The Longer The Red-Shirts Rally, The Higher The Damage

[BKjohn]

Rumor off of Facebook....

Thaksin just suffered from shock after receiving chemotherapy in Dubai....

Can anyone verify... only a rumor...

Way to good to be true

Edited April 21, 2010 by BKjohn

[anotherpeter]

Rumor off of Facebook....

Thaksin just suffered from shock after receiving chemotherapy in Dubai....

Can anyone verify... only a rumor...

That's was a rumour last week (or the week before).

All denied by the reds (ofcourse), but nothing anywhere to back it up.

So, just a rumour.

[Goooner]

Rumor off of Facebook....

Thaksin just suffered from shock after receiving chemotherapy in Dubai....

Can anyone verify... only a rumor...

Rumor off of Facebook...

Thaksin just apologised for all the trouble he has caused... and offered to pay back all the money he stole...

Can anyone verify... only a rumor...

[FreedomDude]

I guess it's also no surprise this article mentions nothing of PM Abhisit's use of the word "TERRORISTS" and the irrational panic this has created in potential travelers from the west.

I received an email from very concerned older family members back home about my safety after they read something about red shirt TERRORISTS.

Let's face it. As long as tourists stay away from the faceoff area and its surrounding hotels and malls, there is no reason to fear anything but a safe and lovely holiday. The severe dropoff in tourism is far greater than it sould be given the facts on the ground. Prime Minister Abhisit has contributed GREATLY to the overhype of traveler fears.

But Thaksin has paid for it.

Abhisit's language has been carefully crafted by a PR agency...he constantly refers to "terrorists" which then gets picked up by the government media and its sympathizers in the Bangkok Post and Nation....the word has been carefully selected because,a s we all know, it's OK to kill terrorists, and so when the army butcher the protesters he won't catch so much flack for the rest of the world's press, democratic governments, and quangos. It's sad to see how desperate this guy is to hang on to power...

How do you call someone who's trying to kill thousands of people and burn down the city by blowing up petrol storage facility by a rocket propelled grenade?

Please... write more apologies for that.

And thank you tomazbodner for continuing to add to the hysteria keeping travelers away.

It is TRULY disgusting and you know dam_n well the reds are NOT trying to

"kill thousands of people" OR

"burn down the city".

[anotherpeter]

And thank you tomazbodner for continuing to add to the hysteria keeping travelers away.

It is TRULY disgusting and you know dam_n well the reds are NOT trying to

"kill thousands of people" OR

"burn down the city".

A red leader did threaten to burn down Bangkok at the start of this mess. Maybe his minions are doing what has been suggested.

That doesn't mean all red shirts are like that, but when a leader suggests it, some people are going to follow.

[thaihome]

Congratulations to the NBT! There must be some real “smart party” people working at that one-sided news agency. Why can't they report on the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects.

In the short-term the economy will suffer, yes. So a few hotels are being disrupted. I think people need to look at the bigger picture; Thailand as a whole with the majority of its people working in the agricultural sector - the heart of the economy.

And all social revolutions cause disruption to the economy (and to society), like all storms cause damage to the environment. But in the long-term, as ecologists know, storms are part of the life creating cycle, producing greater biodiversity and opportunities for new species to thrive. In the case of a social revolution, an opportunity for the lower classes to climb out the poverty trap and show their true potential - for the benefit of the whole. This is how the developed nations of the world came about.

I know you really, really want this to be some sort of social revolution, where a truly down trodden people rise and take control and everyone lives happily ever after.

But, can you please provide some data to backup your rather startling statement.

"the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects."

Here, let me help you out a little bit with a chart comparing the income inequality of Thailand to a few neighboring countries as well a few western ones. The only country that has a better income equality is communist run Vietnam.

TH

[pimay11]

Congratulations to the NBT! There must be some real "smart party" people working at that one-sided news agency. Why can't they report on the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects.

In the short-term the economy will suffer, yes. So a few hotels are being disrupted. I think people need to look at the bigger picture; Thailand as a whole with the majority of its people working in the agricultural sector - the heart of the economy.

