Red Shirts Disappointed With Thai Democrat Verdict

[rubl]

(quote)Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

(/quote)

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

There wouldn't. The threat of a coup is just an attempt by PTP folks to shift some attention and rile some people up!

I say nothing, I'm just waiting for Robert A's vision on this

Where has he been? He mustn't be on retainer any more.

Just checked my agenda. Robert A. is probably busy with the follow-up document to the ICC. That was promised within eight weeks and five are past now

[SergeiY]

PAD Leader Sees Democrat Case Unclear

A core leader of the People's Alliance for Democracy says the Constitution Court's dismissal of the dissolution case against the ruling Democrat Party has created doubt among the public regarding the party's innocence since the allegation has yet to be proven by the court as the case was thrown out on a technicality.

People's Alliance for Democracy, or PAD, leader Sondhi Limthongkul commented on the Constitution Court's decision to drop the dissolution case in which the Democrat Party was accused of allegedly misusing a 29 million baht fund granted by the Election Commission, or EC, for campaigning in a 2005 election.

The court dismissed the case on grounds that the EC did not file the charges in accordance to the Constitution, which states that such a case must be filed within 15 days from when the wrongdoing was detected.

He said the court's ruling is unclear and the public are still in doubt whether the Democrat Party committed the offense as accused by the EC.

Sondhi noted he expected political tension from now on to heat up but believed that it will not lead to chaos.

The PAD leader further said the Pheu Thai Party was dissatisfied with the court's ruling as it believed the court had practiced double standard.

He added the opposition party might release the controversial video clip showing a meeting between a Democrat MP and the former secretary to the president of the Constitution Court to convince the public on the court's bias and that will worsen the situation.

-- Tan Network 2010-11-30

[animatic]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

PTP Trying to keep up fear of the military any way, any time, possible.

Say coup and supposedly people get more jittery and will be more manipulatable.

And then maybe things can blow up, it's the only way they can win at this point,

chaos as a political tool, other wise it's stuck in the wasteland for more months.

No mega projects to siphon and now their latest attempted trick has back fired.

Fear is the old fall back position, so when in doubt spread fear.

[jayboy]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

There wouldn't. The threat of a coup is just an attempt by PTP folks to shift some attention and rile some people up!

And that is why Khun Anand Panyarachun, that well known PTP supporter, has just come out and said a coup would as always be disastrous and solve nothing?

And the rumours of a coup which have been around for a few weeks, which I personally discount, that is also the mischievous work of "PTP folks"?

[jdinasia]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

There wouldn't. The threat of a coup is just an attempt by PTP folks to shift some attention and rile some people up!

And that is why Khun Anand Panyarachun, that well known PTP supporter, has just come out and said a coup would as always be disastrous and solve nothing?

And the rumours of a coup which have been around for a few weeks, which I personally discount, that is also the mischievous work of "PTP folks"?

as you can see from the MCOT quote ------ PTP issued a statement threatening a coup if their own rowdies got out of hand.

Anand is a bit more rational

[SergeiY]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

There wouldn't. The threat of a coup is just an attempt by PTP folks to shift some attention and rile some people up!

And that is why Khun Anand Panyarachun, that well known PTP supporter, has just come out and said a coup would as always be disastrous and solve nothing?

And the rumours of a coup which have been around for a few weeks, which I personally discount, that is also the mischievous work of "PTP folks"?

The military already gives out order who is not allowed to practise constitutional rights like holding protest while the UN boss is in town and the military writes even laws how flip flops have to look like and what is not allowed on flip flops.

So in terms to gain control and power there is no reason to stage a coup, except for the fun in the show part in staging it and making it more visual.

[jdinasia]

Serge -- it seems like you are missing the fact that there is still an SoE in place for BKK, Samut Phrakhan and Phatum Thani.

I am hoping that the SoE ends soon.

[Buchholz]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

I read some posters don't think the Red Shirts are a pro-Thaksin group, so it's a good thing that the reality of

Red Shirts = Thaksin

gets reiterated.

[Buchholz]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

Not all reds are pro-Thaksin

Not all, only 99% of them are

It's higher than that.

[Buchholz]

As you may have noticed on this forum you may say many things. No need to prove, suggesting is sufficient for some

a perfect example was made just two posts down from yours

The EC must be in cohorts with the government, wonder how much money they received...

