Retirement Visa Rejected

[Kron]

Sadly today, through not reading this forum, my retirement visa extension application failed.

Have lived in Thailand 9 years now, originally on a marriage visa and then two years ago changed to a retirement visa. My last two extensions have gone through based on 800k being in a 'joint account'.

Well today, the same Immigration Officer that processed me last year, said the account should contain double the amount i.e. 1.6m. She told me it was a 'new rule'.

I was given a two month extension and upon returning home went to the Bank and transferred the account into my sole name.

What I was unable to really understand is where I stand in the immigration process now. Am I back at the beginning as if making my first application! If so and not wishing to fail in two months would someone kindly confirm that the application should still only be made up of the following documentation:-

1) Completed TM.7 form with photo

2) Copy of relevant passport pages

3) Copy of bank book

4) Original letter from Bank confirming

Whilst I know I should have asked these questions at the time, sadly I was a little taken back by it all. My fault no one else!

Thank you

[thomo]

If you get stuck, leave and re-enter the country and get the 15 day (land border) or 30 day (airport) on arrival.

With your marriage cert, copy of wife's ID, official letter with her address on it, you can extend it for 60 days at immigration.

So that's a border run every 75 days, and no need for any of the money sitting in Thai accounts and all the other hoops.

Keeps things very simple.

[opalhort]

Apparently you have been given an extension based on 'visit Thai wife' good for 60 days because they rejected the combined account since it has to be in your name only now.

Now you have opened a new account in your name but the problem may be the seasoning of the funds. The rules state that only the first application requires a seasoning period of two months whereas any subsequent application requires the funds to be in your account for at least three months so your current 60 days extension will not satisfy this rule.

If you do have any income however small (pension or otherwise) from abroad you could use this plus your bank deposit because in this case the seasoning period of funds does not apply.

opalhort

[thomo]

you have been given an extension based on 'visit Thai wife' good for 60 days

Is this the exact same extension given when arriving on a 15/30 day Visa Exemption?

The 60 day based on 'visit Thai wife'.

[Lite Beer]

2.24 In the case of an alien

visiting a Thai spouse or child:

Permission

will be granted for a period of not more than 60 days at a time.

(1) Proof of relationship.

(2) In the case of a spouse, their marital relationship shall be de

jure (legitimate) and de facto.

[opalhort]

you have been given an extension based on 'visit Thai wife' good for 60 days

Is this the exact same extension given when arriving on a 15/30 day Visa Exemption?

The 60 day based on 'visit Thai wife'.

Yes, but you can not get this extension back-to-back. I'm not sure if they allow a 30 days stamp and 60 days extension and then again a 30 days stamp and again a 60 days extension. The rules only state that a one-time extension can be given to visit Thai wife but it is not clear what time frame is covered under this one time rule.

opalhort

[sarahsbloke]

why not just apply for a married person Visa with 400k in the bank

[opalhort]

why not just apply for a married person Visa with 400k in the bank

This is an option but won't help the OP.

Funds don't appear to be the problem but the seasoning of funds in his new single name account appears to be the problem.

opalhort

[thomo]

you have been given an extension based on 'visit Thai wife' good for 60 days

Is this the exact same extension given when arriving on a 15/30 day Visa Exemption?

The 60 day based on 'visit Thai wife'.

Yes, but you can not get this extension back-to-back. I'm not sure if they allow a 30 days stamp and 60 days extension and then again a 30 days stamp and again a 60 days extension. The rules only state that a one-time extension can be given to visit Thai wife but it is not clear what time frame is covered under this one time rule.

opalhort

Can you show some back up to that?

ref: the not back-to-back, as I know someone with 5 of these Visa Exemptions and 60 day extensions back-to-back, and have never heard of anyone having troubles in this regard.

Thanks.

[opalhort]

Yes, but you can not get this extension back-to-back. I'm not sure if they allow a 30 days stamp and 60 days extension and then again a 30 days stamp and again a 60 days extension. The rules only state that a one-time extension can be given to visit Thai wife but it is not clear what time frame is covered under this one time rule.

opalhort

Can you show some back up to that?

ref: the not back-to-back, as I know someone with 5 of these Visa Exemptions and 60 day extensions back-to-back, and have never heard of anyone having troubles in this regard.

Thanks.

No I can not back up my statement apart from the fact that an officer at Suan-Pluh last year told me so when I found myself also short of the seasoning rules because I changed from combined to single name account and was short by 5 days. Had to use the 60 days option and was told "but only this one time". No idea if this rule can be found somewhere in writing.

opalhort

[thomo]

No idea if this rule can be found somewhere in writing.

