UK Settlement Visa With Foreign Contract?

[manjara]

Hi, I am considering taking a contract in the middle east which would give me a trip back to the UK every month, but I would not be in the UK for more than 90 days in total in the year.

My wife has said that if I take it she would prefer to go and live in the UK with the kids, especially as my father is now very old and is all alone.

I initially thought, great, I can apply for settlement visa and have the family live with my Dad (I have my own house in the UK too, but just to be with my Dad they would stay there).

However, it then occurred to me that I would be 'not ordinarily resident' in the UK because of my work and suddenly it seems a lot less likely that a Settlement visa is possible.

I considered a long term Visitor visa, but that would only allow 6 months of the year in the UK (I think), which would not be enough (9 months would be a possibility, but 10 to be safe)

I could always set up some company in the UK to give me a salary and pretend to be resident, paying tax on the salary I pay myself, but it would be expensive, complicated and possibly dishonest (not sure how, but the government probably would not like it much)

Does anyone know if I would stand a chance to get a settlement visa?

We have been to the UK before on visitor visa for 4 months and stayed part of the time at my Dads and part at my house (they are about 350 miles apart!).

If my family have to be in Thailand then I will have to travel sometimes to the UK and sometimes to Thailand, which would mean I would not see them for periods of 2 months in some cases, which is waaaaay too long! (a month is bad enough). I also tried to get my father to come to Thailand to live but he is not really well enough to travel and is receiving treatment every week now, and due for a heart op in the near future.

[bobrussell]

The more knowledgable on the forum will need more information including your nationality, your wifes, childrens etc.

Generally there should be a visa type suitable for your situation. Do not try and get round the system you will lose! If you are found to be 'bucking the system' and get found out the authorities have very long memories as can be seen by looking at other posts.

Settlement visas are quite specific about requirements. If in doubt talk to a OISC consultant. I am sure one of the forum sponsors will be able to help - if your circumstances are complex it is better to get it right first time even if it costs you more to start with.

Sorry I cannot be of more help but I am sure someone else will be able to advise.

[manjara]

The more knowledgable on the forum will need more information including your nationality, your wifes, childrens etc.

Generally there should be a visa type suitable for your situation. Do not try and get round the system you will lose! If you are found to be 'bucking the system' and get found out the authorities have very long memories as can be seen by looking at other posts.

Settlement visas are quite specific about requirements. If in doubt talk to a OISC consultant. I am sure one of the forum sponsors will be able to help - if your circumstances are complex it is better to get it right first time even if it costs you more to start with.

Sorry I cannot be of more help but I am sure someone else will be able to advise.

Sorry, thought it was apparent. I am from UK, wife is Thai, kids are Thai (6 & 4)

[7by7]

Sorry, but as you are neither a person present and settled in the United Kingdom nor being admitted on the same occasion for settlement then I don't see any way for your wife to be admitted for settlement until you, too, come to the UK to live.

Do not be tempted to set up a fictitious residence. Obtaining a visa by deception is a serious offence.

Cannot your family move with you when you take up your new contract? Surely your employer is used to arranging the necessary visas for family?

[manjara]

Sorry, but as you are neither a person present and settled in the United Kingdom nor being admitted on the same occasion for settlement then I don't see any way for your wife to be admitted for settlement until you, too, come to the UK to live.

Do not be tempted to set up a fictitious residence. Obtaining a visa by deception is a serious offence.

Cannot your family move with you when you take up your new contract? Surely your employer is used to arranging the necessary visas for family?

Actually, I think you have misread the original post.

- I don't have to make up a residence, I own a house in England in my name

- My work is effectively travel from the UK, as I would be returning every 28 days (this is the max length of time I can be in the ME country on a business visa)

- without a 'residence permit' in the ME country, I would not be able to bring my family, plus there are issues like schooling and restrictions on movement of my wife

- There is also the question of my fathers health which makes it much better if we can be there on a regular basis

The not ordinarily resident is a tax declaration, based on the fact that I would not be in the country for more than 90 days, however it would still be my main residence.

Perhaps this is more of a tax issue, in that if my family are in the UK, then I should declare myself as resident?? Obviously that would then mean that I have to pay tax in the UK on the money I earn in the Middle East, which would not be good, but perhaps that is the solution.

The problem with that is that the contract is with a non-UK company, so I would need to create another 'layer' in order to process the money, i.e. a company in the UK which would be a subcontractor to the non-UK company. I would be employed by the UK company and 'travel on business' to the ME. The UK employment would be on a contract basis, not permanent work, but I assume that would be ok?

If I could get a decent job in the UK, I would, but my mortgage is large and I have a company in Thailand to support as well. I can't afford to take a normal paying job back in the UK!

This would also be complicated by the fact that there is a 15% withhlding tax on company transfers out of Thailand to other countries...

[Soutpeel]

Actually, I think you have misread the original post.

- I don't have to make up a residence, I own a house in England in my name

- My work is effectively travel from the UK, as I would be returning every 28 days (this is the max length of time I can be in the ME country on a business visa)

- without a 'residence permit' in the ME country, I would not be able to bring my family, plus there are issues like schooling and restrictions on movement of my wife

- There is also the question of my fathers health which makes it much better if we can be there on a regular basis

The not ordinarily resident is a tax declaration, based on the fact that I would not be in the country for more than 90 days, however it would still be my main residence.

Perhaps this is more of a tax issue, in that if my family are in the UK, then I should declare myself as resident?? Obviously that would then mean that I have to pay tax in the UK on the money I earn in the Middle East, which would not be good, but perhaps that is the solution.

