Aussie Man Held In Thailand On Child Sex Rap

[george]

Update from The Nation:

Aussie held for ‘rape’

BANGKOK: -- An Australian man has been arrested for the alleged repeated rape of a Thai girl under his care over a span of four years from when she was 12 years old, police said yesterday.

Christopher Ronald White, 46, was arrested late on Tuesday night at his Bangkok home, after Australian police intercepted a postal delivery to his home in Perth on August 3. They found a number of VCDs containing images of Western men having sex with an Asian girl who appeared to be aged under 18, Pol Lt-General Phanuphong Singhara, the head investigator, alleged yesterday.

The officer said Thai police had obtained the VCDs and would decide whether the girl in them was the unidentified girl, now aged 16, who told police in Chiang Mai - where her family is based – that White also forced her to have sex with his adult friends on several occasions.

The girl reportedly fled to Chiang Mai two months after escaping captivity in Bangkok.

At White’s home in the Makkasan area, police said they found another 35 VCDs containing similar images, shortly before Western Australian police raided his Perth home and found child-pornographic material and illegal firearms.

Phanuphong said police theorised that other girls had also fallen prey to White.

Meanwhile, police have arrested two German nationals in Pattaya who are wanted in their homeland on separate sex-abuse and fraud charges, Deutsche Press Agentur reported.

Acting on information provided by German Interpol, police arrested Thomas Sassen, 42, and Klaus Falk Schiffer, 63, at separate hotels in Pattaya on Tuesday, said acting Immigration Police Commissioner Maj-General Suwat Kamlongsrisakul.

--The Nation 2005-08-25

[Ice Maiden]

I really don't know how men like this sleep on a night

[LoveDaBlues]

This man was known or deeply suspected to have been deeply involved in pedophaelia for many years. He was also involved with the previous owner of my current business in Chiang Mai, prior to my taking it over.

I wish to stress that his involvement and that of his previous partner ended at the time I took the business over, some four years ago.

I presented solid evidence of illegal activities by this man and another to Thai authorities, Australian National police and another international law enforcement authority some 3+ years ago. I am shocked it has taken so long for action to be taken.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

COOL. We all need to get involved when there's someone like this lurking around. I think his goose is cooked.....let's wait and see. If he goes into the 'Big Tiger' the guards will probably kill him for what he did. Personally I'd like to put his thingy in a vise......that's always a lot of fun.

[sriracha john]

As to justice getting done, keep in mind that the Thais farted around with ###### for years,

Fill in the blank (######)?

[sriracha john]

This man may or may not have commited a crime, however, it not an uncommon practice for the police in third world countries to "set some on up" ie he goes into a presumably reputable brothel, club, fill in the blank and the policia via the management send in an underage person for sexual acts etc.  Once inside the room etc the police break in show great disgust and distain, shake the guy down for whatever they can and throw him in prison etc....

Not saying that this is what happened but TIT rules..

and things are not always what they seem

Cordially,

Hunter

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They certainly waited a long time (4 years) and a long distance (Chiang Mai to Bangkok) to pull off this shakedown with your scenario...

[LoveDaBlues]

This man may or may not have commited a crime, however, it not an uncommon practice for the police in third world countries to "set some on up" ie he goes into a presumably reputable brothel, club, fill in the blank and the policia via the management send in an underage person for sexual acts etc.  Once inside the room etc the police break in show great disgust and distain, shake the guy down for whatever they can and throw him in prison etc....

Not saying that this is what happened but TIT rules..

and things are not always what they seem

Cordially,

Hunter

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Highly doubt the coppers would go this route and bring so much attention to themselves. It's easier and more profitable to just keep getting payoffs over and over from the usual sources. You don't put the golden goose in jail he then stops crapping the golden eggs.

[farang2002]

Rabbits? I've heard of perversion with many other farm animals, but never rabbits.. This poor soul is in need of a long vacation in...The Funny Farm!

[slim]

Rabbits? I've heard of perversion with many other farm animals, but never rabbits.. This poor soul is in need of a long vacation in...The Funny Farm!

Long as they dont misread that and send him to the Bunny farm !

