Why Does Thailand Have Such A Bad Reputation ?

[tatee]

I know what the outsiders think of Thailand and I gotta admit that I don't like it. How many times you have heard that ordinary Thai women have been mistaken to be prostitutes. As a Thai person I don't like it very much. Recently there's a show on Thai TV regarding foreigners who been lived in Thailand for a long time come to tell their story about how much they love Thailand. I think this program is really good. Anyway, since this forum has lots of Farangs who also love Thailand So I'd like to know if you have an idea to help Thailand out of this bad reputation?

[StreetCowboy]

I thought women in Thailand had a very positive image. I don''t know any other country where the ladies are such a tourist attraction in their own right.

I thought it was the police, and the riots, and the Tourist Authority of Thailand, and the cheats and fraudsters that people complain about who gave Thailand a bad reputation.

I certainly don't know anyone that comes here because of them...

SC

[Jingthing]

I don't know, enforce the prostitution laws, how about that?

[Chunky1]

Burn Pattaya to the ground and things get a whole lot easier. It's like a senior citizens home for convicts combined with a brothel. I'd say that it is definitely a blight on Thailand's reputation.

[wintermute]

I don't think Thailand has a bad reputation per se..but it also depends on what you call "bad" reputation wise. Thailand mostly has a rep of being an easy place to retire and have fun. Prostitution etc.. is an element of it but then again that fits in with the whole reputation of being easy going.

If you want to know the truth I don't think many people take Thailand or Thai people seriously though.

[Jingthing]

You're confusing a symptom with the disease. Burning Pattaya would do nothing.

[gotlost]

You're confusing a symptom with the disease. Burning Pattaya would do nothing.

You still have Bangkok, Phuket, Hua Hin, Chiang Mai.

[tijnebijn]

I agree with the Op , it would be great for Thais if they can change their image .

The problem is in itself , as some other posters already mentioned , everywhere you go

you will see karaoke and bar beers where woman pull and some force themselves over you ,

even if you are not interested , not only farangs have this .

If I look at the customers getting in karaoke shops , mostly they are Thais anyway .

With ordinary woman who are not prostitutes in the word itself , I disturb myself for

the fact that these nice , some educated woman will rent themself out , other words they

are willing to stay with a foreigner ( also Thai men )when they give them a monthly amount to spend on , if they can find better they change their ' gik' for the same purpose .

This example is very common , I see this alot and it seems very normal for them , although they are bit ashamed they are going along with it , this is not helping for Thailand to change their image at all , it is even cultural , and in the West is perceived as prostitutes also , only quite ones .

I wish they would value someone on virtue and intelligence or good looks ,

sure many do , but the woman most Westerners come across seem to have this ,

myself and wife not included , my wife also finds this very disturbing and strange ,

but what can you do about it ?

[IanForbes]

Take all the bunch of self righteous bigots in foreign countries who think their own poop doesn't smell and it doesn't surprise me. There are only a few relatively modern Asian countries that are still fairly inexpensive to live in and it is bound to happen. Provide a fairly stable environment with beautiful women and it will attract men from everywhere. Foreign press LOVES to stereotype ANYTHING that involves sex. The press will over excentuate anything remotely involving sex. The press passes that onto the bigots and you have your answer. Thailand doesn't offer anything that can't be had everywhere else. Just yesterday I read a local, free newspaper and the whole last page was advertisements for sexual massage or escort services. That is in the sleepy, staid city of Victoria on Vancouver Island in Canada. A holiday center like Las Vegas is saturated with hookers. So are all the other adult tourist centers in the USA.

[Jingthing]

I agree with you Ian, but there is more to the bad rep of Thailand than just the sex biz.

[wintermute]

Let's not delude ourselves, Thailand DOES have a bad reputation. That's not something that can be changed overnight. Thais can change things by first dealing with corruption. It is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, and polls have said most Thais just accept that. That basically means it is hopeless. So the answer isn't on an expat board, now is it?