[philw]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

I read some posters don't think the Red Shirts are a pro-Thaksin group, so it's a good thing that the reality of

Red Shirts = Thaksin

gets reiterated.

Any possibility of relaxing your fixation ??

Edited December 1, 2010 by metisdead
Flame removed.

[truethailand]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

Not all reds are pro-Thaksin

The problem seems to be that all the red leaders and the PTP are pro-Thaksin.

So, in supporting the red leaders or the PTP, the red shirts are also supporting Thaksin.

Cock and Bull boy. The poor have aligned to Thaksin bcos he is the only person to keep his promise to them after being elected, whatever his motives. Having seen years of fat arsed lazy Dems only sufacing out of BKK at election time with statements that go something like 'vote for us it will be different this time' so they did and the Dems retreated back to BKK and did nothing after winning the election. I have never agreed with his motives but he gave them what he promised. Their agenda is to get somebody to power who helps them, it could be anybody. Dont try to taint peoples struggle to escape poverty with a man on his own mission.

[ballpoint]

Cock and Bull boy. The poor have aligned to Thaksin bcos he is the only person to keep his promise to them after being elected, whatever his motives. Having seen years of fat arsed lazy Dems only sufacing out of BKK at election time with statements that go something like 'vote for us it will be different this time' so they did and the Dems retreated back to BKK and did nothing after winning the election. I have never agreed with his motives but he gave them what he promised. Their agenda is to get somebody to power who helps them, it could be anybody. Dont try to taint peoples struggle to escape poverty with a man on his own mission.

Perhaps you'd like to share your knowledge with the forum and tell us:

Just how many seats the Democrats have ever won in the North and Isarn?

Just what promises Thaksin made prior to the 2001 election (other than "I am already rich, so I don't need to be corrupt)? (Or how about "a phone line in every village?)

Just what Thaksin did to ease the real problems of the poor, such as improving education, dismantling the rice barons and their price fixing cartel or revamping the land distribution laws?

Just how many fresh new candidates Thaksin put up for election in Isarn, rather than buying out the same corrupt MP's and their families / proxies who are the real reason the poor are kept in their place?

Why all these people struggling to escape poverty are quite happy to take 20 baht and a bottle of fish sauce and continue to vote for those same dirty politicians?

Where the growing middle class comes from? The ones who have made the effort to improve their, and their childrens', lives. The ones who invested in small businesses, only to see them ruined by a bunch of those same individuals who quite happily sit on their <deleted>, selling their votes and their attendance at rallies, no matter what colour they are?

Just why, if Thaksin was so pro-poor, both TRT governments spent far less on the North East (by around 30%) than they did on all other regions, including the South?

There are many more questions I have, but let's see you handle these ones first.

[termsak]

Cock and Bull boy. The poor have aligned to Thaksin bcos he is the only person to keep his promise to them after being elected, whatever his motives. Having seen years of fat arsed lazy Dems only sufacing out of BKK at election time with statements that go something like 'vote for us it will be different this time' so they did and the Dems retreated back to BKK and did nothing after winning the election. I have never agreed with his motives but he gave them what he promised. Their agenda is to get somebody to power who helps them, it could be anybody. Dont try to taint peoples struggle to escape poverty with a man on his own mission.

Perhaps you'd like to share your knowledge with the forum and tell us:

Just how many seats the Democrats have ever won in the North and Isarn?

Just what promises Thaksin made prior to the 2001 election (other than "I am already rich, so I don't need to be corrupt)? (Or how about "a phone line in every village?)

Just what Thaksin did to ease the real problems of the poor, such as improving education, dismantling the rice barons and their price fixing cartel or revamping the land distribution laws?

Just how many fresh new candidates Thaksin put up for election in Isarn, rather than buying out the same corrupt MP's and their families / proxies who are the real reason the poor are kept in their place?

Why all these people struggling to escape poverty are quite happy to take 20 baht and a bottle of fish sauce and continue to vote for those same dirty politicians?

Where the growing middle class comes from? The ones who have made the effort to improve their, and their childrens', lives. The ones who invested in small businesses, only to see them ruined by a bunch of those same individuals who quite happily sit on their <deleted>, selling their votes and their attendance at rallies, no matter what colour they are?

Just why, if Thaksin was so pro-poor, both TRT governments spent far less on the North East (by around 30%) than they did on all other regions, including the South?

There are many more questions I have, but let's see you handle these ones first.

Save your strength...one of the basic skills red shirts lack is the skill to answer questions.

