Bangkok: Policeman Killed, 7 Policemen, 2 Civilians Injured In Double Attacks

[yeeowww]

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

Except to his brainwashed sheep, the disgraced, convicted, fugitive felon Thaksin is nothing more than a lowly pariah to Thailand. When this individual was the PM, an unfortunate time for Thailand, I viewed him as an arrogant and deluded megalomaniac. Today I view him as diabolical and evil, the same as Osama bin Laden, and as Thailand's little Hitler. He kicks back wherever he is, plays golf, and laughs as innocent people die or are injured due to his direct actions, and the actions of the ignorant fools who are his loyal followers. It is a situation much the same to that of Hitler and his die-hard, loyal followers. The only news I want to read about this miscreant is his obituary. That will be a great day for Thailand and the world, and it is a day I will celebrate.

[Phuket Stan]

The PM's "road map" was far from fair. <SNIPPED OUT MINDLESSNESS>

OMG another 23 post thai political pundit is spawned. ..

WHILE YOU POST IS OFF TOPIC I’ll answer you with:

Go check your facts before you spout off political one sided rhetoric;

Short history lesson follows;

AFTER the coup there were elections and NOT ONE PARTY got a clear majority.

The redz cobbled together a coalition and had TWO (count 'em TWO) 'red' P/M's. Like I said, they (the redz) didn't have a majority of M/P's in the Lower House so they couldn't run the government without forming a coalition with the smaller parties.

The first P/M; Samak ran amuck of something called the 'law' (which prohibits a P/M from holding another job while in office). Now even a semi-intelligent person might be lead to believe that if someone was gonna be the frickin' P/M of this country he or his party might actually read the constitution and/or the law concerning that job (then again as evidenced by what happened, maybe not. ..).

After Samak the P/M was another 'red' Somchai, but he too ran amuck of something called electoral law and was found guilty of vote buying, and paying small parties to run against them in constituencies where the 'reds' were running unopposed. (In this country if you run unopposed you have to get 20% of the registered voters in an area instead of just a majority of who ever happens to turn out to vote when you run against someone else.

AFTER Somchai was axed, Abhisit and the Dem party were able to for yet another coalition of smaller parties, get a majority of M/P's in the lower house and thereby the mandate under the same law as Samak/Somchai had for their turn at bat to run the government.

Now this was due, in no small part, to Newin Chidchob and his 'Friends of Newin' group of nearly 40 M/P's switching sides from the redz to the Demz, but that is neither here nor there. There is NO provision in the constitution which says if a candidate doesn't fulfill the platform under which he was elected (like saying if he switches sides after he's elected) the people can call for a recall-vote or do anything except just suck it up until the next elections.

The next elections aren't legally required to take place until the END of 2011! That Abhisit is willing to cut his term by A YEAR, as well as his kid-glove approach to the red-rabble (almost to the point of being perceived as weak), and his statements that the constitution NEEDS to be amended, speaks volumes for someone who is really trying to find a way outta this quagmire.

That my politically un-savvy poster; is how the thais have arrived at this juncture.

It's just sour grapes on the redz, and who are obviously mad at Newin for switching sides which lead to the current government with the Demz. (And BEFORE you spout off that the P/M didn't have the mandate of the people, check your facts again, in this country the people DON'T elect a P/M, they elect M/P's who elect the P/M.

Last time I checked, ALL the M/P's of the Lower House WERE elected by the people, so yes in fact the people DID elect this P/M, according to thai electoral/constitutional law.

Now what your post has to with the violence last nite, I've no clue, but please at least check some facts before you spout off..

BACK ON TOPIC:

I still find it strange that the reds are never targeted as victims in any violence; the multiz, the yellowz, the police, the soldiers, the regular rank and file people pissed at the protests yes, but never ever the redz. Hmmm. My vote is on Khattiya or another wing-nut like him.

If the donkeys or asses are not thirsty u cant make them drink....its like a scratched record....on and on and on

[Redsunset]

Isn't it about time the reds got what they are propagating - violence to end their stupidity? They have set up the coral for the buffaloes, so seal them in - tear gas them and as they try to leave, remove their ID's and let them pass. Then hand them all a summons for damages to Public Property and charge them all when they come to pick up the ID's. CHarge them - jail a few and fine the rest.

This continued violence is not going to go away. So let's just end it now to minimise the losses. 300 + dead at Songkran and 27 from these protests so far and Songkran was self inflicted. Go ahead - Make my day...

Honestly.... I like the idea of sealing them in..... I mean besiege the place... then tear gas them or crank up the sound machines aimed right at them 24/7... then let's see how much they want to stay there and screw up everyone else's lives...

