Buyer Beware - The Retailers Are Out To Get You!

[Deeral]

As ever the Electronics retailers are continuing to indulge in dubious practices, misleading the public by incorrect advertising and pricing, price gouging and selling old models as current and operating CARTELS to fix retail prices.

Banana IT and their MAC shop Com.seven added 10% to some external HDDs in some of their shops.

They did not mark the price increase, but told you when you attempted to pay for the item.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami.

This does not ring true to me as the items are made in Thailand and I was attempting to buy old stock that was already in the shop BEFORE the Tsunami.

Furthermore this does not apply to all locations. In Pattaya for instance the identical item was REDUCED by 50 baht. And in a competitors shop the same item was on sale for 1000 baht less (25%).

I was further informed by a Com.Seven product manager that the other shops had also raised their prices.

As I pointed out in Pattaya this was NOT the case, however in some centres (e.g. Sri Racha) this was partially true - all retailers appeared to be acting in unison - although some had not raised their prices quite so much.

Far from indicating to me that this was the result of higher component prices (how does this apply retrospectively to OLD STOCK anyway?) it seems more likely that this was the result of retail price rigging by a CARTEL or agreement between “competitors”; retail price-fixing.

Whatever the case it looks as if led by Banana IT and Com.Seven the public are being duped into paying higher prices for no real reason.

I notice now that the same item is retailed at 4250 baht - this represents an increase of over 15% on the retail price in about 6 weeks.

even if the price of components supplied by Japan has risen I doubt if this would lead to such an increase at the retail end without the covert agreement of both suppliers and retailers to the obvious disadvantage of the customer.

Powerbuy - already noted for offering “copied” OS systems on their new laptops again are pursuing some pretty dubious sales techniques. In their hi-fi section they are offering “bundles” of speaker/amp hi-fi systems claiming massive reduction from the original retail price. THey can’t however supply any evidence that these goods were ever offered at the claimed higher price. furthermore the goods are displayed in such a way that it is not clear what goods exactly are included in the bundle. THe sets are often nixed in with other speakers and amps so that it is very difficult to ascertain what exactly IS or ISN”T included. a smal photo is usually placed on the back of the price label to illustrate. however the photo and or the display can actually be incorrect.

For example - I inspected two such “sets” and was shown by the sales assistant several times which items were included in each set - he did this by touching each item in the bundle in turn. One set in particular seemed OK so I returned with a friend who is a bit of a hi-fi buff to get his opinion before buying anything. It was then that I noticed the itms touched by the sales assistant did not correspond with the items in the photo. It then turns out if I had agreed to buy, I would have been supplied with a different amp/tuner from the one on display and if I’d wanted that one it would have cost an extra 20000 baht.

Two concerns emerge here one is obvious;y that the goods are deliberately displayed in a manner to kid the customer into believing that the deal is better than it really is.

And secondly - the staff are often grossly undertrained in the products they are expected to sell. Presumably the company is hoping that the combined ignorance of the salesman and customer will lead to a sale and no-one will notice that a cheaper item has in fact been substituted.

I might add that when I first looked at the system I was served by a senior salesman who seemed to know his stuff, on returning with my “expert” the senior salesman “disappeared” leaving me with a young man who clearly didn’t know his stuff. I think this was largely because the senior member of staff realised we might spot the inconsistency in the displayed items.

Finally a point about the latest ipad and ACER Iconia.

many shops appear to be displaying these items. I’m beginning to wonder where they come from.

Released elsewhere, are they “officially” released here or are they “grey” imports.

The reason I ask is that they seem to be not only in vey short supply, but the model range is incomplete and accessories are almost completely unavailable.

Com.seven in Pattaya (Central) had a sign saying they’s sold out - but how many did they actually have - and as for the range, as far as I could make out they only had the 16GB basic model. I asked about the 3G and the salesman laughed and said it would not be stocked. I’m beginning to wonder if Com SEven are in fact a recognised Mac dealer at all.

They frequently display old or obsolete stock without any indication that it is a superseded model and cannot supply new items as quickly as the THailand Apple WebSite which is in Singapore!

