Red Shirts Plan To Paralyse Bangkok, Topple Thai Government

[elcent]

domestic flights almost empty

international flights as usual busy

saw a red Volvo today with a big sticker "This car is white"

[commons]

Lots of clear arguments from the rational people. Zip from the 'Thaksin is our savior" brigade. Typical.

If you live in the south or Bkk you never see Thailand as it is.

I feel for the people of Thailand who all they want is a fair Election in which whoever wins gets to govern without being kicked out through a coupe.

Unlike most of you on here, the red shirts couldn't afford to come to BKK without being paid, but they would rather not have to come in the first place.

This isn't fun or funny it's people fighting for Democracy, fairness. Forget Thaksin for a while and if he is a liar, bad, good, a saint, or the devil.

He WAS the Prime Minister of Thailand, he never got voted out of power the people who voted for him - over 60% - do not think this fair. If it were to happen in Germany, the US or the UK would YOU think it fair?

I hope no one gets hurt I hope it is peaceful, and I wish them well.

Shame on all you ignorant fools who think you are far better than most Thai's, and I include you if you are Thai too.

Thaksin apologist puts on the bleeding heart act. A 'feeling' Red. Whatever next? Read between the lines though and there is the usual whitewash of corruption.

How come most on here are "incognito"? You know....some people who say they care......do care.

You no doubt are from the "They are dogs we kick them" camp. What we call in England a ( you guess) tosser, jolly decent chap.

This user has not configured their 'About Me' page and has not added a signature to their account yet.

when rational arguments run out..., as we all human beings do..., it's fine to defend our "sovereign individuality" by attacking others on a personal level, don't we?

thanks na

[mpetersen]

why do non thai posters seem to be negative about the supporters of thaksin, like him or not these are ordinary people for whom the previous regime was of benefit so they like and support him and his policy.

i really dont know if he was good or bad when compared to others but i do know that those wearing yellow shirts are anti democracy as they have stated so the question is, if the choice is to have a vote or not to have a vote, who would you vote for?

Why? Because non-Thai people have a better understanding of mature democracy, what it means, and that the mob-rule, or even majority-rule doesn't necessarily equate to good democracy.

1) The Red shirts are a minority, so why can they decide when and how to dissolve a government?

2) The government is a coalition of elected parties. There is nothing undemocratic about coalition governments. Indeed, it's probalby one of the most democratic means to represent multiple minority views in the form of a common governing front

3) "Populist" leaders more often than not have their own interests in mind. Hitler was a populist, democratically elected, leader. Was he good? Was he democratic? Of course not he was a devil incarnate.

4) Thaksin is a dictatory wannabe. Jealous of the "successful" implementation of "democratic" principles, such as North Korea (sorry Democratic Replublic of Korea(!)), Burma (dedicated ot democratic prinicples of course), Cambodia (look what the "reds" accomplished there) etc.

In previous times, the red shirts would have been denounced as "communists" and crushed. Of course, that is no longer possible since China, a communist nation, would strongly object to that.

Thailand has so many things that should be addressed: Garbage, Energy, Water, Poverty, Infrastructure, Pollution, the South, Heritage and last but not least Education (or lack thereof) which sends hundreds of thousands of desparate girls into prostitution each year.

To be fair, the elites have nobody but themselves to blame, and until they stop looking down on Issan and Karen and Upcountry farming people with disdain, they should not be suprised about any attempt at popular revolts. So, the reds`protests have a very important role in forming democratic princples, even though their stated goals (such as re-instating Thug-sin) are deplorable, the process, if done in peace, will give rise to positive, truly democratic principles in the end.

[Squigy]

Maybe Khun T will fly in by helicopter on Sunday to lead the protest from Cambodia. Are the Thai Airforce on alert for this kind of thing to happen?

[mpetersen]

If one looks at the figure of 1.000,000 (one million) demonstrators although an impressive figure and indeed sight it is actually less than 1% (one per cent) of the population of Thailand.

