Thai Immigration Crackdown On Ed Visas

[EnSvenskTiger]

The bottomline in this thread is not the”new” rules already in existence butthe new way the officials are upholding them. No more “wajs” for the `superior falang´! No more bowing to thewhite people!

A new andmuch better educated and well paid middle class of civil citizens have takenplace and the days of falang having different rules or thinks he can bend them are over. Over!

Its all good to us that stays in the kingdom according to the rules!

[moe666]

This thread is so predictable. When they tightened the rules on border runs and limited the land crossing from 30 days to 15, the world was coming to an end and poor Thailand was on the brink of collapse. Some of you whiners should go back and read those post and see if you can spot yourself and the same arguments made now that where made then.

Get a life boys get legal or go home until you can be legal. yes I am a bit harsh but i do not care about you and your reasons or justification for being illegal. You and your ilk will not be invited to dinner with me or my friends

[geezer553]

like most loopholes-people will continue to abuse the system_fair play 2 the immigration officer!!! -anybody learning thai for 6 yrs previous should b able 2 converce in conversation,. hoping 2 gain a ed visa myself_thats once i have completed my tefl course here in the uk... it would not be a good advertisment as a farrang teaching english without being able to understand the language of the students i teach. can only speak nitnoy and have travelled to thailand on many occassions already-as my lady lives in buriram,. my problem is my tone_being a londoner it dont help."still cant adam and eve the immigration officer"-thats believe 4 you non cockney speakers_lol

-

[ozzieovaseas]

Pla yay geen pla lek

So what the answer?

Just make a sound like kup like Thais say yes whether you or they have understood or not.

Nobody knows.

Had it been me I woulda said..chai, phom khit waa plah yai hiew mak mak

then again i have been called a bit of a smart ar$e on the odd occasion

Edited July 7, 2011 by ozzieovaseas

[ozzieovaseas]

What i'd like to know is if your around 60-70 years old how long does it take to learn thai where you can carry on a basic conversation?

Certainly you'd know more than the guy in the story (big fish eating little fish) if you'd been studying for 6 years no matter what your age.

I guess theres the argument of being a slow learner..and if he could speak Thai already there would have been no reason to have kept coming back to the school for all those years

[techboy]

All you people who are cheering this are absolute scum, you know that? At least people who use ED visa's are trying to do something to stay here legitimately.

Some of you lot forget that we are essentially all here for similar reasons, it's just that not all of us are lucky enough to have a job or be over a certain age so that we can get the visa we need...

You might laugh now while you have your comfortable retirement visa or whatever it is, but one day they'll clamp down on those as well - then perhaps you'll wish you weren't quite so gleeful about the struggles of the rest of us to stay here. Morons. Shameful

Hey Admin. I used "moron" in a response a couple of months ago and you shut me down for 72hrs!!! Hey JudgeDrag- I assure you that we are not all here for basically the same reasons. Possibly you think this because you do not have the wits to figure out that there are mentalities other than those which are encountered in this forum. Oh yes- you also say something about struggling to get visas if one is not lucky enough to have certain circumstances. I have called Thailand my home for twelve years and never "struggled" to renew my visa. Ooh! Ooh! "Clampdown." You mean like comply with simple and versatile rules that are already in place? I hope that the big fish clamps down on yo' backside! You are deserving of more ridicule than I am able to conjure up in this short message.

[wolf5370]

Going to school and learning Thai is one option for people to "long stay" in the Kingdom without having to constantly do "border runs." It is especially popular with those who can self-fund themselves living here and do not need to work but are not yet 50 years of age thus not being able to qualify for a Retirement Visa.

Erm are these people a good target then - they do not work, bring foreign money in, are self supporting and pay for their visas (as well as not-so-cheap courses) - surely these are the people to overlook as they are non-negatives (take nothing away - jobs etc - but spend foreign money here). Seems like a soft target.

I also find it hard to believe that anyoine living here 6 years does not know the words for "big", "small", "fish" and "eat" - even without going through any formal course - after all these words appear on every cafe/restaurant menu! and many Thais will ask the farang "what did you eat?" "what are you eating?" etc. It could have a lot more to do wityh the speed he spoke or the accent he had than the student's ability to understand. I understand and can read a fair bit of Thai, but I certainly do not understand all accents or the way some people speak so rapidly as to merge the whole thing into a single militi-syllibal word.

I have had these little test before too - not at immigration (not on an Ed Visa) - but a CM Night Safari when buying a ticket at Thai price (I was with my Thai kids) she asked in Engish "You live here", "yes" I replied, "You have a watch?" [in Thai], I nodded - that got her! She smiled and then said "OK" and gave me Thai price. Of course I could have nodded at anything she said - I did understand, but didn't realise it was a test, I expected her to then tell me what time the safari was etc - hence I nodded that I did indeed have a watch.

