Bangkok: Another Crackdown, More Bloodshed Expected

[jcsmith]

That was one of the most biased articles I have ever read. I'm sorry. No matter what side of the fence your on, or if your straddling the middle... I'm a journalist myself, and that article was terrible journalism.

[Redsunset]

It would be nice if the red leaders would request mothers and children leave the demo site. There really is no need to place them at risk and onoly a fool thinks there is no risk. The government should also offer them free trips home.

Surely that is one basic humane thing all could agree on.

Sadly, no.... this is NOT the case... life is CHEAP here in Southeast Asia... take, for example, the advice I received from many Thais when I arrived in the early 1990s was if I got into a car accident upcountry and someone was hurt or died, to just run away!!! Do that in the U.S. and you might as well run right into jail!

[Redsunset]

That was one of the most biased articles I have ever read. I'm sorry. No matter what side of the fence your on, or if your straddling the middle... I'm a journalist myself, and that article was terrible journalism.

Really? I rather enjoyed that article. It is one person's opinion, not based on a series of facts... I'll bet most people here have their own opinions based on heresay and what they read on Thai Visa, a bunch of loose facts, rumors, opinions, etc., etc., I'd rather read an article like that, than a boring one with NO OPINION at all. I find what he said rather provocative and interesting... doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

[Redsunset]

Because it wont be 9 months. It will at best be the end of 2011. And then watch for excuses to not hold the elections as required by the constitution they drag their feet to amend.

Another crackdown with live ammunition like Songran 2009, or 10. april 2010 will do more harm to Thailands international reputation then another year for red shirt protests or even the yellowshirt airport occupation.

I wish I had your ability to see the future - I would be a very rich man.

It is moronic to say "this won't happen", "this will happen" your crystal balls are no clearer than anyone else's. If the government promise 9 months and then renege on that promise, it will be the time to question their credibility - not until.

I 'crackdown', in my opinion, would have a positive affect on Thailand's international reputation. That, of course, is not important to most protaganists.

It is impossible to see the future, because so much of what is influencing the future has not been reported or is being brokered behind closed doors!!!!!!!

[animatic]

Giving live ammunition to soldiers that face protesters armed with sticks and stones are a clear violence to human rights. Seen the reduced use of reference to heavily armed terrorists and bombs? The change to "hit in the neck by sharpened bamboo sticks and concussions due to stones"?

Another crackdown with live ammunition like Songran 2009, or 10. april 2010 will do more harm to Thailands international reputation then another year for red shirt protests or even the yellowshirt airport occupation.

Are you really blind???

How about AK 47's - grenades - petrol bombs - lit gas tanks -

I guess those soldiers died being talked to death by red shirt gibberish

BKJohn,

You need to check your work after you run your spell checker.

That was a badly formated quote from another post he was quoting. Not from BKJohn.

Now repaired, but uncredited.

So you figure Robert E. Lee is apropos to this argument?

Civil war I guess is on the menu. I would think BAD Generals ins more in point.

Maybe Gideon Pillow would be as appropriate.

Or maybe 'The Beast of New Orleans 'Benjamin Franklin Butler

Immortalized on southern chamber pots for a decade.

Edited April 20, 2010 by animatic

[hammered]

Those little stickers up around Bangkok are not going to help the red cause at all.

[jdinasia]

It would be nice if the red leaders would request mothers and children leave the demo site. There really is no need to place them at risk and onoly a fool thinks there is no risk. The government should also offer them free trips home.

Surely that is one basic humane thing all could agree on.

Sadly, no.... this is NOT the case... life is CHEAP here in Southeast Asia... take, for example, the advice I received from many Thais when I arrived in the early 1990s was if I got into a car accident upcountry and someone was hurt or died, to just run away!!! Do that in the U.S. and you might as well run right into jail!

The reds NEED the violence and I am sure it would suit their call for martyrs if women and children were killed. Yes, that is sick! Sadly, it is also probably very accurate.

[SICA]

That was one of the most biased articles I have ever read. I'm sorry. No matter what side of the fence your on, or if your straddling the middle... I'm a journalist myself, and that article was terrible journalism.

Really? I rather enjoyed that article. It is one person's opinion, not based on a series of facts... I'll bet most people here have their own opinions based on heresay and what they read on Thai Visa, a bunch of loose facts, rumors, opinions, etc., etc., I'd rather read an article like that, than a boring one with NO OPINION at all. I find what he said rather provocative and interesting... doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

Spot on. Well said. I STILL can't understand why people can't see that article as opinion.

