Pregnant By Absent Farang

[MiG16]

I have deleted one post

all I will say is - lets not go there

you all know the rules

cheers

[nocturn]

Even direct communication (if she has an address) is costly, and I imagine the few baht she has are needed for the birth.

Birth is only 30bht

We have been getting vitamin supplements from our hospital along with all sorts of other pills, total cost for the pregnancy so far 100bht a month for 3 months.

Without the optional extras it would only be 30bht a month. My wife didn't even want to go to the hospital until she was 6 months along, I insisted we spend the extra money.

I'm anticipating a total cost in the order of about 800bht for the pregnancy. Not all that expensive.

Without the frills, the whole thing would cost around 120bht.

So, Thai women do not sctually pay to give birth in a hospital? I was expecting pregnancy and birth to be expensive here.

excellent care is expensive, a Cesarean scar that would put the Joker to shame can be very cheap.

thais that can afford it, pay for decent care.

[SteeleJoe]

Even direct communication (if she has an address) is costly, and I imagine the few baht she has are needed for the birth.

Birth is only 30bht

We have been getting vitamin supplements from our hospital along with all sorts of other pills, total cost for the pregnancy so far 100bht a month for 3 months.

Without the optional extras it would only be 30bht a month. My wife didn't even want to go to the hospital until she was 6 months along, I insisted we spend the extra money.

I'm anticipating a total cost in the order of about 800bht for the pregnancy. Not all that expensive.

Without the frills, the whole thing would cost around 120bht.

So, Thai women do not sctually pay to give birth in a hospital? I was expecting pregnancy and birth to be expensive here.

excellent care is expensive, a Cesarean scar that would put the Joker to shame can be very cheap.

thais that can afford it, pay for decent care.

Fact.

[nocturn]

one does grow tired of the bitter rantings of geriatric whorefuc_kers.

let me just state:

YOUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT DEFINITIVE.

there are plenty of us here who live, work, socialize and even raise families. we may not be the majority, but we are not as thinly spread as you might like to believe.

in my experience of a few thai women in this situation over the years, the women have comported themselves FAR more honourably then the men they had the misfortune of believing.

there are exceptions of course, but we do not all chose to live mired in the muck.

[SteeleJoe]

one does grow tired of the bitter rantings of geriatric whorefuc_kers.

let me just state:

YOUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT DEFINITIVE.

there are plenty of us here who live, work, socialize and even raise families. we may not be the majority, but we are not as thinly spread as you might like to believe.

in my experience of a few thai women in this situation over the years, the women have comported themselves FAR more honourably then the men they had the misfortune of believing.

there are exceptions of course, but we do not all chose to live mired in the muck.

Bravo.

[sbk]

sarahsbloke, then please do not make broad sweeping generalizations about Thai women since you appear to only be discussing one segment of Thai women.

[sarahsbloke]

excellent care is expensive, a Cesarean scar that would put the Joker to shame can be very cheap.

thais that can afford it, pay for decent care.

Caesarean is not the norm, if you go private they tend to push this option as it makes them more money.

Women have been having babies for many years without having them cut out.

Also it is quite a dangerous option IMHO, as date of conception is hard to pin down.

Risks and Benefits

If you go for the cut you may very well be 4 weeks out in your estimation, removing a baby from the womb 4 weeks early will often mean undeveloped lungs, which will bump up the costs even more as you will then need intensive care for the baby.

There is a myth that foreigners babies are bigger and Thai ladies can't give birth to them naturally, this is a myth.

Nature knows best in this case.

[cardholder]

This topic has deviated somewhat.

The OP's question was:-

is there any way this man , can be legally held responsible for his actions ,

and be made to finance his daughters upbringing in thailand .

thanks for your valued opinions.

The answer is that there is recourse but it is unlikely that this girl has the wherewithall to achieve anything on her own. She wouldn't know where to start and is unlikely to have the funds to 'go legal' .

Her only realistic course of action is to get another Falang to correspond on her behalf. I doubt that many white knights will be putting themselves forward for the task.

As Prakhonchai Nick pointed out, there are businesses that would attempt this for her for a percentage fee.

[sarahsbloke]

sarahsbloke, then please do not make broad sweeping generalizations about Thai women since you appear to only be discussing one segment of Thai women.

I am always posting about expat issues, if I were to post on topics other than that it would be on a Thai forum in Thai language..

I was absolutely sure in my mind that all the posters & mods would know that.

