ago we were carrying out some refurb work on the oxfam buildings in oxford [and prime real estate at that] now 2 years ago we were invited to tender for the joinery works on their brand new offices in oxford [cowley business park]

brand new building state of the art, cost ,muti millions of pounds

how many more buildings do they own ? and how many paid staff to operate these prestegious charitable establishments.

BUT most important in my eyes who is accountable for the distribution of any funds ?

[Duelscreen]

Thaksin said: We do not want the world to think we have a bad economy and we can look after our own people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Funny considering that the 90% of Thailand's 'tsunami relief' cash (that didn't line people's pockets) went towards rebuilding tourist beaches and resorts rather than individual families. That seems to me like the economy needed more help than the people.

Don't believe me- take a stroll down Patong Beach followed by a trip to the dozens of 'temporary housing' villages in the Khao Laak area alone. Good thing Thaksin turned down that money; wouldn't want people thinking the government couldn't "look after their own people." They could; they just choose not to.

[greenwanderer108]

Good For Thaksin in not accepting 'government to government' charity!! There is no such thing actually. Everything has political implications.

I don't necesarrily agree everything with Thaksin on post-Tsunami reactions, but I also don't agree with 95 percent of the rest of the world. You guys want to poor all this money into rebuilding everything like it was before the fact---resorts, hotels

Dirty tourism that didn't give a spluck about nature and her resources. That goes for the money keeping the backbone of tourism up. How much of this money is coming from War profits direct/indirect.

Everyone is worried about warning systems and grand memorials, which in reality only address symptoms to the real problem and is missing the point.

Noone seems to have got the true message behind such a disaster. Nature's message. If they truly did, have we stopped raping the earth's resources...wars over oil---plastic bags, foam containers, etcs. Has human consumption of the world's resources changed at all for the better since December 26???

Rebuild your resorts, even stronger and higher! Launder millions/billions into the pockets of whoever, it doesn't make a difference. What we saw last day after Christmas was only a sneeze of her sickness. Eventually, the virus will spread and either she herself will colapse and with her we must go, or she will vaccinate and cure herself from this multiplying cancer....aka overpopulation.

If you think what happened was big in the Andaman seas nearly seven months pass, I am willing to bet that at our rate, we will see even bigger 5 to 10 fold atleast before the century has completed. And as humans deserve it. Hopefully, next time nature will be more selective and suprising paralyzing humans ability to transfer funds/draw borders!!!!

[TokyoT]

&lt;deleted&gt; are you smokn’, and strum a few bars of Kumbaya for us if you will.

Dirty tourism that didn't give a spluck about nature and her resources. That goes for the money keeping the backbone of tourism up. How much of this money is coming from War profits direct/indirect.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

War profits – I assume -and correct me if I am wrong- you are referring to recent US actions. Last time I checked we were not exactly rollin’ in the dough due to the military actions/ wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Everyone is worried about warning systems and grand memorials, which in reality only address symptoms to the real problem and is missing the point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Warning systems miss the point? I beg to differ. The real problem is that too many people died because of a natural disaster. A proper warning system can significantly reduce the number of lives lost – and this misses the point? It might miss your point. But I do not think it misses the main point.

Noone seems to have got the true message behind such a disaster. Nature's message. If they truly did, have we stopped raping the earth's resources...wars over oil---plastic bags, foam containers, etcs. Has human consumption of the world's resources changed at all for the better since December 26???

Rebuild your resorts, even stronger and higher! Launder millions/billions into the pockets of whoever, it doesn't make a difference. What we saw last day after Christmas was only a sneeze of her sickness. Eventually, the virus will spread and either she herself will colapse and with her we must go, or she will vaccinate and cure herself from this multiplying cancer....aka overpopulation.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How can a reduction in human consumption of the worlds resourses possibly prevent a tsunami?

Do you really think that if we all stopped using oil, plastic bags, foam products, etc., we could possibly have an effect on the number of tsunamis caused by earthquakes? Not unless we are disturbing a fault line in the drilling. Or somehow shifting the balance of the tectonic plates by where we pile our trash.

Then you role right into over population – so maybe where we live is causing the shifting of the tectonic plates?