[phiphidon]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

PTP Trying to keep up fear of the military any way, any time, possible.

Say coup and supposedly people get more jittery and will be more manipulatable.

And then maybe things can blow up, it's the only way they can win at this point,

chaos as a political tool, other wise it's stuck in the wasteland for more months.

No mega projects to siphon and now their latest attempted trick has back fired.

Fear is the old fall back position, so when in doubt spread fear.

" No mega projects to siphon " - which party would you readily identify with that accusation, I mean really, without bias, honestly, who would you identify as to be the most likely party?

"when in doubt spread fear", so why does CRES, Suthep and the DSI come to mind first: rumoured assassination attempts, accusations of assassination teams training in Cambodia, Cambodian warriors of Vietnamese descent who have been trained as expert snipers,men in black renting apartments opposite the PM's residence,rumours of bombing major bridges in Bangkok, rumours of bombing plots up until the New Year and Taiwan providing armed training grounds for redshirts, need I go on...................

[whybother]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

Not all reds are pro-Thaksin

The problem seems to be that all the red leaders and the PTP are pro-Thaksin.

So, in supporting the red leaders or the PTP, the red shirts are also supporting Thaksin.

Cock and Bull boy. The poor have aligned to Thaksin bcos he is the only person to keep his promise to them after being elected, whatever his motives. Having seen years of fat arsed lazy Dems only sufacing out of BKK at election time with statements that go something like 'vote for us it will be different this time' so they did and the Dems retreated back to BKK and did nothing after winning the election. I have never agreed with his motives but he gave them what he promised. Their agenda is to get somebody to power who helps them, it could be anybody. Dont try to taint peoples struggle to escape poverty with a man on his own mission.

Thank ypu for confirming that all the reds support Thaksin.

[Throatwobbler]

Not all Nazis supported Hitler - but they were still nazis!!

So if we swap what I take to be the equivalent terms we get: Not all reds support Thaksin - but they are still reds. Is that what you meant?

One mans "suffocatingly yellow" is another mans freedom and liberty from burnt buildings and grenade attacks - you are wrong of course!!

I see. So when I write Thaivisa is suffocatingly yellow, what I mean is that Thaivisa supports freedom and liberty...but I'm wrong.

You do seem rather confused about what you believe. Why don't you go and lie down for a year or two and think it through.

You are yet another naive person who only sees Thai politics in two colours. If i happen to be anti UDD the I must be PAD. What is wrong with you people. I happen to think that the rural poor have many valid grievances but I feel they are being used by the UDD leadership who frankly my dear don't give a dam_n about them. I also think that the yellow shirt leaders are a bunch of expletives. So what colour am I then. How does this fit into your 3 year old child's view of black and white. Or in this case red and yellow.

Edited November 30, 2010 by Throatwobbler

[phiphidon]

Not all Nazis supported Hitler - but they were still nazis!!

So if we swap what I take to be the equivalent terms we get: Not all reds support Thaksin - but they are still reds. Is that what you meant?

One mans "suffocatingly yellow" is another mans freedom and liberty from burnt buildings and grenade attacks - you are wrong of course!!

I see. So when I write Thaivisa is suffocatingly yellow, what I mean is that Thaivisa supports freedom and liberty...but I'm wrong.

You do seem rather confused about what you believe. Why don't you go and lie down for a year or two and think it through.

You are yet another naive person who only sees Thai politics in two colours. If i happen to be anti UDD the I must be PAD. What is wrong with you people. I happen to think that the rural poor have many valid grievances but I feel they are being used by the UDD leadership who frankly my dear don't give a dam_n about them. I also think that the yellow shirt leaders are a bunch of expletives. So what colour am I then. How does this fit into your 3 year old child's view of black and white. Or in this case red and yellow.

If the UDD and their political party, PTP do not represent the rural poor and are exploiting them and the PAD and their political party the NPP do not represent them and just don't care about them, as far as I can work out that leaves the Democrats and their coalition party compatriots. In which case they are going to have to get off their #### and get up there and win some serious hearts and minds and not just rely on a 500 baht pension and a 11 baht pay rise. Unless nobody cares about them, in which case SNAFU.

[rubl]

Opposition Puea Thai issues statement urging people dissatisfied with Court ruling on Democrat's disbandment case to stay calm; defiant activities could be used as excuse for coup /MCOT

I don't understand why there would be a coup just because there are protests. While the government is stable, and while they seem to have the support of a majority of the people ... and, particularly, are getting along with the army, WHY would there be a coup?