In conclusion - I would urge anyone thinking of buying anything in Thailand especially electrical goods to be very careful. If you live here you will at some point have no choice - if a visitor - get your stuff elsewhere.

Retail practices in Thailand are archaic - the vendor can sell without responsibility or fear of redress, unlike many countries in Thailand the customer NEVER comes first.

Furthermore - retail price maintenance and CARTELS are the rule - discounts are fixed between the suppliers and retailers in joint action, the customer will seldom benefit from a genuine bargain in Thailand.

Never mind “caveat emptor”

Let’s have a bit of “caveat venditor” and “emptor primus est” instead!

[Soutpeel]

Feel better now ?....

[manarak]

a lot of bla bla...

prices of electronics are going up and down (in a general downtrend), mostly because of stock levels and projected production figures.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami.

This does not ring true to me as the items are made in Thailand and I was attempting to buy old stock that was already in the shop BEFORE the Tsunami.

He may have given a bullshit explanation, but your point of view does not make any sense either.

If price for HDD has increased, why should the shop sell under market price? The time and price of purchase of their stock doesn't make a difference.

[ukrules]

The Acer Iconica range of products are officially released here, I picked up an Android a500 Tablet a couple of weeks back in Fortune IT Mall, Bangkok from the Data IT store. The a500 tablets are selling for around 19-20,000 Baht. The official retail price in the UK is nearer 25,000 Baht. This is the first time I've purchased anything in Bangkok and actually saved money over the UK price.

The prices are pretty much fixed everywhere based on manufacturers recommended retail prices from what I understand although you can get things slightly cheaper by shopping around if you really want to save a few Baht. However if you don't stick to the larger more established stores you never know what you're actually buying.

This is one of the reasons I generally buy my household electrical items from the Emporium and the computer goods from Fortune IT Mall.

I purchased a reasonably big screen (42") TV, washing machine and a clothes dryer over the last few months and got them all from the 'Power Mall' at Emporium, in Bangkok. They stick to the agreed delivery times, unpack, install and plumb (if required) every item when it's delivered and are reliable. I told the guy I wanted the TV as soon as possible, this was at 6pm one evening when I made the purchase, it was delivered and installed at 8:30 that same night, pretty good service.

In my experience the prices on display are almost never the true prices that you would expect to pay, there are always discounts on larger more expensive items.

It's well known that Apple products were available before the official release dates at a premium price as they're grey imports, I would avoid these wherever possible. In fact I wouldn't buy any Apple product anyway.

Edited May 19, 2011 by ukrules

[Deeral]

a lot of bla bla...

prices of electronics are going up and down (in a general downtrend), mostly because of stock levels and projected production figures.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami.

This does not ring true to me as the items are made in Thailand and I was attempting to buy old stock that was already in the shop BEFORE the Tsunami.

He may have given a bullshit explanation, but your point of view does not make any sense either.

If price for HDD has increased, why should the shop sell under market price? The time and price of purchase of their stock doesn't make a difference.

As I said - it ISN"T the market price - the prices are manipulated IMO by the suppliers and retailers. THis practice is illegal in Europe and a lot of time is spent ensuring that it eitherdoesn't happen or the retailers are forced to compensate the people they have overcharged.

Also these items are sold at less cost in other countries where they aren't even manufactured!.THe price of electrical goods in particular seldom rises - there is in fact a gradual decrease in price as a cursory comparison between goods now and one year ago will bear out.

Edited May 19, 2011 by Deeral

[JurgenG]

I bought a 32 GB USB2.0 in IT mail 2 weeks ago, there was around 1,000 Bahts difference between the most expensive and the cheapest shop. I also bought some other other stuff for my Mac in the Banana shop and I was able to negotiate a 10% discount to their price on the label.

Right, the retailers are out to make money. It's just up to you to shop around and try to get the best price

[RedFxTrade]

I bought a 32 GB USB2.0 in IT mail 2 weeks ago, there was around 1,000 Bahts difference between the most expensive and the cheapest shop. I also bought some other other stuff for my Mac in the Banana shop and I was able to negotiate a 10% discount to their price on the label.