[Valentine]

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

My mind is open, no hatred, but I would like to know the data used when you make the statement "he cut poverty in half during his term in office". The main financial beneficiary of his term was the man himself. All the data that I have seen indicates an increase in debt due to his loan schemes. It's just a pity that he was away during the coup - all this bloodshed could have been avoided with a bit of defenestration.

I agree. Personal debt rose dramatically during Mr T's tenure. Handing out money with no controls meant much of it was spent on new cell phones, motorbikes etc which benefited those in power. All the handouts should have been monitored & used to create more self sufficiency which was often presented as the way forward by the King. Present government is putting a programme in place for many to get out of the clutches of loan sharks.

Anyway, the current conflict is not about hatred, but is all about power. Hatred is one of the seeds used to work up the mobs. The latest attacks are part of the original plan which was to put the country in civil war.

[Redsunset]

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

Except to his brainwashed sheep, the disgraced, convicted, fugitive felon Thaksin is nothing more than a lowly pariah to Thailand. When this individual was the PM, an unfortunate time for Thailand, I viewed him as an arrogant and deluded megalomaniac. Today I view him as diabolical and evil, the same as Osama bin Laden, and as Thailand's little Hitler. He kicks back wherever he is, plays golf, and laughs as innocent people die or are injured due to his direct actions, and the actions of the ignorant fools who are his loyal followers. It is a situation much the same to that of Hitler and his die-hard, loyal followers. The only news I want to read about this miscreant is his obituary. That will be a great day for Thailand and the world, and it is a day I will celebrate.

How dare you insult sheep like that! lols

[Herm]

About 2,000 red shirts from Khon Kaen pass through Ayutthaya checkpoint

About 2,000 red-shirt people from Khon Kaen travelling on over 200 pick-up trucks reached the Ayutthaya checkpoint at 7 am.

Troops let the trucks pass through after they searched the vehicles and did not find any weapon.

Talking about not being in control of a situation - who gave the order to let them through ?

The state of emergency forbids gatherings of more than 5 - ???????

This is total incompetence

They should have been stopped - and arrested if they refused to return to where they came from

There seems to be no control over the situation left what so ever

[Redsunset]

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

My mind is open, no hatred, but I would like to know the data used when you make the statement "he cut poverty in half during his term in office". The main financial beneficiary of his term was the man himself. All the data that I have seen indicates an increase in debt due to his loan schemes. It's just a pity that he was away during the coup - all this bloodshed could have been avoided with a bit of defenestration.

Cut poverty in half? Are you on drugs or something? Go back to your sandbox!

[Redsunset]

Second Thai policeman killed near Bangkok protests

BANGKOK (AFP) -- A second Thai policeman has been killed in attacks near anti-government protests in Bangkok,

in a grenade blast and a drive-by shooting that also left 12 wounded, authorities said Saturday.

-- ©Copyright AFP 2010-05-08

Published with written approval from AFP.

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

Maybe these acts of lawlessness will get the police off their duffs and get them to actually enforce the law...imagine that!

If and when a crackdown is eventually ordered this might force the police to use strong-arm tactics, thus giving the red shirts more ground against the government during negotiations.

Not if during the crackdown the red shirt leaders are killed.

[Insight]

Anyway, the current conflict is not about hatred, but is all about power. Hatred is one of the seeds used to work up the mobs. The latest attacks are part of the original plan which was to put the country in civil war.

Exactly. Quote from a Stickman report describing his latest visit:

I have to say that some of the speakers really ranted and some of their comments can only be described as extreme. I would need to exhaust all of the profanities in the English language to accurately convey what some said, needless to say that Apisit was called a bloody murderer and 100 years in jail would not be nearly long enough for him.

Accusations are well and truly misplaced given where the shots have been originating from, but regardless there seems little effort in actually making peace by the speakers right now. What they need now is for Abhisit in some way to live up to these accusations.

I think the govt will be smart enough to avoid it this weekend, but there'll be a breaking point somewhere.

[Insight]

About 2,000 red shirts from Khon Kaen pass through Ayutthaya checkpoint

About 2,000 red-shirt people from Khon Kaen travelling on over 200 pick-up trucks reached the Ayutthaya checkpoint at 7 am.

Troops let the trucks pass through after they searched the vehicles and did not find any weapon.

Talking about not being in control of a situation - who gave the order to let them through ?

The state of emergency forbids gatherings of more than 5 - ???????

This is total incompetence

They should have been stopped - and arrested if they refused to return to where they came from

There seems to be no control over the situation left what so ever

What can the army do other than check for the existence of weapons? There's too many to arrest and they can't expect them to go home if they are told to turn around.