PTP Trying to keep up fear of the military any way, any time, possible.

Say coup and supposedly people get more jittery and will be more manipulatable.

And then maybe things can blow up, it's the only way they can win at this point,

chaos as a political tool, other wise it's stuck in the wasteland for more months.

No mega projects to siphon and now their latest attempted trick has back fired.

Fear is the old fall back position, so when in doubt spread fear.

" No mega projects to siphon " - which party would you readily identify with that accusation, I mean really, without bias, honestly, who would you identify as to be the most likely party?

"when in doubt spread fear", so why does CRES, Suthep and the DSI come to mind first: rumoured assassination attempts, accusations of assassination teams training in Cambodia, Cambodian warriors of Vietnamese descent who have been trained as expert snipers,men in black renting apartments opposite the PM's residence,rumours of bombing major bridges in Bangkok, rumours of bombing plots up until the New Year and Taiwan providing armed training grounds for redshirts, need I go on...................

Depending on what you already believe either CRES e.a. come to mind, or PTP, red-shirts, 'burn-it-my-way' Arisman c.s. We both know that some is hearsay, some can be proven. Funnily enough most of the 'we can prove' part condemns UDD / red-shirts / PTP. Whenever a grenade explodes in Bangkok I hear it must be the government. Even when some red-shirts say 'it was me'. Go figure. Seems 'when in doubt spread fear' is a red-shirt saying. But don't worry dear PPD, you may sleep safe and soundly, you're an alien anyway probably

[MengWan]

I'm very very disappointed by the whole process, from EC to the roo court, such a waste on our tax. Here inconsistence flourishes. where laws are mere tools of choice to keep opponents under their feet.

Survival is to be submissive to elites, officials, criminals, and politicians. Join the band, kick people asses around, or revolt.

I had the same feeling too ...

Maybe someone can suggest that the losing "plaintiff" be jailed when he is abusing Justice ?

[Buchholz]

Is it really necessary to put "PRO-THAKSIN GROUPS" in the sub-title and then in red on the OP? It's a bit obvious, isn't it?

I read some posters don't think the Red Shirts are a pro-Thaksin group, so it's a good thing that the reality of

Red Shirts = Thaksin

gets reiterated.

Any possibility of relaxing your fixation ??

Just as soon as the fixation on the faked disassociation ends.

You might get a good bowel movement and we could all enjoy the peace.

The "we" being those that disingenuously attempt to excuse the Reds and their mentor?

[OzMick]

'disappointment' is probably and understatement! but it was only one judge that decided it - it would have been 3-3 otherwise - it is not a resounding verdict by any means and is only on a point of law - it doesn't mean they are 'clean'.

Krap - innocent only because of the law, otherwise it would have been 3-3, which is a dismissal of case as innocent until proven guilty.

[siampolee]

Let's have a reality check.

There is no concern for the shall we say , '' The lower orders in Thailand by the Red Shirted or Yellow Shirted movements. It is all about , ''what's in it for me, my family and my cronies.

The Yellow shirted movement display their scorn for the masses by openly stating that voting rights should be selective, along with the policy of keeping people in their place. Wherever or whatever they actually mean by those statements remains to be seen though.

At least they are open concerning their agendas.

The Red Shirted movement on the other hand seem intent on violence and mayhem an open class war and the return of a despot who wishes to yet further bleed the nation, and its people dry. All backed up by legalised murders the stifling of the press and the judiciary as we have already seen.

Neither of these factions have actually stated a clear cut policy regarding the welfare of the people and indeed the country.

The current administration is doing a reasonable job considering the current circumstances. Political infighting, political warlords trying to wrest power from each other and of course the dying political dinosaurs are making the most horrendous noises whilst threshing about in their death throes as well.

Perhaps we should remember that the chance of the country being led by a younger far better educated group of people with international contacts would indeed be of benefit to all of the Thai people.

The world is now a village, Thailand is but a small parish in that world, that younger set should be leading us to better things. Our future is our young people we older folks look back not forward more often than not.

Until the moronic imbecilic leaders of the assorted factions are removed the comic opera or black comedy that is Thai politics will indeed be an ongoing performance.

Edited December 1, 2010 by siampolee

[Siam Simon]

Just as soon as the fixation on the faked disassociation ends.

You might get a good bowel movement and we could all enjoy the peace.