I hardly think that qualifies as an overwhelming popular demand for the return of Thaksin brand of DEMONOCRACY

Ummm, there's around 67 million people in Thailand, so that's actually about 1.5% of the population. In reality, that's huge, and for example, FAR larger than the Iran protests which gained so much media attention in the West. Really, when was the last time you heard about 1.5% of an entire country getting together to protest in the capital? Doesn't happen too often.

I don't know, but if 1.5% of Canada's population (~540,000 people) of all a sudden showed up in Ottawa to protest against the government, I'd say that'd cause a pretty decent stir nationwide.

Yes but it won`t be anywhere close to 1 Million showing up. Maybe not even 100,000, so in the end 0.1% is NOT huge, it`s tiny and insignificant were it not for the potential dangers of people in the background attempting to stir up trouble and violence.

That said, there is nothing wrong with 100,000 people, or 50,000 people or whatever the final number is, peacefully demonstrating or protesting their views.

[elcent]

so the rural have changed from planting crops to farming democracy. How they going to water it? Drought everywhere?

[wolf5370]

If one looks at the figure of 1.000,000 (one million) demonstrators although an impressive figure and indeed sight it is actually less than 1% (one per cent) of the population of Thailand.

I hardly think that qualifies as an overwhelming popular demand for the return of Thaksin brand of DEMONOCRACY

Ummm, there's around 67 million people in Thailand, so that's actually about 1.5% of the population. In reality, that's huge, and for example, FAR larger than the Iran protests which gained so much media attention in the West. Really, when was the last time you heard about 1.5% of an entire country getting together to protest in the capital? Doesn't happen too often.

I don't know, but if 1.5% of Canada's population (~540,000 people) of all a sudden showed up in Ottawa to protest against the government, I'd say that'd cause a pretty decent stir nationwide.

If we look at 1 milliion then that just under 1.5% as you said; if we look at 70,000 then its just over 0.1%. So it depends who's figures you believe I guess - as with most things, its probably somewhere in the middle.

[mpetersen]

Lots of clear arguments from the rational people. Zip from the 'Thaksin is our savior" brigade. Typical.

If you live in the south or Bkk you never see Thailand as it is.

I feel for the people of Thailand who all they want is a fair Election in which whoever wins gets to govern without being kicked out through a coupe.

Unlike most of you on here, the red shirts couldn't afford to come to BKK without being paid, but they would rather not have to come in the first place.

This isn't fun or funny it's people fighting for Democracy, fairness. Forget Thaksin for a while and if he is a liar, bad, good, a saint, or the devil.

He WAS the Prime Minister of Thailand, he never got voted out of power the people who voted for him - over 60% - do not think this fair. If it were to happen in Germany, the US or the UK would YOU think it fair?

I hope no one gets hurt I hope it is peaceful, and I wish them well.

Shame on all you ignorant fools who think you are far better than most Thai's, and I include you if you are Thai too.

Along with being democratically elected (even that, in light of widespread vote-buying is doubtful), does not absolve the leader from acting properly once in power. Extrajudicial killings, sniding the UN, blatant gifting of money to rural poor in the hopes and expectation of gaining their votes, and using the government to fill one`s own coffers, not to mention, in Thailand, being a `republican` and disrespecting the Roayl Institution, should be enough justification for removal. Since the judicial and parliamentary systems are relatively immature and unable to fulfil such a demand, there is no other choice but for the military to step in as `big brother` to rectify such situation.

Thailand has a constitutional Monarchy, with a democratically elected prime minister, and for better or for worse, the military, largely loyal to His Majestey, has been given the default role of gatekeeper of this fledgling democracy.

The last coup resulted in democratic elections which voted a coalition government into power. There is nothing undemocratic about that at all.

[animatic]

Well so far 100,000 red agitators at most are expected.

1% or the country is 670,000 so that is 1/670th of the nation. Or only 0.149%

if 150,000 show up 0.223 % of the nation

If charitably we say 250,000 that still only 0.373%

28 million voters and 150,000 protesters =

0.53% of voters are here trying to bring down the government

through violent social disturbance to help Thaksin and his puppet opposition party.

at 250k only 0.89 % of voters come to complain their vote isn't properly counted.

Not exactly the rousing mandate it is advertised as.