[brahmburgers]

Up until now, I was in favor of firm action by gov't security forces. Now I'm not, and here's why:

The Red protest is fizzling out. Probably half the small # of attendees are there against their will. Either holding out because they're still getting 500 baht per day (better than they get at home), plus there's somewhat of a party mood (better than sitting at home), and they've got a bit of limelight shining on them - with news cameras all around. The others on site are also in the employ of the Big T who's relaxing in coffee houses in Europe, hoping upon hope he'll get some of the money back which was taken - which was the main impetus for the protest getting started, was it not? Are they still wearing red shirts with T's face silkscreened on them? or did they figure out that Thaksin's mug was not helping their cause, and that now it's more advantageous to say they're not beholden to (and crazy about) Thaksin.

Now I hope the army doesn't get tough with the Reds because the Reds are losing steam day by day, and there are still a lot of 'human shields' in place that would make it sad for all Thais if they were harmed. Instead, station buses nearby and make it crystal clear that any time 20 Reds get on a bus, that bus will be taken to the local station and a ticket and box lunch will be given to return to the provinces. Perhaps add a small TV or a cell phone, or some other incentive.

Am still surprised there is electric power for the stages. If the power is coming in on cables, cut the cables. If it's generators, disable the generators (snipers, sabateurs?). Without microphones and PA system the Red movement will crumple faster than a blimp out of gas. Thai public speakers (and musicians) cannot function without a mic and PA system. If you don't believe me, ask yourself, have you ever heard a Thai musician performing (or a public speaker) without a PA system? Didn't think so.

[dhrobertson]

This "Elite" you are saying is loosing money ... isn't Thaksin the epyphany of all elitist ? I mean the chap you are obviously supporting who became richer by ruling this country as his private enterprise than any before him?

And now, people like you are trying anything for him to get it back - the country and his 2 billion $

The reds will not succeed because they don't have a real cause and the whole movement consists of a core of may be less than 1000 paramilitary terrorists and their leaders. You can not claim that the Isaanies who were led to bangkok like cattle to the slaughterhouse real supporters since they do not have a clue what your real agenda is or for that matter why they ar here besides getting paid. If there was any real support, they would not have left for Sonkram and you reds would not have to stop the once that are left from leaving as well since without human shields you'd be in deep kimchi

That's great! Thaksin the epiphany of all elitists! I think you mean epitome but lets all hope that this is his epiphany when he realises that his days as corrupt leader are over!

[Insight]

Those little stickers up around Bangkok are not going to help the red cause at all.

They have really set the Thai message boards alive. Even if it was a plan to discredit the reds, they're going to have a very tough job denying it given how close some of their other publications have come to suggesting something similar.

[Goooner]

Those little stickers up around Bangkok are not going to help the red cause at all.

They have really set the Thai message boards alive. Even if it was a plan to discredit the reds, they're going to have a very tough job denying it given how close some of their other publications have come to suggesting something similar.

What do the stickers say?

[whiterussian]

The reds will not succeed because they don't have a real cause and the whole movement consists of a core of may be less than 1000 paramilitary terrorists and their leaders. You can not claim that the Isaanies who were led to bangkok like cattle to the slaughterhouse real supporters since they do not have a clue what your real agenda is...

That just aint true. Whenever I go into a small shop here in CM, I see little postcards from Thako on the counter, I see red ribbons tied to car aerials. The Thai's love local politics, and it does pay well... sadly the Thai bar owner didn't win the local election a while back for the moobaan, probably because he is a drunk.. but nevertheless, the whole street helped rig up a pickup with speakers and naff posterboards of his smiling mugshot.

He lost and the best lady won. Her new road stopped just at his bar.

It will go on and on.

The natives are restless.

And if they win the next election and the yellows spit dummies, it means i will have to see more postcards and red mementos all over the place. But at least Bangkok folk are happy, thats the main thing...

[hammered]

Those little stickers up around Bangkok are not going to help the red cause at all.

They have really set the Thai message boards alive. Even if it was a plan to discredit the reds, they're going to have a very tough job denying it given how close some of their other publications have come to suggesting something similar.

What do the stickers say?

Not sure that should be posted here

[pornsasi]

Hysterical, heavily biased nonsense - just another day at the office for the Nation writers. This is not journalism.