[WhiteShiva]

Why people resort to pedophilia when there are loads of underage-looking women in Thailand is amazing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have been thinking the same thing myself - you could bed a woman who looks like a 13/14 year old without breaking the law - so what is the point?

And pity about the Hill Tribe girls parents selling her into prostitution like that. I wonder if they'll get the final big payoff they were hoping for by 'eventually' squealing.

And at 16 the girls still fresh enough to be turned out again. Pity her. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is why I think the Thai government has to take some responsibility for the fact that these kinds of things happens. If you are hill tribe or a Burmese/Lao refuge or illegal worker you are not protected by the laws in this country - at least not in practice. I wonder how many children, women and even men are abused in this country, but decide that they have more to lose by reporting it to the authorities? The hilltribe maid mentioned by another poster being a typical (although less severe) example.

On another note - surely it must be possible to be a pedophile without actually committing the crime of abusing children. As a heterosexual, I don't go around raping women just because I find them sexually attractive. I can perhaps understand that some people can get turned on by children (however sick it seems to the rest of us), but to actually abuse a child? To fulfill your own desires with no consideration of the pain and suffering you are causing another person - isn't that the signs of a psychopath?

[WhiteShiva]

This man may or may not have commited a crime, however, it not an uncommon practice for the police in third world countries to "set some on up" ie he goes into a presumably reputable brothel, club, fill in the blank and the policia via the management send in an underage person for sexual acts etc.  Once inside the room etc the police break in show great disgust and distain, shake the guy down for whatever they can and throw him in prison etc....

Not saying that this is what happened but TIT rules..

and things are not always what they seem

Cordially,

Hunter

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Highly doubt the coppers would go this route and bring so much attention to themselves. It's easier and more profitable to just keep getting payoffs over and over from the usual sources. You don't put the golden goose in jail he then stops crapping the golden eggs.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But somethimes you want to show the press/politicians/public that you are doing your job. Better than sacrificing one of your regular "contributors", you set up some stupid tourist who is in the wrong place at the wrong time. Or perhaps to settle some old score with a guy you don't like.

Although in this case, I am pretty sure the police got the right guy.

[Scott]

Yes, there are pedophiles who do not act out their sexual attractions, but it is uncommon--and since those that don't, don't get into trouble with the law, little is known about them.

A lot of this has to do with impulse control and issues of power and control. Since children are vulnerable, it is more difficult for people not act on these impulses. Thus, as one poster said he doesn't go around raping women and part of the reason is it would be difficult to do. Seducing and setting up children is not difficult, especially poor/neglected children.

And yes, something should be done about the parents, but remember, their worst crime (usually) is an act of omission--not caring properly for their kids; not an act of commission--sexually abusing a child.

[NextStationBangkok]

My comment : These &lt;deleted&gt;**er should be hanged soon in every part of the world. Will they agree if their own children abused like this ? How can even thinking of doing this. These &lt;deleted&gt;**ers are making use of poverty in Asian countries. In general Thais authorities are closed their eyes first the abused children are illegal immegrants/refugees,Some times Thais themselves do this,no where they can go and complain becuse they are illegal to stay here, second &lt;deleted&gt;$$ing Dollars comming in from SEX tourists.

Another News from India

Goa child sex abuse case: Aussie paedophile in the net

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/article...051,curpg-1.cms

NEW DELHI: An Australian paedophile, accused in the sensational Goa child sex abuse case of 1991, was picked up by a CBI team after he was extradited earlier this month.

He was flown to Delhi and then taken to Madgaon in south Goa before being remanded to judicial custody by the chief judicial magistrate of Goa.

"Werner Wulf Ingo, a businessman, was picked up from Sidney by a team comprising of two of our officers. He is one of the accused in the Goa child sex abuse case, and faces some very serious charges," a Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI) spokesperson said on Wednesday.

"Of the seven accused in the case, six are foreign nationals, and two of them were arrested previously.

Freddy Peats, an Indian, was arrested in April 1991 and sentenced to life imprisonment and died in April this year.

In 2002 another of the accused, New Zealander Eoghan Colm McBride, was extradited to India and was sentenced to seven years rigorous imprisonment," he added.