I do accept that companies flouting the law should be stopped - this makes sense - but maybe they should also look at this as the fact there obviously is a demand - that the "customers" are trying to be legitimate, are brining in foreign money, and are not a drain on jobs or society at all - that it is a possibility to exploit this demand in a positive way - that is selling Visas and extensions for people that are not married to a Thai, are not old, do not wish to invest millions of dollars (or even have that sort of sum), but are self supporting and not a drain on jobs or resources - i.e. yearly long stay Visas that do not allow work. How many other dubios "get-arounds" would this also solve - such as back to back tourist visas and constant visa runs (where neighbouring countries garner the benefit and not Thailand). Give people options to be legitimate and there will be less scams, less illegal companies providing work-arounds and less illegal overstayers and tourist Visas.

Other than the apparant loss of visitor numbers (from border runs), what is the down side - upside is the extra income from visas, extra money spent in-country, lower drain on immigration and police, more legitimate long stayer, more chance of people opting for citizenship (as they will have the abaility to show back-to-back visas), average class of long term stayers increases (backpackers need to work to fund there movements - so will still to illegal teaching etc and tourist visas - giving a clearer target by removing those that can afford to live here without working).

[wolf5370]

ust to avoid misunderstandings, I was not talking to you but to Olav.

I hope my reply will not lead to new misunderstandings, I am NOT making a pass at you.

Thai joke (with Thai learn English)

A: You see girlfriend? yet?

B: Not yet!

A: Why not?

Thai always laugh

would you mind explaining the punchline..in English

He drops his trousers

[mochafan]

To all those who replied to me earlier, the main point of my post is that those who think it's a "good thing" that they are clamping down on visas are being incredibly ignorant of the reasons as to why people do this.

Sure, there may be some undesirable people who abuse the system, but then there are also LOTS of undesirable people with legitimate visas (retirement, marriage, work, whatever). I just want to live here with my girlfriend - why on earth would some of you guys have a problem with me doing that? You're worse than the most xenophobic of Thais if you are against me doing that.

But regardless, mark my words... It may be us this time but the reality is that the powers that be in this country don't want ANY of us living here. One day, they'll find a way to clamp down on your visas too. And then it will be the more astute people like me who are laughing, as we will find some way to stay here, while all you fools who think everything has to be done "by the book" will have to go home with your tails between your legs.

It will be nothing less than you deserve for wishing misfortune on others.

Well said. I totally agree with you.

[wolf5370]

Pla yay geen pla lek

So what the answer?

Just make a sound like kup like Thais say yes whether you or they have understood or not.

Nobody knows.

Baang Khrang plah lek gin plah yai duay (sometimes the little fish eats the bigs fish also)

or maybe

Jing leh? hee hok, mai dai hen.

or

Gor bpaawn gay leow

Edited July 7, 2011 by wolf5370

[tropo]

What i'd like to know is if your around 60-70 years old how long does it take to learn thai where you can carry on a basic conversation?

Certainly you'd know more than the guy in the story (big fish eating little fish) if you'd been studying for 6 years no matter what your age.

I guess theres the argument of being a slow learner..and if he could speak Thai already there would have been no reason to have kept coming back to the school for all those years

He only had to know Thai for "big", "little", "fish" and "eat" in 6 years. I reckon the Immigration Officer made a good call.

[riceman09]

I'm sure it'll be great remembering this thread when you'll get caught!!

Have agreat day1

I am certain Richard won't get "caught" If you want to be a student in Thailand (thus qualifying you to have and keep an Ed visa) it is simple really.

After you pay your fee, attend class.

Currently you can do this for a long time ...The guy mentioned in the OP on his 7th straight year of Ed visas for learning Thai obviously failed that simple (very simple!) rule.

ehi go back in time and read it VERY CAREFULLY; YOU ARE ILLEGAL. Mr. micky Mouse!!!

[TechnikaIII]

Great news! But they should have done it years ago!

Even though these "students" can take care of them self, it shows clearly that they do not wish to integrate themselves. If you do not have sufficient qualifications to get a job in a foreign country and you are not retired, the least you can do is to learn the language, integrate yourself and then try to positively contribute to the society. Those who just want to be here without doing anything, should not be here!

I agree with every word of this. Well said Jamora.

[wolf5370]

All you people who are cheering this are absolute scum, you know that? At least people who use ED visa's are trying to do something to stay here legitimately.

Some of you lot forget that we are essentially all here for similar reasons, it's just that not all of us are lucky enough to have a job or be over a certain age so that we can get the visa we need...

