What Is A Village Leader ?

[Dirty80s]

What is a village leader and exactly what kind of authority does he have ?

Im refeering to the old man talking in the speakers 5:30 on the morning in small villages.

[zzaa09]

Every situation might be different. A Poo Yai of a moo baan or tambon usually is elected in a loose manner - many times "appointed" by the community, more or less. Acting as a organizer, ombudsman, committee chair, etc. Some moo baans will have a loose-knit "council" that acts for the collective. This obviously varies, as every community's social and political tendencies differ. Historically, a headman or village chief as been passed on through familial chains......back when, the Poo Yai was often the head Abbot at the respective Wat.

[micksterbs]

What is a village leader?

Someone who loves the sound of his own voice.

And fervently believes that everyone else does, too...

[kennalder]

What is a village leader?

Someone who loves the sound of his own voice.

And fervently believes that everyone else does, too...

So far you haven't narrowed the field one iota.

[justcruisin]

Every situation might be different. A Poo Yai of a moo baan or tambon usually is elected in a loose manner - many times "appointed" by the community, more or less. Acting as a organizer, ombudsman, committee chair, etc. Some moo baans will have a loose-knit "council" that acts for the collective. This obviously varies, as every community's social and political tendencies differ. Historically, a headman or village chief as been passed on through familial chains......back when, the Poo Yai was often the head Abbot at the respective Wat.

A very well educated and thought out reply.

May I add as well that their role is wide and varied such as M.C. at weddings and funerals.

Every small village has a hierachy which is deemed to give the younger ones some leadership and instill disciplne.

I just hope that this fraternal instinct remains or...... shudder, it will just go the same as the west with no respect for both the laws and the elders.

I really suspect not, as the culture is strong and some one will always step in to give their neighbour or friend a hand when/if they are really down,

even if that is just to loan them some rice to eat until the next harvest.

[Dirty80s]

First reply was very informative. But exactly what authority do they have (if they even have one?). My Wife wants to open a shop. does she have to get some kind of permission from the leader or not ?

[wildoates]

Most of the time, yes the village idiot, I mean leader has go give a nod for the government office to accept. Remember he has brought this position and needs was to make his money back....

[Atmos]

we moved recently after a year 'rural';

Local poo yai baan was i suppose a busy-body, nosey bugger but did get things done, nagging for local road repairs, improved tap water supply for everyone, before we moved there he'd started a community garden that was well-used and maintained, there are some old/unsupported people living in houses on my partner's family farm and he ensured they enough food - don't know whether he had an allowance for this or if he simple begged off other farmers, last school hols he bought volleyball, petanque and sepak takraw gear for the local kids.

A bit of a muddler maybe, but I'd put him in the means well/no harm category.

My partner was approached to be his replacement, he has to retire when he turns 60. Very progressive of them I thought but believe there are numerous women holding this position. Fortunately we already had plans to move as there is a 24hr-availability expectation, and she wasn't interested anyway; understand the salary was 8500b/mth plus 'perks' whatever they may be.

Edited April 24, 2011 by genghis61

[zzaa09]

My goodly Mrs. zzaa09 is a current {rotating} sitting "committee member" of our little moo baan of 250 + I've been able to pull a couple of indirect strings the Poo Yai's way. Does have it's moments...

[spacemand]

First reply was very informative. But exactly what authority do they have (if they even have one?). My Wife wants to open a shop. does she have to get some kind of permission from the leader or not ?

My wife opened a minimart and internet cafe 10km from Sisaket in a village and she went to him asking if it were OK to do so and he answered it were fine with him as long as we were not open to late meaning until 21-22:00 were OK. My wife said that were the custom to check with him first but I don't know if he had any real say in the matter.

All the permits for the minimart (beer, lhao, cigarettes and so on) and the license for the internet cafe were handled at the Amphur office in Sisaket and they were the ones coming to inspect the internet shop.

[nellyp]

The Poo Yai baan in my wifes village went and obtained a loan with the village as collateral for 750,000 baht off the bank with no knowledge of the village. They are trying to get him removed now. he bought the post by bribing with his retirement money off the army. He had to leave the army as he had been selling meds on the black market, and was told to volanteer for retirement or get kicked out. When the village decided to remove him he threatened to have all the instigators murdered. This is not a nice guy. He had total control over what happened in the village through terror. In fact a lot of the things they give you permission for is only asked for as curtisy as they can have influene in other ways, particularily in smaller, poorer villages.