This is an expat forum devoted to expat issues, why would anyone make a post that was other?

I'll change my sig to reflect that if you like.

How about

'Disclaimer: My posts about Thai ladies only refer to that much younger sort of lady that aging white men hang out with'

The OP was clearly talking about the sort of woman I was talking about.

What lady goes to bed and gets pregnant by a man whose name, address and workplace she doesn't know? (if a foreigner I would include nationality and passport number)

I have never gone to bed with a woman that I don't know those facts about, that would be crazy behavior (if a foreigner I would copy their ID number as well).

Edited May 24, 2011 by sarahsbloke

[inthepink]

For somebody that recently accused 95% of thaivisa posters of experiencing life in Thailand second hand via their wives, instead of first hand as you claim to do, you quote an awful lot of rubbish that your wife tells you.

I would respectfully suggest that she has no idea of how "respectable" Thai ladies behave, and you have even less.

Also, the cost of a natural birth in a private hospital in CM is around 20k baht and a c-section from 30-40k, so it's hardly expensive.

Edited May 24, 2011 by inthepink

[BKKdreaming]

"Also, the cost of a natural birth in a private hospital in CM is around 20k baht and a c-section from 30-40k, so it's hardly expensive."

I would say 20k baht is BIG money to most Thais who are just getting by anyway ,

I would also say that she probably is stuck, IF she knows his address she could send him letters with photos of their child and see if that gets to him , if he was 20-30 years old sending them to the guys parents and saying her are photos of your grandchild would work better !

But what is UK or USA law if his name was on the Thai birth records , maybe even if he paid for the hospital etc admitted it was his child (but really not knowing for sure) and then did a runner.

And just as a question, no I am not going to do it , If I have a child with my Thai girlfriend , and do not marry her is there any official Thai way to have my name on the childs papers so someday the child could get a USA passport or even get an inheritance if they could find the child ? Or would I need to do it at the USA embassy ?

[Beetlejuice]

The pill is not popular in Thailand, I don't know anyone that takes it. So let's forget the pill, rarely used here.

Condoms also not popular, despite HIV.

5 year or 3 year implant under the skin of the arm, free and reversible at most clinics.

Morning after pill, often taken 3 or 4 times a month as a regular birth control method, not advisable but quite popular.

Back street abortion also popular, remember this used to be contraception of choice in East European countries.

What are you talking about? Suggest you start with facts before making statements

http://www.indexmund...-years-old.html

http://docs.google.c...zU6nOeEiznSo9ew

The first page you cited gave statistics on birth control in married women

It did not state the criteria for the condition of marriage to be satisfied, Amphur office or Village wedding, this would have given important information about the social status of the statistical target group. Although I was speaking of working girls when I was talking about contraception, who would make up the vast majority of Thai women for the target group we are talking about.

The second document you cited did not seem to discuss method of contraception, if it did it was hidden away somewhere, but more a discussion on religious morality and contraception as a concept in Thailand, and relating the study to family grouping. Again contraception amongst prostitutes did not seem to be an area of study.

My personal experience of white men and Thai ladies, is that the majority of ladies have a background of prostitution (whether their male western partners choose to recognise that or not), and that is my area of expertise.

So my opinions are more based around the majority of this forums users.

We are not talking Thai/Thai relationships here, so those sort of studies are not relevant.

SBK, I can well understand your comments but would suggest you (as a young professional woman) normally mix with a totally different social environment to most of the TV forum members (who are ageing retired men) and therefore your comments on this subject are largely irrelevant. Unless, of course, you want to argue that most of the western men in Thailand are not mainly using the services of prostitutes and retired prostitutes. An argument that may have some validity, but I would imagine you would not care to take up.

Sarahsbloke

I see exactly where you are coming from and do not think that what you are quoting is making broad sweeping generalisations about Thai women, not in the least.

This is about the average farang guy, Thai woman relationships as most of what you explained makes a lot of sense to me.

Where I do strongly disagree with you is that I would amend the word prostitute to uneducated and maybe chuck the word poor in there as well.

For what I have witnessed in my many years here at the armpit of the world, is that the majority of farang guys seem to take more of an attraction to the lower class, lower educated types of Thai women. And this is in my area of expertise

Perhaps the reason is that most average working or middle class Thai ladies would never become involved with these farangs, they’re just not that desperate. Of course there are the exceptions to the general rule, but these are few and far between. Maybe the farangs find winning over the hearts of a middle to higher class Thai woman too challenging for them and prefer the poorer lower class Thai women because these are more desperate and easier prey.