Right, the retailers are out to make money. It's just up to you to shop around and try to get the best price

History has shown that cartels in a free market always fail because you get someone coming in who realises they can undercut the cartel. It is usually government intervention and bodies that create or allow cartels to thrive, things like the EU CAP, Interstate Commerce Commission in the US, the Federal Farm Board in the US, the FED Reserve and the banking industry enabled cartels, thats why they came into existence in the first place.To grant special priviledges to its members, price fixing, high costs to entry, wage fixing etc etc. So your right that if you shop around you will always be able to get it cheaper. Thats been one reason the internet has brought prices down of many goods due to the fact that governments cannot control tariffs, sales taxes, import and customs across borders.

Edited May 19, 2011 by RedFxTrade

[happyrobert]

As ever the Electronics retailers are continuing to indulge in dubious practices, misleading the public by incorrect advertising and pricing, price gouging and selling old models as current and operating CARTELS to fix retail prices.

Banana IT and their MAC shop Com.seven added 10% to some external HDDs in some of their shops.

They did not mark the price increase, but told you when you attempted to pay for the item.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami.

This does not ring true to me as the items are made in Thailand and I was attempting to buy old stock that was already in the shop BEFORE the Tsunami.

Furthermore this does not apply to all locations. In Pattaya for instance the identical item was REDUCED by 50 baht. And in a competitors shop the same item was on sale for 1000 baht less (25%).

I was further informed by a Com.Seven product manager that the other shops had also raised their prices.

As I pointed out in Pattaya this was NOT the case, however in some centres (e.g. Sri Racha) this was partially true - all retailers appeared to be acting in unison - although some had not raised their prices quite so much.

Far from indicating to me that this was the result of higher component prices (how does this apply retrospectively to OLD STOCK anyway?) it seems more likely that this was the result of retail price rigging by a CARTEL or agreement between "competitors"; retail price-fixing.

Whatever the case it looks as if led by Banana IT and Com.Seven the public are being duped into paying higher prices for no real reason.

I notice now that the same item is retailed at 4250 baht - this represents an increase of over 15% on the retail price in about 6 weeks.

even if the price of components supplied by Japan has risen I doubt if this would lead to such an increase at the retail end without the covert agreement of both suppliers and retailers to the obvious disadvantage of the customer.

Powerbuy - already noted for offering "copied" OS systems on their new laptops again are pursuing some pretty dubious sales techniques. In their hi-fi section they are offering "bundles" of speaker/amp hi-fi systems claiming massive reduction from the original retail price. THey can't however supply any evidence that these goods were ever offered at the claimed higher price. furthermore the goods are displayed in such a way that it is not clear what goods exactly are included in the bundle. THe sets are often nixed in with other speakers and amps so that it is very difficult to ascertain what exactly IS or ISN"T included. a smal photo is usually placed on the back of the price label to illustrate. however the photo and or the display can actually be incorrect.

For example - I inspected two such "sets" and was shown by the sales assistant several times which items were included in each set - he did this by touching each item in the bundle in turn. One set in particular seemed OK so I returned with a friend who is a bit of a hi-fi buff to get his opinion before buying anything. It was then that I noticed the itms touched by the sales assistant did not correspond with the items in the photo. It then turns out if I had agreed to buy, I would have been supplied with a different amp/tuner from the one on display and if I'd wanted that one it would have cost an extra 20000 baht.

Two concerns emerge here one is obvious;y that the goods are deliberately displayed in a manner to kid the customer into believing that the deal is better than it really is.

And secondly - the staff are often grossly undertrained in the products they are expected to sell. Presumably the company is hoping that the combined ignorance of the salesman and customer will lead to a sale and no-one will notice that a cheaper item has in fact been substituted.

I might add that when I first looked at the system I was served by a senior salesman who seemed to know his stuff, on returning with my "expert" the senior salesman "disappeared" leaving me with a young man who clearly didn't know his stuff. I think this was largely because the senior member of staff realised we might spot the inconsistency in the displayed items.

Finally a point about the latest ipad and ACER Iconia.

many shops appear to be displaying these items. I'm beginning to wonder where they come from.

Released elsewhere, are they "officially" released here or are they "grey" imports.

