Snoh Confirms Move To Pheu Thai

[termad]

Yoko Ono and Frank Zappa share the stage for a song called "Scumbag".

If I recall correctly Snoh - Scumbag - is a former party chairman of Thai Lak Thai. The fact that Snoh and three of the eight other opposition Phracharaj MPs are following him suggests that Pheu Thai are going to contest the election to the line.

Snoh's no fool as much as I dislike him. (A slippery snake riding a bicycle.) He has a good nose for money. A pre-election pay off from Thaksin or post election spoils? That's the question. I would suggest the latter.

Little doubt BOTH.

This has been shopping season for the king maker parties.

So, do they make a deal later than could be broken in a coalition that might not happen, or sell out early, get some cash now, and a more insider position in a more likely sure thing?

Just like the last time Thaksin said he has SAID he won a majority. He pre-purchased other parties to pre-build a non-coalition appearing behemoth.Which not coincidentally only lasted as long as he was on top and divvying trough time.

It is nothing more than the little parties selling out their leadership rights to Thaksin as long he is in charge. It is not democracy, but pure money politics corruption that will build Thaksins house this time, like in 2001 and 2005.

He failed to throw enough money at it in 2007... I doubt he will make the same mistake now, but still these king makers have to deliver, in spite of most Thais seeing the Red Shirt destruction for what it was, an attempted coup that failed.

Again more confirmation that there's going to be a coup. As you so rightly say - Thaksin means business this time around.

I was talking about the last 2 Songkran riot situations, both clearly meant as coups, but both grandly miscalculated. It isn't 100% that a coup is done by a standing army, it can come from any source mother than an external army.

It is simply using any means to remove the head of government to install your own.

Could you clarify how you overthrow a government without military support or the tacit approval of the military?

[animatic]

Termad I agree on the irony of Chai Chidchobs comment.

Roll eyes more than split sides.

I will simply note that Newin is not convicted of abuse of power, though often accused. They may get him some day, but not so far.

Thaksin is convicted and on the run. A criminal offense but done while IN political office. A bit of a difference. Banned isn't criminal, it is a political punishment.

But Newin keeps a low profile in general and Thaksin must be SEEN as The General. A need to be admired that has been he downfall in the past, and likely again in the future.

I also note that Newin was essentially dissed in favor of Chalerm at that Hong Kong dinner where Thaksin and Potjamin announced the divorce, and I seemed pretty clear Newin was looking for a better deal from then on. And a bit of revenge no doubt. The satisfaction of getting back at Thaksin would have lowered the asking price some.

Do we know for a fact who paid what for the change of allegiances then, no. But it was clear he was ready to spurn Thaksins offer for The Dems or their backers offer. It was an even playing field as far as putting a new government together, Thaksin just didn't play it as well.

Edited May 14, 2011 by animatic

[Siripon]

[

Could you clarify how you overthrow a government without military support or the tacit approval of the military?

Termad,you don't know too much about Thai history do you?

1973 and 1992.

[animatic]

'bulmercke' timestamp='1305374637' post='4423823']Yoko Ono and Frank Zappa share the stage for a song called "Scumbag".

If I recall correctly Snoh - Scumbag - is a former party chairman of Thai Lak Thai. The fact that Snoh and three of the eight other opposition Phracharaj MPs are following him suggests that Pheu Thai are going to contest the election to the line.

Snoh's no fool as much as I dislike him. (A slippery snake riding a bicycle.) He has a good nose for money. A pre-election pay off from Thaksin or post election spoils? That's the question. I would suggest the latter.

Little doubt BOTH.

This has been shopping season for the king maker parties.

So, do they make a deal later than could be broken in a coalition that might not happen, or sell out early, get some cash now, and a more insider position in a more likely sure thing?

Just like the last time Thaksin said he has SAID he won a majority. He pre-purchased other parties to pre-build a non-coalition appearing behemoth.Which not coincidentally only lasted as long as he was on top and divvying trough time.

It is nothing more than the little parties selling out their leadership rights to Thaksin as long he is in charge. It is not democracy, but pure money politics corruption that will build Thaksins house this time, like in 2001 and 2005.

He failed to throw enough money at it in 2007... I doubt he will make the same mistake now, but still these king makers have to deliver, in spite of most Thais seeing the Red Shirt destruction for what it was, an attempted coup that failed.

Again more confirmation that there's going to be a coup. As you so rightly say - Thaksin means business this time around.

