Psychotherapist

[antipodesant]

I know a young lady here in Chiang Mai who has already made one unsuccessful attempt at taking her own life. I did not know her at the time however understand that she was admitted to a hospital for about 10 days. I do not believe that she undertook any form of therapy following the earlier incident.

The question is; is anyone aware of a person who practices or provides this type of service. I guess to have any chance of succeeding the person should be Thai and preferably one who can speak english. Bit of an oxymoron there I know.

If there isn't there should be as suicide a real risk here in the realm, during the asian financial crisis (1997) two thai's an hour were committing (successfully) suicide in Bangkok alone.

Any advice would be gratefully received.

[uptheos]

I don't know a therapist but this might be of help in a crisis.

Samaritans in Chiang Mai can be reached at phone numbers 053-225-977/8. Their working hours are Monday-Thursday and Saturday from 19:00-22:00 hours. The services are in Thai.

Alternatively your friend can use their Bangkok English line at 02-713-6791. She can call 24 hrs a day, leave her phone number and an English speaking volunteer will return her call. Additionally, she can email to them - [email protected]

I wish your friend well.

[orang37]

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun Antipodesant,

First, your friend is dam_n lucky that she has a friend like you to be concerned for her, and thinking about her welfare. Suicide rates among younger people are reported as high, and getting higher, we read, in Thailand, but in this case we don't know the age of your friend.

From the very limited information in your post ... and realizing you may want to give out only limited information out of respect for her privacy ... it would be difficult to make any recommendations. If we assume that your friend is currently depressed, or is currently thinking about suicide, or verbally expressing ideas about suicide, that's one thing ... if your friend is currently engaging in behavior (like self-mutilation, or driving while drunk or stoned) that's self-destructive ... that's another reality.

Long ago this human being did have formal training in the mental health arena, and did work as a volunteer counsellor on suicide prevention hotlines in San Franciso.

One set of criteria useful for evaluating the degree of "threat of immediate suicidal action" is:

1. context: what's going on in the life of this person right now: are there any recent traumatic events; are they facing illness, have they just been injured; have they just lost a job, a relationship, a lover, a parent, a child; are they broke and desperate financially.

2. ideation: is the person having frequent thoughts, or vivid fantasies, about suicide, are they obssessed with suicide, fascinated with.

3. intent: does the person say they are going to committ suicide ... specifically.

4. means: does the person describe how they would do it, and do they have the "means at hand" to do it (i.e., a gun, a rope, a knife, poison, are they standing in a window prepared to jump).

5. affect: if the person is "breaking down," crying, screaming, ventilating: that can actually be a "good sign" in the sense that an emotional catharsis can be taking place which may ameliorate/relieve/change the dynamics of the internal trauma within the person. Of more concern is the person who is not letting the emotions out, and who is talking impersonally, without feeling.

6. payoff: there are some people for whom hysterical outbursts and threats of suicide are a regular psychic phenomenon, and/or whose (failed) attempts at suicide have a "secondary gain" of getting attention, taking revenge on people indirectly, etc.

7. "locus of control:" is your friend, in her perceptions of herself, feeling like she is being driven to suicide by forces out of her control ... or ... at the other extreme ... does your friend believe that she is making some voluntary choice and that she is in control of her life mentally and emotionally. Does she perceive herself as "victim," or "scapegoat" ?

Resources:

1. there have been several in-depth threads on the Chiang Mai forum about specific psychotherapists or psychoanalysts in Chiang Mai: suggest you search on this forum on the topics of "therapy," "pschotherapy," "psychologist," "psychoanalyst," "Suan Prung," "counselling," and "suicide."

2. if you can persuade your friend to go to Suan Prung Psychiatric Hospital for an intake interview, that could be very helpful.

3. The fact we don't know of any Thai speaking suicide-prevention or crisis hotlines in Chiang Mai ... doesn't mean there aren't any ... perhaps other TV CM members can inform us on that.

Finally, (and this "goes to the issue" of our not knowing much about your friend and her "Thainess"), we come to the "cultural issues, which could be quite complex.

