Payment Of Convenience...

[Khun Jean]

The bribe system works well for some people because they can get their kick from it, i worked with an Aussie who loved riding his motorbike without a helmut. He loved the freedom thing so he was always being stopped and normally gave 50B and on he went. He's still in the LoS doing the same and he loves it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Laws that require people to wear helmets when riding a bike are so fxxking stupid!

Why is it so if the only one who is going to suffer is the person himself? Self responsibility!

I hope governments are not going to make further laws that enforce people wearing shoes or helmets when walking in the streets!!! Freedom!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If i could choose to exclude your hospital bill from my taxes and insurance i would not give a ###### if you split your head against a tree. But if it also cost ME money that YOU don't wear a helmet. Then i do care and am happy it is a law.

In Thailand you are right, its your live your playing with. But don't complain when you fall down and your brains are splattered all over the street. Oh wait, you can't complain, your dead already. Maybe your wife , children, parents, friends will suffer for you instead.

But you are such a good driver, it will not happen to you. I have some news, thailand is full with not so good drivers in big strong cars.

Happy driving. And don't forget to look in the mirrors.

[travelgurl]

too funny

I think its just easier and sometimes alot cheaper to grease your way although I lived in burma for 18 months and the generals have a penchant for johnny walker blue and golf clubs! I had to go to the police station yesterday for a police report (lost my wallet, needed to get report for bank) and the man came out with me when I was finished and said he'd love a coke and a hotdog from 7-11! No worries, came back, gave it to him, he asked my name for the 5th time, thanked me and kissed my hand Its true though, its cheaper than paying tickets back home!

[SiamOne]

too funny

I think its just easier and sometimes alot cheaper to grease your way although I lived in burma for 18 months and the generals have a penchant for johnny walker blue and golf clubs!  I had to go to the police station yesterday for a police report (lost my wallet, needed to get report for bank) and the man came out with me when I was finished and said he'd love a coke and a hotdog from 7-11!  No worries, came back, gave it to him, he asked my name for the 5th time, thanked me and kissed my hand      Its true though, its cheaper than paying tickets back home!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't quite understand your need to "grease" your way at that point, as you had already finished.

Mind you, a 7-11 hotdog is a very apt way to do it.

[DavieA]

too funny

I think its just easier and sometimes alot cheaper to grease your way although I lived in burma for 18 months and the generals have a penchant for johnny walker blue and golf clubs!  I had to go to the police station yesterday for a police report (lost my wallet, needed to get report for bank) and the man came out with me when I was finished and said he'd love a coke and a hotdog from 7-11!  No worries, came back, gave it to him, he asked my name for the 5th time, thanked me and kissed my hand      Its true though, its cheaper than paying tickets back home!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't quite understand your need to "grease" your way at that point, as you had already finished.

Mind you, a 7-11 hotdog is a very apt way to do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'd rather crap in a roll than eat a 7-11 hotdog! eerrrr

[travelgurl]

too funny

I think its just easier and sometimes alot cheaper to grease your way although I lived in burma for 18 months and the generals have a penchant for johnny walker blue and golf clubs!  I had to go to the police station yesterday for a police report (lost my wallet, needed to get report for bank) and the man came out with me when I was finished and said he'd love a coke and a hotdog from 7-11!  No worries, came back, gave it to him, he asked my name for the 5th time, thanked me and kissed my hand      Its true though, its cheaper than paying tickets back home!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't quite understand your need to "grease" your way at that point, as you had already finished.

Mind you, a 7-11 hotdog is a very apt way to do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'd rather crap in a roll than eat a 7-11 hotdog! eerrrr

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[travelgurl]

Well the fact he had his hand on my arm suggested he wasnt quite finished, plus you never know when you may need them, I walk past that station pretty much every day, and as much as I may loathe it, playing the game sometimes is better

[SiamOne]

Well the fact he had his hand on my arm suggested he wasnt quite finished, plus you never know when you may need them,  I walk past that station pretty much every day,  and as much as I may loathe it, playing the game sometimes is better

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

well, you wont be seeing him for a while...he will be sitting on the toilet

[helitool]

I lived in Chiang Mai for 6 years and never once was I asked for a bribe, BUT if ever a policeman or official went out of their way to help me I always made sure that I reciprocated in kind, but never with money! I would bring them back something from the U.S. or proof read their kids application letter to foreign schools, etc. Thais despise people who are "narrow hearted" but will go out of their way to help someone who shows an interest in them and their work.

So, instead of a bribe I give compassion and understanding wraped in a smile and a sense of humor. I have found that this is usually accepted as leagal tender in most parts of this earth.

(This approach may not work as well in Bangkok and Los Angeles, CA as it does up north)

[samran]

Just a thought:

Do the Thai men in the brown uniforms ever report their "tips" for taxation purposes?

Yea,  right......