Secunded

[Redsunset]

It would be nice if the red leaders would request mothers and children leave the demo site. There really is no need to place them at risk and onoly a fool thinks there is no risk. The government should also offer them free trips home.

Surely that is one basic humane thing all could agree on.

Sadly, no.... this is NOT the case... life is CHEAP here in Southeast Asia... take, for example, the advice I received from many Thais when I arrived in the early 1990s was if I got into a car accident upcountry and someone was hurt or died, to just run away!!! Do that in the U.S. and you might as well run right into jail!

The reds NEED the violence and I am sure it would suit their call for martyrs if women and children were killed. Yes, that is sick! Sadly, it is also probably very accurate.

Well, THEY, the leaders, should be the martyrs, not innocent people... it just does not work that way to have ignorant followers serve as martyrs for your cause... in this case, the people who die are called "casulties of war" or "collateral damage" not martyrs... the red shirts are way off base. But that is what warped people do...

[pornsasi]

Well well , once troops have shot a few more protesters , Abhisit can emigrate to Iran . Over there they like a few unelected "gurus" imposing their will on the legally elected folks

[pornsasi]

That's great! Thaksin the epiphany of all elitists! I think you mean epitome but lets all hope that this is his epiphany when he realises that his days as corrupt leader are over!

Thaksin is not the PM and he is not even in Thailand .

Abhisit is ...

Talking bout elitist ....

[hammered]

Well those stickers and Chavalits maybe mistimed step certainly seem to have the Thai forums going

Abhisit and the red leaders are all in a game they cant control any longer from the looks of it.

[pornsasi]

It would be nice if the red leaders would request mothers and children leave the demo site. There really is no need to place them at risk and onoly a fool thinks there is no risk. The government should also offer them free trips home.

Surely that is one basic humane thing all could agree on.

Sadly, no.... this is NOT the case... life is CHEAP here in Southeast Asia... take, for example, the advice I received from many Thais when I arrived in the early 1990s was if I got into a car accident upcountry and someone was hurt or died, to just run away!!! Do that in the U.S. and you might as well run right into jail!

The reds NEED the violence and I am sure it would suit their call for martyrs if women and children were killed. Yes, that is sick! Sadly, it is also probably very accurate.

Its a popular protest not an army deployement . The people is not only composed of adult males 18-25 .

[Redsunset]

in any reasonable democracy and democratic procedures one doesn't have to invest billions and instigate hatred and divisions to supposedly correct wrongs, people will get up themselves. Na Mr. Thaksin, ya hear me?

Yes... Thaksin is not trying to "right a wrong" by pouring billions of baht to bribe people to protest for his cause. Thaksin is a tyrant, dictator whose ego is fueled by power, money and control. He has a warped sense of self.

Having said this, applying any sensible or democratic model to describe this man is futile.

[traderjm]

Most people dont think and know this. The Nation reporter should do what I did,I walked around the red shirt area in Chit lom last night, there are so many of them and they are so well organised that I couldnt help but think that have already won. I just wish Abhisit would have elections and let the country move on. Using force against the red shirts will only strengthen their resolve and will inevitably lead to loss of life and probably to a return of Thaksin.

hahahaha.... wishful thinking....

[jdinasia]

It would be nice if the red leaders would request mothers and children leave the demo site. There really is no need to place them at risk and onoly a fool thinks there is no risk. The government should also offer them free trips home.

Surely that is one basic humane thing all could agree on.

Sadly, no.... this is NOT the case... life is CHEAP here in Southeast Asia... take, for example, the advice I received from many Thais when I arrived in the early 1990s was if I got into a car accident upcountry and someone was hurt or died, to just run away!!! Do that in the U.S. and you might as well run right into jail!

The reds NEED the violence and I am sure it would suit their call for martyrs if women and children were killed. Yes, that is sick! Sadly, it is also probably very accurate.

Its a popular protest not an army deployement . The people is not only composed of adult males 18-25 .

No, it is a paid protest where the organizers have collected the ID cards of the people that are paid to be there.

[Redsunset]

This is what those stickers say, according to Thai Visa, Tuesday Rally report: "New Thai State under President Thaksin Shinawatra"

Honestly, I had to laugh when I read that, because it is so third-graderish... I mean really, that is the dumbest thing I've read in a long time...