I was talking about the last 2 Songkran riot situations, both clearly meant as coups, but both grandly miscalculated. It isn't 100% that a coup is done by a standing army, it can come from any source mother than an external army.

It is simply using any means to remove the head of government to install your own.

Could you clarify how you overthrow a government without military support or the tacit approval of the military?

By marginalizing the army in the eyes of the masses via setups of atrocities, confusion, misinformation, psychological warfare. A scenario they are STILL trying to use to their advantage. A small scale revolution of perception and fear that causes a vacuum at the top to be exploited. It only needed to make the government and military leadership to fall to bring it off. Head off hydra and push your own pieces into place.

"We know that second terms have historically been marred by hubris and by scandal."

David R. Gergin

Sadly, I suspect Thaksins desire for revenge at his loss of face at being shown the door as caretaker PM, is aimed higher still. '

But,

Pride goeth before destruction,

and an haughty spirit before a fall.

Elba now and when St. Helena?

Edited May 14, 2011 by animatic

[Siripon]

Regarding John Lennon, I remember he wrote a song called ' Give Peace A Chance' and 'Imagine', I don't think he was on the side of violence at all.

As for the switch of Sanoh and his sons- this is a man who vehemently oposed the 1996 'green' constitution for imposing checks and balances on politicians- and Yoko Ono supports him!

Edited May 14, 2011 by Siripon

[termad]

[agree and in fact, based on recent newspaper articles and comments, so does Khun Abhisit. He now apparently realises that this election is his last and only chance to legitimise his regime which was established in an army barracks after the Military and Amataya bought the leader of the Friends of Newin, Newin Chitbob (a banned politician described by the BBC as a Notorious Thai politician)and his forty followers in order to install Khun Abhisit as PM. Newin Chitbob's abandonment of the PPP voters who elected his forty Friends of Newin was as you say Thai politics at its worst and most corrupt - especially as the sole reason for doing so was a huge sum of Amataya and Military money.

I'm also sure that you must have split your sides laughing, as I did, when you read in the other newspaper that Tai Chitbob (the 84 year father of Newin Chitbob)who was installed as speaker of the lower house as part of the same Abhisit/Amataya/Military deal recently announced that Phue Thai should be disbanded because of its allegience to Thaksin Shinawatra who is a banned politician.

The one thing that I don't understand is your reference to Thaksin Shinawatra as an usurper as although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)he was overthrown by a military coup (supported by Abhisit a fact which when freedom of the press is again allowed after the next election will also be proven.

In the last election Pheua Thai attained 36.3% of the Constituency vote ( Democrats 30.30%), (Party List 39.60%, Democrats 39.63%). That is not an majority of the electorate.

Termad-Who bought NAP wholesale beacause Chavalit had run out of money to support his 80 MPs? Thaksin.

Who said,' Democracy is not my goal'. and is about to appoint his totally inexperienced sister to be leader of a party where no one else has a say in who runs it?!

Pheua Maeow a total joke.

Are you including the Friends of Newin in your figures?

As far as I'm aware there are many in Phue Thai who support her adoption as prospective PM and many who don't it's for the Phue Thai party to decide - whether because they think she could do a good job or simply because she's the sister of Thaksin Shinawatra if the electorate of Thailand don't approve she will (if adopted) lose the election. It's called democracy. As for being totally inexperienced I don't think that she is (she has been running the Phue Thai party and they aren't doing so badly are they?)

There are cases of inexperienced people being placed in jobs which they subsequently have shown they were totally unsuited for. Take for example Abhisit Jevajjiva he was born into an exceedingly rich family and given an exceedingly expensive education after which he did nothing until he arrived in Thailand, joined the Democrat Party and because of the class orientation of that party became a Democrat MP. Isn't that a story almost identical to that of the sons of the very rich in the not too distant past of British history. Look at the state of Thailand now and compare it to the pre Abhisit democratic Thailand and try to convince me or anybody else that the country is now a better place. You won't be able to and that is why Abhisit will lose the election and subsequently be asked to answer for many things that happened under his military backed rule.

[animatic]

As for being totally inexperienced I don't think that she is (she has been running the Phue Thai party and they aren't doing so badly are they?)

Agree she has be doing a lot of back room things.

She has political wheeling and dealing and message delivery experience. But the perception is she has been herding kittens for her big bro.