Thanks.

I've never seen any reports on the internet of people being refused back2back extensions.

You'd think there'd be some on here at least, if it's an issue.

[Kron]

No I can not back up my statement apart from the fact that an officer at Suan-Pluh last year told me so when I found myself also short of the seasoning rules because I changed from combined to single name account and was short by 5 days. Had to use the 60 days option and was told "but only this one time". No idea if this rule can be found somewhere in writing.

Luckily I applied for my visa nearly a monthy early so I will be sort by 6 days for the seasoning rule (3 months). So hopefully I might get "but only this one time". Otherwise I hope a back-to-back extension will be possible. A lot of "hope' in this game, when the monies have been in Thailand well over the required periods.

[MANICMINER]

No idea if this rule can be found somewhere in writing.

Thanks.

I've never seen any reports on the internet of people being refused back2back extensions.

You'd think there'd be some on here at least, if it's an issue.

i have read a number of posts from the moderators that some immigration offices will issue back to back and some won't. even the ones that do, they may stop at any time, as i don't think it it is mean't to be used as a method of staying here continuously. My guess is that they may be more lenient if you are using the thai child method, as i believe you cannot do the 1yr 400k extension based on thai child as you would with having a wife.

[lopburi3]

http://www.tginfo.com/Publications/Articles/immigration_employment/immigration_new_policy.pdf

Please check para 2.24 of Police Order 777/2551 in the above English translation. The only question seems to be if this is one time for each entry; one time for each year; one time per lifetime? It seems to be read as one time per other entry and may be limited to number of times allowed per year. You can not obtain back-to-back.

Permission shall be granted for one time and no more than 60 days

[Mario2008]

At the end of his 60 day extension OP can extend based on a combination of money in the bank and income, (if he has any income( as no seasoning of money is required for that option.

If not, he can extend based on marriage, as that only requires seasoning of the money for 2 months.

Failing above options will probably mean that he has to get a new visa.

[thomo]

Permission shall be granted for one time and no more than 60 days

Believe this is one time per entry, as my friend has 5 Visa Exemptions with 5 60 day extensions in a row.

[thomo]

http://www.tginfo.com/Publications/Articles/immigration_employment/immigration_new_policy.pdf

Please check para 2.24 of Police Order 777/2551 in the above English translation. The only question seems to be if this is one time for each entry; one time for each year; one time per lifetime? It seems to be read as one time per other entry and may be limited to number of times allowed per year. You can not obtain back-to-back.

Sorry, your statement is quite incorrect. My friend has 5 back-to-back. Where does it say that you cant? It's isn't good to give incorrect info.

You also add your opinion that 'it may be limited to number of times per year'. How about let's keep it to what what the rules say.

I am yet to see any immigration rules stating that back-to-back cannot be given, or anything regarding limits on how many extensions will be given in a year.

[Mario2008]

http://www.tginfo.co..._new_policy.pdf

Please check para 2.24 of Police Order 777/2551 in the above English translation. The only question seems to be if this is one time for each entry; one time for each year; one time per lifetime? It seems to be read as one time per other entry and may be limited to number of times allowed per year. You can not obtain back-to-back.

Sorry, your statement is quite incorrect. My friend has 5 back-to-back. Where does it say that you cant? It's isn't good to give incorrect info.

You also add your opinion that 'it may be limited to number of times per year'. How about let's keep it to what what the rules say.

I am yet to see any immigration rules stating that back-to-back cannot be given, or anything regarding limits on how many extensions will be given in a year.

The official rules doesn't mention it cannot be given back to back, but it has always been the case that they are not given back to back. Some immigration officers even limit them to only one or two times a year.

Rules are always open to interpretation. The information you get is the way immigration interpreters the rules according to reports by members. If you want only the rules, you can just consult the relevant police order. But for example in the case of a 1 year extension of based on marriage you will find that the money in the bank has to be there 2 months prior to applying. Nevertheless, some immigration offices demand it to be there 3 months prior to application after the first extension. If we would just tell the official rule, some people would be in for a nasty surprise.

Your report is the first that they are given back to back. Would be interesting to know which immigration office your friend used to get the extensions and when (what year).

[lopburi3]

You stated your friend receive them with visa exempt entry between. That is not back-to-back as normal extensions of stay are provided. There is only one extension of stay allowed - as I correctly stated. How many times this can be done on new entries per any period of time is up to the immigration officer involved.

[thomo]

The official rules doesn't mention it cannot be given back to back

Indeed.

