Songkran & The Liquor Police

[Paagai]

I think evil is the root of all evil.

Nope Religion and Testosterone

[Sparkles]

They should also ban people that spit venomous insults and generalizations towards others

hear ,hear !!

[orang37]

... snip ... I know some very well dressed, affluent people, who are in fact scum.

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun UpTheos,

Yes, if we interpret your words correctly, we see no correlation between outer style-of-dress, and the degree of affluence, perhaps projected thereby, and inherent "scumhood."

And, may we add to your observation: we know some people whose personalities have several outer-layers of "scumhood," speaking behaviorally, but, just as a ship's hull may be good metal under many countless coats of marine-enamel deck paint, in their hearts ... is ... gold.

We'd separate out the issue of relative personal cleanliness here, since, after all, weary travellers do arrive less than freshy, even out of business-class jets.

And, of course, in that island of racially-scrambled rapacious genocidal colonialists (but no more so than their French, Spanish, Italian, "low countries, Germanic, and Portugese, contemporaries), named by the conquering Romans, Britannia, bath-taking was in general considered unsanitary. And, in Ben Johnson's times, vegetables were considered poisonous.

A breakthrough coming in Victorian times with popularity of the "Turkish Bath" (Hammam) for the elite: History of the Turkish Bath in 19th century England

But, note, that for the "urban masses:" of the crowded cities, often driven off the land, and into the cities, by the legal elimination of the "commons:" as the scholar Croutier noted: "The absence of plumbing made domestic hygiene impossible. In England, rapid urbanisation bringing with it congestion and slums, contributed to the severity of the cholera epidemic of 1832 and of subsequent outbreaks. An estimated 50,000 people died in the epidemic and as a result the British were motivated to become pioneers in plumbing ... (those) who wished to transplant the oriental bath to England were careful to stress its health giving aspects."

And, of course, in England, for the better off, there was the institution of "taking the baths, as at the eponymously named famous town of Bath, or for the very wealthy, the de rigeur European grand tour, with stops at the famous spas.

However there were attempts to make these baths more available to "lower" socio-economic classes: the 1861 Lancet reports: "Of great importance was the impact on the health and hygiene of the poor. The early advocates of the Turkish Bath believed firmly that it should be available to everyone, not only the wealthy. It is recorded that, at the end of the week at Dr. Barter's bath in Blarney, workmen, labourers and afterwards their wives and children were all allowed to use the Turkish Bath. It is even said that he held sessions for the farm animals. Urquart held similar views, stating that 'a nation without a bath is deprived of a large portion of the health and inoffensive enjoyment within man's reach.' "

Claims for the efficacy of the Turkish bath grew extravagant: Bartholomew, writing in the Lancet (1861), claimed his wife: " 'had been unable to perform her domestic duties through 'nervous debility,' but after working as a bath attendant for 18 months she became the strong and healthy mother of triplets. From this, Bartholomew concluded: 'Ladies must only, hope for single births by taking the bath once a week. to make them double or triple will necessitate them and their husbands becoming Turkish Bath attendants.' "

Good taste requires us to not conjecture whether Bartholomew's wife discovered a natural bent for nymphomania, or studly satisfaction, in said baths, or if Bartholmew's attempts to inseminate were not quite "up to snuff," it not being known if she "attended" males in said Hammam.

There is no more wonderful history, ioho, of the stinks and smells of London, its environment, its topography, its commerce, its dark side of underground sexuality, the roisterousness of its theaters, like the immortal Globe, set in an area across the Thames renowned for its brothels, where aristocrats mixed with "commoners," its pagentries, its historical religious-political "earthquakes," betrayals, dark-deeds in high places, its merciless justice, its international spying intrigue (as vital to its defense and commercial success as it was for Spain, France, Italy, or the Germanic constellation remanants of the once "Holy Roman Empire", and the "Great Game" afoot in Asia involving Russia, the Ottoman Empire, etc.), its patterns of settlement by class, race, occupation, etc,., and its general history, over time (informed by the utmost rigorous scholarship, and a creative writer's fluency, and gift for metaphor) than ... Peter Ackroyd's unique "London: a Biography." A "mesmeric" book we'd recommend to any wanna-be writer of either fiction or non-fiction as an example of how to create vivid portrayals of the real environment as experienced by the senses of smell, vision, hearing, taste.

best, ~o:37;

[orang37]

They should also ban people that spit venomous insults and generalizations towards others

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun PlanetX,

Thinking of the labor-intensive super-structure this would entail, the Orwellian social monitoring infrastructure required, which would of course be vulnerable to political manipulations, bribery, and all human corruptions, it might be simpler to simply create an operation like a vasectomy, but, in this case, reliably reversable, performed after childbirth, like circumcision, that would render all children mute, until after they had learned to write.

At that point, an impartial computer program, and genetic analysis, could determine those who should be unmuted by analysis of their writings, classroom drawings, reports on their general deportment, etc.

Of course draconian public punishments ... we favor hanging until unconsciousness sets in, then reviving, and drawing (out the intestines slowly) and quartering (cutting into quarters) ... would be required to deter those who, being unmuted, engaged in said expectorations of vituperation, and generalizations. These, of course, can be carried live on YouTube, or television: their popularity would exceed, we guess, shows like "Dancing with the Stars." (note: we've never seen a single episode of 'some-country-or-other Idol,' or 'Dancing with the Stars,' but we read they are popular.

best, ~o:37;

Edited April 19, 2011 by orang37

[mallmagician]

That's easy for you to say orang. ;-)

[CMX]

Yes, the historical picture of London and its level of hygiene is perfectly accurate as presented by Orang~37, of course. But justice during most of London's history (except perhaps during the period when the Blue Bodies ruled) was equally filthy. And I write as a great admirer of the English common law.

Yet if anyone supposes that during the times of "Royal Rule" or, later, the evolving Parliament, when it was occupied by the nobility, lesser nobility, and merchant princes, Justice was fair and did not go the the monied when high stakes were involved, they don't know history.

On ThVi, many complain of emerging Thailand's justice system. In their machinations, I see little to suggest much difference between that London and the now, here. Developing democracies have never popped up. They have always passed through periods where wresting power from the "haves" and allowing all citizens to decide about laws was not yet at work (and is still imperfect in established democracies).

Is it imagined anywhere that once London got its police force that there was not corruption at every level? Or that country pubs could ignore the hours laws when they were first established?

The imperfect implementation of laws has been part of our human history everywhere. For some reason, Thailand is being called upon to evolve in decades, whereas the West has gotten where it is over centuries.

Those who whine about legal conditions here will find precedents every which way in our planet's stories, should they look.

As an aside, allow me to suggest that the genteel British, as I understood it, burned the entrails of the in front of his dazed and dying eyes before quartering the body. But I am not fully conversant with the history of the styles of judicial murders in that bastion of justice, Great Britain.

Edited April 20, 2011 by CMX

[orang37]

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun CMX,

Yes, you're so right, left out the part of burning the intestines.

Yet, we must admit that if we could time-travel, and have a new "extended" life: it would be to the London of Shakespeare's glory we would wish to go, or to 18th. century London, when Samuel Johnson held forth, the lion of the coffee-houses, accompanied by his hypochrondiacal friend and amanuensis, Boswell. Or, much later, perhaps, with Darwin and Fitzroy on the "Voyage of the Beagle."

Alas, this century is not one for poets.

best, ~o:37;