That PTP would be doing at all well, and that she would have her position without all of them desperate for a share of her big brothers cash flow is a non starter.

Edited May 14, 2011 by animatic

[Buchholz]

^^ Funny how Abhisit achieved more in his first month in office than the 2 proxy PM's did before him in a year.

and oh, btw, those in the PTP opposing Yingluck are few, compared to her supporters, and rather noticeably non-vocal about it. eg. Mingkwan thought of dropping out of PTP, but being Milktoast Mingkwan, he thought better of it and signed back up.

We all eagerly await Yingluck's asset declarations. It'll be a hoot. How long before it's shown to be false?

.

Edited May 14, 2011 by Buchholz

[aaacorp]

The budget for the army has double with the Democrats, any coincidence ?

Would you happen to have any reference you can cite for that claim?

just google

Edited May 14, 2011 by aaacorp

[termad]

Could you clarify how you overthrow a government without military support or the tacit approval of the military?

Termad,you don't know too much about Thai history do you?

1973 and 1992.

Explain.

[termad]

As for being totally inexperienced I don't think that she is (she has been running the Phue Thai party and they aren't doing so badly are they?)

Agree she has be doing a lot of back room things.

She has political wheeling and dealing and message delivery experience. But the perception is she has been herding kittens for her big bro.

That PTP would be doing at all well, and that she would have her position without all of them desperate for a share of her big brothers cash flow is a non starter.

Total ill informed nonsense

[termad]

Buying up party leaders to make them faction leaders just before the election. Thai politics at it's worst and most corrupt. It says he is 'abandoning his own party' to accept a guarantee post in PTP, which no doubt guaranteed a certain amount of profit.

Feudalism was always controlled by money, and patronage, this is just feudalism being funneled through the APPEARANCE of a Democratic election, which makes it easier to lead the slowly awakening masses onward down the profitable path of New Feudalism.

The Liege Lord speaks and his vassals do.

Same as it always has been, except in this case a usurper attempts to return... Bonnie Prince Thaksin soon to hit the beaches and gin up a battle for supremacy.

I agree and in fact, based on recent newspaper articles and comments, so does Khun Abhisit. He now apparently realises that this election is his last and only chance to legitimise his regime which was established in an army barracks after the Military and Amataya bought the leader of the Friends of Newin, Newin Chitbob (a banned politician described by the BBC as a Notorious Thai politician) and his forty followers in order to install Khun Abhisit as PM. Newin Chitbob's abandonment of the PPP voters who elected his forty Friends of Newin was, as you say, Thai politics at its worst and most corrupt - especially as the sole reason for doing so was a huge sum of Amataya and Military money.

I'm also sure that you must have split your sides laughing, as I did, when you read in the other newspaper that Tai Chitbob (the 84 year father of Newin Chitbob) who was installed as speaker of the lower house as part of the same Abhisit/Amataya/Military deal recently announced that Phue Thai should be disbanded because of its allegience to Thaksin Shinawatra who is a banned politician.

The one thing that I don't understand is your reference to Thaksin Shinawatra as an usurper as although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)he was overthrown by a military coup (supported by Abhisit a fact which when freedom of the press is again allowed after the next election will also be proven.

But if you want to speak of corruption I really do think that you should have mentioned the corruption in the Abhisit government which I think few can deny has been one of the most corrupt Thai governments on record. The reason for that being that the coalition parties realised from the word go that they could do whatever they wanted because the installed PM would put up with anything as long as it meant that he could continue on as PM. So much for the Eton and Oxford man's code of ethics which I'm sure you agree wouldn't even be tolerated by an Appalation small town council.

QUOTE:"....although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)"

termad - apologies for repeatedly banging the same drum - but I doubt it'll get to that stage. Coup.

The difference this time is a coup would be opposed not just by the Thai people but also international opinion. Also, remember that the North and the North East is the Thai Military's biggest recruiting ground. Would those conscripts march North or South?

[Buchholz]

The budget for the army has double with the Democrats, any coincidence ?

Would you happen to have any reference you can cite for that claim?

just google

I'll just wait for JurgenG to google his claim and come back to us with it.

He's the one that made it.

.

[powderpuff]

I am waiting for Chalerm Yoobumrung to join the gangsters party. Get Barnharn & Chavilit & it'll be old home week. Yes the old boars will be feeding at the trough.

The next military coup, if Mr Taksin is here; will mean a bullet in the head for him. Problem solved.