I would never label the majority of female Thai partners of farangs as mostly being prostitutes or ex prostitutes or retired prostitutes. Poor and uneducated certainly and there is a universe of difference from being a prostitute to being poor and uneducated.

This could be the case regarding the lady that the OP is referring to, uneducated, naive, not worldly and coming from a poor background, therefore due to these circumstances she now finds herself in this predicament.

[monekyface]

"My personal experience of white men and Thai ladies, is that the majority of ladies have a background of prostitution (whether their male western partners choose to recognise that or not), and that is my area of expertise.

So my opinions are more based around the majority of this forums users. "

sarahsbloke you have a rather bizarre idea of what constitutes the Thai expat community. I might suggest that your "expertise" exists more in your mind than in reality. There are plenty of white men here who date women, find a good one, settle down and have a family. We have jobs, go to church, and work hard to make a living. We may not be 95% of the Caucasian men you see here in Thailand- but we most assuredly are not under 25%. Socialize a bit more here outside of the bars and you might find a different world of expats than you knew existed.

[sarahsbloke]

Wow, and there was me thinking denial was a river in Africa.

I'm sure you are all correct, and it's just me mixing with the wrong crowd.

I never knew that 25% of expats in Thailand were church goers, just goes to show how far my ignorance reaches!

Anyway, you seem to agree that I was 75% correct so my use of the word 'majority' was entirely in order.

PS

There are plenty of white men here who date women, find a good one, settle down and have a family.

I have never questioned that and I completely agree with you, I have done almost the same with a great girl.

(I say 'almost' as I never dated my wife)

I was just exploring the backgrounds of those women.

Edited May 25, 2011 by sarahsbloke

[ExpatJ]

Wow, and there was me thinking denial was a river in Africa.

I'm sure you are all correct, and it's just me mixing with the wrong crowd.

I never knew that 25% of expats in Thailand were church goers, just goes to show how far my ignorance reaches!

As i mentioned yesterday- if you talk about the poorer isaan ladies who work in the bar areas or 'salons' and hook up with expats who enjoy that then your sterotyping of these thai ladies maybe true- alot of them are naughtily cheating on their older farang husbands and bfs.

In terms of expats- i dont know if 25% go to church or not- but i do know there is a whole community of 'expat package' farangs who live here on 300-800,000+ baht per month take home pay plus housing, cars etc- these expats mix with middle and hi so thais and its in this group where you mostly see 'normal' marriages between respectable thai girls and farangs.

[maprao]

Wow, and there was me thinking denial was a river in Africa.

I'm sure you are all correct, and it's just me mixing with the wrong crowd.

I never knew that 25% of expats in Thailand were church goers, just goes to show how far my ignorance reaches!

As i mentioned yesterday- if you talk about the poorer isaan ladies who work in the bar areas or 'salons' and hook up with expats who enjoy that then your sterotyping of these thai ladies maybe true- alot of them are naughtily cheating on their older farang husbands and bfs.

In terms of expats- i dont know if 25% go to church or not- but i do know there is a whole community of 'expat package' farangs who live here on 300-800,000+ baht per month take home pay plus housing, cars etc- these expats mix with middle and hi so thais and its in this group where you mostly see 'normal' marriages between respectable thai girls and farangs.

10,000 TO 25,000 US dollars a month plus benifits. I think there are not many of them.

[ExpatJ]

Wow, and there was me thinking denial was a river in Africa.

I'm sure you are all correct, and it's just me mixing with the wrong crowd.

I never knew that 25% of expats in Thailand were church goers, just goes to show how far my ignorance reaches!

As i mentioned yesterday- if you talk about the poorer isaan ladies who work in the bar areas or 'salons' and hook up with expats who enjoy that then your sterotyping of these thai ladies maybe true- alot of them are naughtily cheating on their older farang husbands and bfs.

In terms of expats- i dont know if 25% go to church or not- but i do know there is a whole community of 'expat package' farangs who live here on 300-800,000+ baht per month take home pay plus housing, cars etc- these expats mix with middle and hi so thais and its in this group where you mostly see 'normal' marriages between respectable thai girls and farangs.

10,000 TO 25,000 US dollars a month plus benifits. I think there are not many of them.