Bad reputation amongst who? The echo chamber of western expats who vent at each other daily? That's not the mainstream.

Thailand's mainstream reputation is mostly a safe fun holiday destination with beach resorts, sun, and women for single men.

A country with a bad reputation? Look at Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, or even Israel. Now that's a real bad international reputation.

[Jingthing]

I suggest we focus on Thailand here. It is true Thailand is not the only country with a bad reputation, but do we really need another proxy Israel bashing thread?

[wintermute]

I suggest we focus on Thailand here. It is true Thailand is not the only country with a bad reputation, but do we really need another proxy Israel bashing thread?

I'm pointing out how there are some exaggerations here from bitter old expats about how bad Thailand is perceived.

Most people don't give a flying fig about the corruption or specific politics in the country they're visiting if it doesn't effect their well being.

[StreetCowboy]

Let's not delude ourselves, Thailand DOES have a bad reputation. That's not something that can be changed overnight. Thais can change things by first dealing with corruption. It is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, and polls have said most Thais just accept that. That basically means it is hopeless. So the answer isn't on an expat board, now is it?

Bad reputation amongst who? The echo chamber of western expats who vent at each other daily? That's not the mainstream.

Thailand's mainstream reputation is mostly a safe fun holiday destination with beach resorts, sun, and women for single men.

A country with a bad reputation? Look at Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, or even Israel. Now that's a real bad international reputation.

I wanted to commend your post but sadly the crusader got there first.

He's forever trying to divert threads into his crusade. Anyway, having never been to Saudi Arabia, Iran or Israel, it is quite clear that their reputation is sufficient to keep tourists away. I have been to Thailand, and do not believe it has a bad reputation. I can think of very few people who have been to any of the countries that you listed for reasons other than work or family. On the other hand, countless people choose to come to Thailand,. Again and Again and Again. And many people come here for a first time. Therefore, no bad reputation.

The OP focussed on the ladies. I have met very many pleasant thai ladies of all walks of life, and to stereotype them as hookers, or even to suggest that they have a reputation as such, is simply to promulgate that lie. Therefore, perhaps if people would stop saying two things:

"All thai ladies are hookers" and

"Everyone thinks that all thai ladies are hookers"

then perhaps fewer people would think it.

While I may dislike English lager louts, I don't go around stereotyping all English as such, nor saying 'everyone believes the English are all alcoholic thugs'; it is a cruel slur on the respectable English.

SC

[bonobo]

Frankly, in my circles in the US, Thailand has a rather positive reputation. Most people with whom I have discussed Thailand want to visit it if they haven't or want to come back if they have already been there. And I am not writing only about American men.  To a person, American women have expressed to me a desire to come to Thailand. 

Even with Thai women, I don't know anyone who thinks that all Thai women are prostitutes.  There is the caveat, though, that if an older American comes home with his new young wife, many might assume she was a prostitute, but that would happen no matter from what country she is, even from the USA. 

[ableguy]

Let's not delude ourselves, Thailand DOES have a bad reputation. That's not something that can be changed overnight. Thais can change things by first dealing with corruption. It is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, and polls have said most Thais just accept that. That basically means it is hopeless. So the answer isn't on an expat board, now is it?

i agree about the corruption but i am sure the average tourist does not get to see it as we expats do, in our face every day, also the tourist may get stung when buying gifts or things on the beach,however as long as they are happy with the price thats fine too, but we expats every day face Thais trying to rip us beacause of a white face, I love the country but it can be trying and I think it is this frustration that gets people on here bitching about Thailand. Finally I feel it is the rampant prostitution memory that tourists go home remmembering most and talk about after all its in your face every day.

[Jingthing]

I can think of very few people who have been to any of the countries that you listed for reasons other than work or family.