And all social revolutions cause disruption to the economy (and to society), like all storms cause damage to the environment. But in the long-term, as ecologists know, storms are part of the life creating cycle, producing greater biodiversity and opportunities for new species to thrive. In the case of a social revolution, an opportunity for the lower classes to climb out the poverty trap and show their true potential - for the benefit of the whole. This is how the developed nations of the world came about.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What revolution ???

This is not a revolution, but a criminal mob that is rioting in Bangkok. This is nothing but "lazy bumb's of Isaan unite" and lets have "papa Thaksin for president because he is going to give us money again so we can buy more lau kao"

The stickers are up already, which you will of course say were placed by the government .....

A revolution, if you look back in history has in virtually all cases emerged from the student classes - the governments of countries which fell to revolutions had usually a very bad record of treating their people and any attempt at voicing a problem in public was severely dealt with. Demonstrations, no matter how peaceful were immediately dispersed and leaders arrested and executed - see Pinochet in Chile or the French revolution.

Those Isaanies have been rioting for months now and had they really been peaceful and not been aggressive with the aim to cause damage, nothing would happen to them. They are neither demonstrators not are they revolutionaries they do deserve neither name but they are a criminal bunch of rioters on the payroll of Thaksin cocooned in a protective mantel of Isaan's dumbest who simply like the cash

BKjohn a little different perspective of the lazy bumbs of Isaan unite as you say. You have to remember 90% of the people who have left Isaan for the rally have a fourth grade education. Not their fault. My father had an eight grade education due to economic issues back on the farm in 1915. The same applies for these folks. They may not have a highschool education but they recognize a money making scheme when they see one. After all, at this time there is absolutely nothing they can do here due to a late rainy season. So why not join a protest, whatever the cause and make 500 or so Bhat a day and free food. As for being lazy when the rice planting and harvesting season is upon us these people work 14/16 hours a day every day in blistering heat to make sure they have food for another year. I can't agree they are lazy, they just do not have steady work. And yes they drink a lot but what else is there to do. The sad part is that they do not understand they are now in grave danger and have let these red leaders fill them with lies and peaked their emotions to a frenzy. Sad but true.

[Goooner]

And thank you tomazbodner for continuing to add to the hysteria keeping travelers away.

It is TRULY disgusting and you know dam_n well the reds are NOT trying to

"kill thousands of people" OR

"burn down the city".

So when the red leaders called on the Northern Reds to each bring an empty 1ltr bottle to the protest, fill it with gasoline and turn Bangkok into a city of fire what they actually meant was to bring a bottle of milk...

Some of you guys have the long term memory of a goldfish!

[retarius]

I was wondering whether any of "Thaksin-is-behind-everything-and-Red-Shirts-should be killed" brigade would like to speculate on who is posting the Thaksin for President stickers all over Silom?

[bangkoklight]

Don't you realize that you have just made a statement showing what those red thugs are really about?

Sending their daughters to work in brothels or bars shows how morally clean these knuckleheads are and by the way, they do so not to buy food but to have that new TV or motorcycle - as I said before, had a factory with more than 100 employees and we had to pay them twice a month because even though we had free decent accommodation rent free for them on top of 6k a month wages some 12 years ago + insurance + holiday pay - they were never able to manage their money and all, wit no exception owed to the money lender. Booze, women and gambling were their priorities - in short - sanook - work came way down the list and saving wasn't even on it.

Even among those couples who together earned over 12k a month and lived rent free a lot of daughters were working in Pat Pont or Cowboy -

I know personally two companies, one in the UK and another in Germany who used to import Thai made products. They have all switched to India, Bali, Sri Lanka, Vietnam .. because labor is a lot cheaper and quality better. Bali produces far better wood work products than Thailand and cheaper where India is a lot cheaper and makes a huge variety of products. Now, lets not forget China, much lower labor costs than in Thailand. They also have cheap highly skilled labor.

The tourism industry is what provides a good living for those Isaani knucklehead red shirts (this does of course only mean the minority making the trouble) - government figures/percentages can not include the "grey" income from tourism since none of the hookers, soup stalls, souvenier shops, massage parlors, taxis, rental shops etc etc etc pay any taxes and do not register their income.

