Media Freedom In Thailand Is At Stake

[jcbangkok]

< First of all, the government has maintained a correct policy in not interfering with the media. >

I may have missed something, but didn't the Govt. force off the air all "Red" TV and Radio stations that they could? Is this how "freedom of press/speech" works now according to this current Govt.?

I'm not saying that the "red" propaganda on their channels is any better/worse than the "yellow" propaganda we hear on the other TV channels, but to say they have not interfered is blatantly ludicrous.

I tend to ignore things like this said by the English attempting news outlets in Thailand ... especially when they say something contradictory in the same article. I have to assume there is some sort of break down in their English abilities or translations.

The government continues to think in one-dimensional terms in restricting information by the anti-government groups, which eventually led to the shut down of satellites and cable TV and radio stations. That was a wrong decision, which the government had to pay dearly for, even though the inciting media should have been challenged so it would not get away with biased reporting with impunity.

It's all contradictions and misinformation from what I see, hard to get to the real facts sometimes in the way news is reported here whether it's in Thai or in English, but hey, I'm an outsider here just looking in from the sidelines with no influence on the outcome of anything. I have my own thoughts and opinions of what is going on here in Thailand, but generally keep them to myself.

Probably the most intelligent things said here but would encourage you to share your thoughts ... that is what a forum is all about.

[Motoon]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

[viking75]

Calm down JC. I ask for links because you and your friends always do same because think clever.... you are not and you not like it when somebody do same to you.

if you happy with info from nation and astv that is up to you. can tell to you that every organisation outside democrat party thinks that they are oppresive.

enjoy yourself reading only what is agreeable with you.

ps, the last links we post on Dr Tul have now been blocked because free and fair democrat junta don't like that you know about this man.

So you are admitting to being a troll?

I hope you can provide link!!! Why not post with more thought instead of angry all time.

OT, looks like the LM strategy is taking back see to the terrorist spin today. All press lakeys reporting on school anti terrorist measures and national terroism list for Seh Deang.

The punishment for these crimes should be put on the people who make the accusation if not true!

At least the debate on TV seems live so maybe some information and views from others than democrats might make it to the public. if they not watching karaoke and thai soap.

[viking75]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

Edited May 3, 2010 by viking75

[dominique355]

"The government continues to think in one-dimensional terms in restricting information by the anti-government groups, which eventually led to the shut down of satellites and cable TV and radio stations. That was a wrong decision, which the government had to pay dearly for, even though the inciting media should have been challenged so it would not get away with biased reporting with impunity.

The Thai public has a high toleration against hate media due to its forgetfulness, allowing prejudiced TV and radio hosts to blurb out hatred and inciting messages to topple the government. In other countries, these journalists would be charged and brought to court. Thai media communities need to further improve their professionalism through better understanding of societal and political developments."

Am I missing something here? Why is it wrong to shut down a TV station, which incites violence and hatred, thus breaking they law and at the same time acknowledging than in other countries these journalist would be charged and brought to court?

[way2muchcoffee]

Here is a reference for free speech law in the US.

Essentially it states that any speech that will cause or incite 'imminent lawless action' is not protected, and that the government may censor any such speech.

Imminent lawless action is a term used in the United States Supreme Court case Brandenburg v. Ohio (1969) to define the limits of constitutionally protected speech. The rule overturned the decision of the earlier Schenck v. United States (1919), which had established "clear and present danger" as the constitutional limit for speech. Under the imminent lawless action test, speech is not protected by the First Amendment if the speaker intends to incite a violation of the law that is both imminent and likely. While the precise meaning of "imminent" may be ambiguous in some cases, the court provided later clarification in Hess v. Indiana (1973). In this case, the court found that Hess's words did not fall outside the limits of protected speech, in part, because his speech "amounted to nothing more than advocacy of illegal action at some indefinite future time,"[1] and therefore did not meet the imminence requirement.

The doctrine states that speech that will cause, or has as its purpose, "imminent lawless action" (such as a riot) does not have constitutional protection. As of 2009[update], "imminent lawless action" continues to be the test applied in free speech cases.

