Third-Sex Thai Hostesses Ready For Takeoff

[SteeleJoe]

These ladyboys got to have their ding dongs removed before they can start work. Well as the saying goes, 'If you look like a duck, walk like a duck and you talk like a duck . . . you must be a duck.'.

I'll just leave it at that.

Actually I think most of them don't get their penis' removed .. at the very least a good portion of them don't. Some don't do much beyond changing their cloths and wearing makeup.

From a previously posted article:

However, only three transvestite candidates will be hired and each of them must undergo sex-change surgery if they haven't already.

(emphasis mine)

Whether they had it cut off or not is a "moot point" Who really cares? I wouldn't care or even wonder aboard a flight, it is just someone doing their job. SRS does nothing to effect the external appearance. except cartilage plasty.

I certainly don't care. Not even a little bit. But I posted what I did because it was in response to a an erroneous assertion another poster had made -- as can be seen in the quotes.

[mark45y]

Back at DM airport, years ago, I was stuck in a transit space with other passengers - waiting for hours for a delayed take-off. On the intercom, there were loud (very loud, as it has to be in Thailand) announcements every minute or so. The voice was obviously a trans-sexual (I hesitate to say the 'k' word on T.Visa, for fear of being bounced). There was muted giggling adjoining each announcement. For some people, that may seem fine, but others of us don't particularly like being loudly spoken at, with a feminine man's overly-effeminate voice accompanied by giggling - periodically for hours on end.

K word??? KATOEY? What's wrong with that?

Katoey is considered offensive to a ladyboy. It is like walking down the streets in any given city or town and calling a black man a Nigger", your libel to get your A*s kicked on the spot. Or a white westerner called, "Potato", or Asian "Rice", or Muslim "Terrorist", or Mexican ....

and so one.

I don't see it that way. The word 'katoy' might be slightly offensive to some katoy, but if so, it highlights my earlier assertion that katoy are hyper-sensitive and quick to anger and vindictiveness if offended - and it appears they're offended easily. Have you ever had someone get offended by a look from you (or from someone), yet that look may have been totally benign and had nothing to do with the offended person. Same can happen with an ordinarily benign comment - not even directed at the person getting offended.

That's why I would feel uncomfortable with katoy as stewardesses. Maybe it's unlikely, but it's still possible that such a person might get offended, angry, recriminatory at some mention or some glance that has nothing to do with them. It's a form of paranoia, and it happens often among people with self-identity problems. Let's be honest, can we agree that most, if not all katoy have suffered to some degree with identity issues?

Do you actually know any lady boys?

[atyclb]

This should not come as a blow to anyone especially those in the company of "borigan girls", but socially after work going out with friends I have enjoyed the company, intelligent, funny, open minded, educated and even considerable better looking than most of the P4P western oriented staff. I also have great gay and lesbian friends that are very smart, creative, open minded, funny and personable, usually studied abroad.

Why dislike people for things other than the content of their character (snippet Dr. Martin Luther King) Really, some of us expats are not exactly stellar examples of humanity.

[Nisa]

These ladyboys got to have their ding dongs removed before they can start work. Well as the saying goes, 'If you look like a duck, walk like a duck and you talk like a duck . . . you must be a duck.'.

I'll just leave it at that.

Actually I think most of them don't get their penis' removed .. at the very least a good portion of them don't. Some don't do much beyond changing their cloths and wearing makeup.

From a previously posted article:

However, only three transvestite candidates will be hired and each of them must undergo sex-change surgery if they haven't already.

(emphasis mine)

Whether they had it cut off or not is a "moot point" Who really cares? I wouldn't care or even wonder aboard a flight, it is just someone doing their job. SRS does nothing to effect the external appearance. except cartilage plasty.

It is NOT a moot point when a company says you MUST cut it off to be considered for the job.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Who and what is P.C. Air?

This is the name of one of the 2 founders of the new airline - Piyo Chantraporn who likes to be known as Peter Chan. He is a "fortune Teller" that had a 'sixth sense' experience guiding him to set up the airline. Talking about someone with serious convictions about their beliefs. They raised 200 million Baht to set the venture up apparently and rather unorthodoxically bought 2 airplanes instead of entering this type of business through the normal route of leasing them initially.

