O - Marriage

[yeno]

Hi, everybody!

So, my question is: Can I get the O kind of visa based on marriage with a Thai woman? (without having to pay ridiculous taxes to lawyers - yap, already checked the forum sponsors through their banners here and don't want to pay that much .. but hey, who else enjoys paying lawyers ?!)

This is my status now:

- Romanian citizen, age 31;

- Currently on ED visa which is about to expire;

- Don't have 400k in a Thai bank (or wherever) and most important (probably) don't have an income of 40k/month (well, I have more, but not in papers);

Other things:basically, I'd like to obtain a kind of visa that will allow me to work (I'm trying to move more, my internet work is bad for my lower-back).

I know the law and the request but I hope is a work-around to this, like can the wife or someone else from her family declare that she will take care of me (provide financial support ), something like an invitation to stay when you visit other countries, so I can get the O visa?! Don't know how to call it, I hope you understand. But, must say here that the wife doesn't have a 40k/month income, either... maybe her mother has, I'm not sure.

Other suggestions regarding other kinds of visa that will allow me to stay longer (forever, if possible) and also work are appreciated. So, basically, the idea is to stay in Th and (if possible) to work - this way I can stop the school, save the school taxes and complicate my life a little less.

Thank you! and I hope you can understand my English.

[InterestedObserver]

Find a job paying at least 40K baht per month. The income for a marriage extension of stay has to be your own, not your wife's or MIL. You will need a non-immigrant "B" visa for the necessary work permit.

Edited June 15, 2010 by InterestedObserver

[lopburi3]

No visa allows you to work - a work permit is required and that requires a job that can support such a permit (Thai company).

You can obtain a non immigrant O visa from a Consulate with marriage/id paperwork without financial requirements. If you want a multi entry at least 100k would have to be in bank account for local issue (Kuala Lumpur). Such visas allow 90 day stay.

For extension of stay longer than 60 days you would either need to meet employment or Thai wife requirements and without 400k/40k it appears that is a dead end for you currently.

There is a 60 day extension available without financial conditions but they must be used in conjunction with an entry (not back-to-back).

[bow]

You can get a 3-months (90 days), single entry, non-imm O visa, at a Thai consulate or Embassy outside of Thailand, if you are married to Thai, but have no income or money in the bank.

This visa can be extended with two months (60 days) at immigration police inside Thailand. So, you get 5 months (120 days) / visa run.

The work permit lives its own life and must not be confused with the visa.

[renaissanc]

Find a job paying at least 40K baht per month. The income for a marriage extension of stay has to be your own, not your wife's or MIL. You will need a non-immigrant "B" visa for the necessary work permit.

I'd like to add to this that for your marriage visa you will also need:

1. Photos of you and your wife on the sofa in your living room; on your bed in your bedroom; and in front of your house/home showing the number of the address. In colour. (Yes ... even on the bed, but they allow you to be sitting on it. So kind of them!) If you live in a housing estate, you'll need a photo of the front entrance signage.

2. If it is not your home, then get a letter in Thai from the owner saying that you are allowed to live there. Also, provide proof that the person signing that letter owns the property. Include her ID card too.

3. House registration document. If your children are on the document, then show their birth certificates too.

4. Wife's ID card.

5. If you're divorced, show your divorce certificate.

6. Photo of yourself. (All photos taken within the last 3 months.)

7. Declaration form for husband.

8. Declaration form for wife. (7 & 8 obtainable from Immigration)

9. Bank book in your name only showing 400,000 Baht or more in the bank for at least the last 2 months without it going below this amount even once. Update the book(s) on the day you go to Immigration. Fixed bank accounts cause confusion as they can't be updated on the day you go to immigration. (See 10 for this.)

10. A letter from the bank stating that the amount in the bank book(s) is true. It should state the amount 2 months ago and on the date when you get the letter. Have the bank stamp and sign every page. Include in the letter, if it is a fixed account, the fact that the bank book cannot be updated. If the bank does try to update the book and it shows a small deduction or interest added, have the letter explain each of these changes. If you don't, you'll be sent back to the bank manager to have him change his letter, which will cost you another 200 Baht per account.

11. 1,900 Baht.

Apply in person with your wife. Sign every photocopy. Provide 2 sets if you live outside Bangkok. You'll get a stamp in your passport stating come back in a month. Either you or your wife can collect the passport in person.

You don't need a lawyer for all of this, though seemingly quite a few foreigners pay 10,000 Baht to one of the many agents, who make sure you get fast service. One of the agents who works with the Immigration office in a province close to Bangkok (I won't mention which one) told me about the "charges" nowadays.