The reason I ask is that they seem to be not only in vey short supply, but the model range is incomplete and accessories are almost completely unavailable.

Com.seven in Pattaya (Central) had a sign saying they's sold out - but how many did they actually have - and as for the range, as far as I could make out they only had the 16GB basic model. I asked about the 3G and the salesman laughed and said it would not be stocked. I'm beginning to wonder if Com SEven are in fact a recognised Mac dealer at all.

They frequently display old or obsolete stock without any indication that it is a superseded model and cannot supply new items as quickly as the THailand Apple WebSite which is in Singapore!

In conclusion - I would urge anyone thinking of buying anything in Thailand especially electrical goods to be very careful. If you live here you will at some point have no choice - if a visitor - get your stuff elsewhere.

Retail practices in Thailand are archaic - the vendor can sell without responsibility or fear of redress, unlike many countries in Thailand the customer NEVER comes first.

Furthermore - retail price maintenance and CARTELS are the rule - discounts are fixed between the suppliers and retailers in joint action, the customer will seldom benefit from a genuine bargain in Thailand.

Never mind "caveat emptor"

Let's have a bit of "caveat venditor" and "emptor primus est" instead!

Can you please provide more details? I have nothing else to do tonight....

Edited May 19, 2011 by happyrobert

[Tonto21]

Thank Deferral……….But please stop………..You’re scaring me!

[neverdie]

Feel better now ?....

[andrewbkk]

Can you please provide more details? I have nothing else to do tonight....

And maybe a few more examples.

Fascinating topic.

[GreenSnapper]

Oh dear, what a load of senseless drivel...

Culture shock Thailand I suppose.

[nocturn]

why read on? the OP obviously has a firm grasp of the obvious.

[moe666]

As ever the Electronics retailers are continuing to indulge in dubious practices, misleading the public by incorrect advertising and pricing, price gouging and selling old models as current and operating CARTELS to fix retail prices.

Banana IT and their MAC shop Com.seven added 10% to some external HDDs in some of their shops.

They did not mark the price increase, but told you when you attempted to pay for the item.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami.

This does not ring true to me as the items are made in Thailand and I was attempting to buy old stock that was already in the shop BEFORE the Tsunami.

Furthermore this does not apply to all locations. In Pattaya for instance the identical item was REDUCED by 50 baht. And in a competitors shop the same item was on sale for 1000 baht less (25%).

I was further informed by a Com.Seven product manager that the other shops had also raised their prices.

As I pointed out in Pattaya this was NOT the case, however in some centres (e.g. Sri Racha) this was partially true - all retailers appeared to be acting in unison - although some had not raised their prices quite so much.

Far from indicating to me that this was the result of higher component prices (how does this apply retrospectively to OLD STOCK anyway?) it seems more likely that this was the result of retail price rigging by a CARTEL or agreement between "competitors"; retail price-fixing.

Whatever the case it looks as if led by Banana IT and Com.Seven the public are being duped into paying higher prices for no real reason.

I notice now that the same item is retailed at 4250 baht - this represents an increase of over 15% on the retail price in about 6 weeks.

even if the price of components supplied by Japan has risen I doubt if this would lead to such an increase at the retail end without the covert agreement of both suppliers and retailers to the obvious disadvantage of the customer.

Powerbuy - already noted for offering "copied" OS systems on their new laptops again are pursuing some pretty dubious sales techniques. In their hi-fi section they are offering "bundles" of speaker/amp hi-fi systems claiming massive reduction from the original retail price. THey can't however supply any evidence that these goods were ever offered at the claimed higher price. furthermore the goods are displayed in such a way that it is not clear what goods exactly are included in the bundle. THe sets are often nixed in with other speakers and amps so that it is very difficult to ascertain what exactly IS or ISN"T included. a smal photo is usually placed on the back of the price label to illustrate. however the photo and or the display can actually be incorrect.

For example - I inspected two such "sets" and was shown by the sales assistant several times which items were included in each set - he did this by touching each item in the bundle in turn. One set in particular seemed OK so I returned with a friend who is a bit of a hi-fi buff to get his opinion before buying anything. It was then that I noticed the itms touched by the sales assistant did not correspond with the items in the photo. It then turns out if I had agreed to buy, I would have been supplied with a different amp/tuner from the one on display and if I'd wanted that one it would have cost an extra 20000 baht.