[ginjag]

My answer to Nisa was to agree, the airline should employ lady boys of any type on merit, as per the job description. Not to descriminate on what surgery they have had, to me it is bad company policy. As per my earlier post

[atyclb]

Actually I think most of them don't get their penis' removed .. at the very least a good portion of them don't. Some don't do much beyond changing their cloths and wearing makeup.

From a previously posted article:

However, only three transvestite candidates will be hired and each of them must undergo sex-change surgery if they haven't already.

(emphasis mine)

Whether they had it cut off or not is a "moot point" Who really cares? I wouldn't care or even wonder aboard a flight, it is just someone doing their job. SRS does nothing to effect the external appearance. except cartilage plasty.

It is NOT a moot point when a company says you MUST cut it off to be considered for the job.

Did you ever consider my post could be reflective and philosophical, argumentative as well as contain some personal thoughts? not to mention an (obvious ????) pun....

Another disturbing element (IMO) is the possibility of having to fund SRS without being certain of having the job. That is tantamount to California Fitness telling an expat he must have a tummy tuck and liposuction to be considered for a position as personal trainer.

[siampolee]

If you are so worried as to the presumed gender of your cabin attendant , host, hostess, whatever label you may pin upon them, why not check for yourself upon boarding said aircraft ?

All you need to do is to shove your hand up the presumed females skirt and have a grope about .

That should please those types who are so anti the scenario, or shall we say, " the more adventurous types who wish to sample the goods."

Satisfaction if the result indicates a female gender, revulsion if it indicates a male style gender or perhaps for the closet merchant euphoria will be the result.

The general day to day pervert will of course derive satisfaction whatever the result may be.

He's got no hair on his chest but when he lifts up his skirt and his vest you'll be surprised.

P.S.

The word "VEST" is used in the U.K. context rather than the American context.

Edited January 26, 2011 by siampolee

[brahmburgers]

K word??? KATOEY? What's wrong with that?

Katoey is considered offensive to a ladyboy. It is like walking down the streets in any given city or town and calling a black man a Nigger", your libel to get your A*s kicked on the spot. Or a white westerner called, "Potato", or Asian "Rice", or Muslim "Terrorist", or Mexican ....

and so one.

I don't see it that way. The word 'katoy' might be slightly offensive to some katoy, but if so, it highlights my earlier assertion that katoy are hyper-sensitive and quick to anger and vindictiveness if offended - and it appears they're offended easily. Have you ever had someone get offended by a look from you (or from someone), yet that look may have been totally benign and had nothing to do with the offended person. Same can happen with an ordinarily benign comment - not even directed at the person getting offended.

That's why I would feel uncomfortable with katoy as stewardesses. Maybe it's unlikely, but it's still possible that such a person might get offended, angry, recriminatory at some mention or some glance that has nothing to do with them. It's a form of paranoia, and it happens often among people with self-identity problems. Let's be honest, can we agree that most, if not all katoy have suffered to some degree with identity issues?

Do you actually know any lady boys?

Yes, several. Two are in my employ at an adventure park I manage. Both fine fellows. They're young, they don't dress as girls, but they have that effeminate girlish way so common to Thai boys. Maybe they're just gay, I don't know. We don't talk about it. They do their jobs well, they get paid, so all's well.

I'm more concerned about the surgery-affected, hormone injected type - some of whom have a propensity for getting offended very easily. That can quickly lead to depression, anger, lashing-out and......

[Payboy]

Just a thought - With all that silicone, would they need safety vests?

[ginjag]

Reply to Brahmburgers post and add again, public OR future passengers should be more concerned about the airline policy-re -selecting surgery (ladyboys). They to my mind should be fined-surely it's against the law.

[cup-O-coffee]

Did you ever consider my post could be reflective and philosophical, argumentative as well as contain some personal thoughts? not to mention an (obvious ????) pun....

Another disturbing element (IMO) is the possibility of having to fund SRS without being certain of having the job. That is tantamount to California Fitness telling an expat he must have a tummy tuck and liposuction to be considered for a position as personal trainer.

Certainly a very valid point for making an argument against the stupidity of any ladyboy being gullible enough to strive to get a job like this with so many uncertainties.