While all this is happening it's costing somebody more and more...

[bob6023]

It´s about time now to arrest these criminals!

It is way past time in my view. Now they should kick some ass and take names. Some of these jerks just need their heads cracked a little.

let some sense in there.

[khaowong1]

folks, when groups of people start using M-16's, M-79's, grenades and bombs, this is either terrorism or cival war, plain and simple. a rose by any other name is still a rose.

[animatic]

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

Utter bilge, he never even came close to cutting real poverty in any quantifiable way.

He did give million baht patronage funds for local kamnans to use as carrots for villagers,

and the loans that many spent quickly, not for sustainable local industry,

but for bikes and phones w/ AIS accounts Thyaksin profited on, and TVs.

He stroked their sense of jealousies for more possessions against the city folks.

And then INCREASED their debt load to the puyais, who then locked in behind him.

Thaksin gave good appearances and attention, but the substance was far too short to be truly useful,

and not approaching sustainable improvements. So nothing but bilge water and psycho-babble.

[granuaile]

I am not at all sympathetic to the reds, and their actions have pushed me from even trying to stay neutral... I will let that speak for where I stand on this. In 2006 my Thai friends here in BKK told me they were safe, happy, and that they knew no one who did not support what happened. It is sad for Thailand that terrorists are dictating the country's course...

The country is now in a state of anarchy and only a coup can restore law and order - anyone who does not realize this is hiding from the facts or a red

The facts are simple, Thaksin is determined to achieve his goals and is financing the reds operation - without substantial funds, an action of this size and over such a long period of time is simply impossible - the logistics alone - food - water - equipment - money for the human shields .... are costing a fortune every day

The red leaders are divided which becomes clear through unilateral statements - we are leaving Monday - we are not ..... their is no real entity one can negotiate with

Abhisit, as well intentioned he is, has to act now or coup will be the only way out - however he does not seem to wanting to give up his course of negotiation which clearly has no impact on the actual situation

Further violence like the deplorable acts by the reds on Friday are a clear statement and show that there is a probably large fraction that follow their leader and are determined to put a stop to negotiations and will not stop until Thaksins goals are achieved

[Herm]

About 2,000 red shirts from Khon Kaen pass through Ayutthaya checkpoint

About 2,000 red-shirt people from Khon Kaen travelling on over 200 pick-up trucks reached the Ayutthaya checkpoint at 7 am.

Troops let the trucks pass through after they searched the vehicles and did not find any weapon.

Talking about not being in control of a situation - who gave the order to let them through ?

The state of emergency forbids gatherings of more than 5 - ???????

This is total incompetence

They should have been stopped - and arrested if they refused to return to where they came from

There seems to be no control over the situation left what so ever

What can the army do other than check for the existence of weapons? There's too many to arrest and they can't expect them to go home if they are told to turn around.

While all this is happening it's costing somebody more and more...

simply confiscate the cars and have buses available to take them home. When cars or trucks are used in an illegal act, the law is clear on this subject and that it is an illegal act during a state of emergency is also clear.

Also, the army must have by now established some detention/processing camps outside of Bangkok to deal with a very large number of arrested if a clampdown is going to happen. Simply dispersing the crowd will not work, they will just re-group and cause havoc.

Only in camps like this will it be possible to sort the buffalo from the snakes - the rice farmer from the terrorist - and deal with them as needed

[animatic]

folks, when groups of people start using M-16's, M-79's, grenades and bombs, this is either terrorism or cival war, plain and simple. a rose by any other name is still a rose.

Yes, and either give in or stand up to them.

Standing up for the majority of Thais civil rights against a violent pressure group

is not the act of an evil government, but the actions of a government working

FOR the majority of the publics obvious well being.

While violence would be regrettable, if it is a choice between endless mob manipulation

and something considerably less than the typical Songkran traffic deaths and injuries,

a coup would not be needed, just a smack down of the red rally, with as little violence as possible,

but NOT excluding what ever strength of purpose is needed to do the job.

THEN be men enough to stand up to the expected howling and just face it down.

Most of the country is more than fed up to the nostrils with this horror show on wheels.

The Reds have been give multiple chances to save face and exit the field gracefully.

They seem to not choose to and that is not the governments fault.

Edited May 8, 2010 by animatic

[xminator]

folks, when groups of people start using M-16's, M-79's, grenades and bombs, this is either terrorism or cival war, plain and simple. a rose by any other name is still a rose.

You obviously know who to blame, so why don't you tell the police who is behind the random attacks? There is motives for various "unknowns" on both sides to disturb the fragile peace we've seen since Abhisit announced his roadmap.