China tourism --

China is the world's fourth largest country for inbound tourism. The number of overseas tourists was 55 million in 2007.

wiki

Israel tourism --

Tourism in Israel is one of the country's major sources of income, with 2.7 million tourists in 2009.[1] Israel offers a plethora of historical and religious sites, beach resorts, archaeological tourism, heritage tourism and ecotourism. Israel has the highest number of museums per capita in the world.[2] The most popular paid site is Masada.[3] The largest groups of tourists visit from the United States, the United Kingdom, Russia, France, and Germany.[4]

According to Tourism Ministry figures, 280,000 people visited Israel in July 2010, marking an all-time record for the month.[5]

wiki

[wintermute]

It's amusingly ironic but I almost never hear the bitter expat style comments coming from foreign women in Thailand. There's plenty of bashing going on against western women though and it's almost always overwhelmingly coming from one direction.

Proportionally speaking there are far more Russian and Filipina brides married to American (and i'll go as far as to say westerners in general) men than there are Thai women anyways. I can tell you for certain that when 20-30 somethings think "Thailand" most of the time they think of the movie "The Beach" or as a exotic bohemian getaway to go diving or something.

[wintermute]

I can think of very few people who have been to any of the countries that you listed for reasons other than work or family.

China tourism --

China is the world's fourth largest country for inbound tourism. The number of overseas tourists was 55 million in 2007.

wiki

Israel tourism --

Tourism in Israel is one of the country's major sources of income, with 2.7 million tourists in 2009.[1] Israel offers a plethora of historical and religious sites, beach resorts, archaeological tourism, heritage tourism and ecotourism. Israel has the highest number of museums per capita in the world.[2] The most popular paid site is Masada.[3] The largest groups of tourists visit from the United States, the United Kingdom, Russia, France, and Germany.[4]

According to Tourism Ministry figures, 280,000 people visited Israel in July 2010, marking an all-time record for the month.[5]

wiki

Proportionally speaking..for the size of its population, geography, and its historical centrality to Asia..China's tourism should be way more than "4th" in the world.

Also, most of the tourists going to Israel are mostly the well off Jewish immigrants who have lived for generations in the U.S., Europe, etc.. going back to the "motherland" to visit. You won't find many tourists at all outside of that demographic.

[bonobo]

 

Proportionally speaking there are far more Russian and Filipina brides married to American (and i'll go as far as to say westerners in general) men than there are Thai women anyways.

 

Not just proportionally, but in real numbers, too.  The Immigration Service actually has one separate office for the US/Philippines marriages/engagements and subsequent visa/green card issues.

I can tell you for certain that when 20-30 somethings think "Thailand" most of the time they think of the movie "The Beach" or as a exotic bohemian getaway to go diving or something.

I would have to agree with that. 

[StreetCowboy]

I can think of very few people who have been to any of the countries that you listed for reasons other than work or family.

China tourism --

China is the world's fourth largest country for inbound tourism. The number of overseas tourists was 55 million in 2007.

wiki

Israel tourism --

Tourism in Israel is one of the country's major sources of income, with 2.7 million tourists in 2009.[1] Israel offers a plethora of historical and religious sites, beach resorts, archaeological tourism, heritage tourism and ecotourism. Israel has the highest number of museums per capita in the world.[2] The most popular paid site is Masada.[3] The largest groups of tourists visit from the United States, the United Kingdom, Russia, France, and Germany.[4]

According to Tourism Ministry figures, 280,000 people visited Israel in July 2010, marking an all-time record for the month.[5]

wiki

You're absolutely right - I should have added in religion, as well as family or work. Saudi Arabia benefits greatly from religous tourism. And you are right, China was, in my opinion, incorrectly on that list, since I have myself been there as a tourist, and I have acquaintances that have gone there on shagging-trips, I believe. Of course, if we subscribe to the People's Republic's classification of China, it is a great place to visit - the gambling and vice dens of Macau, the outrageous extravegance and libertarian debauchery of Hong Kong, the culture and open friendliess, as well as the scenery, in the Republic - although to be sure, I still wouldn't go there (the Republic) but to visit friends.

