The Man Who Refused To Die

[poldebol]

from the BBC site

"True Story of the Bridge on the river Kwai.

........ In the hope that one day the true story would be told, Lieutenant Colonel Philip Toosey, the commander of the Bridge Camp, left behind nearly 50 hours of taped memoirs recounting his experiences during captivity. Using these tapes, eyewitness accounts of those who built the real bridge, and an astonishing correspondence with Colonel Toosey kept with his Japanese captor after the war, this film uncovers a story even more remarkable than the legend created by the film. In reality, Toosey saved most of his men by working on the bridge, and was viewed as a hero by them. Even his captor respected him, and credited him with later saving his life after World War II. "

Next time you go to the pass, look at the memorial plaque there. It lists fallen officers and soldiers from different countries. I do not remember the exact details, but it struck me that there was a big difference in the ratio officers/ soldiers for individual countries. I remember that the ratio was highest for the Dutch. This was due to the fact that many of the Dutch soldiers came from Indonesia and had some experience with life in the jungle.

[colinp]

Both my Grandfathers were serving in Singapore when it fell. Officially 15 Feb 1942.

1 (Arthur Pryke RIP) spent time in Changi before being moved to a Japanese camp in Taiwan (http://www.powtaiwan.org/).

The other (Mike Pledge B.E.M.) was unfortunately kept at changi for a long period before being moved into the camps in Thailand to work on the railway, which included helping with the bridges over the river.

He was awarded the B.E.M. (British Empire Medal, given to non-english forces for 'meritorious military service worthy of recognition', he is Irish). After the war he spent literally years going back and forth to military hospitals and still wears a neck brace due to being 'strung-up' by the neck for days, and I do mean days, on end.

He holds no grudge against the Japanese. He always said to me that the Allied force in the war and in previous wars wasn't a 'friendly' force.

[Xangsamhua]

People who are interested in the Burma Rail POW experiences would be interested in "The Railway Man", a very moving book by Eric Lomax, a Scotsman, who was captured in Singapore and sent to the railway.

Lomax was very, very bitter and suffered depression and stress through his postwar life. The book describes life for the POWs and how he was able to come to terms with it to some extent late in life, including reconciliation with one of his captors. I've seen the book in Asia Books. It's one of the most memorable books I've read.

[bjoe97]

Both my Grandfathers were serving in Singapore when it fell. Officially 15 Feb 1942.

1 (Arthur Pryke RIP) spent time in Changi before being moved to a Japanese camp in Taiwan (http://www.powtaiwan.org/).

The other (Mike Pledge B.E.M.) was unfortunately kept at changi for a long period before being moved into the camps in Thailand to work on the railway, which included helping with the bridges over the river.

He was awarded the B.E.M. (British Empire Medal, given to non-english forces for 'meritorious military service worthy of recognition', he is Irish). After the war he spent literally years going back and forth to military hospitals and still wears a neck brace due to being 'strung-up' by the neck for days, and I do mean days, on end.

He holds no grudge against the Japanese. He always said to me that the Allied force in the war and in previous wars wasn't a 'friendly' force.

your relative is a man to respect, may he RIP, he was so right ,there was no friendly force,and its so good to hear from someone like him.

[Thongkorn]

Defend the right to speak , to discus , Thats what the whole thing was about , thats why We can voice our opinions because men like these fought for us to Speak which ever view We have,

[jayjayjayjay]

Both my Grandfathers were serving in Singapore when it fell. Officially 15 Feb 1942.

1 (Arthur Pryke RIP) spent time in Changi before being moved to a Japanese camp in Taiwan (http://www.powtaiwan.org/).

The other (Mike Pledge B.E.M.) was unfortunately kept at changi for a long period before being moved into the camps in Thailand to work on the railway, which included helping with the bridges over the river.

He was awarded the B.E.M. (British Empire Medal, given to non-english forces for 'meritorious military service worthy of recognition', he is Irish). After the war he spent literally years going back and forth to military hospitals and still wears a neck brace due to being 'strung-up' by the neck for days, and I do mean days, on end.

He holds no grudge against the Japanese. He always said to me that the Allied force in the war and in previous wars wasn't a 'friendly' force.

Thank you to Arthur Pryke RIP, and Mike Pledge for what you sacrificed for our freedom.

RIP all Diggers and alike. May we all take the chance to remember all that died for wrong reasons this ANZAC day at Hellfire Pass. Atrocities continue even until today.

Edited March 3, 2010 by jayjayjayjay

[Richb2004v2]

Only in the virtual world of Internet debates can someone compare the Japanese in the 1940's to the Vikings.

[geriatrickid]

Is this movie generally available in Thailand, Big Wheel Man? Read the story of "The Rape of Nanking ", many years ago, an atrocity the Japanese still try to hide, along with their use of chemical weapons in China during WWII.