Most of the workers in the tourist industry are from Isaan and their own people, the red shirts are busy destroying their source of income

Investors looking at Thailand with higher wages, more restrictions and lots of trouble on the streets ( I refuse to call it political trouble because this has nothing to do with politics) caused by armed thugs will not be impressed

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

And don't say in your reply "200 dollars/month is a reasonable wage in this country". I'm merely asking what you would spend this money on. Please tell me.

Edited April 21, 2010 by bangkoklight

[tomyummer]

These Thai Olympics are so damaging from within the country, just imagine the damage to Thailand's brand. Like someone mentioned before, Thailand's neighbors will benefit from this situation the most if the Thais don't get their act together quickly.

Here's an interesting article with a viewpoint looking at Thailand. It's from a South Korean newspaper, the Chosun Ilbo:

Right from the newspaper, English edition:

Beware of Populism

Protesters clashed with soldiers in Bangkok on Saturday in a standoff that killed 21 people and injured around 870 after the Thai government had announced a state of emergency. In April last year, anti-government protesters stormed into the conference venue of the ASEAN+3 Summit causing the high-profile meeting to be cancelled, and 16 heads of state, including Korean President Lee Myung-bak, had to be airlifted to safety from the rooftop. In December, 2008, an ASEAN foreign ministers' meeting in Thailand had to be canceled due to protests.

At the center of anti-government protests is former Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra. He became prime minister in 2001 and was re-elected in 2005. But in January of 2006, his family was sold US$1.9 billion worth of shares in a telecom company to Singapore's state investment company without paying any taxes. More revelations followed showing that he funneled lucrative business contracts to his own businesses, avoided taxes, took bribes and rigged bids. In February, the Thai Supreme Court ordered the confiscation of Thaksin's illegal fortune worth 46 billion baht (W1.61 trillion).

Thaksin has been roaming the world since being stripped of power at the end of 2006, and the anti-government protesters who have swept through the Thai capital want to see him return. At present, Thailand is in a virtual state of civil war as the red shirted anti-government protesters face off against citizens clad in yellow shirts supporting the incumbent government. Thaksin is leading his supporters, mostly poor farmers from northern and northeastern Thailand, via appearances on satellite broadcasts and through phone messages.

The reason why Thaksin's supporters long for his return despite his massive corruption scandals is that they have become hooked on his populist policies. After taking office, Thaksin rolled over farmers' debts for three years, provided state medical insurance to all Thais for a basic fee of just 30 baht (W1,050) and handed out 1 million baht (W35 million) to each village under the pretext of narrowing the income gap between city dwellers and farmers. The generous policies ended up emptying Thailand's state coffers. Thaksin was finally driven out of office as he faced mounting discontent among the middle class, who grew tired of the deteriorating quality of medical services despite rising taxes.

But low-income Thais had already become addicted to free handouts. There is no cure for a public that has become addicted to populist policies. Thailand is not the only country to experience such a problem. Argentina, which had almost reached advanced-country status in the late 1990s as well as other Latin American countries ended up falling back to Third World status after trying to meet the demands of citizens who had grown accustomed to populism.

In Korea, ruling and opposition parties are racing to come out with policies to win the hearts and minds of voters ahead of the June 2 regional elections. The Democratic Party has proposed using W1.5 trillion in taxpayer's money to provide free lunches to 5.48 million students, while the Grand National Party has produced nine policy goals aimed at helping the poor at a cost of W1.22 trillion in state spending. To those watching the red- and yellow-shirted protesters in Thailand, those pledges have an ominous ring.

[email protected] / Apr. 15, 2010 12:38 KST

[animatic]

I guess it's also no surprise this article mentions nothing of PM Abhisit's use of the word "TERRORISTS" and the irrational panic this has created in potential travelers from the west.

I received an email from very concerned older family members back home about my safety after they read something about red shirt TERRORISTS.

Let's face it. As long as tourists stay away from the faceoff area and its surrounding hotels and malls, there is no reason to fear anything but a safe and lovely holiday. The severe dropoff in tourism is far greater than it sould be given the facts on the ground. Prime Minister Abhisit has contributed GREATLY to the overhype of traveler fears.

But Thaksin has paid for it.