The "we" being those that disingenuously attempt to excuse the Reds and their mentor?

.....And the fixation goes on.

What about the main event (ie: the current mix-n-match government), John? Will you turn your talents in that direction anytime soon? They're the ones making all the big decisions at the mo, and there seem to be an awful lot of anomalies going on in those decision-making processes. Surely it's time to re-focus?

[Buchholz]

Just as soon as the fixation on the faked disassociation ends.

You might get a good bowel movement and we could all enjoy the peace.

The "we" being those that disingenuously attempt to excuse the Reds and their mentor?

.....And the fixation goes on.

As does the disingenuous attempt to excuse the Reds and their mentor.

What about the main event? Will you turn your talents in that direction anytime soon? They're the ones making all the big decisions at the mo, and there seem to be an awful lot of anomalies going on in those decision-making processes. Surely it's time to re-focus?

If your idol would stop his efforts to disrupt this country, it would help tremendously in their endeavor to make progress.

[Siam Simon]

Let's have a reality check.

There is no concern for the shall we say , '' The lower orders in Thailand by the Red Shirted or Yellow Shirted movements. It is all about , ''what's in it for me, my family and my cronies.

The Yellow shirted movement display their scorn for the masses by openly stating that voting rights should be selective, along with the policy of keeping people in their place. Wherever or whatever they actually mean by those statements remains to be seen though.

At least they are open concerning their agendas.

The Red Shirted movement on the other hand seem intent on violence and mayhem an open class war and the return of a despot who wishes to yet further bleed the nation, and its people dry. All backed up by legalised murders the stifling of the press and the judiciary as we have already seen.

Neither of these factions have actually stated a clear cut policy regarding the welfare of the people and indeed the country.

The current administration is doing a reasonable job considering the current circumstances. Political infighting, political warlords trying to wrest power from each other and of course the dying political dinosaurs are making the most horrendous noises whilst threshing about in their death throes as well.

Perhaps we should remember that the chance of the country being led by a younger far better educated group of people with international contacts would indeed be of benefit to all of the Thai people.

The world is now a village, Thailand is but a small parish in that world, that younger set should be leading us to better things. Our future is our young people we older folks look back not forward more often than not.

Until the moronic imbecilic leaders of the assorted factions are removed the comic opera or black comedy that is Thai politics will indeed be an ongoing performance.

This is an excellent post, but i have to disagree with the opinion of political dinosaurs being in their death-throes: They appear to have allies in the very highest realm of the military, which makes the job of the genuine reformers in government difficult, to say the least.

[OzMick]

Back on topic - wouldn't you think that the democrats could afford one reasonably competent lawyer who would have noticed that the case was brought after the allowed time period, and applied for an early dismissal. Of course, he would have lost a fortune in fees, but might have got a bonus.

[Buchholz]

Reading the other paper this morning reveals that Chalerm is leading the Puea Thai Party's plan to have the four judges impeached and if that fails, to have the Election Commissioner Apichart expelled.

.

[Siam Simon]

If your idol would stop his efforts to disrupt this country, it would help tremendously in their endeavor to make progress.

John, if you broaden your horizon a little, you will see that Thaksin and his cronies are a very noisy side issue nowadays. Thaksin won't be back. It won't be allowed. The country has moved on, and so have the politicians at the cutting edge. It's time to re-assess. The important battle now is between the modernisers led by Abhisit and the dinosaurs such as Suthep. And a battle it is. This is where you should be directing your focus if you don't want to be left behind like some museum piece.

[Buchholz]

If your idol would stop his efforts to disrupt this country, it would help tremendously in their endeavor to make progress.

Thaksin and his cronies are a very noisy side issue nowadays. Thaksin won't be back. It won't be allowed. The country has moved on, and so have the politicians at the cutting edge. It's time to re-assess. The important battle now is between the modernisers led by Abhisit and the dinosaurs such as Suthep. And a battle it is. This is where you should be directing your focus if you don't want to be left behind like some museum piece.

I can appreciate your predictions on what the unpredictable man will or will not do and also appreciate your telling me what to post on, but if it bothers you that much as to what and where I choose to post, perhaps its best if you just focus on your own posting and allow others the freedom to post on what they choose to without attempting to belittle and insult them for those choices. It would make for a more harmonious discussion by toning down the noisy overly-personal rhetoric.

.

Edited December 1, 2010 by Buchholz