As others have said, the utmost respect must be given to all the POWs and forced labourers who suffered at the hands of a brutal Japanese regime. I'd love to go to Kanchanaburi, but I'm informed that many Japanese tourists go there, taking photos, and I honestly wouldn't trust myself to keep my temper....I had an Uncle that was a prisoner there too. Personally I think in view of the atrocities they committed there, Japanese should be barred...but I also think that two nuclear bombs weren't anywhere nearly enough.

silly comment, backward thinking, aggressive, senseless 'the Japanese were armed, trained, advised by the west so, should all those in the west be barred for helping create this monster?

the Brits bombed Bangkok as punishment and killed many innocents bear this in mind when you have temper issues we are all guilty, the losers should not be more so this constant continuation of the blame game doesn't help, looks so childish,ios not the progressive way forward at all

Whatever the British did, it saved lives. Yes you read that right.

The countries Japan invaded did not arm the Japanese. The Americans did not, nor did the British, nor the Dutch.

When the Japanese rolled into China, my old grandfather was kept from being sent to the concentration camps because he was a manager of the British food processing operation and one of the few people that could keep it running. That didn't stop the Japanese from beating him up and basically making his wife and young family prisoners. He had it easy compared to the other Europeans. His Dutch neighbors were deported and the English neighbor executed as a lesson to the other whities. The Americans disappeared overnight. Chinese residents were rounded up to be used in biological warfare experiments and disected alive. These people were called logs. The same thing happened to American servicemen and to Koreans and Philippinos.

My great uncle was one just out of a U.S. medical school in 1944 when he was sent to the Pacific. He was assigned to providing medical care to concentration camp inmates and POWS after they were liberated. He didn't talk much about the experience, but he used to say it was a shame the horrors he saw were not documented like Aushwitz and that the Japanese were not made to go into the camps to see the emaciated and diseased inmates. He then went to Thailand and Malaya to help with the refugee problem and to assist the with the identification of massacred personnel. The Japanese were simply executing the POWS and dumping the bodies in shallow graves. He wasn't one given to emotional outbursts but he wasn't particularly fond of the Japanese.

Ask a Japanese university student if he or she is aware of these unpunished war crimes and you get a blank stare or denial.

Edited March 4, 2010 by geriatrickid

[Ijustwannateach]

Things are changing, a bit. More liberal Japanese teachers are making the effort to introduce some of the events into either English classes or even history classes. Furthermore, the widespread phenomenon of Japanese teachers and students refusing en masse to stand for the national anthem or salute the national flag (both are associated with emperor-worship and the war) is directly related to a feeling of shame and anger at those parts of the nation's history. The attempt at whitewash and revisionism largely comes from the conservative old guard who are dying off.

I'd also like to point out that (in attempting to get this thread back to a Thai or at least an Southeast Asian angle) that though the exhibits in Kanchanaburi generally don't give much time to the Asian victims of the camps, it is clearly acknowledged everywhere that there were many, many, many more of them, and their suffering generally goes under-recognised because fewer of them were left alive to speak out about it (or fewer perhaps chose to do so)- most of the 'white' prisoners acknowledged that they were treated at least slightly better than prisoners of Asian nationality, though it was no country club for them either.

[carmine]

Things are changing, a bit. More liberal Japanese teachers are making the effort to introduce some of the events into either English classes or even history classes. Furthermore, the widespread phenomenon of Japanese teachers and students refusing en masse to stand for the national anthem or salute the national flag (both are associated with emperor-worship and the war) is directly related to a feeling of shame and anger at those parts of the nation's history. The attempt at whitewash and revisionism largely comes from the conservative old guard who are dying off.

I'd also like to point out that (in attempting to get this thread back to a Thai or at least an Southeast Asian angle) that though the exhibits in Kanchanaburi generally don't give much time to the Asian victims of the camps, it is clearly acknowledged everywhere that there were many, many, many more of them, and their suffering generally goes under-recognised because fewer of them were left alive to speak out about it (or fewer perhaps chose to do so)- most of the 'white' prisoners acknowledged that they were treated at least slightly better than prisoners of Asian nationality, though it was no country club for them either.

Good post. Pleased to hear about a couple of the points you made as i was previously unaware.

[neverdie]

Only in the virtual world of Internet debates can someone compare the Japanese in the 1940's to the Vikings.

An appauling example of disrespect in my opinion, this individual bjoe, would be alot better off discussing this subject with a few Aussie's in Kanchanaburi over a couple of beers.

Sadly, this thread seems to have failed to show the RESPECT to the gentleman and hero it was started over.

Lest we forget.