In 26 years of going to renew my marriage visa the service at Immigration offices around Thailand has been wonderful. I loved Suan Plu, even though one had to wait so long before it was one's turn. But where I have to go now, if you don't pay a fee somehow either in person or through an agent, be prepared for the officials to send you back home or wherever to get larger photos, more documents, more photos, etc. The officials can be very creative, if they want to be. I don't pay under-the-table money and so I have to go back and forth each year for this and that, together with receiving unkind, unfriendly, and at times humiliating service, which seems to get worse each year. This year the officials seemed to go out of their way to humiliate us in spite of our trying to be humble and subservient. Pity!

[bow]

Find a job paying at least 40K baht per month. The income for a marriage extension of stay has to be your own, not your wife's or MIL. You will need a non-immigrant "B" visa for the necessary work permit.

I'd like to add to this that for your marriage visa you will also need:

1. Photos of you and your wife on the sofa in your living room; on your bed in your bedroom; and in front of your house/home showing the number of the address. In colour. (Yes ... even on the bed, but they allow you to be sitting on it. So kind of them!) If you live in a housing estate, you'll need a photo of the front entrance signage.

2. If it is not your home, then get a letter in Thai from the owner saying that you are allowed to live there. Also, provide proof that the person signing that letter owns the property. Include her ID card too.

3. House registration document. If your children are on the document, then show their birth certificates too.

4. Wife's ID card.

5. If you're divorced, show your divorce certificate.

6. Photo of yourself. (All photos taken within the last 3 months.)

7. Declaration form for husband.

8. Declaration form for wife. (7 & 8 obtainable from Immigration)

9. Bank book in your name only showing 400,000 Baht or more in the bank for at least the last 2 months without it going below this amount even once. Update the book(s) on the day you go to Immigration. Fixed bank accounts cause confusion as they can't be updated on the day you go to immigration. (See 10 for this.)

10. A letter from the bank stating that the amount in the bank book(s) is true. It should state the amount 2 months ago and on the date when you get the letter. Have the bank stamp and sign every page. Include in the letter, if it is a fixed account, the fact that the bank book cannot be updated. If the bank does try to update the book and it shows a small deduction or interest added, have the letter explain each of these changes. If you don't, you'll be sent back to the bank manager to have him change his letter, which will cost you another 200 Baht per account.

11. 1,900 Baht.

Apply in person with your wife. Sign every photocopy. Provide 2 sets if you live outside Bangkok. You'll get a stamp in your passport stating come back in a month. Either you or your wife can collect the passport in person.

You don't need a lawyer for all of this, though seemingly quite a few foreigners pay 10,000 Baht to one of the many agents, who make sure you get fast service. One of the agents who works with the Immigration office in a province close to Bangkok (I won't mention which one) told me about the "charges" nowadays.

In 26 years of going to renew my marriage visa the service at Immigration offices around Thailand has been wonderful. I loved Suan Plu, even though one had to wait so long before it was one's turn. But where I have to go now, if you don't pay a fee somehow either in person or through an agent, be prepared for the officials to send you back home or wherever to get larger photos, more documents, more photos, etc. The officials can be very creative, if they want to be. I don't pay under-the-table money and so I have to go back and forth each year for this and that, together with receiving unkind, unfriendly, and at times humiliating service, which seems to get worse each year. This year the officials seemed to go out of their way to humiliate us in spite of our trying to be humble and subservient. Pity!

You don't need 1, 2, 5, 7, 8, 9 and 10 to get a 3 months, single entry, non-imm O at a Thai embassy or consulate outside of Thailand. The two months extension inside Thailand is more difficult, they might ask you for almost anything. But not for proof of income or money in the bank.

Edited June 15, 2010 by bow

[yeno]

Hi, guys!

Thanks for your help..

LOL, pictures on the sofa, in front of the house, under the sofa, under the shower... what else, in the name of God?

I know I need a work permit to legally work here, not only to change the visa... I expressed myself wrong, probably. What I know for sure is that the ED visa I own now restricts me for working (and, of course, obtaining a work permit). Anyway, still want to change it in anything else because I don't want to go school any more and, therefore, pay them only for my visa.

So, after reading the laws and the other lawyers sites on the internet, also your answers regarding my issue, these are my possibilities - please tell me if I'm wrong and, eventually, provide me with more information if you can:

- Plan 1. arrange a money transfer from my bank (RO) in my account here (TH) for a little more then 40k monthly. Pay another 3-4 months the school (to extend the ED visa), after that I request the O visa proving I have a monthly income of 40k with my bank notebook and eventually a letter from the bank. Problem: I don't know if this is to be considered monthly income or I need to be employed and provide a letter from my employer for this - any suggestions are welcomed.

- Plan 2. ask the (future) wife to open a small company in her name and hire me too... watch the stars, or whatever the company will suppose to do, in papers. This way she can declare my income more then 40k and after that I can get the O visa; or just remain with the B (is it B?) and work here for a Thai company. However, don't know the prices for this and also don't know how much it will cost (if the 'opening' price is acceptable) the monthly/yearly company's costs: taxes, accountant etc.

