I Was Attacked By My Ex-Foreman Today With A Shovel And 4 Workers

[Tokay]

What a day.

I will make another thread about the ongoing struggle with the builder who goes by the name Khun Ann (tall skinny guy, drives a beige truck) and post photos of the totally botched job he did, but for now I will tell you what happened today.

Being that he never finished the job and it has been impossible to track down to get the key from him (Smart Door, can't just change the lock) and collect the money for the things he never completed, I was happy when I saw him today on another job site as I was driving down a soi. I stopped and was very kind to him, asked him for my keys and what we could do about the money he owed me. I spoke in a way that tried to preserve his face and tried to not make the situation so serious.

It was the end of the work day and he had clearly been drinking and I should have left then but foolishly didn't. I was very polite even though I was angry with him for the mess he has created. In return, he was drunk and rude, telling me to go home and that he was working and that I was never getting my keys or my money. (They were not working, they were drinking.) Then he took out some money and counted it, 20,000, and acted like he was going to give it to me, then turned and gave it to another man. They all laughed. I told him to stop playing around and just give me my keys and I would be on my way. He said OK and had me follow him inside the building where he reached for a big shovel and swung at it me out of the blue. He was slow and drunk so I was able to get my hands on it and try to fight it from him as I knew where this mess was heading. About 4 more of his guys ran in and attacked me in true Thai style.

It was me and then in a construction site and if it wasn't for myself getting my hands on the shovel and defending myself, I would have never made it out alive, but I did and was able to get away but took some hits in the process and gave a few as well. They are gonna feel it in the morning, that's for sure.

Went to the police station, filed the report and did that song and dance which ended up in 6 hour affair where they finally had to go to his house to get my keys. He refused the police requests to come to the station to deliver them, however prior to me going there he also went to the police station after the fight to make a report about ME! The police saw he was drunk and since he also owes me money they will ticket him to appear in court to deal with that part. He was even rude and belligerent to the police.

What a total mess.

I don't know the rules here about posting about scum like this but if permitted I will post police report along with his ID, photo, truck plates, number and businesses he works for, so you can avoid him. I'll be making another thread with pics from the job he screwed up. Amazing pics. Never seen a project so screwed up before. If anyone knows the TV rules about posting such data, please let me know. You do NOT want to use this guy for anything. I know he has done some great jobs for others in the past but he has fallen apart in the worst way. I don't know if its drugs or not but he's become a mess and has now turned violent in addition to being a thief, hack and con man. A few of his other employees told me before how he cons the people who hires him, things like telling them a shop will make something (security bars, windows, doors) and he will just have one of his people make them and usually with parts they have stolen from other houses during rehab jobs. A real prize this guy is.

[rocketmanbkk]

Apologies but did this chap build a house for you or do some work on your house?

A very bad situation.

I hope it gets sorted out.

[yabaaaa]

Sadly you cant name and shame in Thailand so people like this keep on getting away with it. Mind you in the UK they get put out of business only to start up with a new name............incredible everywhere really!!!

[Tokay]

Apologies but did this chap build a house for you or do some work on your house?

A very bad situation.

I hope it gets sorted out.

Yes, he was hired to do a rehab job. He started guns a blazing and was doing a great job out of the gate. I thought I found someone great.

Then he asked if he could take a small break because there was a very big job he wanted to do but would come right back to mine after. Not being in a time crunch I said ok. BIG mistake. He never really came back other than sending a few flunkies over to literally ruin the place. The skilled workers he started with were never seen again and those he did come for a few hours here and there broke pretty much everything. Literally. He never returned there and always promised to fix this and that, but never followed through. Finally he just stopped and refused to give us our key for some reason or money he owed us for not finishing some of the work. Didn't even start on him yet for the things he ruined. We'll let the courts deal with that.

[rocketmanbkk]

Apologies but did this chap build a house for you or do some work on your house?

A very bad situation.

I hope it gets sorted out.

Yes, he was hired to do a rehab job. He started guns a blazing and was doing a great job out of the gate. I thought I found someone great.