Does your friend find any solace in or "meaning" in her current condition in her religious faith (Buddhist, Muslim, Christian, ?); does your friend recognize and "value" western-style psychological ideas and concepts. Does your friend, like many Thais, have any belief in animist entities, ghosts (phii), malign spirits, or does she reject such things completely.

You are right on track, we think, by wanting to find someone who is Thai to talk with her.

In any case, best of luck, and may your friendship for this human being continue to be a "light" for her.

best, ~o:37;

Edited September 4, 2010 by orang37

[antipodesant]

I don't know a therapist but this might be of help in a crisis.

Samaritans in Chiang Mai can be reached at phone numbers 053-225-977/8. Their working hours are Monday-Thursday and Saturday from 19:00-22:00 hours. The services are in Thai.

Alternatively your friend can use their Bangkok English line at 02-713-6791. She can call 24 hrs a day, leave her phone number and an English speaking volunteer will return her call. Additionally, she can email to them - [email protected]

I wish your friend well.

Thank you, I will follow it up and then pass on all the info to my friend.

[uptheos]

I don't know a therapist but this might be of help in a crisis.

Samaritans in Chiang Mai can be reached at phone numbers 053-225-977/8. Their working hours are Monday-Thursday and Saturday from 19:00-22:00 hours. The services are in Thai.

Alternatively your friend can use their Bangkok English line at 02-713-6791. She can call 24 hrs a day, leave her phone number and an English speaking volunteer will return her call. Additionally, she can email to them - [email protected]

I wish your friend well.

Thank you, I will follow it up and then pass on all the info to my friend.

Good luck. The information is up to date, as of September 1st 2010.

[eek]

Hi antipodesant,

Here is a couple of threads that i think are worth a look over:

I wish your friend success in coming through this obviously terrible time for her.

[BWPattaya]

I am a little curious. You wrote "The question is; is anyone aware of a person who practices or provides this type of service. I guess to have any chance of succeeding the person should be Thai and preferably one who can speak english. Bit of an oxymoron there I know."

If your friend is Thai why would the therapist need to speak English?

[antipodesant]

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun Antipodesant,

First, your friend is dam_n lucky that she has a friend like you to be concerned for her, and thinking about her welfare. Suicide rates among younger people are reported as high, and getting higher, we read, in Thailand, but in this case we don't know the age of your friend.

From the very limited information in your post ... and realizing you may want to give out only limited information out of respect for her privacy ... it would be difficult to make any recommendations. If we assume that your friend is currently depressed, or is currently thinking about suicide, or verbally expressing ideas about suicide, that's one thing ... if your friend is currently engaging in behavior (like self-mutilation, or driving while drunk or stoned) that's self-destructive ... that's another reality. No she doesn't drink very much nor take drugs, which is a blessing. Not expressing thoughts of suicide. But there is, a history.

Long ago this human being did have formal training in the mental health arena, and did work as a volunteer counsellor on suicide prevention hotlines in San Franciso.

One set of criteria useful for evaluating the degree of "threat of immediate suicidal action" is:

1. context: what's going on in the life of this person right now: are there any recent traumatic events; are they facing illness, have they just been injured; have they just lost a job, a relationship, a lover, a parent, a child; are they broke and desperate financially. Entered a new relationship but left a previous one. Is very confused and shows marked ambivilence.

2. ideation: is the person having frequent thoughts, or vivid fantasies, about suicide, are they obssessed with suicide, fascinated with. No

3. intent: does the person say they are going to committ suicide ... specifically. No

4. means: does the person describe how they would do it, and do they have the "means at hand" to do it (i.e., a gun, a rope, a knife, poison, are they standing in a window prepared to jump). No

5. affect: if the person is "breaking down," crying, screaming, ventilating: that can actually be a "good sign" in the sense that an emotional catharsis can be taking place which may ameliorate/relieve/change the dynamics of the internal trauma within the person. Of more concern is the person who is not letting the emotions out, and who is talking impersonally, without feeling. Crying and I told her this was good.