If you think what happened was big in the Andaman seas nearly seven months pass, I am willing to bet that at our rate, we will see even bigger 5 to 10 fold atleast before the century has completed. And as humans deserve it. Hopefully, next time nature will be more selective and suprising paralyzing humans ability to transfer funds/draw borders!!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Willing to bet there will be a bigger one before the century is complete. Well now that is a pretty bold bet. Especially considering the century just freakn’ started.

All this green talk about mother earth – I am certainly not against an increased awareness and implementation of conservation. But does mother earth give a crap? H*ll no – right now we can pump her dry of every bit of oil, completely pollute the atmosphere to an unbreathable point and mother earth would still continue her timeless journey around the sun. We humans would be long gone but mother earth would not miss us in the least.

And do you really believe mother earth/ mother nature/ mother who ever consciously made the decision to rattle a couple of plates together, cause a big fukcn’ wave and kill also those people because we are abusing the natural recourses of the planet?

Expounding on things in this manner will never convince people to better utilize the recourses of this planet. Logical, thought provoking dialoged can.

[greenwanderer108]

Actually Tokyo T, this Tsunami and its dammage/effects are inter related with human actions in the cycle of life. Directly/indirectly. I will provide one direct example here in this post.

For example, Kao Lak area (and most of Phanga coast) was vulnerable for disaster for the fact that many of it's natural defenses against coastal flooding/ tidal waves were depleated over the past century i.e. mangrove deforesting/mining.

Here is a specific explanation of Phanga's vulnerability :

And now, when examining Takua Pa’s history of land use and economic development, the tsunami tragedy appears to be more than just another scar on this tainted landscape – it appears it might have been a result of that history.

For two centuries Takua Pa’s natural resources have been exploited to the extreme. Tin mining, mangrove logging and aquaculture have all affected the area’s shoreline defences, rendering tourism development more feasible, but at the same time, vulnerable.

In 1809, when Burmese troops raided Thalang (on Phuket island), its residents – many were tin miners – were forced to migrate north. Many settled in the quiet port town of Takua Pa to continue the tin trade. King Rama V (1868-1910) further stimulated mining activities by allowing the free-flow of Chinese labour into the Kingdom.

Extraction accelerated in the 1960s along with growth in the export economy, and new government concessions granted to foreign companies to mine in the sea.

Thousands of locals flocked to the tiny seaside village of Ban Nam Khem, transforming it into a miner’s ghetto. Of the 1,149 locals who perished during the tsunami in Phang Nga, most were mineworkers and their families who stayed behind after the end of the mining era.

By the 1980s, the tin was gone, leaving barren land at the beachfronts and destroyed reefs in the bays. Meanwhile, the mangrove concessions were handed out to loggers from the charcoal industry, further depleting the shore’s natural protection against erosion and storms.

In an area known for unpredictable tides and winds, such defences are valuable, as was illustrated by the more limited tsunami damage experienced in some of the more naturally intact coastal areas of Phuket, Phang Nga and Ranong.

“Many communities survived because there were still mangrove forests to provide natural defences,” says Piphob Vasuvanich, deputy director of the Coastal Resources Department. “There are no casualties from these areas.”

This was taken from here

For the entire google results on my instant search, check here

I need not get in a dogfight here, because there are plenty of other environmental studies to prove that are actions and mismanagement of world resources do directly/indirectly effect natural disasters and habitats/defenses to these.

I find it very ignorant for you to claim as you seem to be doing in your last post that there is no connection with the exploitation and mis/overuse of natural resources.

I'm not saying that the implimentation of a warning system is pointless, but obviously is only reactive measure to symptoms of an even bigger environmental problem.

Have you ever heard of the concept of global warming? Are you not aware that this has an effect on global weather patterns. Global temperatures also have a chain effect on sub-surface activity (dealing with the poles, gravitational pull, core temperatures, and energy release via volcanoes eruptions, plate tectonics, and other weather disaster patterns---there is enough material that will prove how plate tectonics is indirectly related to such factors as the earth's resources. What do you think causes plates to move? It's many factors surely, and you are a fool if you argue that Earth and the balance/imbalance of its resources is not related.