[neverdie]

Just a little reminder, this thread is about Mr Alistair Urquhart, a man that deserves a little bit of RESPECT.

[Ijustwannateach]

Things have gone way off-track. Time to clean them up.

Ok, I have removed some extensive off-topic posting- which in the case of one poster I agree was trollish/inflammatory, and I have dealt with that. So let's keep things on track and keep this thread on topic with the discussion of Mr. Urquhart, his experiences, directly related history, and if possible Thailand and Southeast Asia.

[mrtoad]

Things have gone way off-track. Time to clean them up.

Ok, I have removed some extensive off-topic posting- which in the case of one poster I agree was trollish/inflammatory, and I have dealt with that. So let's keep things on track and keep this thread on topic with the discussion of Mr. Urquhart, his experiences, directly related history, and if possible Thailand and Southeast Asia.

Thank you.

[WeeGB]

I tried to buy this book from the online retailer that has the same name as a south american river.(UK branch - they won't deliver to LOS, so I get items I want sent to a friends UK address and he posts them on to me here). It appears to have been published in hardback (but is out of stock), but not yet in paperback. I did email them about this, but no reply as yet). There is however an audio book available for visually impaired people, which I thought may be useful information to some TV members or perhaps their elderly relatives.

Is this book available in Thailand?

As the old song says Bless 'em all.

May they rest in eternal peace, never to be forgotten.

[tangcoral]

Wow, the same type of punishment were used on me by my parents and teachers back when I was in grade school 20 years ago.

Part about holding rocks above their head.

We had to hold large books over our head and if it ever drifted below our forehead we were hit a stick and our time was extended.

I guess its an asian thing...

korea

[IMA_FARANG]

I read the responses in this topic. I personally met a Dutch man,then living in Bangkok, who has now now passed on (originally his family was from Indonesia) who was about 14 years old at the time the Japanese took over Indonesia.

Because of his age then, he was originally placed in a children's camp by the Japanese...he claimed that saved his life. Whe he reached the age of 16 he was placed in the regular men's camps. He was in Chiangi and also brought to Thailand to work on the railroad (ala bridge on the river Kwai).

Some points I wanted to make on some of the posts on this topic:

1. The Thais villagers were forced to aid the Japanese. Many Thais were used as porters, laborers, etc. by the Japanese. The policy in the villages around the camps in Thailand was that any villager who was found to be aiding or have aided an escaped prisioner, that person would be killed along with his/her entire family. That is one reason whay few of the villagers aided any POW who ttempted to escape.

2. The British, especially the officers, established control of the POWs in the camps as best they could. Any food that happened to come in, and there were a few Red Cross food deliverys, was confiscated by the British officers; and was distributed by them. First priority was the officers, next the British enlisted, and what was left was distributed to the other nationalities involved. I don't know where the Aussies were on that pecking order. My Dutch friend clearly saw food shipments, from the Netherlands and the Red Cross confiscated by British officers and distributed to the British POWs in the camp he was in. I'm not blaming them, everyone was hungery, and just trying to survive as best they could.

3. There was a Thai resistance...it was backed by the U.S. It was called the Thai Seri, For political reasons, the British government was not very friendly to the Thai Seri. Part of the reason was that the French were allies, and the French still had ideas of keeping their colonies in Southeast Asia...so they were opposed to any "resistance" movements that might interfere with that prospect. Vietnam (or French Indochina as it was then called) is one of the results.

4. Thailand was bombed by the Americans late in the war, Japanese shipping and ports and railroads in Thailand were attacked as part of the war. Earlier the American Volunteer Group (the Flying Tigers) also strafed airfields in the north of Thailand with the Japanese were using to attack british forces in Burma. It was a war, and that was what happened.

5. The Austrailians made two attacks on Singapore harbor, after it fell, Using Aussie commandos in ships disguised as fishing boats and the Aussie commandos dressed as Malay fishermen. One raid managed to sink a couple Japanese cargo vessels in Singapore harbor. The Japanese assumed it was done by a local Singaporean resisitance group, and executed local Singaporeans as a response. The 2nd raid, about a year later, failed, and most of the Aussie commandos were eaither captured or killed in the raid.

There are a lot of stories that haven't been told about the WWII years in Thailand and Southeast Asia. The people involved are all passing away now, without a lot of those stories being told.

Edited March 6, 2010 by IMA_FARANG

[thaimiller]

What a Brave Brave Man. I never knew my Grandad as he was blown up at Dunkirk but Im glad he never had to go through the torture that these guy's did. R.I.P to everyone who died in such an horrific way.

[bjoe97]

yes, lets not forget- anything.

There was never any disrespect intended to that good man, who to defend people right of speech.And truth.Oneof those is sadly- we're all guilty