It might be best to edit the incorrect info stating this from the post that states it.

but it has always been the case that they are not given back to back. Some immigration officers even limit them to only one or two times a year.

I'm yet to see any report on this being the case.

TV has been around for many a year, and there doesn't seem to be one report on here of people being refused.

Your report is the first that they are given back to back.

Seems that there's not many reports on it either way.

Would be interesting to know which immigration office your friend used to get the extensions and when (what year).

Bangkok.

He's on his 5th in a row now, so presumably started about 1 yr ago. Said that he was fed up with keeping money in Thai bank accounts earning next to nothing. So shipped it home to earn money on it.

[thomo]

You stated your friend receive them with visa exempt entry between. That is not back-to-back as normal extensions of stay are provided. There is only one extension of stay allowed - as I correctly stated. How many times this can be done on new entries per any period of time is up to the immigration officer involved.

Apologies if there's mix up or lack of understanding on the phrasing/terminology used.

Yes he received VE, then extension. Border run for another VE, then extension.

He has done this 5 times already.

Which reads to me as back-to-back.

Apologies if this is not the case, and it isn't known as 'back-to-back'.

What terminology could be used to describe this?

[lopburi3]

Back to back would be extension 60 and new extension 60 and new extension 60. Will not happen. The 60 day extension of stay can not be issued back-to-back as the normal one year extensions of stay are.

[thomo]

How many times this can be done on new entries per any period of time is up to the immigration officer involved.

Okay, so there are no rules or limitations on how many times it can be done. VE+60 day extension, VE+60 day extension.

Like all other extensions on all visas, it is up to the immigration officer, and there aren't any rules governing it. Looks like a good alternative to keeping money sitting dead in a Thai bank account. Also as there's no reports people being refused.

Back to back would be extension 60 and new extension 60 and new extension 60.

Comprende. :jap:

[samtam]

Where did you do your Extension of Stay? (Chaengwattana?). I used to have no problem doing extension of stay for myself and my male partner using joint accounts with THB1.6m, but after advice from lopburi, I changed it to two separate fixed deposits for THB800k each, and it was processed without problem in May this year.

Your conversation with the Immigration officer seems to imply that THB1.6m would have worked for a joint account, although why, (if your wife is Thai), is not obvious to me.

In our case we are both non Thai males, over 50, and as I said, there has never been a problem previously and I didnt chance it in May.

[Kron]

At the end of his 60 day extension OP can extend based on a combination of money in the bank and income, (if he has any income( as no seasoning of money is required for that option.

If not, he can extend based on marriage, as that only requires seasoning of the money for 2 months.

Failing above options will probably mean that he has to get a new visa.

The Income option is not for me as I live in the South and its a rather long trip to BK.

As it will only be 5 days short of the 90 I will try an extension based upon Retirement and hopefully the Immigration Officer will have some understanding. She was rather kind to us yesterday.

However based on your advice Mario2008 I will have all the paperwork ready for a marriage visa as backup.

samtam - I live in Chumphon and use the Ranong Immigration Office as Chumphon has no such office.

[Mario2008]

Depending on your embassy, you might be able to apply by mail for an embassy leter confirming your income.

[Kron]

At the end of his 60 day extension OP can extend based on a combination of money in the bank and income, (if he has any income( as no seasoning of money is required for that option.

If not, he can extend based on marriage, as that only requires seasoning of the money for 2 months.

Failing above options will probably mean that he has to get a new visa.

The Income option is not for me as I live in the South and its a rather long trip to BK.

As it will only be 5 days short of the 90 I will try an extension based upon Retirement and hopefully the Immigration Officer will have some understanding. She was rather kind to us yesterday.

However based on your advice Mario2008 I will have all the paperwork ready for a marriage visa as backup.

samtam - I live in Chumphon and use the Ranong Immigration Office as Chumphon has no such office.

Just an update and to pass on thanks. Got my Retirement visa extension today.

As I said above went armed with the paperwork for both a retirement and a marriage visa. Well if the Immigration Officer noticed the account was 5 days short he did not mentioned it. He was more keen to have copies of my Wife's ID and the house book, which I have never seen as a requirement for the retirement visa. Oh well luckily they were in the wad of paper I had as backup for the Marriage visa.

Thanks Guys and I will now keep a more closer look on this forum for future chances

[lopburi3]

It is not required for retirement extension of stay but she was there as your backup plan so suspect they wanted her to feel useful. Although if you are living at the housebook address that is important now as proof of where you make application so that or lease or other proof is often asked.

As you did not extend directly from a previous retirement extension of stay suspect they could forgive the 6 days by saying it was a new application so only 2 months seasoning would be required.