Then he asked if he could take a small break because there was a very big job he wanted to do but would come right back to mine after. Not being in a time crunch I said ok. BIG mistake. He never really came back other than sending a few flunkies over to literally ruin the place. The skilled workers he started with were never seen again and those he did come for a few hours here and there broke pretty much everything. Literally. He never returned there and always promised to fix this and that, but never followed through. Finally he just stopped and refused to give us our key for some reason or money he owed us for not finishing some of the work. Didn't even start on him yet for the things he ruined. We'll let the courts deal with that.

Good luck mate, I hope all goes well.

[waza]

I am guessing this happened in Pattaya?

[onnut]

Sorry to hear about this. I learnt a lesson a long time ago and that was not to pay until job done.

Good luck in sorting it out.

[Tokay]

I am guessing this happened in Pattaya?

But of course!

Sorry to hear about this. I learnt a lesson a long time ago and that was not to pay until job done.

Good luck in sorting it out.

I paid him as the job went. Install this, get paid. Make that, get paid. Build this, get paid. And so on. On the surface it looks like the items were completed. The small bit of money he does owe me is just for one more item, the only thing I did pay him for in advance - the large windows - because he was short on funds he claimed. He had been good to that point so I foolishly trusted it.

The project had to be done in stages and it wasn't until later on that the early on steps, that they did get paid for, turned out to poorly made or incorrect. Then it was agreed that they screwed up ( big time ) and he said he would fix it all and we were not to pay him more until they fix it and finish it correctly. Deal. Problem is, they never came back to fix anything else other than a few hours here and there and made it worse than it was before. And of course never made the windows I did pay for.

The place is in shambles now. Broken and cracked concrete, the garage door is scratched and rusting already, the entire bathroom has to be re-done, the downstairs bathroom that was turned into storage leaks water THROUGH the new cracks in the wall, it is now without windows, the steps are in broken pieces, they ended up stealing all of my wire and shorting me on the electric, didn't put in the earth, knocked hole in the ceiling when someone tripped while walking in the attic, leaks through the new ceiling... it goes on and on. Never seen anything like it. I think the guy is on drugs now based on his severe attitude change. Plus he is slimming down even more than he was. I've known a lot of two faced and back stabbing Thais in my years here but never seen one change so drastic as he did.

[yabaaaa]

Hey if thats him in your avatar................. i would've seen the warning signs

[Tokay]

Hey if thats him in your avatar................. i would've seen the warning signs

No, that's just some guy I kicked in the nads and took a photo of it right afterwards.

Ann actually looks like a lizard. Not being hateful with that, but he has a lizard look to him. A tall, skinny, lizard.

[jackr]

I know it won't help, but this is one major reason I do everything myself. Had a semi-major job done, which wasn't too bad to be fair, but other things would wind up getting broken, workers not turning up for days on end, leaving a mess, pissing in the hedge, bringing wives/girlfriends/kids along lounging about etc. One guy even brought along a rifle one day to shoot birds over the perimeter wall.

Two options: drag the a-hole through court and make the bugger pay, or let it go for fear of repercussions as he's clearly unhinged.

[CarlBkk]

Don't let it go. Give him hel_l. After the way he acted to you when you were polite to him, make him think twice that foreigners are a push-over next time.

[Mario2008]

1 post removed for promoting violence.

Also be aware that our forum rules do not allow naming and shaming.

[Semper]

1 post removed for promoting violence.

Also be aware that our forum rules do not allow naming and shaming.

Sorry.

[Phil Conners]

I'll leave it to the mods to tell you what you can and can't do on TV, but you can always setup a "www.khunannsucks.com" website with your story and your pictures. If you are savvy and can do it yourself that will not cost you much pocket money and with privacy on the whois it'll be very difficult for anyone in Thailand (or elsewhere for that reason) to find you (of course it can be done but for starters courts would needs to agree).

[angiud]

The url you give and a search on khunannsucks give no results

This because I don't read the post deeply....