Two concerns emerge here one is obvious;y that the goods are deliberately displayed in a manner to kid the customer into believing that the deal is better than it really is.

And secondly - the staff are often grossly undertrained in the products they are expected to sell. Presumably the company is hoping that the combined ignorance of the salesman and customer will lead to a sale and no-one will notice that a cheaper item has in fact been substituted.

I might add that when I first looked at the system I was served by a senior salesman who seemed to know his stuff, on returning with my "expert" the senior salesman "disappeared" leaving me with a young man who clearly didn't know his stuff. I think this was largely because the senior member of staff realised we might spot the inconsistency in the displayed items.

Finally a point about the latest ipad and ACER Iconia.

many shops appear to be displaying these items. I'm beginning to wonder where they come from.

Released elsewhere, are they "officially" released here or are they "grey" imports.

The reason I ask is that they seem to be not only in vey short supply, but the model range is incomplete and accessories are almost completely unavailable.

Com.seven in Pattaya (Central) had a sign saying they's sold out - but how many did they actually have - and as for the range, as far as I could make out they only had the 16GB basic model. I asked about the 3G and the salesman laughed and said it would not be stocked. I'm beginning to wonder if Com SEven are in fact a recognised Mac dealer at all.

They frequently display old or obsolete stock without any indication that it is a superseded model and cannot supply new items as quickly as the THailand Apple WebSite which is in Singapore!

In conclusion - I would urge anyone thinking of buying anything in Thailand especially electrical goods to be very careful. If you live here you will at some point have no choice - if a visitor - get your stuff elsewhere.

Retail practices in Thailand are archaic - the vendor can sell without responsibility or fear of redress, unlike many countries in Thailand the customer NEVER comes first.

Furthermore - retail price maintenance and CARTELS are the rule - discounts are fixed between the suppliers and retailers in joint action, the customer will seldom benefit from a genuine bargain in Thailand.

Never mind "caveat emptor"

Let's have a bit of "caveat venditor" and "emptor primus est" instead!

Can you please provide more details? I have nothing else to do tonight....

If it is cheaper some where else why are you carring on about the more expensive place or wait a week and the price will be cheaper. it is a common pratice in the states it is called bait and switch.

[Deeral]

Market forces and true discounts don’t exist in Thailand - So how do you explain that the SAME retailer who insisted on charging me 440 baht over the indicated price of 3650 baht in the Sri Racha store, was selling the same item for 3600 baht in their Pattaya store?

The reason for the increase of 10 to 16 percent in price - the Tsunami was given by the Comseven/Banana IT product manager. Not the shop

The variation in price was at the same ComSeven at a different location thus indicating that the reason for the price increase was not valid as this would have lead to a universal increase at all stores. Unless you are prepared to drive from town to town you will not be able to find any significant price variation as within one mall the retailers appear to operate a retail price maintenance scheme.

It is my firm belief that the increase have been agreed by all retailers and are not justified.

It would also be nice if any increase is marked on the price tags, this was not done.

Unfortunately these retail price rigging practices are common in ALL aspects of business in Thailand and there is no consumer law to prevent it.

Have you noticed this when buying a car. THere are virtually no options and try wherever you like, no significant discounts.

Old model products are frequently sold as current models, any “discount” is in fact a false claim and when a price is reduced it is “reduced” virtually identically by all retailers.

Edited May 20, 2011 by Deeral

[JurgenG]

After reading a quite popular thread in the "news" forum, about KFC wages, I guess that people who don't agree that companies try to get the best price for their products, will agree to get the lowest salary possible for their qualification.

And that unions are rigging salary negotiation, they are some form of cartel and should be banned ?

[Richard4849]

I imagine there are lots of eyes rolling when the OP visits his friendly local electronics retailer...