Abhisit's language has been carefully crafted by a PR agency...he constantly refers to "terrorists" which then gets picked up by the government media and its sympathizers in the Bangkok Post and Nation....the word has been carefully selected because,a s we all know, it's OK to kill terrorists, and so when the army butcher the protesters he won't catch so much flack for the rest of the world's press, democratic governments, and quangos. It's sad to see how desperate this guy is to hang on to power...

No need for careful crafting actually.

Those gunmen shooting the riot squads

and apparently random red shirts to run up the body count,

did a great jiob of creating REAL terror in many peoples minds.

It's no stretch to actual call them by what they were

people terrorizing other people for their agenda.

[pimay11]

Culprits fired RPG at PTT petrol depots in Pathum Thani

These are the things those reds are up to now. If the tank had blown it would have caused huge loss of life.

Now I'm just waiting for those reds here to cme out of their holes and say "oh tha government did this to discredit the red " such a statement wouldn't surprise me at all

The reds can end all this now by simply leaving and going home - anything that happens when the government /army moves in to clear them is 100% their fault

Get the <deleted>.. out of Bangkok

News to your ears eh BKjohn? If the tank had blown... If these people weren't repressed in the first place... If they got a fair wage for the work they did... If they didn't have the send their daughters to work in the sex industry in the City to make ends meet... With all these "ifs", you can see the "whys".

bangkoklight if your explaination of the reason for the protest was correct you would not have anyone on this forum disagreeing with you. But surely you are not naive enough to believe what you have written. As has been stated a zillion or so times it is all about Mr. T coming back and getting his billions back plus paying off his minions.

[Chaimai]

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

OMG! Not another pitiful neuvo-peasant trying to interfere with Darwinian progress.

The Thais will evolve (probably better) without your Socialist/Communist interference.

[anotherpeter]

From the daily live update:

The atmosphere at the red-shirt rally site at Ratchaprasong Intersection this morning was relatively quiet except for red-shirt core leader Natthawut Saikua taking to the stage to refute claims made by the Center for the Resolution of Emergency Situation that the group is hoarding weapons.

He challenged the center to produce evidence to back its claim that demonstrators are collecting sharpened sticks, explosives and corrosive acid before commenting that the claim was likely made to justify a protest dispersal.

Given that he is CLEARLY lying about the sharpened sticks, I wonder how many other nice little party tricks the protestors have in store.

[pimay11]

Don't you realize that you have just made a statement showing what those red thugs are really about?

Sending their daughters to work in brothels or bars shows how morally clean these knuckleheads are and by the way, they do so not to buy food but to have that new TV or motorcycle - as I said before, had a factory with more than 100 employees and we had to pay them twice a month because even though we had free decent accommodation rent free for them on top of 6k a month wages some 12 years ago + insurance + holiday pay - they were never able to manage their money and all, wit no exception owed to the money lender. Booze, women and gambling were their priorities - in short - sanook - work came way down the list and saving wasn't even on it.

Even among those couples who together earned over 12k a month and lived rent free a lot of daughters were working in Pat Pont or Cowboy -

I know personally two companies, one in the UK and another in Germany who used to import Thai made products. They have all switched to India, Bali, Sri Lanka, Vietnam .. because labor is a lot cheaper and quality better. Bali produces far better wood work products than Thailand and cheaper where India is a lot cheaper and makes a huge variety of products. Now, lets not forget China, much lower labor costs than in Thailand. They also have cheap highly skilled labor.

The tourism industry is what provides a good living for those Isaani knucklehead red shirts (this does of course only mean the minority making the trouble) - government figures/percentages can not include the "grey" income from tourism since none of the hookers, soup stalls, souvenier shops, massage parlors, taxis, rental shops etc etc etc pay any taxes and do not register their income.

Most of the workers in the tourist industry are from Isaan and their own people, the red shirts are busy destroying their source of income

Investors looking at Thailand with higher wages, more restrictions and lots of trouble on the streets ( I refuse to call it political trouble because this has nothing to do with politics) caused by armed thugs will not be impressed

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

And don't say in your reply "200 dollars/month is a reasonable wage in this country". I'm merely asking what you would spend this money on. Please tell me.

Again bangkoklight I agree with your statement about the thugs repressing the poor people of this country. But this is not what the red rally is about. Surely you can see this right?