[Phil Conners]

Of course not, it hasn't been created yet. I suggested the OP could create it.

[CHdiver]

You could try to put your thread on the wooden opening in a house forum. Maybe they are a little more relaxed there.

[craigt3365]

I'll leave it to the mods to tell you what you can and can't do on TV, but you can always setup a "www.khunannsucks.com" website with your story and your pictures. If you are savvy and can do it yourself that will not cost you much pocket money and with privacy on the whois it'll be very difficult for anyone in Thailand (or elsewhere for that reason) to find you (of course it can be done but for starters courts would needs to agree).

That's a great idea. But do it for all of Thailand for every type of service. They have that in the US and I have referenced it a few times...especially for auto work. Hummm....may be a biz idea here? But I am sure a hefty security detail would be required if doing this here in Thailand!

[thaihome]

This is why for any project short of very small, you get the contractor to post a performance bond in order to make sure they finish the job or you can pull the bond and get someone else to do it. If they cannot get the bond, then chances are they are not the right people for the project, and you are going to get what you pay for.

TH

[Tokay]

Also be aware that our forum rules do not allow naming and shaming.

Please explain something to me.

Every day I get sent emails from Thai Visa where they post news reports that "name and shame people" who were arrested for crimes they may or may not have committed. Why then, would I not be permitted to name and shame his low life if I have the proper police report to back up my claim? What's the difference?

[Tokay]

I'll leave it to the mods to tell you what you can and can't do on TV, but you can always setup a "www.khunannsucks.com" website with your story and your pictures. If you are savvy and can do it yourself that will not cost you much pocket money and with privacy on the whois it'll be very difficult for anyone in Thailand (or elsewhere for that reason) to find you (of course it can be done but for starters courts would needs to agree).

\

I like your style.

[slapout]

The suggestion of performance bond to most of these shade tree builders/remodel people would most likely be met with a vacant stare and a mi mee. Look up his wife, let her look at the mess he made, and let slip you paid him in advance so he could buy gold for his girlfriend. Doubt if you can sort things out to your satisfaction, but the end result, between he and the wife may be some reward.

[Tokay]

The suggestion of performance bond to most of these shade tree builders/remodel people would most likely be met with a vacant stare and a mi mee. Look up his wife, let her look at the mess he made, and let slip you paid him in advance so he could buy gold for his girlfriend. Doubt if you can sort things out to your satisfaction, but the end result, between he and the wife may be some reward.

Someone pointed out today that his SISTER works for the falang company here in town that is giving him the work. She is married to the owner. Thai Visa sleuths on the case! :jap:

His wife runs a Thai style convenience shop out of the front of their home.

[Tokay]

If anyone knows of other Thai boards or outlets where the discuss construction or remodeling, please PM me with them. I want to get the news of this violent dirt bag out to as many as possible so others do not have the same misfortune I've had with him.

Thank you.

[MiG16]

Also be aware that our forum rules do not allow naming and shaming.

Please explain something to me.

Every day I get sent emails from Thai Visa where they post news reports that "name and shame people" who were arrested for crimes they may or may not have committed. Why then, would I not be permitted to name and shame his low life if I have the proper police report to back up my claim? What's the difference?

HI Tokay

sorry to hear about the traumatic experience you had. Sadly, it is not uncommon in the construction industry I have to say. Please do be careful. I know we all get into the moment, especially when we know we are not at fault. However, it is usually not worth the risk to ourselves/friends and family. In future it is best to deal with them by phone, or through an intermediary if things do not progress. Keep proof of all damage done, contracts entered into, but try not to confront them yourself!

in terms of naming and shaming on the forum, while a police report may have been filed, this is not proof of crime committed (not saying he did or did not, but as we all know, the law as it applies is innocent unless proven guilty). The anti naming and shaming policy on this forum is in place to protect not only the forum but also individual members that posts such comments, as libel laws in Thailand are very strict.

I hope you understand.

regards, and again best wishes in getting the matter sorted with as little stress and damage as possible.

[SAMCHAROEN]

It happened to me too some years ago when I was renovating ..