This is what it seems to be boiling down to. The airlines are now clearly asking for the moon, and spin doctoring the whole scheme into a gender equality campaign. What a bunch of <deleted>.

Personally, I would warn any ladyboy to stay far away from having SRS simply to create a possibility to be placed on a short list and maybe get an interview, and then play the odds at getting a job. It all sounds too risky, and the disrespectful requirement to have SRS really makes this a strongly biased, ignorant and discriminating issue.

Who cares if the female flight attendants shave or don't shave or are experiencing their period? Similarly, who cares whether a very feminine looking man has a penis or not. What in Hades does the status of the groin area have to do with performing the tasks, duties and responsibilities of a flight attendant.

I stick with my original thoughts that this is another Thai way of promoting face at the expense of some poor unfortunate soul, who simply wants to make their way in life with the least amount of hassle possible. It's like striking a deal with old Lucifer, himself.

Anyone stupid enough to jump through incredibly expensive hoops to secure something so uncertain should have their head examined. With regard to the transgendered, I direct this comment. Compelling someone to get an SRS for the purpose of getting an interview is almost criminal when you think about it. Requiring someone to get it with no guarantees, and not having anything at all to do with what being transgendered is all about should cause the prosecuting attorney to slap the wrists of these airline tycoons for not respecting the real reasons that people get SRS in the first place. For a job? Stupid and disrespectful and it demonstrates their ignorance towards this gender type!

[Mitker]

I only hope Pattaya ladyboys do not hear of the news! Or i am afraid passengers will be harassed in the air just as much as on the ground.

i also hope the airline is prepared to lose some customers, there is a large number of people who do not accept so called third sex.

Sure, P.C. Air, I do not know you and I am not interested to know you even if your flights are for free. I have still some respect for myself as well and do not want to mingle with mentally sick ladyboys who better belong in the Pattaya nightlife than on an airplane. Not surprised to see that it is Thailand to be the first country to make this shameful step! What about the insurance Companies? They systematically refuse to health-insure katoeys. And why is that do you think...

The end of the straight civilisation...

On this aspect, Thai society proves far more mature than many others.

P.C. demonstrates that Thai people simply don't care what people do in their private life (it's their business) but rather if they're fit for the job.

Unlike posts above, they don't make this common western mistake of looking in someone's personal life and judge it according to narrow cultural/religious frames with no relevance to others.

These FA won't be there to marry you, to get close to you or even "to know you". They actually won't give a *** about you as a person but well as a customer.

They will perform their AF duty according to their job description and that's the only relevant point.

Other considerations/generalizations only demonstrate "shameful" bigotry and imported narrow-mindedness.

If these aircrafts are well maintained, I'll gladly be a customer. And, no, I'm not into TG/TV persons for private moments but can sure enjoy their company.

[kuffki]

I only hope Pattaya ladyboys do not hear of the news! Or i am afraid passengers will be harassed in the air just as much as on the ground.

i also hope the airline is prepared to lose some customers, there is a large number of people who do not accept so called third sex.

Sure, P.C. Air, I do not know you and I am not interested to know you even if your flights are for free. I have still some respect for myself as well and do not want to mingle with mentally sick ladyboys who better belong in the Pattaya nightlife than on an airplane. Not surprised to see that it is Thailand to be the first country to make this shameful step! What about the insurance Companies? They systematically refuse to health-insure katoeys. And why is that do you think...

The end of the straight civilisation...

On this aspect, Thai society proves far more mature than many others.

P.C. demonstrates that Thai people simply don't care what people do in their private life (it's their business) but rather if they're fit for the job.

Unlike posts above, they don't make this common western mistake of looking in someone's personal life and judge it according to narrow cultural/religious frames with no relevance to others.

These FA won't be there to marry you, to get close to you or even "to know you". They actually won't give a *** about you as a person but well as a customer.

They will perform their AF duty according to their job description and that's the only relevant point.

Other considerations/generalizations only demonstrate "shameful" bigotry and imported narrow-mindedness.

If these aircrafts are well maintained, I'll gladly be a customer. And, no, I'm not into TG/TV persons for private moments but can sure enjoy their company.

Thai society does not care about anything.

