WhiteShiva Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Can anybody explain to me why an average american uses about 600 liters of water a day, while a European uses only about 150 to 200 liters?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Because they are - how shall I put it? - bulkier..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otherstuff1957 Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Can anybody explain to me why an average american uses about 600 liters of water a day, while a European uses only about 150 to 200 liters?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Because they are - how shall I put it? - bulkier..... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Or maybe the're cleaner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singa-traz Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 There seems to be a lot of oversight here. Desalinization - wow, what a great idea - sounds like it's going to give someone a lot of face. Oversight, sorry off track...... Isn't Thailand a tropical country? Hasn't Chiang Mai ust experienced floods? surely there is already enough water. What happened to better water management: Rainwater tanks, increseased efficiency, not watering the road to clean it...... etc etc. Sounds like another great idea with no thought behind it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I disagree ! it's a great plan, with special thought behind it ... $$$$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rinrada Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Can anybody explain to me why an average american uses about 600 liters of water a day, while a European uses only about 150 to 200 liters?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Because they are - how shall I put it? - bulkier..... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Or maybe the're cleaner? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Or put ice cubes in their whiskey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cikeda Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Drill deep wells and chlorinate; usually does not require filtration as the natural properties of the earth takes care of the process. Commonly done process. This now allows us to drink from the tap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 For God's Sake, what does how much water American's use have to do with this thread (or how little Europeans' use). America is not running out of water, and where it is short supply they have strict restrictions and people usually follow them or get into serious trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidtongue Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Govt urged to launch seawater desalination programme RAYONG: -- A leading industrialist yesterday called on the government to establish seawater treatment plants for the production of freshwater, amid growing fears that crippling drought this year could see a sharp drop in industrial sector manufacturing rates. Mr. Sombat Praihanwichitranut, director of Peroxi Thai Co. Ltd., told reporters that a desalination plant based in Thailand's eastern coastal province of Rayong would help address water shortages in the industrial Eastern Seaboard area. Faced with severe water shortages this year, industries have been warned that they might have to slash their rates of production by as much as 10 percent. The government has indicated that it wants to see a 40 percent drop in water usage, a move which industrialists have denounced as lethal for production efficiency. Mr. Sombat said that desalination would obviate the need for the government to rely on the creation of artificial rain, and would halt water disputes between industry and the public. --TNA 2005-06-22 <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The more persistent problem is water management. Only 10% of the farms are under managed irrigation.Active plans are underfoot for massive concrete viaducts a la California style (evaporation) and yes, it takes a mssive amount of electric to make it work and solar right now isn't up to snuff.Maybe export more people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TizMe Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 I was in the Wimerra district of Western Victoria during April and May. They hadn't seen a decent rain in over 12 years. But, there was still water in their rain water tanks, because they know that they must manage their water usage. How many Thai houses even have gutterings and rain water tanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaiyapoon Posted August 24, 2005 Share Posted August 24, 2005 Outside the larger towns and to a degree even in them nearly all Thai houses have large rain water jars. This is used mostly for drinking water and are filled from roof rain water run off.Many areas don't have the luxury of a government water supply. My house has 5 such jars and I would guess at something around the 1000 liter each. In places like Malta large cysterns are used to store rain water on a household basis could also be used in Thailand to ease the problem.The jar method is a bit hit and miss on availability against storage.Many people have to pay for a tanker to refill at peak times.When it rains just think how much could be stored away if bigger storage methods were able to be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 (edited) Well… it’s looks like I copped a bit of criticism for my comment on awarrumbungle’s post yesterday… Maybe I jumped a bit early at some of the comments in that post… trollish comments like “Isn't Thailand a tropical country?” and “surely there is already enough water” and “not watering the road to clean it” etc.. just got my goat. Of course Thailand is located in the tropics. No, there is not enough water in all areas of the country, and what little reserves there are are diminishing at an alarming rate. And I can honestly say that I have never, repeat never seen anyone washing the roads to clean them anywhere in Thailand. Can you all understand now why I bit at awarrumbungle’s post yesterday? For the record, I have an active interest in this subject, as I live in Pattaya where we are experiencing severe water shortages, and my missus’ village is in the Korat province which is also experiencing severe water shortages, and I am doing my bit