The Court upheld the statute on the ground that, without more, "advocating" violent means to effect political and economic change involves such danger to the security of the State that the State may outlaw it. Cf. Fiske v. Kansas, 274 U.S. 380 (1927). But Whitney has been thoroughly discredited by later decisions. See Dennis v. United States, 341 U.S. 494, at 507 (1951). These later decisions have fashioned the principle that the constitutional guarantees of free speech and free press do not permit a State to forbid or proscribe advocacy of the use of force or of law violation except where such advocacy is directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imminent_lawless_action

Edited May 3, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[elcent]

excuse me, is there any media in this country? Can you provide a link to those?

I mean independent media of course.

[TheItaliann]

this is the first time i have ever heard anyone suggest that Thailand has a free media or a model media system. i guess next we will be hearing from the Nation Ministry of Propaganda about how great Thailand is with regards to human rights.

[jcbangkok]

One only need to look at Abe Lincoln (a hero in the US) who took much more severe actions during the civil war when it came to things like freedom of speech and press. I mention this because so many red sympathizers say this is a civil war.

[jcbangkok]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

LMAO

1) the request for a link was to back up (what appears to be false) that the PM said the military didn't use live ammo.

2) You provided a link which didn't do this and on top of it ... IT IS A LINK TO A BANGKOK PUNDIT .. in other words it is an opinion page.

Edited May 3, 2010 by jcbangkok

[jcbangkok]

Calm down JC. I ask for links because you and your friends always do same because think clever.... you are not and you not like it when somebody do same to you.

if you happy with info from nation and astv that is up to you. can tell to you that every organisation outside democrat party thinks that they are oppresive.

enjoy yourself reading only what is agreeable with you.

ps, the last links we post on Dr Tul have now been blocked because free and fair democrat junta don't like that you know about this man.

So you are admitting to being a troll?

I hope you can provide link!!! Why not post with more thought instead of angry all time.

OT, looks like the LM strategy is taking back see to the terrorist spin today. All press lakeys reporting on school anti terrorist measures and national terroism list for Seh Deang.

The punishment for these crimes should be put on the people who make the accusation if not true!

At least the debate on TV seems live so maybe some information and views from others than democrats might make it to the public. if they not watching karaoke and thai soap.

calm down dude. you appear to be the only one all fired up. take a deep breathe and get your thoughts together. there is no reason to get all worked up. we are just people expressing our opinions and hopefully trying to do it in an honest and somewhat respectful way.

[viking75]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

LMAO

1) the request for a link was to back up (what appears to be false) that the PM said the military didn't use live ammo.

2) You provided a link which didn't do this and on top of it ... IT IS A LINK TO A BANGKOK PUNDIT .. in other words it is an opinion page.

you did not read it then as it was linked in from B P who we do not mention on here. it is a valid link and you choose not to read it because afraid of opinion not from nation.

caught you there dude

[yesdavy]

Hmmm, do you suppose someone might suggest that it is actually possible to sync the audio with the video these days, and that it is possible to actually set the audio volume levels according to a standard that does not require viewers to adjust the volume for each individual channel? Do you suppose it is possible to actually start and end programs at appointed hours? Do you suppose that English language newscasters on radio and TV could be introduced to the concept of actually pre-reading instead of cold reading, could be introduced to actually preparing news copy instead of reading newspaper columns (there is a difference you know), could be taught that guessing how to pronounce names and words affirms ignorance (but then if you are cold reading...)

What is wrong with media having an agenda? It is the right--some would say obligation--for media to endorse candidates and policies. It is the right of media to influence opinion. This, of course, is when media is truly free and functioning in a competitive marketplace. When you hear things like the army owns all the TV stations, you see the same news footage on all the TV stations, and only token dissenting views, is this what is at stake of being compromised? If so, compromised which way?

[yesdavy]

Sorry for my being uninformed, but regarding comments that the PM closed down the red shirt media, how did the government pay dearly for this?

[fairandbalanced]

'First of all, the government has maintained a correct policy in not interfering with the media. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva himself respects the role and duty of the Thai media. He dutifully answered all questions and has given ample time for questions and answers to be submitted by the press - be they official or impromptu. Unlike previous prime ministers, Abhisit has responded to questions, sometimes even too personal, with honesty and grace. Although the Thai media is still hostile to Abhisit, all have admitted that he has never ducked reporters' questions, even at the time of crisis'.