And similarly Israel, Iran and Saudi Arabia. Maybe part of the poor reputation relates to a perceived lack of separation between church and state? And also fractious hypersensitivity and xenophobia.

SC

[Max2010]

Take all the bunch of self righteous bigots in foreign countries who think their own poop doesn't smell and it doesn't surprise me. There are only a few relatively modern Asian countries that are still fairly inexpensive to live in and it is bound to happen. Provide a fairly stable environment with beautiful women and it will attract men from everywhere. Foreign press LOVES to stereotype ANYTHING that involves sex. The press will over excentuate anything remotely involving sex. The press passes that onto the bigots and you have your answer. Thailand doesn't offer anything that can't be had everywhere else. Just yesterday I read a local, free newspaper and the whole last page was advertisements for sexual massage or escort services. That is in the sleepy, staid city of Victoria on Vancouver Island in Canada. A holiday center like Las Vegas is saturated with hookers. So are all the other adult tourist centers in the USA.

Ian, I agree with you 100% on this. There are so many ignorant people in this world. Thailand gives a chance to retired folks from all over the world a decent place to live cheaply on their meager pensions and even get a nice looking wife/gf half their age along the way, yet so many complain as if they live like a royal family in their homeland or their countries are so perfect in every sense. You hear of people compaining about Thailand and then tell you that they have been living in Thailand for a decade. If you don't like Thailand, why don't you go back home? Like Ian said, prostitution, corruption etc is everywhere. There are as many prostitutes who harass tourists in London as there are in Pattaya. I couldn't run away far enough from them in Earl"s Court, London. They were far more aggressive than your average Thai girls. And about corruption, it is just as common in EU and North America as it is in Thailand. Ever heard of "cash-for-honours affair" in the U.K? How about the BAE bribes to the Saudis, which was conveniently dropped by the U.K. government? How about the "campaign contributions" in the U.S. which is a nice convenient word for "bribing" to influence the Senators' voting? Corporate moneyhas hijacked American democracy for a very long time. Joe Lieberman, the former Democratic candidate for Vice-President. He has taken $448,066 in campaign contributions from private healthcare companies while his wife raked in $2m as one of their chief lobbyists, and he has blocked any attempt in the Senate to break the stranglehold of the health insurance companies and broaden coverage.

The US political system now operates within a corporate cage. If you want to run for office, you have to take corporate cash – and so you have to serve corporate interests. Corporations are often blatant in their corruption: it's not unusual for them to give to both competing candidates in a Senate race, to ensure all sides are indebted to them. It has reached the point that lobbyists now often write the country's laws. Not metaphorically; literally. The former Republican congressman Walter Jones spoke out in disgust in 2006 when he found that drug company lobbyists were actually authoring the words of the Medicare prescription bill, and puppet-politicians were simply nodding it through.

I think I have made my point.

Max2010

[koheesti]

I don't know anyone outside Thailand who thinks it has a bad reputation. Everyone I know thinks it is a paradise and that I was lucky to have lived there. However, expats living in Thailand tend to see beneath the paradise surface, the less pleasant elements of the country hence they complain more.

[HarrydePotter]

I don't know, enforce the prostitution laws, how about that?

how? what happened on the room is just between 2 people, want to change that?

[maccaroni man]

I don't know, enforce the prostitution laws, how about that?

how? what happened on the room is just between 2 people, want to change that?

if you were to visit sanur bali, on the surface it looks like a quiet upscale tourist area and women for rent are not something you will readily see however there are aprox 1,000 mostly beautiful working girls to be had. hence to the unfamiliar they will come and go with out ever knowing the difference. Thailand has a more, in your face approach to the same services and no one is spared the spectical of women selling themselves.

[Jingthing]

Let's not delude ourselves, Thailand DOES have a bad reputation. That's not something that can be changed overnight. Thais can change things by first dealing with corruption. It is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, and polls have said most Thais just accept that. That basically means it is hopeless. So the answer isn't on an expat board, now is it?

