Jatuporn And Other Red-Shirt Leaders Blow The Whistle On Coup

[yoshiwara]

After the coup Gen. Sonthi, in an interview with the Western press stated: "We had to have a coup because would couldn't find any way to democratically remove him" (Thaksin)

Meanwhile, Sondhi, the PAD leader, during a speech at an American University, claimed the coup was necessary because the "Bangkok elite were losing their power and wanted it back", a position he also embraced.

Part of me says you don't have a coup in a - supposedly - democratic country. Yet, another part of me can understand the "rationale" of Gen Sonthi.

The biggest problem I have with the coup is when they tore up the "People's Constitution", replacing it with one that was approved by the military, absolving themselves from any liability. People say it was voted on and passed by over 60% of the population, but one small fact they forget to mention is that they were pretty much told by the coup makers: "Vote for this or stay under military rule and martial law". They chose the lesser of two evils.

The constitution is of little use in a firefight. Although Thaksin was nominally the PM he was a 'caretaker' PM. An important point when one is arguing if the legal government was overthrown. The scenario was not about the consitution. It was the realisation that Thaksin was mounting an internal coup and that it was 'him or us'. Thaksin had the police tied up and a serious wedge into the judiciary. The next step was to secure the army appointments. Once that had been done if he had been allowed to do so, it would have been game over. Thaksin, stupid as ever when going for the main prize tried to seize the final piece of low-hanging fruit while not elected. He had screwed up the election process and didn't know how to retreat. The establishment took the opportunity to say 'Oh know you don't', the army went out on the streets to be faced with garlands of flowers and did I hear mention of people's uprising? No I didn't. Thaksin was allowed to fill up as many suitcases of cash as he could carry and the rest as they say is history. Ever since then the forum red apologists and academic bag carriers have tried to confuse 2006 with the events of 1992 and continue to scream 'coup' at the drop of a hat. What is so so interesting is that Thaksin continues to focus on controlling the army and the 2010 events were an attempt to force out the government before the 2010 army appointments. The reds? Pawns in a bigger game.

Edited April 23, 2011 by yoshiwara

[TheyCallmeScooter]

The Thai people deserve what government they have with all its warts and halos. It does not take a educated individual to realize he is being sh.t on and to take action to bring positive changes. When the old guard can pass the baton to their children, grandchildren, extended family, etc, without question, and retain/propose impunity, it reflects on the people not the minority who get away with it.

I agree with the inherent Truth of collectively deserving the nature of how one is governed (which is a nice way of saying people deserve the level at which they are exploited - or are minimum wage earners - and below-min wage earners in the US - living the dream?)...but it certainly takes a special kind of education / cognisance to realise that everyone is being sh*t on, like EVERYONE (the % doing the sh*tting are simply too tiny a number to be anything but a negligible consideration when you're talking %'s).

And everyone sh*ts to their capacity, and it's all directed down stream.

When everyone, where "everyone" who is capable of straining their necks for their own good...should really be looking to aim their waste products, in a diametrically opposed manner. Sh*tting up, not to put too fine a point on it.

What with the Church (et al), cultural values (all mysterious in origin and not-as-mysterious in perpetuation), and the judicial system firmly bonding over caviar in the opposing camp...you can bet the farm on the fact the level of education required is of a very rare kind, in that it was achieved outside the traditional / societal framework. Which does not lend itself to education of that...sort. For fairly obvious - if tragic - reasons.

Those kind of numbers are duplicated pretty much world wide including in communist countries. There is ALWAYS an elite that has a large percentage of the national cash, or investments. Of course if this is considered investments that create jobs, then IMO this changes the dynamic significantly.

If they were just hoarding cash and letting others starve to death it would be different than investing in infrastructure that creates jobs for many. It might not be glamourous to pour cement, but it's better than no job because no one is building. Should minimum wages be raised yes and significantly.

What differentiates countries is how they deal with the poorest of the poor, and how fast their middle classes are growing and educating their children to advance.

Of course all of this ALSO takes a tax base to finance it,

and businesses make jobs, so workers feed families,

workers also pay taxes at most levels, especially the better paid ones,

but more so companies pay taxes also.

Investment profits usually pay taxes also.

It may be fashionable in some circles to scream 'Eat the rich!', but who will replace their necessary functions in society?

Why it's not fashionable to add an appendage on that chant, separating the ones that are living, from the ones who are dead, is the real issue.

I was unaware the wealthy dead did much, in the way of facilitating economic stimulation; let alone performed some 'necessary' function.

It's the ludicrous contradiction that is "heredity title" that much be brought to the front and center; and I'm not even talking about Thailand really, it only seems relevant here in ways that are a contradiction themselves, if you're British or American. As you'd have far more reason to - not - be buying into the idea that the offspring of a billionaire deserves his father's billions, more than the millions of EQUALLY-DESERVING offspring, who would put it to far greater economic use, than a single lump sum lottery winner (of birth).

It doesn't even need to be controversial, though those who have an interest in making it so, have the mass means of communication, to do just about anything they want with the collective psyche. But we wouldn't want those sons and daughters of billionaire dynasties feeling ripped off. So they get 5 million, of the 300 million. 295 goes to society.

The economic basis for Trickle-Down nonsense and arguments about Wealthy Hoarders being the noble benefactors every society requires, kind of got shipped out the door in some long-since monetized European revolutions. That kind of logic is fallacious, and runs against every sensible economic theory which has been proposed, by two centuries of non-ridiculous economists. Keynes wouldn't be impressed, with the lack of logic which persists in those kinds of arguments.

The fact that no one even understands Keynesian theory, when it's - trendy - to be Keynesian...the fact that arguments can be sold as Truth to people who simply cannot be saved (from themselves), at far too commercially viable a price...the fact those arguments could even be sold as Truth to minds of any kind, let alone those capable of critical analysis....all that's just really more depressing, than anything else.

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Please, someone quickly fire out a line about redistribution discouraging wealth acquisition / creation...so that I can obliterate it.

Edited May 6, 2011 by TheyCallmeScooter

[barrybankruad]

Maybe ther army should mount a coup and eradicate the red shirt leaders - the country would certainly be better for it.

What an assenine comment! Why is that when farangs from countries with strong and mature democratic traditions comment on politics in Thailand, they are amongst the first to call for this politician or that political group to be banned, jailed or exiled? Then they complain about double standards in Thailand!

Quite so. Of course there are going to coup rumours in this Country, just how many have their been in the last 60 years or so? They have occurred with monotonous regularity so at this time with the country split down the middle and the prospect of forthcoming elections (will believe that when it happens) rumours like this are bound to occur.