Edited March 13, 2010 by animatic

[Sunderland]

Protesters will move from Ratchadamnoen to Phaholyothin Road either later tomorrow or first thing on Monday. The peace-keeping operations command centre set up by the government at the base of the 11th Infantry regiment north of Kaset-Nawamin intersection and south of Bang Khen/Laksi roundabout (monument) will be their target.

Edited March 13, 2010 by Sunderland

[Old Man River]

According to MCOT, Weng Tochirakarn, a leader of the anti-government United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), said the protesters intend to proceed with their planned massive rally Sunday to call for the government to dissolve parliament. He said if the government refuses to budge, the protesters would “seize every corner of Bangkok after March 15.”

Given the relatively small turnout, it looks like these guys are starting to get desperate.

[Jingthing]

Let them block the streets. Then arrest every last one of them. That will wipe out their Thaksin money packet, and then some.

[Maxi101]

Off to the monkey house? There's about 95% of ThaiVisa going with them!

And why would that be?

[frodo]

No wonder Weng and Jatuporn are spewing anger. According to the Nation:

Metropolitan Police estimates number of protesters at 40,000 at 7 pm

By 7 pm Saturday, the Metropolitan Police Bureau estimated that about 40,000 red-shirt protesters were rallying at the Pan Fah Bridge and on Rajdamnone Road.

Metropolitan Police spokesman Pol Maj Gen Piya Uthayo said the number was rising as more protesters were still arriving.

The Nation

A long way from 1,000,000 I would say.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Metro...s-30124609.html

[granuaile]

Let them block the streets. Then arrest every last one of them. That will wipe out their Thaksin money packet, and then some.

Agreed. The government has been more than even-handed thus far, giving them much room. If they act on their threats to close down roads, lay siege to government offices, and other similar movements, they should be arrested immediately.

[RegularReader]

Lots of clear arguments from the rational people. Zip from the 'Thaksin is our savior" brigade. Typical.

If you live in the south or Bkk you never see Thailand as it is.

I feel for the people of Thailand who all they want is a fair Election in which whoever wins gets to govern without being kicked out through a coupe.

Unlike most of you on here, the red shirts couldn't afford to come to BKK without being paid, but they would rather not have to come in the first place.

This isn't fun or funny it's people fighting for Democracy, fairness. Forget Thaksin for a while and if he is a liar, bad, good, a saint, or the devil.

He WAS the Prime Minister of Thailand, he never got voted out of power the people who voted for him - over 60% - do not think this fair. If it were to happen in Germany, the US or the UK would YOU think it fair?

I hope no one gets hurt I hope it is peaceful, and I wish them well.

Shame on all you ignorant fools who think you are far better than most Thai's, and I include you if you are Thai too.

You're not wrong in saying that.

But, why don't you tell that to the local "warlords" who hold sway over so many people up country?

These people hold Thailand back more than any other faction in this fight.

And whose side are they on ?

Tomorrow is Sunday and so they might be wearing red - but only because it's Sunday.

So far these people and their subordinate puyi barns etc have manged to stay under the radar.

Perhaps we need all this to bring about a "RED" /Thaksin Government again, in the hope that the rank & file red supporter realize they're being conned.

But, the consequences of that are too terrible to contemplate.

[SomTumTiger]

The Million Man March turns into a few thousand....surprise, surprise.

[Old Man River]

Let them block the streets. Then arrest every last one of them. That will wipe out their Thaksin money packet, and then some.

At some point the Reds or others will provoke a violent response. I fear it is inevitable when the Reds' leaders start calling for violence.

House Speaker Chai has called for an urgent meeting to find a way out of this.

[rainman]

No wonder Weng and Jatuporn are spewing anger. According to the Nation:

Metropolitan Police estimates number of protesters at 40,000 at 7 pm

By 7 pm Saturday, the Metropolitan Police Bureau estimated that about 40,000 red-shirt protesters were rallying at the Pan Fah Bridge and on Rajdamnone Road.

Metropolitan Police spokesman Pol Maj Gen Piya Uthayo said the number was rising as more protesters were still arriving.