[Netfan]

Congratulations to the NBT! There must be some real “smart party” people working at that one-sided news agency. Why can't they report on the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects.

In the short-term the economy will suffer, yes. So a few hotels are being disrupted. I think people need to look at the bigger picture; Thailand as a whole with the majority of its people working in the agricultural sector - the heart of the economy.

And all social revolutions cause disruption to the economy (and to society), like all storms cause damage to the environment. But in the long-term, as ecologists know, storms are part of the life creating cycle, producing greater biodiversity and opportunities for new species to thrive. In the case of a social revolution, an opportunity for the lower classes to climb out the poverty trap and show their true potential - for the benefit of the whole. This is how the developed nations of the world came about.

Nice Post BangkokLight....very true indeed....many of the posters in here think that the poor should just put up with the status quo and let the elite eat the whole pie...would it hurt these pigs if they only had 95% of the pie instead of 100%?

Nice. I can just see you two cheering on the "People's Army" as they marched into Phnom Penh in '75. How naive can you be?

[brd199]

From the daily live update:

The atmosphere at the red-shirt rally site at Ratchaprasong Intersection this morning was relatively quiet except for red-shirt core leader Natthawut Saikua taking to the stage to refute claims made by the Center for the Resolution of Emergency Situation that the group is hoarding weapons.

He challenged the center to produce evidence to back its claim that demonstrators are collecting sharpened sticks, explosives and corrosive acid before commenting that the claim was likely made to justify a protest dispersal.

Given that he is CLEARLY lying about the sharpened sticks, I wonder how many other nice little party tricks the protestors have in store.

Those pesky Matichon photographers show today's sharpening activity

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3525155

[FreedomDude]

And thank you tomazbodner for continuing to add to the hysteria keeping travelers away.

It is TRULY disgusting and you know dam_n well the reds are NOT trying to

"kill thousands of people" OR

"burn down the city".

Do I really need to attach you the Arisaman's video, telling protesters to bring empty water bottles to fill up with gasoline in Bangkok and burn down the city?

And he is redshirt, isn't he? The fatso escaping from SC Park hotel? The leader of the redshirts that broke into parliament? The redshirt nutcase on the stage in Rajprasong every evening (except yesterday, when he mysteriously disappeared the moment the army chopper started making circles around the area)?

So YOU know dam_n well that the reds ARE trying to "burn down the city", but of course that doesn't suit your image of peaceful, peace loving, nice rural people with no intention whatsoever to cause any disturbance to anyone else.

And PS: many of the reds in the area do carry water bottles filled with some yellowish liquid which I doubt is their pee...

Your premise is something awful Arisaman said. I don't deny what he said.

Your conclusion based on this premise is NOT correct. In the days upon days of these speeches, which I sure are recorded and documented, one of the many leaders says something admittedly bad, and you JUMP to the CONCLUSION that the followers AGREE with him and are going to try to "burn down the city" and "kill thousands of people". Every large scale political organization has its fringe elements. I seriously doubt that the reds have significant numbers of followers who agree with arisaman on that point and intend to follow it.

[FreedomDude]

Congratulations to the NBT! There must be some real “smart party” people working at that one-sided news agency. Why can't they report on the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects.

In the short-term the economy will suffer, yes. So a few hotels are being disrupted. I think people need to look at the bigger picture; Thailand as a whole with the majority of its people working in the agricultural sector - the heart of the economy.

And all social revolutions cause disruption to the economy (and to society), like all storms cause damage to the environment. But in the long-term, as ecologists know, storms are part of the life creating cycle, producing greater biodiversity and opportunities for new species to thrive. In the case of a social revolution, an opportunity for the lower classes to climb out the poverty trap and show their true potential - for the benefit of the whole. This is how the developed nations of the world came about.

Nice Post BangkokLight....very true indeed....many of the posters in here think that the poor should just put up with the status quo and let the elite eat the whole pie...would it hurt these pigs if they only had 95% of the pie instead of 100%?

Nice. I can just see you two cheering on the "People's Army" as they marched into Phnom Penh in '75. How naive can you be?