If the freedom of the press is so much better under the current administration, then why has Thailand fallen to number 130 in the Reporters without Borders Press Frredom Index? We are now behind such bastions of press freedoms like Kyrgyzstan, Cambodia, Tajikistan, Sierra Leone and Venezuela to name but a few.

Taksin too was a master of manipulating the press and placing absurd restrictions on what they could print, but even at the hight of his powers and during the 2005 election campaign Thailand was at least ranked at 107.............certainly no need for celebration but far better then the current state of affairs we have now.

A quick search on their website, rsf dot org will give people who want to read more a better understanding on how the rest of the world view our non-interfering, open and transparent PM and government.

[jcbangkok]

LMAO

1) the request for a link was to back up (what appears to be false) that the PM said the military didn't use live ammo.

2) You provided a link which didn't do this and on top of it ... IT IS A LINK TO A BANGKOK PUNDIT .. in other words it is an opinion page.

you did not read it then as it was linked in from B P who we do not mention on here. it is a valid link and you choose not to read it because afraid of opinion not from nation.

caught you there dude

I already had read it and my previous posts still stands as factual. However, you may want to put some consideration into the latest blurb from The Nation ...

THE NATION: TV Channel 9 quoted psychiatrists as saying serious political stress is dangerously spreading, esp on social media.

[onlycw]

When will The Nation accept the concept of a pluralistic society? It would be a good start to allow independent thought. But then one hears of heavy censorship and some editorials are extremely biased.

I wish there would be a debate like in the British elections.

Q: When did your party win the last election? A: 1992

Q: When a PM needs to step down over a cooking show, how about a $ 8 million illegal party contribution?

Q: Since we all want the law to be enforced, how are indictments for the occupation of airports coming along?

Open debate where each side is allowed to speak would be a great start. In the UK, people hold different and often opposed opinions. that's okay. we all need to learn how to handle this.

[boggle]

Internet censorship including self censorship of websites which want to survive is now the order of the day. This http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/ website is still unblocked, but prachatai has been harassed. Soon our Thaivisa site will have to be hosted abroad too.

Last time I looked TV was hosted out of Singapore. Well at least that's what firefox shows me.

[Motoon]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

First of all you should refer to the red marked text in your response . I'm disputing your statement about the use of ammo. From what I can research the first statement of the PM was that the military has not aimed at protesters, while using live ammo (this was later corrected by army after some clips showed soldiers aiming their guns in defense). So please, provide the reference where he says that NO live ammo was used...

As for LM charges, I did not refer to that so stop bothering me with your "clever falang" approach... You want to have references for LM go and buy "Voice of Taksin" from your friends...

[jcbangkok]

Looks like even the land of the free is willing to consider abandoning free speech & press when face with a violent group ...

In the aftermath of the 9/11 attacks, the Justice Department secretly gave the green light for the U.S. military to attack apartment buildings and office complexes inside the United States, deploy high-tech surveillance against U.S. citizens and potentially suspend First Amendment freedom-of-the-press rights in order to combat the terror threat, according to a memo released Monday.

[jcbangkok]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

First of all you should refer to the red marked text in your response . I'm disputing your statement about the use of ammo. From what I can research the first statement of the PM was that the military has not aimed at protesters, while using live ammo (this was later corrected by army after some clips showed soldiers aiming their guns in defense). So please, provide the reference where he says that NO live ammo was used...

As for LM charges, I did not refer to that so stop bothering me with your "clever falang" approach... You want to have references for LM go and buy "Voice of Taksin" from your friends...

NEVER did the PM say there was not live ammo as originally stated above in red. And is there anybody with any common sense who would think an army would not return fire if fired upon and felt their lives were in danger. It is also clear just from standard operating procedures here in Thailand that the Army always has some soldiers with live ammo when doing crowd control for both firing into the air as well as defending itself.

Edited May 3, 2010 by jcbangkok

[kissdani]

Sorry for my being uninformed, but regarding comments that the PM closed down the red shirt media, how did the government pay dearly for this?

Losing credibility doesn't come cheap these days.