The Nation

A long way from 1,000,000 I would say.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Metro...s-30124609.html

Go read the numbers that the highway police counted that have not yet reached Bangkok. There's a reason Abhisit is sleeping at the army barracks, in the house next to the coup leader Sonthi, with 4 helicopters (1 BlackHawk) on stand-by for emergency evacuation, in case the army base gets overrun by the red shirts. Source: Bangkok Post, today's edition.

[frodo]

The Million Man March turns into a few thousand....surprise, surprise.

Don't tell UDD supporters that...they are saying at least a million right now!

[SomTumTiger]

Yes there is a good reason for that Rainman - the red shirts are DANGEROUS thugs. Why aren't you there? I'm sure they have some somtum and feces bags waiting for you. Bring your own homemade grenade launcher - the police impounded the ones they were gonna pass out to everyone.

[Old Man River]

Lots of clear arguments from the rational people. Zip from the 'Thaksin is our savior" brigade. Typical.

If you live in the south or Bkk you never see Thailand as it is.

I feel for the people of Thailand who all they want is a fair Election in which whoever wins gets to govern without being kicked out through a coupe.

Unlike most of you on here, the red shirts couldn't afford to come to BKK without being paid, but they would rather not have to come in the first place.

This isn't fun or funny it's people fighting for Democracy, fairness. Forget Thaksin for a while and if he is a liar, bad, good, a saint, or the devil.

He WAS the Prime Minister of Thailand, he never got voted out of power the people who voted for him - over 60% - do not think this fair. If it were to happen in Germany, the US or the UK would YOU think it fair?

I hope no one gets hurt I hope it is peaceful, and I wish them well.

Shame on all you ignorant fools who think you are far better than most Thai's, and I include you if you are Thai too.

You're not wrong in saying that.

But, why don't you tell that to the local "warlords" who hold sway over so many people up country?

These people hold Thailand back more than any other faction in this fight.

And whose side are they on ?

Tomorrow is Sunday and so they might be wearing red - but only because it's Sunday.

So far these people and their subordinate puyi barns etc have manged to stay under the radar.

Perhaps we need all this to bring about a "RED" /Thaksin Government again, in the hope that the rank & file red supporter realize they're being conned.

But, the consequences of that are too terrible to contemplate.

Oh, I think they already know the score, but speak up about it and you disappear. Changes like these take many, many years if at all.

[RegularReader]

If one looks at the figure of 1.000,000 (one million) demonstrators although an impressive figure and indeed sight it is actually less than 1% (one per cent) of the population of Thailand.

I hardly think that qualifies as an overwhelming popular demand for the return of Thaksin brand of DEMONOCRACY

Ummm, there's around 67 million people in Thailand, so that's actually about 1.5% of the population. I don't know, but if 1.5% of Canada's population (~540,000 people) of all a sudden showed up in Ottawa to protest against the government, I'd say that'd cause a pretty decent stir nationwide.

I agree and to answer the question am I claiming that I can see Thailand better than the rest of you who have lived here for years?

Well possibly yes......ever heard of the saying can't see the Wood for the Trees? I talk to Thai's most days and I read the Times, The Independent, watch BBC News and many other English speaking newspapers including The Bangkok Post and The Nation. I'd say the Thai newspapers are slightly biased wouldn't you? Or perhaps you haven't noticed.

I take just as much an interest in Thailand than I do the UK because I intend to live in Thailand when I retire because I like it and the people.

What about also Thai Rath, Daily News, Matichon, Manager, Truth Today and watch the news on CHs 3,5,7,9,11 + TNN + Nation Channel + + + ?

Then you might get a more rounded feel for Thailand.

Edited March 13, 2010 by RegularReader

[rainman]

Yes there is a good reason for that Rainman - the red shirts are DANGEROUS thugs. Why aren't you there? I'm sure they have some somtum and feces bags waiting for you. Bring your own homemade grenade launcher - the police impounded the ones they were gonna pass out to everyone.

Throwing a bag of poop is hardly violent. And the homemade grenade launchers are not proven to have been made for the red shirts, even the police said that. They could just as well have been made for the southern insurgency.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

domestic flights almost empty

international flights as usual busy

Was in a very full flight to CNX this afternoon. People still need to get around, and by road is a bit iffy with all the checkpoints.