Another awful comparison. Please don't commit the "Hitler comparison" debate violation as well. Don't you spend any time in forum debates? What's next: grammar and spelling fights?

[mythBuster]

Not such considerations were brought up when the from economic terrorism crimes suspect foreign minister Kasit occupied the airports and declared it fun.

Not such considerations when the yellow shirts occupied government house and sat in the middle of the road near MBK (Same district) for many many months.

Stop crying crocodile tears. The court could end this stand off just as quickly as they did it with Samak.

Disband the Democrat party, the offenses were committed from 2005 onwards which means that we are getting rid of Chuan, Abhisit, Sanan (who was still a DP member) people like Suthep and many many others.

We could start with a almost complete clean sheet of new fresh politicians.

[mythBuster]

Not such considerations were brought up when the from economic terrorism crimes suspect foreign minister Kasit occupied the airports and declared it fun.

Not such considerations when the yellow shirts occupied government house and sat in the middle of the road near MBK (Same district) for many many months.

Stop crying crocodile tears. The court could end this stand off just as quickly as they did it with Samak.

Disband the Democrat party, the offenses were committed from 2005 onwards which means that we are getting rid of Chuan, Abhisit, Sanan (who was still a DP member) people like Suthep and many many others.

We could start with a almost complete clean sheet of new fresh politicians.

[Chaimai]

Congratulations to the NBT! There must be some real "smart party" people working at that one-sided news agency. Why can't they report on the fact that the class divide in Thailand will ultimately leave the country behind its regional neighbours, who are getting their act together with social reform, social welfare programmes, and infrastructure projects.

In the short-term the economy will suffer, yes. So a few hotels are being disrupted. I think people need to look at the bigger picture; Thailand as a whole with the majority of its people working in the agricultural sector - the heart of the economy.

And all social revolutions cause disruption to the economy (and to society), like all storms cause damage to the environment. But in the long-term, as ecologists know, storms are part of the life creating cycle, producing greater biodiversity and opportunities for new species to thrive. In the case of a social revolution, an opportunity for the lower classes to climb out the poverty trap and show their true potential - for the benefit of the whole. This is how the developed nations of the world came about.

Nice Post BangkokLight....very true indeed....many of the posters in here think that the poor should just put up with the status quo and let the elite eat the whole pie...would it hurt these pigs if they only had 95% of the pie instead of 100%?

Nice. I can just see you two cheering on the "People's Army" as they marched into Phnom Penh in '75. How naive can you be?

Keep watching. I sense that there is more verbiage to come from these two. A shared vision certainly - even if it is grossly myopic.

[anotherpeter]

Your premise is something awful Arisaman said. I don't deny what he said.

Your conclusion based on this premise is NOT correct. In the days upon days of these speeches, which I sure are recorded and documented, one of the many leaders says something admittedly bad, and you JUMP to the CONCLUSION that the followers AGREE with him and are going to try to "burn down the city" and "kill thousands of people". Every large scale political organization has its fringe elements. I seriously doubt that the reds have significant numbers of followers who agree with arisaman on that point and intend to follow it.

Is that where the "fake" reds come into it?

If the red leaders tell their followers to do it, and it happens, then who is to blame?

The red leaders know they have fringe elements. That's why they continue to incite violence. Because they know their fringe elements will follow. There doesn't need to be many of them. Just a few to throw a grenade here, or a grenade there.

[pimay11]

Not such considerations were brought up when the from economic terrorism crimes suspect foreign minister Kasit occupied the airports and declared it fun.

Not such considerations when the yellow shirts occupied government house and sat in the middle of the road near MBK (Same district) for many many months.

Stop crying crocodile tears. The court could end this stand off just as quickly as they did it with Samak.

Disband the Democrat party, the offenses were committed from 2005 onwards which means that we are getting rid of Chuan, Abhisit, Sanan (who was still a DP member) people like Suthep and many many others.

We could start with a almost complete clean sheet of new fresh politicians.

Of course we could. Why didn't we think of this. How stupid of us. New politicians with Mr. T as the ultimate CEO leader.

By the way please post links to back up your accusations of offenses of Chuan and Abhisit?