[Old Man River]

We all eagerly await Yingluck's asset declarations. It'll be a hoot. How long before it's shown to be false?

.

You can be sure that Korn et. al. will be watching very closely for any "Ample Rich" type structures.

[bulmercke]

Termad I agree on the irony of Chai Chidchobs comment.

Roll eyes more than split sides.

I will simply note that Newin is not convicted of abuse of power, though often accused. They may get him some day, but not so far.

Thaksin is convicted and on the run. A criminal offense but done while IN political office. A bit of a difference. Banned isn't criminal, it is a political punishment.

But Newin keeps a low profile in general and Thaksin must be SEEN as The General. A need to be admired that has been he downfall in the past, and likely again in the future.

I also note that Newin was essentially dissed in favor of Chalerm at that Hong Kong dinner where Thaksin and Potjamin announced the divorce, and I seemed pretty clear Newin was looking for a better deal from then on. And a bit of revenge no doubt. The satisfaction of getting back at Thaksin would have lowered the asking price some.

Do we know for a fact who paid what for the change of allegiances then, no. But it was clear he was ready to spurn Thaksins offer for The Dems or their backers offer. It was an even playing field as far as putting a new government together, Thaksin just didn't play it as well.

Spot-on. I pity newbees here attempting to grapple with the complexities and intricasies of Thai politics.

Newin. Keep your eye on him. A major power player in the formation of the next government. That's for sure. A shrewd and calculating operator.

[Siripon]

Could you clarify how you overthrow a government without military support or the tacit approval of the military?

Termad,you don't know too much about Thai history do you?

1973 and 1992.

Explain.

Surely you know what happened to the governments of Thanom and Sujinda? You must know, right?

[bulmercke]

Buying up party leaders to make them faction leaders just before the election. Thai politics at it's worst and most corrupt. It says he is 'abandoning his own party' to accept a guarantee post in PTP, which no doubt guaranteed a certain amount of profit.

Feudalism was always controlled by money, and patronage, this is just feudalism being funneled through the APPEARANCE of a Democratic election, which makes it easier to lead the slowly awakening masses onward down the profitable path of New Feudalism.

The Liege Lord speaks and his vassals do.

Same as it always has been, except in this case a usurper attempts to return... Bonnie Prince Thaksin soon to hit the beaches and gin up a battle for supremacy.

I agree and in fact, based on recent newspaper articles and comments, so does Khun Abhisit. He now apparently realises that this election is his last and only chance to legitimise his regime which was established in an army barracks after the Military and Amataya bought the leader of the Friends of Newin, Newin Chitbob (a banned politician described by the BBC as a Notorious Thai politician) and his forty followers in order to install Khun Abhisit as PM. Newin Chitbob's abandonment of the PPP voters who elected his forty Friends of Newin was, as you say, Thai politics at its worst and most corrupt - especially as the sole reason for doing so was a huge sum of Amataya and Military money.

I'm also sure that you must have split your sides laughing, as I did, when you read in the other newspaper that Tai Chitbob (the 84 year father of Newin Chitbob) who was installed as speaker of the lower house as part of the same Abhisit/Amataya/Military deal recently announced that Phue Thai should be disbanded because of its allegience to Thaksin Shinawatra who is a banned politician.

The one thing that I don't understand is your reference to Thaksin Shinawatra as an usurper as although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)he was overthrown by a military coup (supported by Abhisit a fact which when freedom of the press is again allowed after the next election will also be proven.

But if you want to speak of corruption I really do think that you should have mentioned the corruption in the Abhisit government which I think few can deny has been one of the most corrupt Thai governments on record. The reason for that being that the coalition parties realised from the word go that they could do whatever they wanted because the installed PM would put up with anything as long as it meant that he could continue on as PM. So much for the Eton and Oxford man's code of ethics which I'm sure you agree wouldn't even be tolerated by an Appalation small town council.

QUOTE:"....although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)"

termad - apologies for repeatedly banging the same drum - but I doubt it'll get to that stage. Coup.

The difference this time is a coup would be opposed not just by the Thai people but also international opinion. Also, remember that the North and the North East is the Thai Military's biggest recruiting ground. Would those conscripts march North or South?

A post election coup when the judiciary get mired and bogged-down in their attempts to subvert a Pheu Thai victory and PT led coalition lest it get to that stage.