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well not for official income tax purposes. But the coppers work in a sort of pyramid scheme. The ones who collect the 'fines' pass them up to the food chain to their superiors. Each level takes a gradually larger cut. The policeman you see on the side of the road does all the work but gets paid the least.

Promotions are based not on performance, but on your ability to 'buy' your way into that position. You pay your predecessor essentially for the right to take his place. You then spend the rest of your time in that position recouping your investment.

It works at all levels of the civil service, and it is well known that to become the premanent secretary of any financially responsible ministry costs tens of millions of baht.

This is where looking at the bribe you pay as a small administrative fee for service falls down. Sure they get paid pittance and should be paid more. If the full amount of money went directly to the copper then that would be acceptable. But it doesn't.

As a result, you have a system which is primarily geared to make money, recouping investments for the indivdual stakeholder. The provision of providing a public service, or upholding laws often become a secondary or even teritary priority, behind career advancement and making money.

[sbk]

We don't bribe the guys on the side of the road (don't need to) but it seemed less corrupt to think that these terribly underpaid cops at least got a bit of money. I understand that the police have to buy their own weapons and often office supplies. Now you are saying they don't really, it mostly gets passed to the guy overhead.

God Samran, that is the scariest, most disheartening post I have read.

[opothai]

Just a thought:

Do the Thai men in the brown uniforms ever report their "tips" for taxation purposes?

Yea,  right......

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well not for official income tax purposes. But the coppers work in a sort of pyramid scheme. The ones who collect the 'fines' pass them up to the food chain to their superiors. Each level takes a gradually larger cut. The policeman you see on the side of the road does all the work but gets paid the least.

Promotions are based not on performance, but on your ability to 'buy' your way into that position. You pay your predecessor essentially for the right to take his place. You then spend the rest of your time in that position recouping your investment.

It works at all levels of the civil service, and it is well known that to become the premanent secretary of any financially responsible ministry costs tens of millions of baht.

This is where looking at the bribe you pay as a small administrative fee for service falls down. Sure they get paid pittance and should be paid more. If the full amount of money went directly to the copper then that would be acceptable. But it doesn't.

As a result, you have a system which is primarily geared to make money, recouping investments for the indivdual stakeholder. The provision of providing a public service, or upholding laws often become a secondary or even teritary priority, behind career advancement and making money.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

untill they adress this problem, the country will not progress and fulfill the potential that is their

[ovenman]

As a result, you have a system which is primarily geared to make money, recouping investments for the indivdual stakeholder. The provision of providing a public service, or upholding laws often become a secondary or even teritary priority, behind career advancement and making money.

That's a very succinct summary. This is why it will be very difficult at best to ever reform the system and root out the endemic corruption.

[ovenman]

Now you are saying they don't really, it mostly gets passed to the guy overhead.

A good percentage of it does anyway. The "boys" are no doubt given a quota every day that they are to return with back to the cop shop.

[meadish_sweetball]

The bribe system works well for some people because they can get their kick from it, i worked with an Aussie who loved riding his motorbike without a helmut. He loved the freedom thing so he was always being stopped and normally gave 50B and on he went. He's still in the LoS doing the same and he loves it.

Laws that require people to wear helmets when riding a bike are so fxxking stupid!

Why is it so if the only one who is going to suffer is the person himself? Self responsibility!

I hope governments are not going to make further laws that enforce people wearing shoes or helmets when walking in the streets!!! Freedom!!!

You are forgetting most people have families who feel a lot better if their loved ones don't die in a traffic accident.

[meadish_sweetball]

Just a thought:

Do the Thai men in the brown uniforms ever report their "tips" for taxation purposes?

Yea,  right......

Well not for official income tax purposes. But the coppers work in a sort of pyramid scheme. The ones who collect the 'fines' pass them up to the food chain to their superiors. Each level takes a gradually larger cut. The policeman you see on the side of the road does all the work but gets paid the least.

Promotions are based not on performance, but on your ability to 'buy' your way into that position. You pay your predecessor essentially for the right to take his place. You then spend the rest of your time in that position recouping your investment.

It works at all levels of the civil service, and it is well known that to become the premanent secretary of any financially responsible ministry costs tens of millions of baht.

This is where looking at the bribe you pay as a small administrative fee for service falls down. Sure they get paid pittance and should be paid more. If the full amount of money went directly to the copper then that would be acceptable. But it doesn't.

As a result, you have a system which is primarily geared to make money, recouping investments for the indivdual stakeholder. The provision of providing a public service, or upholding laws often become a secondary or even teritary priority, behind career advancement and making money.

Thanks for the effort Samran. If more people understood this, they might reconsider.

My GF refuses to pay any bribes when dealing with government officials, and it works ok anyway. My general experience is that it is not necessary to bribe if you follow the rules and stay out of other people's business.