to influence the powers that be and the locals in both locations on water conservation and improved and expanded storage capacity. I follow this subject carefully in the various Thai news services, and of course on ThaiVisa, and have posted articles, comments, and even photographs in various threads of this topic. See this thread for example. And just for galong, who was very quick to question both my command of the English language and my level of education… I am of Australian heritage, thus I can read, write and speak English (albeit a strine version), and I have successfully completed tertiary education in a field of Engineering… ‘nuff said. Rant and self-justification over… back on topic… As far as Pattaya is concerned, the average rainfall for the Chonburi area is as follows: Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Year mm 11.8 23.1 40.5 79.0 164.5 118.5 166.1 166.3 302.3 229.6 66.2 9.8 1378.1 inches 0.5 0.9 1.6 3.1 6.5 4.7 6.5 6.5 11.9 9.0 2.6 0.4 54.3 (Apologies for the formatting... tables are not easy to post) I’m not sure what the statistics were for last year and this year, but they would certainly fall way below the average. Maybe it’s the El Nino effect, which seems to recurr every 6 or 7 years… Reference to an article published by The Nation on 5 September 1997 here Edited August 25, 2005 by Jai Dee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 On the issue of wasting water, they certainly do waste a lot here in Thailand--maybe not the last poster because you are short enough of water not to have any to waste! As far as washing the road--I've seen it, mostly driveways, but also out into the soi, hosing things down that could/should be swept instead. Washing dishes with water running full blast, long showers, brushing teeth and washing faces with the water running the whole time. I try to be careful. When I wash clothes, I try to get 2 or 3 loads in one wash water--white or very light first, followed by colored and finish up with rugs or other non-wearable things. The partner, however, wouldn't dream of washing anything in the same water--not even floor rugs. Also wouldn't dream of not filling the machine to the top, brushing teeth without water running full blast etc. The partner always says "water is cheap". I always try to say it doesn't matter, try not to waste it, but it doesn't work. Most locals think I am trying to save money on water and that the cost is the ONLY thing that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteShiva Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 (edited) The partner always says "water is cheap". I always try to say it doesn't matter, try not to waste it, but it doesn't work. Most locals think I am trying to save money on water and that the cost is the ONLY thing that matters. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Which I think really says it all - water is too cheap here. I have a household with 3 aldults and 2 kids, and I occasionally water the garden, wash the cars, etc. Washing machine is frequently used, lots of showers taken, etc, etc. Monthly bill - 300 baht only. I think the first thing the authorities should do is start charging for water on a progressive scale (first X cubic meters/month should be dirt cheap (as now), then increasingly more expensive per unit volume). Next fix leaking transmission pipes. I remember doing a school visit to a sewage treament plant when I was a kid (about 25-30 years ago). The water there was cleaned to the extent that it could be used as drinking water (although it was discharged to the sea). Why not do a similar thing here, and use this water to supply the big industrial users? Surely there is no shortage of sewage? Edited August 25, 2005 by WhiteShiva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 From the website of the Office of Natural Resources and Environmental Policy and Planning: Surface water The amount of surface water depends upon the amount of rainfall. According to rainfall statistics during the previous 40 years, the amount of rainfall has been declining The average rainfall is 800,000 cu.m. annually, however, only 198,880 cu.m. directly contributes to runoff in rivers, canals, dams and reservoirs. Dams and reservoirs store only 19% of the total runoff in the country or 37,740 cu.m. which indicates that most of rainfall has lost and in fact, the storage capacity is very limited. Moreoveer, various activities especially the habits of humans result in extravagant and inefficient use of water, thus contributing to water shortage. As a result, the government has raised public awareness for water conservation and the economical use of water. Underground Water Underground water water has been withdrawn from all parts of the country to meet an increasing demand for water. The country has a total of 152,510 underground wells. In 1995, 16,286 new wells were dug by government agencies. 117 wells had been located in Bangkok and its peripheral area. Domestic consumption and business operation are the major uses of underground water. These wells in Bangkok and its vicinity can produce 20,464 cu.m. of water per day. With a total of 7,397 existing and new underground wells, the total water utilization is accounted for 1,789,129 cu.m. a day. Such high demand and consumption have caused critical use of underground water and therefore land subsidence, especially in the Bangkok Metropolitan Area. Consequently, the government has launched some measures to control the use of underground water and has also monitored the level of land subsiding since 1683. These measures have to some extent reduced the rate of land subsidence. Dams and Reservoirs The government has developed dams and reseroirs in order to respond to the increasing demand for water. This has resulted in large, medium and small dams and reservoirs being constructed all over the counter. Most small-scale dams and reservoirs are prepared for storing water for rural consumption. For the medium and large-scaled dams with high water storage capacity, these are designed for multipurpose supply. Currently, there are 28 large and medium-scaled dams with high water storage capacity, these are designed for multipurpose supply. Currently, there are 28 large and medium-scale dams with a storage capacity of 66,360 million cu.m. According to the Royal Irrigation Department (1996), the water demand