[Ayutthaya69]

verry sad story n boaring too n Thai Baht strong everry day <deleted> lolll

[OzMick]

I was wondering whether any of "Thaksin-is-behind-everything-and-Red-Shirts-should be killed" brigade would like to speculate on who is posting the Thaksin for President stickers all over Silom?

I don't think that I fit the description, but I'll have a go.

It could be a very stupid red shirt - but that description fits most of them so it's a distinct possibility. and it does tie in with some of their propaganda.

It could part of the commie supporters with their social revolution BS, not sure why, but most of what they say is drivel. maybe they think they can use it to disassociate from T. The thing is with commies, they believe their own lies.

It could be a very clever yellow using it to discredit the reds, also a distinct possibility because it would stir their royalist supporters, but I'm not convinced they are that smart.

I'm ruling out the gov't, because they couldn't keep a secret if they tried.

[BKjohn]

Don't you realize that you have just made a statement showing what those red thugs are really about?

Sending their daughters to work in brothels or bars shows how morally clean these knuckleheads are and by the way, they do so not to buy food but to have that new TV or motorcycle - as I said before, had a factory with more than 100 employees and we had to pay them twice a month because even though we had free decent accommodation rent free for them on top of 6k a month wages some 12 years ago + insurance + holiday pay - they were never able to manage their money and all, wit no exception owed to the money lender. Booze, women and gambling were their priorities - in short - sanook - work came way down the list and saving wasn't even on it.

Even among those couples who together earned over 12k a month and lived rent free a lot of daughters were working in Pat Pont or Cowboy -

I know personally two companies, one in the UK and another in Germany who used to import Thai made products. They have all switched to India, Bali, Sri Lanka, Vietnam .. because labor is a lot cheaper and quality better. Bali produces far better wood work products than Thailand and cheaper where India is a lot cheaper and makes a huge variety of products. Now, lets not forget China, much lower labor costs than in Thailand. They also have cheap highly skilled labor.

The tourism industry is what provides a good living for those Isaani knucklehead red shirts (this does of course only mean the minority making the trouble) - government figures/percentages can not include the "grey" income from tourism since none of the hookers, soup stalls, souvenir shops, massage parlors, taxis, rental shops etc etc etc pay any taxes and do not register their income.

Most of the workers in the tourist industry are from Isaan and their own people, the red shirts are busy destroying their source of income

Investors looking at Thailand with higher wages, more restrictions and lots of trouble on the streets ( I refuse to call it political trouble because this has nothing to do with politics) caused by armed thugs will not be impressed

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

And don't say in your reply "200 dollars/month is a reasonable wage in this country". I'm merely asking what you would spend this money on. Please tell me.

Your state of mind worries me

could you explain where those people have been repressed - suppressed and oppressed ?? They live in a free country, can do any work they want, travel freely and have open borders and free speech - just because someone is poor does not mean someone has forced them to be poor, its up to the individual to get up and make something of themselves. I know personally a few Isaanies who came from this, as you call it "oppressed" farm life . One of them drives a "mobile" restaurant making great barmi and makes about 60 k a month - the other has an actual restaurant and makes about 100k .. well made, until the reds <deleted>.... up his business - a month. You should here his opinion about you reds - believe me it would curdle your blood if you heard what he would like to do to you guys....

You are saying basically if they government does not give them cash or the minimum wage is put up to 20,000.00 baht a month it is a bad government ? never mind that the economy would crash and famine be rife in Thailand if a government would be stupid enough to do so..

Just for your information, 6-7,000.00 baht up country in Thailand considering the cost of living - yes, not a fortune but good money and if anyone earns less, they should get off their asses and find another job ......

Remember one thing, communism does not work ! History has clearly shown that - look up "The Soviet Union" - this was a communist country - I'm pointing this out since you obviously were on the thrown when this came up in history ..........

Edited April 21, 2010 by BKjohn

[OzMick]

Don't you realize that you have just made a statement showing what those red thugs are really about?

Sending their daughters to work in brothels or bars shows how morally clean these knuckleheads are and by the way, they do so not to buy food but to have that new TV or motorcycle - as I said before, had a factory with more than 100 employees and we had to pay them twice a month because even though we had free decent accommodation rent free for them on top of 6k a month wages some 12 years ago + insurance + holiday pay - they were never able to manage their money and all, wit no exception owed to the money lender. Booze, women and gambling were their priorities - in short - sanook - work came way down the list and saving wasn't even on it.