[cdnmatt]

Agreed. The government has been more than even-handed thus far, giving them much room.

That's because the government doesn't have a choice in the matter. Doing something stupid like closing all gas stations, or using the military to block all entrances to Bangkok to red-shirt supporters would basically be suicide for the current government.

[RegularReader]

Lots of clear arguments from the rational people. Zip from the 'Thaksin is our savior" brigade. Typical.

If you live in the south or Bkk you never see Thailand as it is.

I feel for the people of Thailand who all they want is a fair Election in which whoever wins gets to govern without being kicked out through a coupe.

Unlike most of you on here, the red shirts couldn't afford to come to BKK without being paid, but they would rather not have to come in the first place.

This isn't fun or funny it's people fighting for Democracy, fairness. Forget Thaksin for a while and if he is a liar, bad, good, a saint, or the devil.

He WAS the Prime Minister of Thailand, he never got voted out of power the people who voted for him - over 60% - do not think this fair. If it were to happen in Germany, the US or the UK would YOU think it fair?

I hope no one gets hurt I hope it is peaceful, and I wish them well.

Shame on all you ignorant fools who think you are far better than most Thai's, and I include you if you are Thai too.

You're not wrong in saying that.

But, why don't you tell that to the local "warlords" who hold sway over so many people up country?

These people hold Thailand back more than any other faction in this fight.

And whose side are they on ?

Tomorrow is Sunday and so they might be wearing red - but only because it's Sunday.

So far these people and their subordinate puyi barns etc have manged to stay under the radar.

Perhaps we need all this to bring about a "RED" /Thaksin Government again, in the hope that the rank & file red supporter realize they're being conned.

But, the consequences of that are too terrible to contemplate.

Oh, I think they already know the score, but speak up about it and you disappear. Changes like these take many, many years if at all.

Yes,I think they (by that I presume you mean Thai People?) do know the score.

Some are probably taking what they can get for now - but one day the "score" will need to be settled.

Until it is, they will not achieve what they seem to want.

And, I do agree it will take many, many years, if at all.

[Jingthing]

Let them block the streets. Then arrest every last one of them. That will wipe out their Thaksin money packet, and then some.

At some point the Reds or others will provoke a violent response. I fear it is inevitable when the Reds' leaders start calling for violence.

House Speaker Chai has called for an urgent meeting to find a way out of this.

Yes I agree. I am wondering how to characterize the red threat of closing down the entire city. Civil disobedience is a form of peaceful protest. However, does a political faction have the right to shut down a great city indefinitely until they get everything they demand? I don't think so. I don't know of any government in the world that would not begin mass arrests of such protesters.

Also I find the demands of this red mob very unreasonable. They want it all. Or else! That is not reasonable and that is not the model successful movements have done in other countries. First of course they need to lose Thaksin. After that, why not prioritize their top issues and demand fast change for those? For example massive educational reform for the poor in Thailand. Those kinds of social demands would actually have huge support well beyond Thaksinistas. Frankly watching the reds, they are a classic case of doing everything wrong.

Edited March 13, 2010 by Jingthing

[rainman]

Agreed. The government has been more than even-handed thus far, giving them much room.

That's because the government doesn't have a choice in the matter. Doing something stupid like closing all gas stations, or using the military to block all entrances to Bangkok to red-shirt supporters would basically be suicide for the current government.

Well, they already stopped gas deliveries to Bangkok, so no need to close the empty gas stations as well. And the military is already standing at all entrances to Bangkok to search every single incoming red shirts vehicle. So maybe they're going for semi-suicide?

[rainman]

Yes I agree. I am wondering how to characterize the red threat of closing down the entire city. Civil disobedience is a form of peaceful protest. However, does a political faction have the right to shut down a great city indefinitely until they get everything they demand? I don't think so. I don't know of any government in the world that would not begin mass arrests of such protesters.

The current government has shown that it's fairly acceptable in Thai society to take over the government building for months and 2 international airports for over a week without being punished. Maybe they should get rid of the double standards, don't you think?

Or maybe the yellow shirts are a special case, considering they brought the current government into power.