You'd be surprised. But yes, you are right in that there are more at the lower level of that salary range, that's true.

[inthepink]

"Also, the cost of a natural birth in a private hospital in CM is around 20k baht and a c-section from 30-40k, so it's hardly expensive."

I would say 20k baht is BIG money to most Thais who are just getting by anyway ,

I was really referring to the fact that for a Westerner who is having a baby with a Thai lady (from whatever background) the cost of private treatment is hardly prohibitive and well worth it.

[Shurup]

And accidents NEVER happen?

Accidents are avoidable.

Most contraceptive pills cost upwards of 70bt for a monthly course, and if taken correctly should prevent pregnancy.

In the villages those that take the pill rely on those provided by the local health care worker at 10bt a months course. These frequently let women down if they miss even one.

Sadly the young girls who experiment with sex whilst still at school and often as young as 13/14 know nothing of contraception or Aids. Parents don't tell them, the school doesn't tell them. That's why so many end up pregnant and are making their way to the bars and gogos of Bangkok, Pattaya and Phuket at an early age to support their unwanted kids.

You can't give a monkey a computer and expect it to use it. I don't mean to say Issan or/and young girls are monkey, but sometimes they have no more brains than them.

Some awfully embarrassing statements have been made regarding birth control and how it's the woman's. Sorry, but the "pill" is not 100% effective and if it is a product sourced from China or Thailand, the likelihood of failure most likely is higher. Post coitus contraception only works if it is available and the woman knows that she is at risk of the pregnancy. Abortion is not available to most Thais.

Why is the woman being blamed for the pregnancy? She didn't provide the sperm that fertilized the egg. In the absence of knowing the actual relationship between the two parties, how can anyone call the woman irresponsible or as many of the comments indirectly accuse, a woman of loose morals. Some of these comments are quite unfair and I suspect that the tone would be different if the woman was one of the respondents' children or sister. Put yourself in the woman's position and think about it.

Not a 100% efficient but pretty close (up to 99.9% actually). Meds from china are possible issue in any argument, not all of the Chinese meds are substandart and cheap often doens't mean of a lesser quality. What other awfuly embarrassing statements have you found?

Why the woman being blamed? It's her body and it was her choice to get pregnant outside of marriage. She didn't provide the sperm but she had a choise whether she wanted to get pregnant or not.

As you said, we don't know the exact circumstances are. If they both planned for the kid and then a guy "changed his mind", he should be responsible. If they TOGETHER didn't plan to have a baby, if it was only HER decision, he should not be responsible. As other posters suggested, it's a possibility that a kid is used to trap the man into marriage. It is a possibility... Have you heard of stories when a girl got pregnant after giving a guy BJ?

Again, I don't know what exactly happened between them, it's not right to judge a guy or a girl after reading 3rd party story about what happened.

I personally would say that I wouldn't get a girl pregnant and then leave her if I didn't plan to have a family together with her.

[Semper]

the lady had a long term relationship with a farang,

she was off the opinion , it would lead to marriage .

Obviously, it did not.

[cardholder]

Wow, and there was me thinking denial was a river in Africa.

I'm sure you are all correct, and it's just me mixing with the wrong crowd.

I never knew that 25% of expats in Thailand were church goers, just goes to show how far my ignorance reaches!

As i mentioned yesterday- if you talk about the poorer isaan ladies who work in the bar areas or 'salons' and hook up with expats who enjoy that then your sterotyping of these thai ladies maybe true- alot of them are naughtily cheating on their older farang husbands and bfs.

In terms of expats- i dont know if 25% go to church or not- but i do know there is a whole community of 'expat package' farangs who live here on 300-800,000+ baht per month take home pay plus housing, cars etc- these expats mix with middle and hi so thais and its in this group where you mostly see 'normal' marriages between respectable thai girls and farangs.

Thailand would not be my first choice to be if my income was in that band.

[Mirth]

i am friendly with a respectable and hard working thai lady ,

only friends because i do not want, and i am too old for the responsibility involved .

the lady had a long term relationship with a farang,

she was off the opinion , it would lead to marriage .

she becomes pregnant , and in due course gave birth to a baby girl .

the farang does a runner , and does not care about his child .

he has know returned to his home country ,england .

is there any way this man , can be legally held responsible for his actions ,

and be made to finance his daughters upbringing in thailand .

thanks for your valued opinions.

Ever occur to you that she wants your sympathy and possibly "donations" for her dilemna?