The only time care or maturity comes in is when it hits personal wallet, as for everything else "does not matter"

[Nisa]

I only hope Pattaya ladyboys do not hear of the news! Or i am afraid passengers will be harassed in the air just as much as on the ground.

i also hope the airline is prepared to lose some customers, there is a large number of people who do not accept so called third sex.

Sure, P.C. Air, I do not know you and I am not interested to know you even if your flights are for free. I have still some respect for myself as well and do not want to mingle with mentally sick ladyboys who better belong in the Pattaya nightlife than on an airplane. Not surprised to see that it is Thailand to be the first country to make this shameful step! What about the insurance Companies? They systematically refuse to health-insure katoeys. And why is that do you think...

The end of the straight civilisation...

On this aspect, Thai society proves far more mature than many others.

P.C. demonstrates that Thai people simply don't care what people do in their private life (it's their business) but rather if they're fit for the job.

Unlike posts above, they don't make this common western mistake of looking in someone's personal life and judge it according to narrow cultural/religious frames with no relevance to others.

These FA won't be there to marry you, to get close to you or even "to know you". They actually won't give a *** about you as a person but well as a customer.

They will perform their AF duty according to their job description and that's the only relevant point.

Other considerations/generalizations only demonstrate "shameful" bigotry and imported narrow-mindedness.

If these aircrafts are well maintained, I'll gladly be a customer. And, no, I'm not into TG/TV persons for private moments but can sure enjoy their company.

You can defend people's rights to a different lifestyle all you want but I would think more about holding P.C. Airlines up as a good example. They have not only set the number they will hire at 3 (clearly they are not judging people on merits alone) and have also excluded any men from being hired as well as appear to be exploiting these ladyboys (publicity & the whole Miss Thailand thing) but more importantly THEY ARE REQUIRING THESE LADYBOYS TO CUT OFF THEIR PENIS TO EVEN BE CONSIDERED FOR THE JOB.

And just because Thai people have a mai pen rai attitude doesn't mean that ladyboys are considered equal by any means. Much of the Thai people see them as a source of entertainment and they are usually portrayed on TV and movies in a way to get a laugh. In fact it is my personal opinion this airline is exploiting these women for publicity and for travelers amusement since they are also FORCING them to wear tags on their uniform that will indicate they are ladyboys. They say this is to help immigration but immigration goes by legal documents and not name tags on a uniform and they certainly wouldn't need to have this designated on their uniform for all to see while they are working as opposed to simply providing them a company card or letter they can present to immigration.

[atyclb]

Dear Mr P.C.

Since "real men" should have penis length of 203.2 mm or more, and most certainly not shorter than that of any ladyboy we are effectively placing you on probation pending ternmination should you not undergo a surgical lengthening procedure.

Airline Board Of Directors

Edited January 27, 2011 by atyclb

[JemJem]

Then I suggest you take your PC attitudes and go back to the West.

Why? Why do I have any less right to be here than you? Because I'm too tolerant? Huh. Odd. Especially as the Thais are -- in this instance -- equally tolerant and its their country, not yours. And since I've gotten along well here for decades, being tolerant of difference, it seems there's no need for me leave now because I remain tolerant (and unafraid of people whose life choices/needs I frankly can't even begin to understand).

And it has eff-all to do with "PC" -- I was raised to be tolerant and unafraid of differences long before there was such a thing as "PC". It's called being a fair and ethical person -- regardless of what's "politically correct". (But "PC" is the pejorative codeword bigots always use when they want to object to someone whose not a bigot -- it's meaningless rhetoric but it succeeds for some people in diminsihing the other person's position: 'Oh, you're just being politically correct' (the implication being that it's not a genuine principle based on ideas of right and wrong and one that many people also hold and have held for generations).

Excellent post, SteeleJoe !

[SteeleJoe]

P.C. demonstrates that Thai people simply don't care what people do in their private life (it's their business) but rather if they're fit for the job.

Unlike posts above, they don't make this common western mistake of looking in someone's personal life and judge it according to narrow cultural/religious frames with no relevance to others.

These FA won't be there to marry you, to get close to you or even "to know you". They actually won't give a *** about you as a person but well as a customer.

They will perform their AF duty according to their job description and that's the only relevant point.