[Tejas]

I think - on this note that Thai Journalists need to do a better job of "Digging for the truth", rather than taking what all these windbags say at face value. How many times to they have to report the crap that Jatuporn utters, with no fact checking or challenges, etc. Their idea of journalism is to record the quotes and the repeat the quotes. Thats not journalism, that is parroting.

Ah... they dont want truth they want to sell newspapers and advertising nothing else they are all the same world wide

Yep............and it is actually a very old story.

The mainstream media, worldwide, is controlled by a few giant corporations.

Those corporations, worldwide, control the flow information.

The flow of information dictates what we think and guides decision-making.

That flow of teaching people worldwide to exploit themselves (often via a divide and conquer myth).

As stated, this is an old story, but unfortunately few people seem aware of it.

Einstein talked about it.

Ben Bagdikian has done lots of work on it:

The Media Monopoly

by Ben H. Bagdikian

published by Beacon Press, 1997

But nobody seems to be listening

All they want is to entertain and divert us, and teach us how to exploit ourselves and maintain a corrupt status quo.........they also want us focused on problems (virtually never solutions).

There is a reason for that.............but I have said enough already.

[landofthefree]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

How dare you doubt the Nation's impartiality and comments on media freedom? You know most countries lock people up for 15 years for saying the wrong thing, close down a TV chanel, spend millions of baht closing down websites, have the TV owned by the Army and Government and ban countless articles isnt it? The Human rights commision are obviously wrong as is every other country that asks Abhisit awkward questions about his ligitimacy.

[jayjay0]

You cannot call a group who tells lies and advocates lawlessness the Press just because they have a means to communicate with a mass audience. It would be like calling each ThaiVisa poster The Press.

Are you saying the yellow shirt TV and radio stations are not the press

[chantorn]

...another gem from the Nation...all on media freedom day of all all days....

Let's see, close all the red sympathetic media outlets, and then tell us Abhisit is doing a great job with media freedom... tell us he answers questions at news conferences...but don't tell us that he tells important lies about the army not using live ammo after 19 protesters are shot, when the very next day, the army ask for their live ammo back!

A masterful piece with no hint of bias at all...

If you make an attempt to state facts you should do it correctly with corresponding reference. Otherwise it is just some more red propaganda statements and we all know how close to the truth these are...

from here mr appologist is list of what army lost when attack red shirts. why not read some things not from nation.

http://us.asiancorrespondent.com/stories/?...o=5&yo=2010

Ammunition also went missing, including 580 rubber bullet rounds, 600 anti-aircraft rounds and 8,182 M16 rifle rounds.

NOW PLEASE you clever falang who as for links and reference all time. NOW give us facts on LM charges against reds, NOW please with full quotes can you do? or are you just more spin for yellows

is more difficult for us to find links because many block and other english paper reports not allowed on here.

lost 25 of these peaceful items of crowd dispersal

The army was protecting the RED-shirts from Cambodian Air Force attacked.

That was the only truth.

On a different subject, when will the government air both ASTV & PTV on the usual VHF/UHF? I cannot afford a dish receiver.

[enginerevision]

" First of all, the government has maintained a correct policy in not interfering with the media. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva himself respects the role and duty of the Thai media. "

[gl9999]

" First of all, the government has maintained a correct policy in not interfering with the media. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva himself respects the role and duty of the Thai media. "

Besides closing down Red Shirt TV and radio stations which had been used to incite violence and the overthrow of the government, can you tell us what Abhisit has done to interfere with the media?

[difos57]

Why is Viking trying to pass himself off as a Thai? He is a foreigner too, maybe not a Farang.

[somo]

" First of all, the government has maintained a correct policy in not interfering with the media. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva himself respects the role and duty of the Thai media. "

Besides closing down Red Shirt TV and radio stations which had been used to incite violence and the overthrow of the government, can you tell us what Abhisit has done to interfere with the media?

From Reporters Without Borders

After the Thai government has declared a state of emergency in Bangkok and surrounding provinces on April 7, 2010, the government has officially blocked 36 websites associated with, or sympathetic to, the red-shirt movement. In further development, Thai Rath daily newspaper in a report on April 16, 2010 cited an anonymous source, stated that 190 further URLs have been blocked [