The problem with that is that the contract is with a non-UK company, so I would need to create another 'layer' in order to process the money, i.e. a company in the UK which would be a subcontractor to the non-UK company. I would be employed by the UK company and 'travel on business' to the ME. The UK employment would be on a contract basis, not permanent work, but I assume that would be ok?

If I could get a decent job in the UK, I would, but my mortgage is large and I have a company in Thailand to support as well. I can't afford to take a normal paying job back in the UK!

This would also be complicated by the fact that there is a 15% withhlding tax on company transfers out of Thailand to other countries...

I really dont see what the issue is, Your Mrs shouldnt have any problem getting a visa under these circumstances, your tax status in the UK has FA to do with getting a visa issued.

The only caution I would have if your Mrs goes for an interview, think she should keep stum about you doing 28 abouts, you are all going to live in the UK thats all...

[7by7]

Actually, I think you have misread the original post.

- I don't have to make up a residence, I own a house in England in my name

No, I don't think I have. Owning a property in the UK does not make you a resident; you have to actually live in the UK.

In the application you, or rather your wife, will need to show that you have sufficient income to adequately maintain and accommodate yourselves without recourse to public funds, so you will need to show where this income is coming from. Whether the UKBA would accept you spending a maximum of 90 days a year in the UK as being 'ordinarily resident' is something I don't know for sure.

It seems that you want to tell the UKBA that you are, or are going to be, resident in the UK, the HMRC that you are not and the Thai tax authorities that you are resident in Thailand.

Maybe you should speak to a professional.

[Soutpeel]

Actually, I think you have misread the original post.

- I don't have to make up a residence, I own a house in England in my name

No, I don't think I have. Owning a property in the UK does not make you a resident; you have to actually live in the UK.

In the application you, or rather your wife, will need to show that you have sufficient income to adequately maintain and accommodate yourselves without recourse to public funds, so you will need to show where this income is coming from. Whether the UKBA would accept you spending a maximum of 90 days a year in the UK as being 'ordinarily resident' is something I don't know for sure.

It seems that you want to tell the UKBA that you are, or are going to be, resident in the UK, the HMRC that you are not and the Thai tax authorities that you are resident in Thailand.

Maybe you should speak to a professional.

7by7,

Think you are confusing the two aspects of this, and agree that it would be expedient to seek professional advice on this, but the OP residance status for tax purposes has no bearing on his wife's application for a visa.

The OP has a property in the UK and is/will be employed by a middle eastern company, which requires him to spend time out the UK on business, therefore the OP can prove there is no recourse to public funds if providing a visa for his Mrs and kids to live in the UK.

[mark515]

Just what i was thinking.. Soutpeel.

The facts about tax is not an issue.

As you say he has a UK house and UK job but works from home.

I see no problem.

Keep us up to date.

[Farma]

As an observation.

For the past 20 odd years I've been working with Brits in the Middle East. The Brits I know married to Thais usually have their wives accompanying them in the Middle East or minding home in Thailand.

All of them that Ive known have to obtain visit visas for their wife to visit the UK or quit and move back to the UK to live if they want a UK settlement visa for their wife.

[7by7]

I can find no reference in the immigration rules nor the entry clearance guidance to a situation where the British spouse is working outside the UK and only enters the UK for a maximum of 90 days per year for tax reasons.

The immigration rules do make constant reference to

Spouses or civil partners of persons present and settled in the United Kingdom or being admitted on the same occasion for settlement

The entry clearance guidance says

SET3.4 What is 'present and settled'? 'Present and settled' means that the sponsor is either:

• settled in the UK and, at the same time that an application under the Immigration Rules is made, is physically present in the UK; or,
  
• is coming to the UK with or to join the applicant and intends to make the UK their home with the applicant if the application is successful.
  

'Settled' is defined in paragraph 6 of HC395 and means "free from any restriction on the period for which he / she may remain in the UK, and ordinarily resident in the UK".

'Ordinarily resident' means "having a regular habitual mode of life in a particular country, the continuity of which has persisted despite temporary absences".

If the sponsor has temporarily traveled abroad to accompany the applicant in making the application, this will not prejudice the sponsor's present and settled status. Such absence from the UK is not of itself a reason for refusal.

Sponsors may be British citizens. Strictly speaking, a British citizen who has been resident abroad but who returns to the United Kingdom to live is not 'admitted for settlement'. However, if he/she expresses the intention of returning to the United Kingdom to reside, the ECO can regard him/her as present and settled in the UK.

So, the question is does working outside the UK, spending a maximum of 90 days per year in the UK and telling HMRC that one is not resident for tax purposes mean one is or is not considered present and settled for immigration purposes?

As I said previously, I think that seeking a professional opinion, from a suitably qualified, registered and regulated adviser, is the only way to resolve this question. Other than actually submitting an application and seeing what happens, of course.

Although Farma's experience seems to indicate that it doesn't.

[Farma]

While discussing this situation at work today we could only think of just 1 case where a guy managed to get a settlement visa for his wife and remain employed in the Middle East.

Brit, Filipino wife and Brit national children from the marriage. They had been living as a family in the Middle East for a number of years. They also owned a house in the UK.

The Brit handed in his notice to quit well in advance. This information was provided in the settlement application. As he had full intention of quitting his job he obviously satisfied the ECO of his intention to return to the UK to reside.

As it turned out his wife was granted the settlement visa and moved with the children to the UK in preparation for his return home.

At the last minute he was requested by his employer to stay on in his job and withdrew his notice to quit. His wife and children are still in the UK and he’s still working in the Middle East.