Peats ran an orphanage called Gurukul near Colva beach in south Goa since 1987, and under that guise he connived with foreign visitors to sexually abuse minor boys and girls and took nud_e photographs of them for about a decade. Most of the victims had been abducted.

Goa police raided the orphanage and arrested Peats in 1991, after registering a complaint from a victim inmate. The case had sent shock waves through the state regarded as a tourist paradise. Ingo was placed under observation by the Australian government after CBI issued an arrest warrant in his name and alerted them. He was handed over after extradition formalities were completed.

The other accused are Nils Oscar Jonsson of Sweden, British citizen currently hiding in Bangkok, Raymond A Varley, German Zell Jurgen Andreas, and Dominique Sebire of France.

Sebire, who had been arrested when he landed in Delhi in 1996, managed to jump bail due to police negligence and is currently absconding.

Arrest warrants and letters rogatory were sent to the Swedish government and to Germany through diplomatic channels and Interpol for Jonson and Andreas.

In the former's case, the Swedish government informed that he would be tried in his home country, but later declared that the evidence available was not sufficient to make out a case against Jonson.

As per German law, citizens cannot be extradited to other countries, and Andreas could not be brought to justice in India either. Relevant documents were dispatched to Germany to prosecute him.

[WhiteShiva]

Yes, there are pedophiles who do not act out their sexual attractions, but it is uncommon--and since those that don't, don't get into trouble with the law, little is known about them. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If so little is know about them, how can you state that it is uncommon? Doesn't seem logical. How would you even know if a person was a pedophile if he didn't act on it?

Thus, as one poster said he doesn't go around raping women and part of the reason is it would be difficult to do.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As I was that poster, let me just point out that rape being difficult is not even a tiny part of the reason I (and most other men - or women for that matter) don't do it. We do not commit rape because it is wrong in every possible way, morally as well as legally. Because we can feel empathy with the other person.

If you say that someone would be more inclined to rape if it was easier, I'd say that person had a major problem. But I don't think that is what you meant, right?

[figaro]

What a sad photo.

The copper on the right looks like he's happy to get this &lt;deleted&gt; as far away from Thailand as possible, as quickly as possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

After reading such news relevant to pedophiles, am struck by the statistics that every such person is a farang, that is, Australian, European, Canadian ,

American (maybe) .

Have never read of Korean, Japanese, Indian, Chinese, African, pedophiles.

Is pedophilia a farang disease ??

[WhiteShiva]

What a sad photo.

The copper on the right looks like he's happy to get this &lt;deleted&gt; as far away from Thailand as possible, as quickly as possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

After reading such news relevant to pedophiles, am struck by the statistics that every such person is a farang, that is, Australian, European, Canadian ,

American (maybe) .

Have never read of Korean, Japanese, Indian, Chinese, African, pedophiles.

Is pedophilia a farang disease ??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No it is not a farang desease - it is just that in many of the countries you mentioned above, pedophilia is either allowed, ignored, or so common it doesn't make the head lines.

Sad, but true.

[bossman]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No it is not a farang desease - it is just that in many of the countries you mentioned above, pedophilia is either allowed, ignored, or so common it doesn't make the head lines.

Sad, but true.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's a pretty racist way to spin things. I don't know any country in asia where pedophilia is expressly allowed or even viewed in a manner aside from disgust.

Edited August 25, 2005 by bossman

[StateSix]

The problem with some paedophiles is that they believe that the children want it. They do not see it as morally wrong to have sex with a child, and that it is no different from an adult having consensual sex with another adult. I once saw a documentary on the BBC where they followed a convicted paedophile around and it was sickening to hear him speak so casually and so openly about how his and the childrens rights were being violated by the Criminal Justice System and who were the police and courts to tell him he could not have a consensual sexual relationship with any other person, regardless of their age. These people are dangerous because of the fact that they can not really be rehabilitated as they are not attracted to mature adults, but children. It would be like locking me up and trying to convince me that I should not be attracted to women.

A significant number of paedophiles were also victims of child abuse themselves. They have grown up from a young age being sexually abused and so when they get older they may see sex with family members as being 'normal' and continue it with their children. These people are the most likely to be rehabilitated and not offend again. They have been abused themselves and with correct treatment could easily be made to see the wrong in what they do. Their children should obviously be removed from them. They are much less likely to abuse anothers child.