He is now trying to become head of the area (17 villages). Talking to the head of the local amphur, he says this is possible, but would cost him 50,000 baht a head to bribe the Poo Yai Baans. A lot of money but he would make a lot back, plus he feels that a lot would acept the bribe and not vote for him. This is politics in Thailand

[zzaa09]

The Poo Yai baan in my wifes village went and obtained a loan with the village as collateral for 750,000 baht off the bank with no knowledge of the village. They are trying to get him removed now. he bought the post by bribing with his retirement money off the army. He had to leave the army as he had been selling meds on the black market, and was told to volanteer for retirement or get kicked out. When the village decided to remove him he threatened to have all the instigators murdered. This is not a nice guy. He had total control over what happened in the village through terror. In fact a lot of the things they give you permission for is only asked for as curtisy as they can have influene in other ways, particularily in smaller, poorer villages.

He is now trying to become head of the area (17 villages). Talking to the head of the local amphur, he says this is possible, but would cost him 50,000 baht a head to bribe the Poo Yai Baans. A lot of money but he would make a lot back, plus he feels that a lot would acept the bribe and not vote for him. This is politics in Thailand

Political, perhaps. These traditional social and familial extensions are still quite evident throughout rural and small-town society.

[micksterbs]

What is a village leader?

Someone who loves the sound of his own voice.

And fervently believes that everyone else does, too...

So far you haven't narrowed the field one iota.

True, but then I wasn't really attempting to. Just a little bit of levity...

[selftaopath]

What is a village leader?

Someone who loves the sound of his own voice.

And fervently believes that everyone else does, too...

Amen to that. And he - typically he - is not the brightest either. Some of the "decrees" set down in this village make little or no sense (logic) but...... TIT and yea lets all wait for the "if you don't like it bla bla bla " bragade.

And from what I've seen he is not always democratically elected. Here in Nong Sang the previous election where the standing "chief" was apposed resulted in the chief telling the opposition "you lost" but refused to show evidence of such loss. LOLOLLOOLL Amusing Thailand.

[citizen33]

Had to edit a report which contained some information on this recently, and am summarising some vaguely relevant bits – though I think the anecdotes in the posts above are broadly on the right lines. Thailand has quite a complicated local government structure below the provinces which includes municipalities (tesaban), sanitation districts (sukhaphiban), districts (amphur), subdistricts (tambon), and villages (mooban).

At the bottom end that we are discussing are the tambon and the mooban. A tambon consists of a number of villages (average about 9), whose residents elect a headman (kamnan) from among the village headmen (phuyaiban). The kamnan is not a local government official as such, but he is confirmed in office by the provincial governor and receives a monthly stipend. The kamnan records statistics, helps the district (amphur) officer collect taxes, supervises the work of village headmen, and submits periodic reports to the district officer.

Each village (mooban) elects a headman, who generally functions as a middleman between villagers and the district administration. Again he receives a monthly stipend. The phuyaiban's duties included attending meetings at the district headquarters, keeping village records, arbitrating minor civil disputes, and serving as village peace officer. Generally the headman serves five years or so.

There is some controversy about whether the power of these local headmen is diminishing. In the 1980s, the importance of the pooyaiban seemed to be declining as the authority of the central government expanded steadily through the provincial and local administrations. Since then the CEO approach of the Thaksin era and the gradual implementation of aspects of the Decentralisation Act have probably pulled in opposite directions. The CEO phenomenon tended to strengthen top-down control, while the Decentralisation Act is opening up some new areas of local government influence, with developments like community health funds and tambon health promotion hospitals. The phuyaiban have some clout in local communities, but they may be over-ruled by centrally-appointed district officers and the tambon administrative organizations. There is also the cross-cutting influence of certain local families and strong men who reportedly have a lot of power in Isaan.

Don't know if our on-the-ground reporters can correct any mistakes in this.

Edited April 25, 2011 by citizen33

[zzaa09]

What is a village leader?

Someone who loves the sound of his own voice.

And fervently believes that everyone else does, too...

Amen to that. And he - typically he - is not the brightest either. Some of the "decrees" set down in this village make little or no sense (logic) but...... TIT and yea lets all wait for the "if you don't like it bla bla bla " bragade.

And from what I've seen he is not always democratically elected. Here in Nong Sang the previous election where the standing "chief" was apposed resulted in the chief telling the opposition "you lost" but refused to show evidence of such loss. LOLOLLOOLL Amusing Thailand.

Noticing.....you're quite consistently negative and full of angst. Why is this?