[Siripon]

Buying up party leaders to make them faction leaders just before the election. Thai politics at it's worst and most corrupt. It says he is 'abandoning his own party' to accept a guarantee post in PTP, which no doubt guaranteed a certain amount of profit.

Feudalism was always controlled by money, and patronage, this is just feudalism being funneled through the APPEARANCE of a Democratic election, which makes it easier to lead the slowly awakening masses onward down the profitable path of New Feudalism.

The Liege Lord speaks and his vassals do.

Same as it always has been, except in this case a usurper attempts to return... Bonnie Prince Thaksin soon to hit the beaches and gin up a battle for supremacy.

I agree and in fact, based on recent newspaper articles and comments, so does Khun Abhisit. He now apparently realises that this election is his last and only chance to legitimise his regime which was established in an army barracks after the Military and Amataya bought the leader of the Friends of Newin, Newin Chitbob (a banned politician described by the BBC as a Notorious Thai politician) and his forty followers in order to install Khun Abhisit as PM. Newin Chitbob's abandonment of the PPP voters who elected his forty Friends of Newin was, as you say, Thai politics at its worst and most corrupt - especially as the sole reason for doing so was a huge sum of Amataya and Military money.

I'm also sure that you must have split your sides laughing, as I did, when you read in the other newspaper that Tai Chitbob (the 84 year father of Newin Chitbob) who was installed as speaker of the lower house as part of the same Abhisit/Amataya/Military deal recently announced that Phue Thai should be disbanded because of its allegience to Thaksin Shinawatra who is a banned politician.

The one thing that I don't understand is your reference to Thaksin Shinawatra as an usurper as although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)he was overthrown by a military coup (supported by Abhisit a fact which when freedom of the press is again allowed after the next election will also be proven.

But if you want to speak of corruption I really do think that you should have mentioned the corruption in the Abhisit government which I think few can deny has been one of the most corrupt Thai governments on record. The reason for that being that the coalition parties realised from the word go that they could do whatever they wanted because the installed PM would put up with anything as long as it meant that he could continue on as PM. So much for the Eton and Oxford man's code of ethics which I'm sure you agree wouldn't even be tolerated by an Appalation small town council.

QUOTE:"....although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)"

termad - apologies for repeatedly banging the same drum - but I doubt it'll get to that stage. Coup.

The difference this time is a coup would be opposed not just by the Thai people but also international opinion. Also, remember that the North and the North East is the Thai Military's biggest recruiting ground. Would those conscripts march North or South?

The only talk of a coup is coming from the fat man, who thankfully is now in jail, joining in the same successful diet programme as Victor Bout and Nattawut.

The last coup was welcomed by the middle class.

Jatupon claimed on stage last year that the rank and file soldiers, hailing from Issan and the North, would not follow orders to march against the red shirts.

As usual, he was wrong.

[metisdead]

Some nonsense posts and replies have been removed.

[Buchholz]

I am waiting for Chalerm Yoobumrung to join the gangsters party.

Chalerm is already back in after earlier resigning...

The top ten candidates in the Phue Thai list would include Chalerm Yoobamrung.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467059&view=findpost&p=4413820

and so is his son...

Pheu Thai Party yesterday unveiled General Chaiyasit Shinawatra, cousin of former premier Thaksin, as its MP candidate for Ratchaburi constituency 1.

In Bangkok, Deputy Spokesman Jirayu Huangsap introduced two new MP candidates for the capital: Wan Yoobamrung and Anuttama Amornwiwat. Wan is the son of veteran politician and former Pheu Thai MP Chalerm

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467059&view=findpost&p=4415448

Edited May 14, 2011 by Buchholz

[Buchholz]

We all eagerly await Yingluck's asset declarations. It'll be a hoot. How long before it's shown to be false?

.

You can be sure that Korn et. al. will be watching very closely for any "Ample Rich" type structures.

I wouldn't be surprised if they've already started one on their own... detailing her assets so as to compare it with the one she eventually comes up with.

It'll be interesting when for all those years when she wasn't in politics and acted as a conduit to all sorts of transactions, stock swapping, personal loans, and whatnot within and outside the clan.

The phrase, "put it in Yingluck's name because she doesn't have to file declarations", was a likely common refrain when not all that long ago the thought of her ever entering politics was never considered..

[bulmercke]

I am waiting for Chalerm Yoobumrung to join the gangsters party.