The majority of child sex offenders though, in my opinion, are not doing it for the sexual act. They are, like rapists, doing it for the power that they feel when committing such acts. A number of these men (I say men, as generally they are male, although women are involved too), choose children because they are easier to control and manipulate. They use mind games to control the child and ensure that they do not tell anyone. A number may not be able to have normal sexual relationships with adults as it is the power that turns them on. These people are dangerous as well, as they can be extremely charming people and skilled at getting people to trust them. Rehabilitation is unlikely to curb their urges.

In my previous job in England I had cause to deal with a number of incidents of abuse and it was extremly hard to remain professional. It was even harder to watch someone go free because of lack of evidence, or the Crown Prosecution Service felt there wasn't a reasonable chance of conviction. Try telling parents that some guy who has abused their child has been released without charge. Then charge the father with assault when he has dealt with the abuser himself.

In response to Figaro I think part of the problem is that westerners are usually caught as part of a joint venture between Thai and their own national governments agencies. I also believe that part of the problem is that in non 'first world' countries it is easier to commit such acts at home, than it is to travel to another country, and pay off people.

Paedophilia is not just a farang disease. Go out into the country in Thailand and there are brothels etc where underage girls are kept. When these things are dealt with, they are usually dealt with quietly, and not splashed all over the newspapers, so how would you hear about it. Look at the Japanese fetish for schoolgirls, or the sheer number of rapes that occur in South Africa everyday. Sexual abuse is common in India, but Indians do not come to Thailand or Cambodia to commit these acts as a rule. Why, when it is easier for them to do it in their home country. It seems like they are always farangs because when they get caught it makes national news. Most others are quietly swept under the carpet.

[sriracha john]

The problem with some paedophiles is that they believe that the children want it.  They do not see it as morally wrong to have sex with a child, and that it is no different from an adult having consensual sex with another adult. 

These people are dangerous because of the fact that they can not really be rehabilitated as they are not attracted to mature adults, but children.

The majority of child sex offenders though, in my opinion, are not doing it for the sexual act.  They are, like rapists, doing it for the power that they feel when committing such acts.  A number of these men (I say men, as generally they are male, although women are involved too), choose children because they are easier to control and manipulate.

In response to Figaro I think part of the problem is that westerners are usually caught as part of a joint venture between Thai and their own national governments agencies.  I also believe that part of the problem is that in non 'first world' countries it is easier to commit such acts at home, than it is to travel to another country, and pay off people.

Paedophilia is not just a farang disease.  Go out into the country in Thailand and there are brothels etc where underage girls are kept.  It's not splashed all over the newspapers, so how would you hear about it. 

It seems like they are always farangs because when they get caught it makes national news.  Most others are quietly swept under the carpet.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

An excellent, factual, intelligent, and accurate assessment... Thank you for taking the time to compose it.

[opothai]

The problem with some paedophiles is that they believe that the children want it.  They do not see it as morally wrong to have sex with a child, and that it is no different from an adult having consensual sex with another adult. 

These people are dangerous because of the fact that they can not really be rehabilitated as they are not attracted to mature adults, but children.

The majority of child sex offenders though, in my opinion, are not doing it for the sexual act.  They are, like rapists, doing it for the power that they feel when committing such acts.  A number of these men (I say men, as generally they are male, although women are involved too), choose children because they are easier to control and manipulate.

In response to Figaro I think part of the problem is that westerners are usually caught as part of a joint venture between Thai and their own national governments agencies.  I also believe that part of the problem is that in non 'first world' countries it is easier to commit such acts at home, than it is to travel to another country, and pay off people.

Paedophilia is not just a farang disease.  Go out into the country in Thailand and there are brothels etc where underage girls are kept.  It's not splashed all over the newspapers, so how would you hear about it. 