Even among those couples who together earned over 12k a month and lived rent free a lot of daughters were working in Pat Pont or Cowboy -

I know personally two companies, one in the UK and another in Germany who used to import Thai made products. They have all switched to India, Bali, Sri Lanka, Vietnam .. because labor is a lot cheaper and quality better. Bali produces far better wood work products than Thailand and cheaper where India is a lot cheaper and makes a huge variety of products. Now, lets not forget China, much lower labor costs than in Thailand. They also have cheap highly skilled labor.

The tourism industry is what provides a good living for those Isaani knucklehead red shirts (this does of course only mean the minority making the trouble) - government figures/percentages can not include the "grey" income from tourism since none of the hookers, soup stalls, souvenier shops, massage parlors, taxis, rental shops etc etc etc pay any taxes and do not register their income.

Most of the workers in the tourist industry are from Isaan and their own people, the red shirts are busy destroying their source of income

Investors looking at Thailand with higher wages, more restrictions and lots of trouble on the streets ( I refuse to call it political trouble because this has nothing to do with politics) caused by armed thugs will not be impressed

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

And don't say in your reply "200 dollars/month is a reasonable wage in this country". I'm merely asking what you would spend this money on. Please tell me.

Your maths disgust me (amongst other things).

Your example is a thai on $200/m buying a house worth $16,000 or a little more.

How is that different from an Oz worker on $2,000/m buying a $160,000 house - about the going rate for both when I left 10 years ago. Should the workers rise up and slaughter the Packers and Murdochs?

[danc]

Don't you realize that you have just made a statement showing what those red thugs are really about?

Sending their daughters to work in brothels or bars shows how morally clean these knuckleheads are and by the way, they do so not to buy food but to have that new TV or motorcycle - as I said before, had a factory with more than 100 employees and we had to pay them twice a month because even though we had free decent accommodation rent free for them on top of 6k a month wages some 12 years ago + insurance + holiday pay - they were never able to manage their money and all, wit no exception owed to the money lender. Booze, women and gambling were their priorities - in short - sanook - work came way down the list and saving wasn't even on it.

Even among those couples who together earned over 12k a month and lived rent free a lot of daughters were working in Pat Pont or Cowboy -

I know personally two companies, one in the UK and another in Germany who used to import Thai made products. They have all switched to India, Bali, Sri Lanka, Vietnam .. because labor is a lot cheaper and quality better. Bali produces far better wood work products than Thailand and cheaper where India is a lot cheaper and makes a huge variety of products. Now, lets not forget China, much lower labor costs than in Thailand. They also have cheap highly skilled labor.

The tourism industry is what provides a good living for those Isaani knucklehead red shirts (this does of course only mean the minority making the trouble) - government figures/percentages can not include the "grey" income from tourism since none of the hookers, soup stalls, souvenier shops, massage parlors, taxis, rental shops etc etc etc pay any taxes and do not register their income.

Most of the workers in the tourist industry are from Isaan and their own people, the red shirts are busy destroying their source of income

Investors looking at Thailand with higher wages, more restrictions and lots of trouble on the streets ( I refuse to call it political trouble because this has nothing to do with politics) caused by armed thugs will not be impressed

Your words disgust me.

Who are the real thugs when people have been repressed, suppressed and oppressed for years?

And what you would spend your money on if you earned less than 200 dollars/month. What would you suggest they do? Save 500 baht/month for 80 years so they can buy a house?

Seems like your only interest here is the availability of cheap labour and your self gain. We know your priorities and hence your opinions.

And don't say in your reply "200 dollars/month is a reasonable wage in this country". I'm merely asking what you would spend this money on. Please tell me.

Your maths disgust me (amongst other things).

Your example is a thai on $200/m buying a house worth $16,000 or a little more.

How is that different from an Oz worker on $2,000/m buying a $160,000 house - about the going rate for both when I left 10 years ago. Should the workers rise up and slaughter the Packers and Murdochs?

Well, I don't know but there might be a queue if it is the Packers and especially, the Murdochs!