I'm no scientist but as the ol' saying goes, it doesn't take rocket science to figure it out. While you can attack me and/or my ideas about such a serious matter, it still doesn't justify our actions in the world. While ignorance is bliss, it doesn't change anything to act ignorant, when deep in your heart you know the real deal.

It's also funny that you are not aware of the billion dollar business of war actions in Iraq/Afganistan. Don't you remember the free world wide advertising the US military recieved of their latest missle technology during the bombing of Baghdad. Don't you think there's such a market for smaller countries around the world who wish to acquire such tech? Who's losing money? Tax payers, of course. But whenever did our 'democratic' process benefit the entire people. There's a few getting rich, and the benefits obviously don't get poured back into the people.

Before you go on to conclude that there isn't profitable business in iraq/afghanistan, you should do a quick research about GW and Sr.s family business ties with Saudi Arabia, particularly the Bin Ladens. Enron for starters. It doesn't end there certainly. You might be surprised to find out that an energy representative surveying the rigs in iraq has atleast twice the average salary as an active combat soldier on the same field. I don't need to go in to details, I'm sure if you want to prove anything, you'll do enough research to learn all this.

Here I've already started a google regarding war business/oil here

[TokyoT]

You see if you put a little effort behind it you can present an argument that provides real information rather than spouting “tree huggen” mumbo jumbo that does not help to convince anyone of anything. As I stated in my post and you have provided in your follow-up – logical, thought provoking dialogue can help.

In regard to people and businesses making money from war – of course, and many US and European defense companies turn a fat profit. And good old GW is certainly not some poor beggar man in his business dealings. Your post specifically outlines “government to government” money being declined. The US Government is not making money off the wars - some US people - yes, some US companies -yes, the US Government - no.

And yes I agree no need to turn anything into a dog fight. And while I do not agree with all of the points in your follow-up I certainly am in favor of the general concept. Environmentalism and conservation are important to the long term benefit of the human race.

[Dakhar]

"""You might be surprised to find out that an energy representative surveying the rigs in iraq has atleast twice the average salary as an active combat soldier on the same field."""

Nope not surprised, and I would hope so. Soldiers sign on for this type of life. Or do you think soldiering is just a chance to spend your life excersising/training recieving tons of benifits provided by the govt/tax payers, and not have to give back. If that is what soldiering is, sign me up!

[Duelscreen]

Greenwanderer,

Perhaps you've misunderstood my opinions, and you've certainly misconstrued them. If you somehow got from my post that I encourage to government to build hotels and resorts in the tsunami-hit areas then you must be blind, one-legged and mildly retarded. Though I personally think you've gone a bit overboard in your ideology that the tsunami was a direct result of people being disrespectful to the environment, I'm not going to trample all over your beliefs.

I do, however, think that the number one post-tsunami importance should be people- not the environment. Hence why I disagree with the way the government has handled 'tsunami relief' in the last 8 months. I mean, honestly, how can you say that tsunami warning measures are not neccesary whereas saving forests are? The only thing of real importance on this planet are the lives of the people living on it. If you start to care more about the planet itself than the people then you have got some serious issues.

To bring this whole argument back to the topic at hand, I do feel that Thaksin made a mistake, not neccesarily by not accepting foreign goverment aid, but by not ensuring that donated money helped individual people to rebuild their lives before focusing on resorts and hotels. I've worked in southern Thailand a lot since the tsunami and I've seen first hand how many people are depending on the government for help that they aren't planning on giving.

Forget oil-drilling, some issues are more important.

[Jai Dee]

Where have you been Duelscreen?

6 weeks between consecutive posts...

It's not very conversational hey?

[Andrew K Fletcher]

I believe our Green Wanderer is correct with regards to the removal of forests from the shores. The impact of the tsunami was there for everyone to see and yet, in forested regions of the coastline, it’s devastation was less apparent.

Why do you think we see flash floods following rain? This is because the trees have been removed inland, an their root systems no longer hold the soils together and soak up the heavy rains. The ground becomes devoid of moisture and when the rains do finally arrive, the water does not soak into the desiccated soils, but runs over the surface rapidly accelerated by the inclusion of roads, on its way to the cities and towns, for all to witness.

How many people did you see during the tsunami, saved by hanging onto a tree? This should be evidence enough that trees are able to survive such a force when all of mankind’s infrastructure is demolished by the same force.