Chalerm is already back in after earlier resigning...

The top ten candidates in the Phue Thai list would include Chalerm Yoobamrung.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467059&view=findpost&p=4413820

and so is his son...

Pheu Thai Party yesterday unveiled General Chaiyasit Shinawatra, cousin of former premier Thaksin, as its MP candidate for Ratchaburi constituency 1.

In Bangkok, Deputy Spokesman Jirayu Huangsap introduced two new MP candidates for the capital: Wan Yoobamrung and Anuttama Amornwiwat. Wan is the son of veteran politician and former Pheu Thai MP Chalerm

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=467059&view=findpost&p=4415448

Oh for sure Chalerm is in big time. He's been positioning himself in the last six months or so. The Democrats are going to have one hell of a fight on their hands in the next month or so. And the military are worried.

[Buchholz]

For every old timer power-broker that PTP ropes in (Snoh), one drops out (Chavalit).

For any PTP not kow-towing to Thaksin's whims, they are shown the door.

Thaksin Banned Two Pheu Thai MPs

[Siripon]

[agree and in fact, based on recent newspaper articles and comments, so does Khun Abhisit. He now apparently realises that this election is his last and only chance to legitimise his regime which was established in an army barracks after the Military and Amataya bought the leader of the Friends of Newin, Newin Chitbob (a banned politician described by the BBC as a Notorious Thai politician)and his forty followers in order to install Khun Abhisit as PM. Newin Chitbob's abandonment of the PPP voters who elected his forty Friends of Newin was as you say Thai politics at its worst and most corrupt - especially as the sole reason for doing so was a huge sum of Amataya and Military money.

I'm also sure that you must have split your sides laughing, as I did, when you read in the other newspaper that Tai Chitbob (the 84 year father of Newin Chitbob)who was installed as speaker of the lower house as part of the same Abhisit/Amataya/Military deal recently announced that Phue Thai should be disbanded because of its allegience to Thaksin Shinawatra who is a banned politician.

The one thing that I don't understand is your reference to Thaksin Shinawatra as an usurper as although he has the support of the majority of the Thai electorate (soon to be proven)he was overthrown by a military coup (supported by Abhisit a fact which when freedom of the press is again allowed after the next election will also be proven.

In the last election Pheua Thai attained 36.3% of the Constituency vote ( Democrats 30.30%), (Party List 39.60%, Democrats 39.63%). That is not an majority of the electorate.

Termad-Who bought NAP wholesale beacause Chavalit had run out of money to support his 80 MPs? Thaksin.

Who said,' Democracy is not my goal'. and is about to appoint his totally inexperienced sister to be leader of a party where no one else has a say in who runs it?!

Pheua Maeow a total joke.

Are you including the Friends of Newin in your figures?

As far as I'm aware there are many in Phue Thai who support her adoption as prospective PM and many who don't it's for the Phue Thai party to decide - whether because they think she could do a good job or simply because she's the sister of Thaksin Shinawatra if the electorate of Thailand don't approve she will (if adopted) lose the election. It's called democracy. As for being totally inexperienced I don't think that she is (she has been running the Phue Thai party and they aren't doing so badly are they?)

There are cases of inexperienced people being placed in jobs which they subsequently have shown they were totally unsuited for. Take for example Abhisit Jevajjiva he was born into an exceedingly rich family and given an exceedingly expensive education after which he did nothing until he arrived in Thailand, joined the Democrat Party and because of the class orientation of that party became a Democrat MP. Isn't that a story almost identical to that of the sons of the very rich in the not too distant past of British history. Look at the state of Thailand now and compare it to the pre Abhisit democratic Thailand and try to convince me or anybody else that the country is now a better place. You won't be able to and that is why Abhisit will lose the election and subsequently be asked to answer for many things that happened under his military backed rule.

The figures I mention above include Newin's group in PPP before its dissolution.

Apisit became an MP when he was 27 and has a record of Parliamentary attendance that puts most MPs to shame.

Let's see Yinglak debate with him on TV regarding policies and their implementation, the Thai people have the right to know their prospective leaders insights and poitical strategies.

[rubl]

The figures I mention above include Newin's group in PPP before its dissolution.

Apisit became an MP when he was 27 and has a record of Parliamentary attendance that puts most MPs to shame.

Let's see Yinglak debate with him on TV regarding policies and their implementation, the Thai people have the right to know their prospective leaders insights and poitical strategies.