Bad reputation amongst who? The echo chamber of western expats who vent at each other daily? That's not the mainstream.

Thailand's mainstream reputation is mostly a safe fun holiday destination with beach resorts, sun, and women for single men.

A country with a bad reputation? Look at Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, or even Israel. Now that's a real bad international reputation.

He is the prototype of a grumpy old expat. Lost the ability to enjoy his life and just want share his misery. Cries fascism if the t-shirt seller hasn't a tee for his obese body. And that bad reputation myth is just shared between him and other old grumpy foreign men. Someone should send them home for their own sake.

It was the Thai OP who brought up Thailand's bad reputation as a fact. Sorry, it is a fact. I guess some people don't watch many Hollywood comedies, some dig at Thailand as a whoring sex zoo or even worse a pedo haven graces many of them. Those joke writers didn't write those jokes in a vacuum, people get the jokes and laugh loudly at them.

BTW, I am really not very old. (Yet.)

Edited August 23, 2010 by Jingthing

[StreetCowboy]

Let's not delude ourselves, Thailand DOES have a bad reputation. That's not something that can be changed overnight. Thais can change things by first dealing with corruption. It is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, and polls have said most Thais just accept that. That basically means it is hopeless. So the answer isn't on an expat board, now is it?

Bad reputation amongst who? The echo chamber of western expats who vent at each other daily? That's not the mainstream.

Thailand's mainstream reputation is mostly a safe fun holiday destination with beach resorts, sun, and women for single men.

A country with a bad reputation? Look at Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, or even Israel. Now that's a real bad international reputation.

He is the prototype of a grumpy old expat. Lost the ability to enjoy his life and just want share his misery. Cries fascism if the t-shirt seller hasn't a tee for his obese body. And that bad reputation myth is just shared between him and other old grumpy foreign men. Someone should send them home for their own sake.

That's a really good effort at a flame, but sadly, you'll need to learn a good deal more about your target. I imagine your vitriol will wash away like water off a duck's back. I'm very impressed with your ability to be rude and obnoxious in any thread, and deeply offensive, switching viewpoints with a magnanimity that displays a great breadth of mind and catholic (not meant religously) outlook. Actually, I can see some consistency in your outlook, but I'm not going to go there - as I have said earlier in this thread...

Anyway, carry on your baiting - you appear to be a master at it

SC

[Shotime]

This isn't the first time this has been discussed here.

Burning Pattaya to the ground wouldn't be a bad start, but it isn't relevant to the reputation thing. Most people unfamiliar with Thailand have never even heard of it..

The real reason for the perception that Thailand has is that everyone wants to point the finger elsewhere. Las Vegas (sin city) isn't looked at like people look at Thailand. Amsterdam, too. I could show you places in my home city that make Thailand look like a nunnery.

Mexico and other countries that produce and smuggle drugs are looked at as the culprits. Not the consumers.

Most people believe what they've heard or read, but know very little about the world. They're brainwashed.

I have a toothache so my sense of humour is shot. Sorry..

[Jingthing]

I don't know, enforce the prostitution laws, how about that?

how? what happened on the room is just between 2 people, want to change that?

I don't want to change that, but the OP asked how to change Thailand's rep, not me. I don't really care, it's not my country, it's his country. If I was allowed a path to permanent residence here from my current status, I would care more. Countries that seriously decide to enforce prostitution laws can indeed enforce them, its not that hard, look around the world.

[bonobo]

]It was the Thai OP who brought up Thailand's bad reputation as a fact. Sorry, it is a fact. I guess some people don't watch many Hollywood comedies, some dig at Thailand as a whoring sex zoo or even worse a pedo haven graces many of them. Those joke writers didn't write those jokes in a vacuum, people get the jokes and laugh loudly at them.

BTW, I am really not very old. (Yet.)

Not  trying to be argumentative, but what movies are you watching?  I can't think of any movies where pedo, for example, is a subject.