- Plan 3. I wait, again, on ED visa for half year and next year, when the school starts, I go to teach English for free, one year. After that, if this works for foreigners too, and not only for Thais, I could get a teacher certificate from the school and also find a paid job (there will be an examination, as far as I understood).

That's all that came to my mind today. Please advise and correct me if I'm wrong or confirm whatever can be done from my list.

Other possible things TO DO if I want to stay in the kingdom would be (please don't follow them ):

- Burn the Times Square building and save 10-20 Thais from the flames, this will probably grant me a medal and any kind of visa I'll ask for (where was I when the red-shirts burned the Central-Zen!?... lost that occasion);

- Open my own church and start a new religion will probably grant me some long stay visa;

- Throw away my passport and sing "Frere Jackques" every time the police will stop me and ask me anything... dancing a little will increase the desired effect.

Lumumba, thanks m8, but how can I trust someone rich who like "people in distress" for 10k sounds terrible wrong

Edited June 16, 2010 by yeno

[lopburi3]

There is no income required for a non immigrant O visa - once married you can obtain (at least single entries). The income from foreign source requires a letter from your Embassy for extensions of stay - not deposits to a Thai account. A work permit would not likely be available to a shop your wife sets up - it needs to be for a job a Thai can not do. If married and have 100k in bank KL will issue multi entry non immigrant O visa which only requires a border crossing every 90 days.

[yeno]

There is no income required for a non immigrant O visa - once married you can obtain (at least single entries). The income from foreign source requires a letter from your Embassy for extensions of stay - not deposits to a Thai account. A work permit would not likely be available to a shop your wife sets up - it needs to be for a job a Thai can not do. If married and have 100k in bank KL will issue multi entry non immigrant O visa which only requires a border crossing every 90 days.

In that case, I already erased the O visa from my list - I cannot go outside Th every 90 days, that's no different then being a tourist Is much cheaper and convenient to remain a student all my life... dam_n, some day I'll be 50 and still in school, what a shame!

About the company, I wasn't thinking about selling something. I know how it works (probably the same everywhere): if the company cannot find someone capable for a job then it can hire almost anyone else to do that job (eg foreigners). So if the company will (suppose) to do web site optimization and SEO services (don't know what activity is this included in), I guess it could hire me since they're not so many people who can do this and don't have jobs here. Or maybe a job position can be invented that will restrict most of the Thais to qualify. What do you think about this?

BTW, do you know the prices and the taxes a small company with probably 0 activity will have to pay?

Thanks!

[lopburi3]

It is a lot more complex than wanting to hire a foreigner. The company must be capitalized and make tax payments and have a company office/employees and for an extension of stay would have had to be in operation for a year or two. Read through the other topics here for a general guideline.

[Mario2008]

1 post offering help deleted as it seemed to be an illegal activity.

[JusMe]

I cannot go outside Th every 90 days, that's no different then being a tourist

No money in the bank, no monthly income. Sounds like a tourist to me!

[chowder]

If married and have 100k in bank KL will issue multi entry non immigrant O visa which only requires a border crossing every 90 days.

hmmm i thought that you only needed to report to the immigration every 90days until your visa is expired, for this kind of visa multiple O base on marriage Edited June 17, 2010 by chowder

[Lite Beer]

If married and have 100k in bank KL will issue multi entry non immigrant O visa which only requires a border crossing every 90 days.

hmmm i thought that you only needed to report to the immigration every 90days until your visa is expired, for this kind of visa multiple O base on marriage

With a Multi Entry Non Imm O Visa you have to leave the country every 90 days.

[yeno]

With a Multi Entry Non Imm O Visa you have to leave the country every 90 days.

And that makes this also no better (actually worst, unfortunately) then the ED visa which I hold now.

So, after analysing the possibilities I've kind of erased the O completely from my list. I'm now thinking about this: find someone (a friend of a friend) who has a company older then 2 years (as Lopsuri2 said), maybe volunteer work will also count, so the company will not have to complicate too much, OR stay with the ED visa and pay the school taxes yearly. Actually this is not bad, it seems the easiest way, the only problem is ED doesn't allow me to work, as far as I've understood... and I'd really like to do something. In one year I guess I'll make the 400k and I can change then to O... dam_n, one more year - reminds me of high school.

I'm wondering, however, if foreigner woman will get married with Thai man, she must have also this money in the bank or is only the man?! Because it would be strange, like the woman supporting the family (well, usually is the other way); in not, it would be even stranger, making me feel discriminated :)

No money in the bank, no monthly income. Sounds like a tourist to me!

No, Jusme, that's the other way - the tourist has money in the bank and a monthly income. Is much easier to go as a tourist with a credit card in your pocket rather then a bag of money ... either way, you must have money to go visit other countries.