Another Uk Settlement.

[Philmaca]

My Girlfriend's with me in the UK, on a Fiance/marriage visa. The plan was to get married and then apply for a settlement visa, but as i live in N. Ireland and hold an Irish passport as well as a British one, i was wondering if it would be easier and cheaper to marry her as an Irish citizen and then apply for a residency for her as the non EU spouse of a EU citizen. It almost sounds too good to be true! I have checked over the forms and guidance notes and i do not see any problems.

Does anyone know the timescale involved and anything that would be a problem given my circumstances. It might also be worth mentioning that we have a 11 week old son, he was born in Thailand, but has dual British/Thai citizenship already, so he probably won't figure in the process. The girlfriend has had two previous British visitor visas issued, the first one using the excellent services of Ralph Davies of Davies Khan in 08, then another in 09.

One other matter, when i contacted the local marriage office, they want a certified copy of the GF's Birth certificate, in Bangkok the agencies offering this service, where everywhere and cheap. So far, using the internet searches i have found a few in the UK, but they are charging £50, sounds a bit steep. Anyone know of anything cheaper and reliable?

Edited July 15, 2010 by Philmaca

[Mercury]

Whilst in Thailand I got a certified copy of my child's birth certificate for around Bt300, ready the next day. I am guessing that if you were to colour scan the birth certificate, presuming you have it, and email that scanned copy to someone in Thailand, they could easily sort it out for you in a similar fashion. However, in the big scheme of things, £50 or around Bt2500 seems small fish when dealing with settlement visa costs. I would just get it done or google for a bit cheaper.

[7by7]

What you are talking about is an EEA family permit which is issued under EU regulations rather than a member state's immigration rules.

She does not qualify at present as you and she are not married, unless you can prove that you have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage outside the UK for at least the last 2 years.

I'm not 100% sure about the following, but am fairly confident it is correct; hopefully someone can confirm/deny/clarify.

As she has entered the UK with a UK fiance visa under the UK immigration rules she cannot now switch in the UK to an EEA family permit but will have to continue along the UK route.

To switch, she would need to return to Thailand after your marriage (or before and then marry in Thailand) and apply there under the EU rules.

Alternatively you could live for a short period in another EU state with her and then obtain a permit to live in the UK. Remember that she would need a permit to live in that other state.

Whether you could use your British citizenship to obtain a family permit for her to live in the RoI and once there use your Irish citizenship to obtain a permit for her to live in the UK, I don't know; but probably.

[Philmaca]

Of course, i didn't think it all over. She would have to exit the UK and return to Thailand to put an end to her current visa. It still sounds like a good idea, the downside being, that the GF and my son would have to endure an arduous round trip. Although at least, she could visit her folks.

Would she be entitled to medical care under either UK settlment or EEA family permit?

[7by7]

Last question answered first; yes, as she would be taking up residence in the UK she would be entitled to full NHS cover.

Obviously the decision whether to abandon your current course and follow the EEA route is one for you and your fiance to make; but I'd like to give some further information which I hope will help you make that decision.

Your fiance is already in the UK with a fiance visa. Once you have married she applies for 24 months Further Leave to Remain. During this time she passes the LitUK test or makes progrees in an ESOL with citizenship course (KOL requirement) and at the end of her FLR she applies for Indefinite Leave to Remain (if she hasn't satisfied the KOL at that time she will need to obtain another FLR).

The current cost of FLR is £435 by post, £730 in person.

The current cost of ILR is £840 by post, £1095 in person.

Plus the cost of the LitUK test or ESOL with citizenship course.

An EEA permit is free. After 5 years in the UK she can apply for permanent residence; this application is also free and she will not have to satisfy KOL to get it.

If you were both still in Thailand marrying there and using your Irish citizenship to obtain an EEA family permit for her to join you in the UK is obviously better costwise. But as she is in the UK already, is the cost of a return ticket to Thailand for her and your son (and you?) worth it? Although the cost of ILR is bound to increase before she is eligible to apply, will the amount saved by the time you've paid the extra airfares and costs of staying in Thailand while she applies for her EEA permit make it worth the effort?

Even if you all move for a short while to another EEA state, what about your job? Her living in, for example, the RoI while you work in the UK would not qualify her for the Irish equivalent of an EEA permit. You would have to be living with her in Ireland too.

Another point, ILR (which is to all intents and purposes the same as permanent residence) after 2 years, or permanent residence following the EEA route after 5 years; which is better?

Finally, as the spouse of a British citizen she will be able to apply for naturalisation as British after she has ILR and she has been living in the UK for 3 years (time spent on her fiance visa before the marriage will count).

As the spouse of an EEA national she will not be able to apply for naturalisation as British until she has permanent residence and has been living in the UK for 5 years (she would also have to satisfy KOL as she would not have already done so to obtain ILR).

I'm sure you are aware the advantages that having a British passport; including visa free travel to all of the EEA and many other places that Thais have to obtain a visa for.

These are the main points, I think, you need to consider before deciding which route to follow.

Good luck for the future, whatever you decide.

[Philmaca]

That's great info, can't thank you enough for taking the time to reply. I've a while to decide which option to take. if i could make the trip over the winter, it would be a no brainer, but unfortunately the visa was issued in March. Missing september at home would get me down! But the more important issues will decide.

[nongbkk]

I was not, at first going to read this topic.. I thought that it would not concern me, was i wrong !! 7by7 your reply had to one of the finest responses have ever witnessed at any time on the Internet. The knowledge and cander re your reply is second to none, I doff my hat to you sir, I too am from N.I, if your every in N.I, I would love to buy you a beer. Or two and pick your brains. The time and effort in your post must have been considerable, posts like this make the Internet great for what it is... Knowledge sharing.

Well done sir ( or madam !!)