Buying A Condo In Thailand At Age 19?

[rkbauer]

Hello,

Earlier this year I was in Bangkok and signed contracts to purchase a condo (I did some commercial work when I was younger). I now get an email from the developer, 2 months before I'm supposed to go over there for the transfer, saying that because I'm 19 years old, my parents will have to come to Thailand with me for me to purchase the condo. I'd really not like to pay for hotels and airfare for my parents and the developer seems to be unable to answer my question in a timely manner, so that I can buy plane tickets earlier if necessary. Which is: Is there any way for me to buy able to buy the condo, without my parents having to fly to Thailand? Maybe have the legal documents sent here and notarized? Thanks everyone.

[InterestedObserver]

From the Civil and Commercial Code:

Section 19. A person, on completion of twenty years of age ceases to be a minor and becomes sui juris.

At 19 you cannot legally sign documents in Thailand, the condo contract you signed is void.

Edited January 1, 2011 by InterestedObserver

[rkbauer]

From the Civil and Commercial Code:

Section 19. A person, on completion of twenty years of age ceases to be a minor and becomes sui juris.

At 19 you cannot legally sign documents in Thailand, the condo contract you signed is void.

Hmm.. I already sent them $30,000. Does this mean I will be unable to purchase the condo? Is there anyway to make the contract work?

[Khun Jean]

I think you can do the paperwork in the Thai embassy as the only concern is that the ones signing are really the one who they say they are, checking identification is not that complicated for an embassy because that is part of their daily work. Make sure the purchase contract is included and can be signed again, the correct way.

You're parents would be able to sign the necessary papers for you.

Best if you all are there together at the same time.

At 19 you learn an important lesson. First prepare and research then buy. I learned that a little later.

[rkbauer]

I think you can do the paperwork in the Thai embassy as the only concern is that the ones signing are really the one who they say they are, checking identification is not that complicated for an embassy because that is part of their daily work. Make sure the purchase contract is included and can be signed again, the correct way.

You're parents would be able to sign the necessary papers for you.

Best if you all are there together at the same time.

At 19 you learn an important lesson. First prepare and research then buy. I learned that a little later.

Thanks,

Would the condo be in multiple names then, or just mine? If so, wouldn't half of the money need to come from a bank account in one of my parent's name's, and half in mine? Just wondering if it works that way.

[rkbauer]

Furthermore, would it be possible to just wait until I'm 20 years old in 9 months? Would a new contract 9 months from now when I'm 20 work, even if the money had been sent over before the contract?

[InterestedObserver]

Technically minors cannot own property in Thailand unless it's subject to court supervision. This entire deal was ill-conceived. Get your deposit back from the void contract or wait until you are of legal age to transfer the condo.

[rkbauer]

Technically minors cannot own property in Thailand unless it's subject to court supervision. This entire deal was ill-conceived. Get your deposit back from the void contract or wait until you are of legal age to transfer the condo.

Okay, thanks. I still want the condo, so I'll probably just end up waiting until I'm 20 and transfer the condo. Now I just have one more question: Will the land office care if the money was sent before the new contract (the one I will make when I'm 20) was made?

[InterestedObserver]

The only thing that the land office cares about is the Foreign Currency Transaction Form. Your bank will issue this form for foreign currency transactions of at least $20,000 (may have been recently increased to $50,000). You will need the form to cover the entire purchase price of the condo, including deposit.

Edited January 1, 2011 by InterestedObserver

[rkbauer]

I was looking at the Thai Civil Code myself.

Section 21: For the doing of a juristic act, a minor

must obtain the consent of his legal representative. All acts done by

him without such consent are voidable unless otherwise provided.

1. "Void" is different from "Voidable". Technically, the contract is still valid. I just have the choice to void it if I want to, correct? And wouldn't I need to just get a permission form, signed by my parents to make the contract not even voidable?

Section 24. A minor can do all acts which are suitable to his condition in life, and actually required for his reasonable needs.

I'm going to University in Thailand and own property besides this condo. Isn't buying this condo suitable to my condition in life and required for my reasonable needs? Edited January 3, 2011 by rkbauer

[trogers]

I was looking at the Thai Civil Code myself.

Section 21: For the doing of a juristic act, a minor

must obtain the consent of his legal representative. All acts done by

him without such consent are voidable unless otherwise provided.