Put into words a long long time ago by your’s truly.

When roads turn into rivers and people fall and die.

When the only growth is concrete, reaching for the sky.

Desert winds blowing, fan the mighty flame.

Forest but a memory, don't even have a name.

Ocean levels rising, stink of rotten fish,

No longer do they live here, or end up in our dish.

Seagulls feeding inland, dive upon the tips.

Pipelines belch out sewage, exposing tell-tale slicks

Now the oil stops flowing, and gushing from the floor,

And water is the reason for which we go to war.

Tankers held at ransom, await the highest prices,

Now the tides have turned and clean water is the crisis.

By Andrew K Fletcher

[Jai Dee]

I see you're back too Mr Fletcher.

Did you ever do anything about contacting the Thai government and airing those thoughts of yours on reforestation?

BTW, you wouldn't be related at all to Thomas Merton would you?

[Andrew K Fletcher]

I tried and failed as usual, but there are some more tree planting projects underway, so maybe someone listens, who knows, or more to the point who cares?

As for Thomas Merton, I doubt there is as much connection as you being related to George Bush

[khall64au]

I tried and failed as usual, but there are some more tree planting projects underway, so maybe someone listens, who knows, or more to the point who cares?

As for Thomas Merton, I doubt there is as much connection as you being related to George Bush

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Excuse me, Mr Fletcher, for butting in ... but what reforestation ideas might you have in mind? I'm interested in hearing about them. PM if you'd rather - than air them out loud again.

Cheers

[khall64au]

I believe our Green Wanderer is correct with regards to the removal of forests from the shores. The impact of the tsunami was there for everyone to see and yet, in forested regions of the coastline, it’s devastation was less apparent.

Why do you think we see flash floods following rain? This is because the trees have been removed inland, an their root systems no longer hold the soils together and soak up the heavy rains. The ground becomes devoid of moisture and when the rains do finally arrive, the water does not soak into the desiccated soils, but runs over the surface rapidly accelerated by the inclusion of roads, on its way to the cities and towns, for all to witness.

How many people did you see during the tsunami, saved by hanging onto a tree? This should be evidence enough that trees are able to survive such a force when all of mankind’s infrastructure is demolished by the same force.

Put into words a long long time ago by your’s truly.

When roads turn into rivers and people fall and die.

When the only growth is concrete, reaching for the sky.

Desert winds blowing, fan the mighty flame.

Forest but a memory, don't even have a name.

Ocean levels rising, stink of rotten fish,

No longer do they live here, or end up in our dish.

Seagulls feeding inland, dive upon the tips.

Pipelines belch out sewage, exposing tell-tale slicks

Now the oil stops flowing, and gushing from the floor,

And water is the reason for which we go to war.

Tankers held at ransom, await the highest prices,

Now the tides have turned and clean water is the crisis.

By Andrew K Fletcher

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is one poignant poem Mr Fletcher.

Reminds me of a modern day "Big Yellow Taxi" (Joni Mitchell).

The fact that the sea front at Khao Lak had largely been denuded of forest and replaced by large numbers of resorts and bungalows filled to capacity with international tourists may have contributed to the extreme death count.

Tourism is a saviour, in a sense, for the local economy but the impact on the environment does leave a lot to be desired.

I recently spent a few days in the peace and tranquility of Khao Sok National Park... only to be disturbed from my Sunday slumber by the sound of a bulldozer clearing land for yet another bungalow resort.

Where will the line ever be drawn? When will enough be enough?

Sustainability is the issue here. Mass tourism is not the answer for Thailand!

[jrincon17]

An educated population would never have voted for him.

An educated population is considered dangerous in this neck of the jungles.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

and he's chinese right ?

[Jai Dee]

Excuse me, Mr Fletcher, for butting in ... but what reforestation ideas might you have in mind? I'm interested in hearing about them. PM if you'd rather - than air them out loud again.

You can read all about Mr Fletcher's ideas in this thread.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

The Tsunami had a profound effect on the generosity of ordinary people. Individuals are still going to great effort to raise money.

Please send money direct to my ex business partner in Jakarta, who really was a crook, whilst telling me ad infinitum how honest he was.

Tank you velly velly much.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Posted a boxful today