[kkerry]

"Primary chip suppliers in Japan mostly had their production lines devastated by the earthquake, while the makers' secondary suppliers do not have enough capacities to fully cover the supply gap, the hard drive's price started to have a little rise in early April with some models have already seen a price increase of 10-15 per cent, Digitimes said.."

http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/22680-earthquake-softens-hard-drive-market

[mstribling]

I imagine there are lots of eyes rolling when the OP visits his friendly local electronics retailer...

[dom samui]

You are completly right and all the stupid answers to your thread just show how uneducateted lazy jalous and bored are those people...

I just bought an 2 T ext hard drive this morning after checking 4 retaillers here in samui...... will never go again in IT BANANA ,

incompetent and always the "" no have '' '' mot leo ...'' ''my mee "" Fonnd what i was looking for at JIB computer group 15 p/c les expensive .

[IanForbes]

I have always worked on the theory that there is nothing I want that I can't afford to wait for. Most often by doing so I've been able to find a better price by waiting. I understand that dealers have to make money. I also know they will tell the customer anything they can to make a sale. Don't be in a hurry and learn your prices of everything you are interested in. Make a list and do some research. Here in North America it is a comsumers market and when you wait you can often get what you want far cheaper. In Thailand there is an import duty on many items and you are stuck with it. If you live in Thailand full time then you just have to put up with it as one of the negative things about the country... to balance off all the positive things about Thailand.

Apple is a smart company. They pretty much hold their prices world wide. They make a good quality product and charge you dearly for it. My daughter is one of the most clever women I know and she is a computer technician. She doesn't like Apple computers but she bought an Apple I-phone because of its good quality and what it offered.

[samurai]

Can you please provide more details? I have nothing else to do tonight....

Morning, coffee, reading TV, see your post, clean the keyboard. fully wake up now and still laughing.

Will bookmark this post to read on Monday morning again for therapeutic reasons. Thank you.

[jackr]

Op, when you fully accept you are living in banana land, this type of thing won't bother you any more.

[seriouseats]

Wow some of you actually read all of it? not just 2-3lines?

My guess is OP is the kind of annoying guy every salesperson does not want to deal with, so they just gave him the highest price they had instead of the biggest discount.

[chuang]

Can some please precise it for easy reading...thanks

[Deeral]

for more background as to why CS and consumer protection is so poor in Thailand - take a look at this thread.

[Wavefloater]

"

Banana IT and their MAC shop Com.seven added 10% to some external HDDs in some of their shops.

They did not mark the price increase, but told you when you attempted to pay for the item.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami."

After one lives in Thailand for a while, he or she can tell when Thais are lying.

Step 1: Watch to see if their lips are moving.

Step 2: Listen for words coming out.

If these two things happen, then you know they're lying.

[Deeral]

"

Banana IT and their MAC shop Com.seven added 10% to some external HDDs in some of their shops.

They did not mark the price increase, but told you when you attempted to pay for the item.

When I asked why the price had gone up, the manger told me it was because of the tsunami."

After one lives in Thailand for a while, he or she can tell when Thais are lying.

Step 1: Watch to see if their lips are moving.

Step 2: Listen for words coming out.

If these two things happen, then you know they're lying.

Other countries have expressed concern about supplies of components after the tsunami. Some have een suggested that price increases may follow - only companies like Banana IT/Com.seven have simply raised prices BEFORE any shortage occurred.

I notice that the unit I was looking at has gone from 3650 to 4050 to 4250 and back down to 4050. In some of there shops it was 3600 after the tsunami at the same time they were selling for 4250. I paid 3000 for the unit in another shop.

Many shops in Oz are worried about component supplies for electronic goods - but they have NOT increased prices - one reason is that they are in a relatively free competitive market and fear they may be forced to loose market share to competitors who can ride out or overcome the supply shortage.

This doesn't readily happen in thailand as cartels operate to monopolize the market and ensure retail prices are pretty much uniform and maintained to give maximum profits. In most countries this is illegal. Furthermore even if you think you are buying from another company it would appear that quite often it turns out it is owned by the same person. So even if the company appears to be a separate entity, it is run by the same small group of people or even one person.

Other than blaming tsunami - Banana IT failed to offer a detailed explanation of their pricing policy - which includes different pricing of identical items in stores only feet away from each other.....after the tsunami