Other considerations/generalizations only demonstrate "shameful" bigotry and imported narrow-mindedness.

If these aircrafts are well maintained, I'll gladly be a customer. And, no, I'm not into TG/TV persons for private moments but can sure enjoy their company.

I'm sorry, I haven't the slightest problem with this airline's decision and -- as can be seen in my posts on this thread -- share your opinion of others' intolerance. But you are guilty of the flip side of the cretins who can see nothing but the negative in Thai people: the comments in bold are.. well...ridiculous.

Thais are in many ways very tolerant. (Sometimes, in my opinion, too much so). But they do judge people and thier private lives. Do you speak Thai by any chance? Ever spent extended time with Thais who are relaxed with you enough to converse as they normally would? I can assure they do plenty of judging about personal lives.

It's not a "western" thing nor is it "imported". (That western thing is so absurd -- Falangs who come here and decide that its the West that's messed up always crack me up -- there is intolerance and bigotry on a massive scale in plenty of the east.)

But then there's this...uhmmm...person:

Thai society does not care about anything.

The only time care or maturity comes in is when it hits personal wallet, as for everything else "does not matter"

I can' be bothered to even address that...stuff.

[SteeleJoe]

Then I suggest you take your PC attitudes and go back to the West.

Why? Why do I have any less right to be here than you? Because I'm too tolerant? Huh. Odd. Especially as the Thais are -- in this instance -- equally tolerant and its their country, not yours. And since I've gotten along well here for decades, being tolerant of difference, it seems there's no need for me leave now because I remain tolerant (and unafraid of people whose life choices/needs I frankly can't even begin to understand).

And it has eff-all to do with "PC" -- I was raised to be tolerant and unafraid of differences long before there was such a thing as "PC". It's called being a fair and ethical person -- regardless of what's "politically correct". (But "PC" is the pejorative codeword bigots always use when they want to object to someone whose not a bigot -- it's meaningless rhetoric but it succeeds for some people in diminsihing the other person's position: 'Oh, you're just being politically correct' (the implication being that it's not a genuine principle based on ideas of right and wrong and one that many people also hold and have held for generations).

Excellent post, SteeleJoe !

Thanks JemJem.

Actually I didn't express myself that well; but I did notice that the poster had no reply. (The colossal nerve required for a farang to tell me to go back to the west -- for being in agreement with Thais...)

[kuffki]

P.C. demonstrates that Thai people simply don't care what people do in their private life (it's their business) but rather if they're fit for the job.

Unlike posts above, they don't make this common western mistake of looking in someone's personal life and judge it according to narrow cultural/religious frames with no relevance to others.

These FA won't be there to marry you, to get close to you or even "to know you". They actually won't give a *** about you as a person but well as a customer.

They will perform their AF duty according to their job description and that's the only relevant point.

Other considerations/generalizations only demonstrate "shameful" bigotry and imported narrow-mindedness.

If these aircrafts are well maintained, I'll gladly be a customer. And, no, I'm not into TG/TV persons for private moments but can sure enjoy their company.

I'm sorry, I haven't the slightest problem with this airline's decision and -- as can be seen in my posts on this thread -- share your opinion of others' intolerance. But you are guilty of the flip side of the cretins who can see nothing but the negative in Thai people: the comments in bold are.. well...ridiculous.

Thais are in many ways very tolerant. (Sometimes, in my opinion, too much so). But they do judge people and thier private lives. Do you speak Thai by any chance? Ever spent extended time with Thais who are relaxed with you enough to converse as they normally would? I can assure they do plenty of judging about personal lives.

It's not a "western" thing nor is it "imported". (That western thing is so absurd -- Falangs who come here and decide that its the West that's messed up always crack me up -- there is intolerance and bigotry on a massive scale in plenty of the east.)

But then there's this...uhmmm...person:

Thai society does not care about anything.

The only time care or maturity comes in is when it hits personal wallet, as for everything else "does not matter"

I can' be bothered to even address that...stuff.

and yet you just did-LMAO.

[SteeleJoe]

You are easily amused.

But in fact I didn't address it.

"Address" transitive verb: to try to deal with a problem or question, for example by thinking carefully about it, or by doing things to improve a situation