1. "Void" is different from "Voidable". Technically, the contract is still valid. I just have the choice to void it if I want to, correct? And wouldn't I need to just get a permission form, signed by my parents to make the contract not even voidable?

Section 24. A minor can do all acts which are suitable to his condition in life, and actually required for his reasonable needs.

I'm going to University in Thailand and own property besides this condo. Isn't buying this condo suitable to my condition in life and required for my reasonable needs?

Takes two hands to clap. You have only entered into a contract to promise to buy. You are a minor (before age 20) and the promise you have made is voidable, meaning, you or the seller can both rescind the contract.

If both parties are agreeable to wait till you turn 20, and you do not desire to rescind the contract, you can make the purchase and title transfer after becoming 20.

The meaning of 'suitable to his condition in life' applies more to basic necessities, like food, drinks, that pertain to your normal standard of living. Buying a condo next to a university is not one of them, but renting a place to stay is.

[rkbauer]

I'm not sure if the term is the same in Thailand, but in the United States and by every legal definition I've seen yet, a "voidable" contract can be voided by only one party. The party that was assumed to be incompetent (whether by insanity, being underage, or otherwise).

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/void-vs-voidable-contract-lawyers.html

On the other hand, a “voidable” contract is a valid contract. Usually only one party is bound to the contract terms in a voidable contract. The unbound party is allowed to repudiate (cancel) the contract, at which time the contract becomes void. This typically involves situations where only one party has committed a breach.

Contracts where one party was of minor age (they may elect to disaffirm the contract once they reach the age of majority; if the other party is an adult, they will usually be bound to perform)

Even so, wouldn't I just need parental consent (which I have) to make the contract not even voidable?

[Mario2008]

After becoming 21! (on completion of 20 years) one is considered to be an adult.

The fact that one is a minor means that he parents manage the property. In Thailand the parents need permission from the court to among others sell the property of a minor. A minor is protected against abuse by his parents pretty well.

Yes, there is a big difference between void and voidable.

But I don't think that buying a condo is considered to fall under section 24. Buying a condo would be an unusual step. Renting a room would be normal, as that would be normal for a student and as a result of renting a house get a contract for electricity and telephone would also be normal.

[trogers]

I'm not sure if the term is the same in Thailand, but in the United States and by every legal definition I've seen yet, a "voidable" contract can be voided by only one party. The party that was assumed to be incompetent (whether by insanity, being underage, or otherwise).

http://www.legalmatc...ct-lawyers.html

On the other hand, a "voidable" contract is a valid contract. Usually only one party is bound to the contract terms in a voidable contract. The unbound party is allowed to repudiate (cancel) the contract, at which time the contract becomes void. This typically involves situations where only one party has committed a breach.

Contracts where one party was of minor age (they may elect to disaffirm the contract once they reach the age of majority; if the other party is an adult, they will usually be bound to perform)

Even so, wouldn't I just need parental consent (which I have) to make the contract not even voidable?

The seller can void the contract on grounds of non-performance, meaning, the condo unit booked is not fully paid and transferred within a specific time period. Your parents (or if they are deceased, a legal guardian) can authorise the purchase and transfer before you turn 20. whether they need to be in Thailand to do it will depend on requirements of the Land dept.

[rkbauer]

I'm not sure if the term is the same in Thailand, but in the United States and by every legal definition I've seen yet, a "voidable" contract can be voided by only one party. The party that was assumed to be incompetent (whether by insanity, being underage, or otherwise).

http://www.legalmatc...ct-lawyers.html

On the other hand, a "voidable" contract is a valid contract. Usually only one party is bound to the contract terms in a voidable contract. The unbound party is allowed to repudiate (cancel) the contract, at which time the contract becomes void. This typically involves situations where only one party has committed a breach.

Contracts where one party was of minor age (they may elect to disaffirm the contract once they reach the age of majority; if the other party is an adult, they will usually be bound to perform)

Even so, wouldn't I just need parental consent (which I have) to make the contract not even voidable?

The seller can void the contract on grounds of non-performance, meaning, the condo unit booked is not fully paid and transferred within a specific time period. Your parents (or if they are deceased, a legal guardian) can authorise the purchase and transfer before you turn 20. whether they need to be in Thailand to do it will depend on requirements of the Land dept.

That's what I was thinking too, actually.

But I looked in the contract and there is no specified date for the transfer. It's blank.