[glomp]

The mooban headsman also has to deal with a lot of shit. Disputes or when the coppers come looking for people they go to him/her. When some dope hangs himself in a tree in the middle of the village guess who has to take care of the shit storm and arrange for banishing of evil spirits. Those temples don't run themselves too and they take care of the "lost people", in "my village" for example there is a man who got a brick in his head while working, he lost his mind and now only the temple and monks "care" for him.

He gets some monk donated food and he gets to sleep under a roof in the temple. All this is arranged by the head monk and mooban leader. Im not saying they are all good but not all of them are scum and do nothing to help people.

[prakhonchai nick]

I think they are past their sell by date. Villagers, if they had any sense, would realise that they need to go to the amphur to deal with any local problems. The puyai baan merely does things on their behalf, for which he is "rewarded"

In my village, apart from spouting over the loudspeakers every morning, he frequently negotiates on behalf of villagers with the motorbike shops when they need a new bike on finance. A nice little earner!

[prakhonchai nick]

I think they are past their sell by date. Villagers, if they had any sense, would realise that they need to go to the amphur to deal with any local problems. The puyai baan merely does things on their behalf, for which he is "rewarded"

In my village, apart from spouting over the loudspeakers every morning, he frequently negotiates on behalf of villagers with the motorbike shops when they need a new bike on finance. A nice little earner!

[zzaa09]

I think they are past their sell by date. Villagers, if they had any sense, would realise that they need to go to the amphur to deal with any local problems. The puyai baan merely does things on their behalf, for which he is "rewarded"

In my village, apart from spouting over the loudspeakers every morning, he frequently negotiates on behalf of villagers with the motorbike shops when they need a new bike on finance. A nice little earner!

Nicky! Nice to see you around, mate! Hope you're well! Cheers!

[swissie]

This is "hearsay": When Thai-Wife and Farang husband have a good rapport with the village-chief, this may have a positive effect as far as the "O-Visa-Situation" of the farang is concerned.

= The 400'000 Bht requirement is not written in stone anymore (it can be a little less), or/and the 90 day reporting can be done by the village-chief by making a short phone call (?!)

As far as these things are concerned, it's hard to seperate fact from fiction and "hearsay". But still, anyone out there that can shed some light on this?

Cheers.

[SanukJoeII]

I'm living in a small rural Isan village (300 people) and I can only say the Phu Yai Ban is a valuable part of the village life.

He is not an old man as OP stated, end 40, voted into his job in an official election directed by Amphur officials and even a police officer was present.

Not that is was all regular, one could see one of the three candidates' helper handing out 100 baht for a vote, after the election those who surely voted on the winner got a kilo of beef.

So far Isan elections. But at least it was officially counted and every vote paper was shown to the public, no cheating there.

Yes it has cost him money and he was urged to pay back, but look at the guy and you give him credit.

He manages a lot in favour of the village, he cools down disputes, he helps with documentation or testimonies at the amphur office, he is always willing to accompany someone to the amphur or to the Government Bank or even Farmers Bank. He arranges transport (we have only 3 cars in the village, and 5 farmer trucks) for those people without transport.

In the morning he starts the day with during a short period of time terrible music (I managed to have him change it, costs 50 baht Lao khao) and not only says good morning and what day it is, but announces things like a doctor being in the tambon village for older people or things like that.

In the evening he plays some music again and ends the day. Nice, just nice.

He is a nice guy, he does his job well, no problem.

Joe

[mario299]

I'm living in a small rural Isan village (300 people) and I can only say the Phu Yai Ban is a valuable part of the village life.

He is not an old man as OP stated, end 40, voted into his job in an official election directed by Amphur officials and even a police officer was present.

Not that is was all regular, one could see one of the three candidates' helper handing out 100 baht for a vote, after the election those who surely voted on the winner got a kilo of beef.

So far Isan elections. But at least it was officially counted and every vote paper was shown to the public, no cheating there.

Yes it has cost him money and he was urged to pay back, but look at the guy and you give him credit.

He manages a lot in favour of the village, he cools down disputes, he helps with documentation or testimonies at the amphur office, he is always willing to accompany someone to the amphur or to the Government Bank or even Farmers Bank. He arranges transport (we have only 3 cars in the village, and 5 farmer trucks) for those people without transport.

In the morning he starts the day with during a short period of time terrible music (I managed to have him change it, costs 50 baht Lao khao) and not only says good morning and what day it is, but announces things like a doctor being in the tambon village for older people or things like that.

In the evening he plays some music again and ends the day. Nice, just nice.

He is a nice guy, he does his job well, no problem.

Joe

Our village chief must be the twin brother of yours, pretty much exactly the same situation in our village, except we don't get the music and announcements every day, but almost. I like him, and the job he does.

mario299