[noahvail]

The PM's "road map" was far from fair. <SNIPPED OUT MINDLESSNESS>

OMG another 23 post thai political pundit is spawned. ..

WHILE YOU POST IS OFF TOPIC I'll answer you with:

Go check your facts before you spout off political one sided rhetoric;

Short history lesson follows;

AFTER the coup there were elections and NOT ONE PARTY got a clear majority.

<<educational post snipped for brevity only - sorry>>

If the donkeys or asses are not thirsty u cant make them drink....its like a scratched record....on and on and on

Yes, this post and many others like it have repeatedly on the TV forums. There is a reason for that. This post, and others like it, describe the constitutional processes before, during, and after a popular election. Those processes can be found in the Thai Constitution - a link to which (in English) already exists on this forum. Posts of this ilk state the facts of the matter.

It is sad that such posts as these have to be repeatedly entered. They are entered because other people do not know the law of Thailand, yet spout platitudes and slogans as though those statements were the law.

It is necessary to show where misinformation and disinformation exist, and replace those with the laws of Thailand as written.

Those of us who have written such posts get tired of having to write the same thing over and over - but we do it for relative newbies who have an honest misunderstanding of the law.

I'd like to think that some of the posters who have been around a while might also benefit from reading these.

Ok, my flamesuit is on now...because that's been the history of such posts. They can not be argued by fact, so very often they are answered with flames.

[AskTheCPT]

RIP to the victims

I've driven by there probably a dozen times in the last month in a taxi, pretty scary considering you pretty much have to drive past there if you want to head to Patumwan.

[warfie]

After Samak the P/M was another 'red' Somchai, but he too ran amuck of something called electoral law and was found guilty of vote buying, and paying small parties to run against them in constituencies where the 'reds' were running unopposed. (In this country if you run unopposed you have to get 20% of the registered voters in an area instead of just a majority of who ever happens to turn out to vote when you run against someone else.

Clarification: The issue you mentioned was one of the reasons the TRT was banned. The PPP were disbanded and the executive banned because they were caught on video handing over cash to some village leaders.

AFTER Somchai was axed, Abhisit and the Dem party were able to for yet another coalition of smaller parties, get a majority of M/P's in the lower house and thereby the mandate under the same law as Samak/Somchai had for their turn at bat to run the government.

Before someone says Abhisit got a majority because the PPP were banned. Only a few MPs were banned (the PPP executive) and there were by-elections, so all voters were still represented. There were a couple of party list (not directly voted for) banned PPP MPs that weren't replaced.

The reason Abhisit/Dems are in government is because some elected MPs changed their support when voting for a new PM to replace Somchai. Not because of the yellows. Not because of the courts.

To take that line of reasoning one step further:

If the people want to blame someone for Abhist/Democrats being in power, they should blame the MPs they voted as their representatives and subsequently changed allegiances...

correct me if I'm wrong,

which, according to my wife, is most of the time...

[Robby nz]

The 2000 that are on their way from the north are a long way from the million Khun Waeng promised us, wonder when the rest will arrive?

Have never advocated giong into the reds camp with guns blazing but really it is getting far too much, possibly if the DSI could arrange for one or two of the leaders to dissappear then the rest would be craping their pants wondering who would be next, but I guess they all have plenty of armed bodyguards around them at all times so that may not be easy.

Notice how the leaders appear nicely dressed in clean clothes each day while the human shields squat in squaller, another indication of how much they really care.

[animatic]

The PM's "road map" was far from fair. <SNIPPED OUT MINDLESSNESS>

OMG another 23 post thai political pundit is spawned. ..

WHILE YOU POST IS OFF TOPIC I'll answer you with:

Go check your facts before you spout off political one sided rhetoric;

Short history lesson follows;

AFTER the coup there were elections and NOT ONE PARTY got a clear majority.

<<educational post snipped for brevity only - sorry>>

If the donkeys or asses are not thirsty u cant make them drink....its like a scratched record....on and on and on

Yes, this post and many others like it have repeatedly on the TV forums. There is a reason for that. This post, and others like it, describe the constitutional processes before, during, and after a popular election. Those processes can be found in the Thai Constitution - a link to which (in English) already exists on this forum. Posts of this ilk state the facts of the matter.

It is sad that such posts as these have to be repeatedly entered. They are entered because other people do not know the law of Thailand, yet spout platitudes and slogans as though those statements were the law.

It is necessary to show where misinformation and disinformation exist, and replace those with the laws of Thailand as written.

Those of us who have written such posts get tired of having to write the same thing over and over - but we do it for relative newbies who have an honest misunderstanding of the law.

I'd like to think that some of the posters who have been around a while might also benefit from reading these.