[traderjm]

Am still surprised there is electric power for the stages. If the power is coming in on cables, cut the cables. If it's generators, disable the generators (snipers, sabateurs?). Without microphones and PA system the Red movement will crumple faster than a blimp out of gas. Thai public speakers (and musicians) cannot function without a mic and PA system. If you don't believe me, ask yourself, have you ever heard a Thai musician performing (or a public speaker) without a PA system? Didn't think so.

This part has always baffled me, they just seem to be tapping into power lines where ever the want and just set stuff up where ever they choose and nobody stops it.. it simply is not that hard to turn off the power as it were and make them sit around listening to their own thoughts... that would send a lot more home.. right now many of them are being fired up on a daily basis by a long list of lies being repeated over and over again...

It is true the numbers have dropped a huge amount. My last drive by on the fly over on Petchaburi by Ratchadamre I could see over the little hill that empties out by Platinum and a fair ways down the road, this was on Monday, a week ago on the same fly over it was jammed and red shirts as far as the eye could see there is no doubt for whatever reasons the numbers are way way down in that area

[rabo]

Giving live ammunition to soldiers that face protesters armed with sticks and stones are a clear violence to human rights. Seen the reduced use of reference to heavily armed terrorists and bombs? The change to "hit in the neck by sharpened bamboo sticks and concussions due to stones"?

Another crackdown with live ammunition like Songran 2009, or 10. april 2010 will do more harm to Thailands international reputation then another year for red shirt protests or even the yellowshirt airport occupation.

Are you really blind???

How about AK 47's - grenades - petrol bombs - lit gas tanks -

I guess those soldiers died being talked to death by red shirt gibberish

BKJohn,

You need to check your work after you run your spell checker.

That was a badly formated quote from another post he was quoting. Not from BKJohn.

Now repaired, but uncredited.

So you figure Robert E. Lee is apropos to this argument?

Civil war I guess is on the menu. I would think BAD Generals ins more in point.

Maybe Gideon Pillow would be as appropriate.

[image]

Or maybe 'The Beast of New Orleans 'Benjamin Franklin Butler

Immortalized on southern chamber pots for a decade.

[image]

BKjohn, apologies for getting the wrong author, but trusting the spellchecker is a mistake I make all the time.

Mixed mental imagery probably led to the avatar. To me Lee was a person of integrity in a time of conflict. Agree that Butler, famous for stealing silverware (did I get that right), is more appropriate locally. But they could probably use a Lincoln about now.

Edited April 20, 2010 by rabo

[kimincm]

It's funny how people massage numbers to make their point. During the 'height' of the demos no anti-red commentator would admit to their being anywhere near 100,000 people on the streets at any one time. Now, to make a point about how much their numbers have dwindled, they apparently had well over 100,000 at the time.

There are lies, damned lies and then there's propaganda.

If we are massaging numbers I seem to remember something about the 1,000,000+ rally/demonstration.

Which of your three categories does this little flight of fantasy fall into.

[traderjm]

It's funny how people massage numbers to make their point. During the 'height' of the demos no anti-red commentator would admit to their being anywhere near 100,000 people on the streets at any one time. Now, to make a point about how much their numbers have dwindled, they apparently had well over 100,000 at the time.

There are lies, damned lies and then there's propaganda.

I agree with your main point that the numbers really do get massaged but in fairness every report I have ever read always stated that the first week or so had 65k to 80k swelling to over 100k for the first parade... with things dwindling from there over time.

Although I am not sure who you are referring to as an anti red commentator so maybe I missed their guesstimates.

[TonyH]

That's great! Thaksin the epiphany of all elitists! I think you mean epitome but lets all hope that this is his epiphany when he realises that his days as corrupt leader are over!

Thaksin is not the PM and he is not even in Thailand .

Abhisit is ...

Talking bout elitist ....

Wot, did you just look up those big words then? Aint you the Clever one.

[siampolee]

BANGKOK: -- Ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra on Tuesday issued a statement condemning what he termed a campaign to smear him by promoting his name as the president of a "New Thai State".

"I condemn ill-intentioned people for what I see as a most malicious political smear," he said in the statement.

Thaksin said ill-intentioned people had distributed stickers with vicious message against him at Silom Road.

Well well Thaksin.

Does the truth hurt you and your fellow republicans i.e Arisman, Weng, Jutaporn to name but three of your little acolyte puppets ?