6. payoff: there are some people for whom hysterical outbursts and threats of suicide are a regular psychic phenomenon, and/or whose (failed) attempts at suicide have a "secondary gain" of getting attention, taking revenge on people indirectly, etc. Nothing really relevant here

7. "locus of control:" is your friend, in her perceptions of herself, feeling like she is being driven to suicide by forces out of her control ... or ... at the other extreme ... does your friend believe that she is making some voluntary choice and that she is in control of her life mentally and emotionally. Does she perceive herself as "victim," or "scapegoat" ? In part

Resources:

1. there have been several in-depth threads on the Chiang Mai forum about specific psychotherapists or psychoanalysts in Chiang Mai: suggest you search on this forum on the topics of "therapy," "pschotherapy," "psychologist," "psychoanalyst," "Suan Prung," "counselling," and "suicide."

2. if you can persuade your friend to go to Suan Prung Psychiatric Hospital for an intake interview, that could be very helpful. I will try but thai's are notorious for putting things off.

3. The fact we don't know of any Thai speaking suicide-prevention or crisis hotlines in Chiang Mai ... doesn't mean there aren't any ... perhaps other TV CM members can inform us on that.

Finally, (and this "goes to the issue" of our not knowing much about your friend and her "Thainess"), we come to the "cultural issues, which could be quite complex.

Does your friend find any solace in or "meaning" in her current condition in her religious faith (Buddhist, Muslim, Christian, ?); does your friend recognize and "value" western-style psychological ideas and concepts. Does your friend, like many Thais, have any belief in animist entities, ghosts (phii), malign spirits, or does she reject such things completely.

You are right on track, we think, by wanting to find someone who is Thai to talk with her.

In any case, best of luck, and may your friendship for this human being continue to be a "light" for her.

best, ~o:37;

I guess it can be best summed up by saying that whilst she should be happy with her new relatinship, this doesn't seem to be the case and in reality she is one very confused little girl. Her whole being, "no father figure, her conception being outside marriage or a established relationship, no positive example from her mother, the Thai custom of having the responsibility to support the mother clearly conveyed etc, no siblings" Whilst the foregong would fit many Thai's it seems to have a greater influence in this case.

[antipodesant]

I am a little curious. You wrote "The question is; is anyone aware of a person who practices or provides this type of service. I guess to have any chance of succeeding the person should be Thai and preferably one who can speak english. Bit of an oxymoron there I know."

If your friend is Thai why would the therapist need to speak English?

Whilst it may not be necessary it might be beneficial for a falang (english) to be in support.

[Drew Aitch]

It's extremely sad and often unnecessary the way some folks get so low they want to end it all. Quite often, 'Failed Suicide Attempts' are mere cries for help.

Usually, when people have a failed suicide attempt, or numerous failed suicide attempts, it's pretty obvious they don't really want to die. I've never heard of anyone survive after stepping out in front of a speeding train, or jumping from a 30 story building, but that doesn't mean those who fail to end it all using other methods aren't on the edge of despair. Even unsuccessful, botched, efforts can go wrong and take the sufferer where they never really meant to go.

There are of course, multiple reasons why people reach the depths of desolation, but I think Mother Teresa of Calcutta probably put her finger on the button when she said, quote;

“The biggest disease today is not leprosy or tuberculosis, but rather the feeling of being unwanted”.

Societies have in many ways, lost community spirit and taken a more selfish and greedy approach to life, IMHO!

The bad news is that very few upbeat people who love life and live it to the full, want to be around those who are down, depressed, and negative about the world in which we live. This is especially the case if they are not very close friends or immediate family.

But people NEED PEOPLE. Gods have their place with some, but at the end of the day, it’s a listening and understanding ear from a real live person that helps other flesh and blood beings in the real world.

A 'sympathetic ear' also helps to some degree, but it's really only the right advice, understanding, and genuine compassion that helps suicidal types in the long run. That's why it's always best to get that comfort and support from those who really understand and have some sound experience with assisting in these areas.

Compassion is a wonderful thing, but it too comes at a price. That price is PAIN! There can be no compassion without pain any more than there can be true success without some amount of failure.

The OP sounds like a caring individual, and I hope some of the responses he has had so far are proving to be of use and direction.

I haven't really got anything to add from a professional perspective, but just wanted to show my support to the thread by scribbling down a few lines.

I hope this, and many other stories like it, turn out well.

Best regards

Aitch

Edited September 4, 2010 by Drew Aitch