Ok, my flamesuit is on now...because that's been the history of such posts. They can not be argued by fact, so very often they are answered with flames.

Seconded with out reservations.

[lannarebirth]

This is a possibility.

Another is that the peace plan is something the reds dont want but they know they cant reject it outright. Perhaps they still want Abhisit out and house dissolution ASAP to create a power vacuum.

Other than an attempt at discrediting someone, it's not at all obvious who benefits from this violence...if it was reds, they appear to gain absolutely nothing...if it was yellows it may be to disrupt the peace process, since they now want Abhisit out as well, and this puts more pressure on the prime minister...

Somebody knows whodunit, but certainly no one on these boards....

The Reds DO gain something and that is an excuse for quitting the peace process which they don't favor in any way. How does peace bring Thaksin back? As for the Yellows they staked out an opening position at the extreme. They have no voice in government and if they do support anyone it is Abhisit. They gain nothing by making Abhisits job harder. Their enemy is Thaksin.

Don't be silly, Thaksin isn't the enemy...he cut poverty in half during his term in office...the only PM to do anything for the poor...I don't get all these people blinded by hatred...hatred uses up so much energy...stop hating and open your mind...

Ignored for being a prick.

[animatic]

After Samak the P/M was another 'red' Somchai, but he too ran amuck of something called electoral law and was found guilty of vote buying, and paying small parties to run against them in constituencies where the 'reds' were running unopposed. (In this country if you run unopposed you have to get 20% of the registered voters in an area instead of just a majority of who ever happens to turn out to vote when you run against someone else.

Clarification: The issue you mentioned was one of the reasons the TRT was banned. The PPP were disbanded and the executive banned because they were caught on video handing over cash to some village leaders.

AFTER Somchai was axed, Abhisit and the Dem party were able to for yet another coalition of smaller parties, get a majority of M/P's in the lower house and thereby the mandate under the same law as Samak/Somchai had for their turn at bat to run the government.

Before someone says Abhisit got a majority because the PPP were banned. Only a few MPs were banned (the PPP executive) and there were by-elections, so all voters were still represented. There were a couple of party list (not directly voted for) banned PPP MPs that weren't replaced.

The reason Abhisit/Dems are in government is because some elected MPs changed their support when voting for a new PM to replace Somchai. Not because of the yellows. Not because of the courts.

To take that line of reasoning one step further:

If the people want to blame someone for Abhist/Democrats being in power, they should blame the MPs they voted as their representatives and subsequently changed allegiances...

correct me if I'm wrong,

which, according to my wife, is most of the time...

And a step farther, many of these who changed to the Dems coalition, after PPP failed,

had prior to the election vowed to their constituents to NOT JOIN WITH PPP.

Then after PPP won the larger minority they were pressured to join and did.

After PPP failed at governance TWICE with Samak and Somchai and then PPP the entity disappeared,

these MP's then returned to the pre-election position and voted with the Dems in a coalition,

and not with the vast majority of PPP, who entered PTP.

This actually matched their election promises more closely.

Edited May 8, 2010 by animatic

[lazurus]

Shouldn't the protest be getting smaller, not bigger? If the reds really want to participate in the roadmap they should start going home, not calling for a million people to join them in Bangkok (I know they will never get that many). Letting more people into the protest is just another massive failure by the police. You'd think they'd be motivated to get things under control after last night.

[animatic]

If the iconic Ahmadinejad had the Red Shirts acting up in Iran,

they would already be living with then fishes and worms on March 14th.

So this is a particularly poor choice of avatar for the positions espoused.

[lannarebirth]

If the iconic Ahmadinejad had the Red Shirts acting up in Iran,

they would already be living with then fishes and worms on March 14th.

So this is a particularly poor choice of avatar for the positions espoused.

Some people think its exciting when people die. Other people that is.

[webfact]

Related article:

Thai rivals commit to peace plan despite deadly violence

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=3578294

[whybother]

Shouldn't the protest be getting smaller, not bigger? If the reds really want to participate in the roadmap they should start going home, not calling for a million people to join them in Bangkok (I know they will never get that many). Letting more people into the protest is just another massive failure by the police. You'd think they'd be motivated to get things under control after last night.

For every day that the red shirts stay at Ratchaprasong after tomorrow, the election date should be pushed back two days.

[roykeanz]

The redshirts are on the verge of getting what they want. It is more much likely that it is someone else who wants to disrupt the peacetrain.

Erm ... The great compromiser (not!) Thacky's not really getting what he wants (assuming that he is not getting what he deserves - sitting on the right middle finger of satan!  - as abundant rumours suggest!)