It seems like they are always farangs because when they get caught it makes national news.  Most others are quietly swept under the carpet.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

An excellent, factual, intelligent, and accurate assessment... Thank you for taking the time to compose it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i also agree. very good accont.

i remember reading one of the tabloids a few years ago and they published some amazing facts ie the age of consent in different countries, and if i recolect correctly japan was at the lower end, they could get married at 13 or 14. their are other countries around the world that at the time of the article the age of consent was very low, has this changed and been brought up to date.

when in pattaya 2-3 years ago my wife was very exited about an article she read to me from a thai news paper, they had caught a police man with a twelve year old apparently it was reported she was a prostitute. the reason she was exited was the fact that in rural thailand this sort of thing goes on and nobody can or will addres the problem.

so with this article she thought things were on the up and at last the powers that be were taking it seriously but alas it was only a one off it seems.

having children myself and seeing them grow up, i find it very difficult to understand a mature man taking pleasure with minors, and furthermore we should not try to understand them, when the so called proffesionals try to understand why a mature adult commits these offences to me it looks like they are in some way justifying his actions.

to me the action is simple if you ruin some bodies life then your life should be ruined, and not to the sum of 5years or so but indefinately

[WhiteShiva]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No it is not a farang desease - it is just that in many of the countries you mentioned above, pedophilia is either allowed, ignored, or so common it doesn't make the head lines.

Sad, but true.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's a pretty racist way to spin things. I don't know any country in asia where pedophilia is expressly allowed or even viewed in a manner aside from disgust.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It has got nothing to do with race. But if you think the fact that you don't read about pedophilia or incest in, say Thai or Malaysian newspapers is because it doesn't happen, think again.

If you look at the western world, a generation ago these subjects were toboo - do you really think this is something that only has happend in the last 20-30 years?

I have heard of people being gullible, but you take naivity to new hights - or should I say new lows. You wouldn't last 5 minutes in Sukhumvit!

PS - Statesix - excellent post!!!!

Edited August 25, 2005 by WhiteShiva

[TheAceFace]

Being a parent I know what I'd do to the Tw@s, these feckers make me sick, they should all be burnt alive.

[sriracha john]

An excellent, factual, intelligent, and accurate assessment...  Thank you for taking the time to compose it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i find it very difficult to understand a mature man taking pleasure with minors, and furthermore we should not try to understand them, when the so called proffesionals try to understand why a mature adult commits these offences to me it looks like they are in some way justifying his actions.

I would only add that by trying to understand them, to understand why they do the things they do, to study them... that what the psychologists, criminologists, social scientists... are all trying to do is find a solution to controlling it. Much in the same Dr. Jonas Salk studied and researched and then finally understood how the polio virus operated in order to create the vaccine that ultimately destroyed it.

We DO need try to understand them.... understanding is not to be construed as agreeing with them or condoning their actions.

[opothai]

An excellent, factual, intelligent, and accurate assessment...  Thank you for taking the time to compose it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i find it very difficult to understand a mature man taking pleasure with minors, and furthermore we should not try to understand them, when the so called proffesionals try to understand why a mature adult commits these offences to me it looks like they are in some way justifying his actions.

I would only add that by trying to understand them, to understand why they do the things they do, to study them... that what the psychologists, criminologists, social scientists... are all trying to do is find a solution to controlling it. Much in the same Dr. Jonas Salk studied and researched and then finally understood how the polio virus operated in order to create the vaccine that ultimately destroyed it.

We DO need try to understand them.... understanding is not to be construed as agreeing with them or condoning their actions.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i agre to some extent on what you are saying, but this is not a virus or disease, we are talking illegal urges and actions that are generated from the brain.

at first i used the term un natural in stead of illegal i changed un natural to illegal, because when at the age of 13 and 14 i had the urge to have sex with the girls at school, however we have to control ourselves as we progress and get older, obviously for the protection of the younger generation because they will learn at thier own pace. what you say about finding a cure there isn't one.

Example:-

you can walk down the road in england and some of the girls ar dressed and made up like adults and they look up to 4-5 years older, it is only your control and common sense along with the law of the land that will stop you doing what you should not.

thier is nothing to stop you looking and admiring the beuatiful specimen and wishing you were of the same age but it is maturity and control and that my friend is an individual trait.

Edited August 25, 2005 by opothai

[DJ Pat]

I saw the German guy on Thai Tv yesterday, every time he tried to hide his face with a newspaper, the police ripped it away!!