K. Siripon, the Thai people indeed have a right to know their prospective 'leaders', but a televised debate seems 'not the Thai way', at least at the moment. Maybe when the questions are forwarded to the candidates a few days before AND no other questions are allowed AND AND AND, maybe we could have such a Q&A. A real debate seems out of the question till Thai concepts evolve a bit more, IMHO

[Buchholz]

The figures I mention above include Newin's group in PPP before its dissolution.

Apisit became an MP when he was 27 and has a record of Parliamentary attendance that puts most MPs to shame.

Let's see Yinglak debate with him on TV regarding policies and their implementation, the Thai people have the right to know their prospective leaders insights and political strategies.

Agree whole-heartedly. It's time for debates. The ability to think and speak on your feet is a revealing trait. How one can organize their thoughts and enunciate what their opinions (and preferably without a Blackberry connection to Uganda in their ear) are important for the voters to see live in their homes.

The populace deserves no less in such a critical election.

People deserve to know what they're getting into devoid of prepared statements and orchestrated public appearances.

.

Edited May 14, 2011 by Buchholz

[Buchholz]

The figures I mention above include Newin's group in PPP before its dissolution.

Apisit became an MP when he was 27 and has a record of Parliamentary attendance that puts most MPs to shame.

Let's see Yinglak debate with him on TV regarding policies and their implementation, the Thai people have the right to know their prospective leaders insights and poitical strategies.

K. Siripon, the Thai people indeed have a right to know their prospective 'leaders', but a televised debate seems 'not the Thai way', at least at the moment. Maybe when the questions are forwarded to the candidates a few days before AND no other questions are allowed AND AND AND, maybe we could have such a Q&A. A real debate seems out of the question till Thai concepts evolve a bit more, IMHO

Time to join the 21st century.

Both contestants are overseas-educated and should be able to voice their Party's platform and positions on issues confronting Thailand today in front of all their constituents.

If Thailand can handle the televising of the Parliamentary debates, this is just a one-to-one version of that.

Who was that boxing referee who used to preface each match with, "Let's get it on!"

[geriatrickid]

The only talk of a coup is coming from the fat man, who thankfully is now in jail, joining in the same successful diet programme as Victor Bout and Nattawut.

The last coup was welcomed by the middle class.

Jatupon claimed on stage last year that the rank and file soldiers, hailing from Issan and the North, would not follow orders to march against the red shirts.

As usual, he was wrong.

Your statement overlooks several critical facts. Specifically;

1. The police had been unable to control the crowds. This may have been due to either an inadequcy and/or an unwillngess to engage the protestors.

2. Until May 14, regular army units had been deployed. There was a reluctance to move against the protestors. Actions consisted mostly of containment and "picking off" protestors when the opportunity arose. The commanders at the time were reported to have expressed a reluctance to take actions that would have caused large scale damage or injuries.

3. The turning point came when the 21st Infantry Regiment of the Royal Armament, aka the Queen's Guard, were deployed. At the same time, the 2nd Infantry Battalion of the 31stInfantry Regiment aka the Royal Guards were deployed. Army regulars were replaced at key contact points with Royal unit personnel.

4. On May 19, the red barricades were breached by a Royal Guards attack, and the end of the protests started, whileBangkok's commercial structures were set on fire.

I offer that until the regular army units and the police were replaced by the Royal units, no significant action was undertaken. The reluctance to act until that time may have been a reflection of the police regular army's reluctance to inflict fatalities and physical damage to Bangkok. Is it a coincidence that the police and army units personnel are drawn from the general population with a heavy weighting from the north and north east?

The term middle class is misused in Thailand. Supposedly the middle class occupies the space between the working class and the upper classes in Thailand. If one applies the conventional western parameters of the middle class; a good education, a professional or senior management position and home ownership, then yes the middle class might very well have been supporters of the military coup. On the other hand if one uses the definition that is typically used in Thailand and is best expressed by the Asian Development Bank, "people living on approximately US$2-20 per day as determining middle class status. For a family of two parents and two children, therefore, that would equate to a family income of around 7,200-72,000 baht per month. That would encompass the great majority of urban, salary-owning Thai citizens.", then the answer would be no, the middle class did not support a coup.

[sbk]

Posts quoting or discussing a deleted post removed, guys you do know better than that, and you also know to use the report button or PM a mod on duty. Do that next time, cheers.