That guy looked and talked decently and was very polite.

I did not have time to be at the site all day but my wife (Thai) was doing all the talking and overseeing the work.

After a few days he asked for some advance money and a few days later he asked for some more. This went on till all the money owed to him was paid but a good portion (I put it at about 20%) of the work had not yet been completed.

One day they came in the morning as usual and worked till about 2pm. Then this guy got a call and he told my wife that he was needed back home and left with all his workers and most of his equipment.

We never heard from him again.

We called and called but his phone was always switched off.

We waited for a week fearing that this guy must have met some accident or was hospitalized or something. It soon dawned on us that that we had been left hanging.

I quickly found another team who were ready to complete the job. I also found out that they would have done the job at half the price what I had agreed with the original team.

The lucky thing for me was that he forgot some of his drilling machines and I sold it for bt2000 (what the heck).

Looking on the bright side, its a good lesson for my wife who is "chai dee" to a fault specially with money since I had warned her many times to be careful.

Now she never pushes her will on me as far as money is concerned.

[Chunky1]

These threads usually start with a tough talking OP but by the end of it he has either rearranged his entire life (moved to another location/job/etc) or apologized w/ payment with his tail between his legs. Just saying.

[Tokay]

These threads usually start with a tough talking OP but by the end of it he has either rearranged his entire life (moved to another location/job/etc) or apologized w/ payment with his tail between his legs. Just saying.

Lets see, I was jumped by a few Thai guys, one of them had a large shovel. I was unarmed and alone. Not only did I get out of the mess without a trip to the ER, but I also was able to get the shovel from them for most of the fight, until I finally lost the shovel due to them all taking me to the ground at once, then I fought them off me and had to scoot the heck out of there with a quickness before it escalated and someone was killed. So yea, I'm only talking tough here.

I drove past the work place today as I was going to eat, the entire location was closed down for the first time in 2 months. I doubt one of them could get out of bed this morning after the serious rib and kidney shots they took from me with the shovel. They may be in the ER themselves with broken ribs. Who knows, but that job site has been alive every day for 2 months until today.

Sure, maybe he will try to get his friends to get me but he was also dumb enough to tell the police he was going to hurt me again and that is documented too. If he does, he goes to jail. If he does something and has me shot, then I'm dead and it doesn't matter anyway. Though I had to admit, the loss of face for several Thai men with weapons to lose to a single falang must be massive. So yea, maybe they will kill me. Maybe they didn't come to work today because they were looking for me. Time well tell.

Maybe you would leave with your tail between your legs but I will not. This was not my first rodeo.

[Tokay]

in terms of naming and shaming on the forum, while a police report may have been filed, this is not proof of crime committed (not saying he did or did not, but as we all know, the law as it applies is innocent unless proven guilty). The anti naming and shaming policy on this forum is in place to protect not only the forum but also individual members that posts such comments, as libel laws in Thailand are very strict.

I thank you for the detailed explanation but this is still very confusing to me. I can't count the amount of stories posted here of people simply accused of a crime, but no proof of it. If the law states that EVERYONE is innocent until proven guilty, then why does TV post any stories if they may not be guilty? Take example the 90 year old man who allegedly raped 4 young girls at the same time. That is clearly a false story and there was no proof of it, yet the story was posted her with his full information. Countless stories just like this, only accused, no proof or guilty verdict. In fact, you hardly ever hear of a guilty verdict because people just buy their way out of trouble.

Does it have to be in the news paper in order for it to be a real crime that is allowed to be spoken of on TV?

This is very blurry line. It seems that if another press breaks the story, it's ok even if there is no proof at all. However, if one of the board members breaks a story or tells of a situation and can back it up, it's not ok. In my case the guy admitted to fighting me and its all on paper, documented by police. That is not innocent until proven guilty, that is admitting to being guilty as charged.

Anyway, I'm not being combative with you, just stating the obvious here. The rules at TV are a little sided and creeps like this continue to get away with it because we can not speak about it properly, even when they admit their guilt.