[Ijustwannateach]

I'm amazed- even though this case is clearly (at least, once they cleared up the gender of the victim) about an older man abusing an underage girl, they STILL have to work in this angle about "Chiang Mai is a haven for old guys who like boys" bit into the news article. Even though it has nothing to do with the news event at all! I guess they thought a little bit of gayness added to the sordid atmosphere of the article. F***ers!

I don't suppose the girl's parents will wind up in jail for neglect/abandonment/not filing a missing person's report for four years, now, will they. Funny that.

It's a foreign dog-and-pony show arrest to avoid dealing with the much bigger problem of Thai-on-Thai sexual abuse, but I suppose one less foreign perv is better than no enforcement of the law at all.

"Steven"

[DJ Pat]

And what were the parents thinking by letting her go and stay with him at 12 years old? Had he already bought her?

[chuchok]

I'm amazed- even though this case is clearly (at least, once they cleared up the gender of the victim) about an older man abusing an underage girl, they STILL have to work in this angle about "Chiang Mai is a haven for old guys who like boys" bit into the news article.  Even though it has nothing to do with the news event at all!  I guess they thought a little bit of gayness added to the sordid atmosphere of the article.  F***ers!

I don't suppose the girl's parents will wind up in jail for neglect/abandonment/not filing a missing person's report for four years, now, will they.  Funny that.

It's a foreign dog-and-pony show arrest to avoid dealing with the much bigger problem of Thai-on-Thai sexual abuse, but I suppose one less foreign perv is better than no enforcement of the law at all.

"Steven"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm surprised by your comments Steven. The girls parents were hilltribe people..quite possibly illegal. Some of these young kids are "married" at the age of 13.Do they know any better?

[Ijustwannateach]

Whether hilltribe or not, they're living in the Kingdom, same as the German guy, legal or not. Ignorance and white skin wouldn't be an excuse in the case of the German; why should ignorance and brown skin be in the case of the girl's parents? Either it's legal or not- and if it's illegal and they're persecuting the German for it then they should persecute the parents, too, for neglect. Who knows? If word got around, maybe parents would realize their kids are their responsibilities, not just cash machines (as I'm not fooled into thinking the parents let this go on for so long with no expectations from the German).

"Steven"

[ozzydom]

This man may or may not have commited a crime, however, it not an uncommon practice for the police in third world countries to "set some on up" ie he goes into a presumably reputable brothel, club, fill in the blank and the policia via the management send in an underage person for sexual acts etc.  Once inside the room etc the police break in show great disgust and distain, shake the guy down for whatever they can and throw him in prison etc....

Not saying that this is what happened but TIT rules..

and things are not always what they seem

Cordially,

Hunter

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Highly doubt the coppers would go this route and bring so much attention to themselves. It's easier and more profitable to just keep getting payoffs over and over from the usual sources. You don't put the golden goose in jail he then stops crapping the golden eggs.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But somethimes you want to show the press/politicians/public that you are doing your job. Better than sacrificing one of your regular "contributors", you set up some stupid tourist who is in the wrong place at the wrong time. Or perhaps to settle some old score with a guy you don't like.

Although in this case, I am pretty sure the police got the right guy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The arrest of this bloke only came after Australian Police intercepted a parcel of vcd,s depicting this bloke and others having sex with the lass,evidentally there are other victoms on the video,s as well. Oz police notified Thai authorities and it went from there. Oz police also seized a large collection of graphic videos at his house in West Aus.

[ozzydom]

Whether hilltribe or not, they're living in the Kingdom, same as the German guy, legal or not.  Ignorance and white skin wouldn't be an excuse in the case of the German; why should ignorance and brown skin be in the case of the girl's parents?  Either it's legal or not- and if it's illegal and they're persecuting the German for it then they should persecute the parents, too, for neglect.  Who knows?  If word got around, maybe parents would realize their kids are their responsibilities, not just cash machines (as I'm not fooled into thinking the parents let this go on for so long with no expectations from the German).

"Steven"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you have your pedophiles mixed up Steven, it is the Oz guy that had the young lass from the hilltribe