is projected to increase to 70,496 million cu.m. by the year 2006. Therefore, water utilization planning should be established to enhance the balance between water consumption and total water supply. Consequently, awareness of water use must be raised and water recycling should be promoted. See the full article here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 And another excerpt from the same website... Thailand is classified as a country without water shortage problem. This is because the annual internal renewable water resource in Thailand of 1,845 cubic meters per person per year is above the international standard of 1,700 cubic meters per person per year. Although the annual figure does not reveal water shortage, it was found that water shortage occurs in some parts of Thailand during the dry seasons especially in the Northeast region. Much of the water shortage problem in the Northeast region can be attributed to the fact that water resource development is inadequate. The abundance water supply during the dry season 2000-2001 did not lead to water utilisation conflicts. See the full article here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 I remember doing a school visit to a sewage treament plant when I was a kid (about 25-30 years ago). The water there was cleaned to the extent that it could be used as drinking water (although it was discharged to the sea). Why not do a similar thing here, and use this water to supply the big industrial users? Surely there is no shortage of sewage? Some info on waste water treatment here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenfuji Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 I would like to add some information with the aim to hopefully better inform others on some of the issues raised in this thread. I currently work for the Water Corporation of Western Australia (WA) and for those not in the know, WA is embarking on building a desalination plant at the moment. Some facts: Desalination plants have been in operation around the world for many decades now. Small island countries and remote locations rely on desalination for their drinking water. The process of desalination (typically reverse osmosis through microfiltration) has and is used in industry for a very long time now. Australians may be interested to note that although the desalination plant is WA is being touted as the first, the process has been used in WA, QLD and NSW for a number of years now in industry. The argument of power usage of a desalination plant is predominatly scare tactics from extreme environmentalists. The power requirements are typical with an equivalent ground water treatment plant. Factoring operational and maintenance costs into the equation, desalination plants actual cost favourably compared to a groundwater treatment plant. The water used to clean the streets and largely in industry is grey water, water not suitable for drinking but suitable for cleaning and cooling and specific other industrial uses. The world at large is generally experiencing water shortages. Desalination and water reclamation (recycling wastewater) which by the way uses extremely similar processes, are the logical step in satisfying the shortage. This does not exclude better education in using water wisely. Germany is the only country to my knowledge encouraging greater water usage. This is due to water quality issues. I believe it is perfectly sesible that Thailand is looking into desalination as an alternative means of obtaining more drinking water. From what I have seen of how Thailand handles infrastructure implementation, BTS and MRT, I would believe any desalination plant would be well executed. Hope this helps in the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted August 25, 2005 Share Posted August 25, 2005 I believe it is perfectly sesible that Thailand is looking into desalination as an alternative means of obtaining more drinking water. From what I have seen of how Thailand handles infrastructure implementation, BTS and MRT, I would believe any desalination plant would be well executed. A good positive and informative post greenfuji. But then I would expect nothing less from an Aussi... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NBT TV Phuket Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 To see Interview with Jaturong Saduagkan, General Manager of R.E.Q. Water Services Company, at first Phuket desalination plant to convert sea- to potable or drinking water, now operational, go to: http://www.thaisnews.com/news_detail.php?newsid=202874 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chownah Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 The argument of power usage of a desalination plant is predominatly scare tactics from extreme environmentalists. The power requirements are typical with an equivalent ground water treatment plant. Factoring operational and maintenance costs into the equation, desalination plants actual cost favourably compared to a groundwater treatment plant. I am so doubting the truth of this......any references? Chownah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markuk Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 (edited) From what I have seen of how Thailand handles infrastructure implementation. :D :D maybe you need help with your eyes!! Edited January 18, 2007 by markuk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faranggl Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Have they considered the high budget to produce desalinated water? It shouldn't be difficult. They coulld place generators over the water and harness sharks up to submerged shafts with some "you swimmy here" signs floating close by.Perhaps the unemployed elephants would lend a hand. With the price of sugar cane being down, alchohol comes to mind as a gen fuel with the possibility of decent rum production an added plus. How about a new air regulation that makes it manditory to bring in a pint of water for every pound of luggage brought in? Why rely on unstable oil prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dupont Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 7 million litres a day! Any technicians care to comment. Seems like a hel_l of a lot of water for one plant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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