I signed the contracts when the condo was being built, and they required 1% of the purchase price every month, for 10 months, at a specified date. But I've looked all over the contract and it doesn't say anything about a specified transfer date.

Plus, as long as the company has their money in full, would they really care when I transfer it? The company is TCC Capitalland.

[trogers]

That's what I was thinking too, actually.

But I looked in the contract and there is no specified date for the transfer. It's blank.

I signed the contracts when the condo was being built, and they required 1% of the purchase price every month, for 10 months, at a specified date. But I've looked all over the contract and it doesn't say anything about a specified transfer date.

Plus, as long as the company has their money in full, would they really care when I transfer it? The company is TCC Capitalland.

Careful here. You need to bank certification for money transferred into Thailand in foreign currency to submit to the Land dept in order to get the condo unit transferred to a foreign owner.

Two things to cap the uncertainty - get a letter from the developer stating they agree to wait till you turn 20 to do the title transfer, or check with the Land dept if written authorisation from your parents is sufficient to do the title transfer.

[rkbauer]

That's what I was thinking too, actually.

But I looked in the contract and there is no specified date for the transfer. It's blank.

I signed the contracts when the condo was being built, and they required 1% of the purchase price every month, for 10 months, at a specified date. But I've looked all over the contract and it doesn't say anything about a specified transfer date.

Plus, as long as the company has their money in full, would they really care when I transfer it? The company is TCC Capitalland.

Careful here. You need to bank certification for money transferred into Thailand in foreign currency to submit to the Land dept in order to get the condo unit transferred to a foreign owner.

Two things to cap the uncertainty - get a letter from the developer stating they agree to wait till you turn 20 to do the title transfer, or check with the Land dept if written authorisation from your parents is sufficient to do the title transfer.

Okay, I'll contact the land office. Thanks.

And don't worry, I've been very careful with that. I've transferred most (60%) of the money to TCC Capitalland, in USD and had written the notes what the money was being transferred for. The company had said that they will get the bank confirmation. The amount that was transferred thus far was less than $50,000 (I think it used to be $20,000), so I don't think I should need a foreign exchange transaction form either.

[InterestedObserver]

As things stand now, the OP will not be able to transfer title to the condo until he is of legal age and posses a Foreign Exchange Transaction Form(s) for the entire purchase price. The land office will not allow the title deed to be issued in his name until these two basic requirements are met. Any variation on this will require the cooperation of the land office, which may or may not be forthcoming; there is no guarantee the parents could sign for the OP. This entire deal was ill conceived from the start.

Edited January 4, 2011 by InterestedObserver

[rkbauer]

I realize that this is a bit of an old topic, but since I don't believe there's any documentation on the internet about something like this, I thought I'd update and that it may be of use to someone.

I had the condo transferred to me at age 19, without my parent's presence in Thailand. What ended up happening, is I had my parents sign a Power of Attorney document, with my birth certificate, all of our passports and had it notorized by a State of Texas notary public. This gave Power of Attorney to one of TCCCapitalLand's lawyers and he basically was able to act as my parents. It took about 3 hours (which is much longer than it normally takes, apparently), but it worked out. And I'm glad it did! It would have been pretty bad to have my earned money lost in Thailand, and have to somehow figure out how to get it all back, minus several thousand dollars from the exchange rate.

[ExpatJ]

Well done.

I didnt think there would be a problem- it was not in the interest of the condo owners to make a big deal about this- after all you had given them money and they are interested in profit not the fine points of the law.

Congrats- good start in life having a condo that you can rent out in the future or live in.

[rkbauer]

Well done.

I didnt think there would be a problem- it was not in the interest of the condo owners to make a big deal about this- after all you had given them money and they are interested in profit not the fine points of the law.

Congrats- good start in life having a condo that you can rent out in the future or live in.

Thanks!

I was mostly concerned about the Land Office, not the company. The company seemed willing to work with me from the start and were the ones who figured all of this out. Like someone told me, they're not in the business of not selling condos. But I wasn't sure if the Land Office would go along with it, too.

Edited June 30, 2011 by rkbauer

[trajan]

congrats! great start at 19!

I like TCC CapitalLand's condos...Emporio Place on Sukhumivt 24, Athenee Place on Soi Ruam Rudee and Empire Place on Sathorn Rd

[havent visited Villa Asoke, Sathorn-Taksin or Villa Ratchathewi]

[ESB7]

Get down Soi 4...am sure there would be a very helpful girl that would let you purchase in her name