You might laugh now while you have your comfortable retirement visa or whatever it is, but one day they'll clamp down on those as well - then perhaps you'll wish you weren't quite so gleeful about the struggles of the rest of us to stay here. Morons. Shameful

Dredd, you seem to be somewhat of a raging maniac. Others have tried to explain to you how it is in a polite manner, but you seem to be only concerned about your own needs. Well let me tell you how it is. If you cannot find a legal way to stay in Thailand, THEN YOU SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! And whether I'm sympathetic to your plight, or "gleeful about your struggles," it just doesn't matter. Because you SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! If you are a short-term tourist, Thailand wants you here. If you have skills that can qualify you for a work permit, Thailand wants you here. If you are of retirement age and can support yourself, Thailand wants you here. If you want to open a factory and create jobs, Thailand wants you here. If you're married to a Thai, or are pursuing an education, or any other number of legitimate reasons, Thailand wants you here. If after this long lists of eligibility criterion, you STILL can't find a legal way to stay, THEN YOU SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! Wanting to stay in Thailand to be with your girlfriend, or your boyfriend, or your pet ferret, those are not legitimate reasons. Wake up and smell the coffee! Thailand doesn't want you here! And it's their country! You got a problem with that? THEN GO START YOUR OWN F**KING COUNTRY! Then you can let in any lowlife maggot you like, any time, all the time.

Rant over.

Whie I don't disagree with your sentiment, it has to be asked: What is the difference between someone who gets the Ed Visa legitimately and goes to school and someone who gets it legitimately and doesn't - assuming both pay their course fees etc. Why does Thailand want one over the other? If it's because they want more Thai speakers worldwide, then why does this also apply to students here learning any other languages (other than native tongue)?

On that, why do they want 50 year olds that contribute nothing to society (other than cash) - because they can't work on their OA's - over a 40 year old in the same boat? Assuming the same situation - i.e. self supporting from foreign investment (be it a pension or any other investment). The 40 year old has, on avereage, 10 more years to contribute to the country too. As all extensions are 1 year max, any can be ended quite quickly if required, so I ask again - what benefit does one have over the other for Thailand?

Why is the 40 year old a low-life maggot? It is clear with age comes wrinkles, not wisdom.

Edited July 7, 2011 by wolf5370

[FritsSikkink]

All you people who are cheering this are absolute scum, you know that? At least people who use ED visa's are trying to do something to stay here legitimately.

Some of you lot forget that we are essentially all here for similar reasons, it's just that not all of us are lucky enough to have a job or be over a certain age so that we can get the visa we need...

You might laugh now while you have your comfortable retirement visa or whatever it is, but one day they'll clamp down on those as well - then perhaps you'll wish you weren't quite so gleeful about the struggles of the rest of us to stay here. Morons. Shameful

Dredd, you seem to be somewhat of a raging maniac. Others have tried to explain to you how it is in a polite manner, but you seem to be only concerned about your own needs. Well let me tell you how it is. If you cannot find a legal way to stay in Thailand, THEN YOU SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! And whether I'm sympathetic to your plight, or "gleeful about your struggles," it just doesn't matter. Because you SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! If you are a short-term tourist, Thailand wants you here. If you have skills that can qualify you for a work permit, Thailand wants you here. If you are of retirement age and can support yourself, Thailand wants you here. If you want to open a factory and create jobs, Thailand wants you here. If you're married to a Thai, or are pursuing an education, or any other number of legitimate reasons, Thailand wants you here. If after this long lists of eligibility criterion, you STILL can't find a legal way to stay, THEN YOU SHOULDN'T F**KING BE HERE! Wanting to stay in Thailand to be with your girlfriend, or your boyfriend, or your pet ferret, those are not legitimate reasons. Wake up and smell the coffee! Thailand doesn't want you here! And it's their country! You got a problem with that? THEN GO START YOUR OWN F**KING COUNTRY! Then you can let in any lowlife maggot you like, any time, all the time.

Rant over.

[chunktal]

So let me see if I have this correct?

I get the correct visa, work permit and pay my taxes but if I happen to think that someone, who by their own admission is breaking the law, should be held accountable, I am scum, an idiot, a moron or one of the other blanket statements cast out by those who feel that the law is not for them.

However if I change my point of view, it would be perfectly acceptable for me to get drunk and take out a few people going about their business???

Correct me if I'm not following you properly on this?

I correct you

In Thailand everyone break law, but people in thread break law of some kind.

Let he without guilt, cast the first stone.

That is not us.

1) Ever give tea money? felony to bribe policeman/government official, fine and deportation.

2) Ever work without permit? fine and deportation.

3) Ever drink drive? felony and deportation.

4) Ever buy house or business with Thai nominee, fraud and deportation

I know nobody in Thailand, Thai or foreigner who not commit one of crime.

You run business you pay bribe to someone.

You drive car you pay bribe to someone.

So why everyone in thread upset by VISA trick? I not know!

You have Ed VISA but not learn, not crime, minor rule break, no fine, no deportation, just need different visa next time.

1 - In 6 years here, I've never given "tea money" to anyone. The 1 time I have been pulled over by the police, I sat there asking for a ticket and directions to the police station to go and pay the fine, eventually he sent me on my way with a warning. I was driving in the right hand lane at the time which is why I was pulled over so you may have me on that point. You may also note that I asked for the ticket as I acknowledge I was in the wrong and accept the results of that action.

2 - I have worked for 2 companies in that time, my orignal company that sent me over from Australia and organised a Visa from the Thai Consulate in Sydney and the Work Permit on my arrival. For the company I work for now, I had to wait for 3 months before I could start work with them after being made redundant from the original job while the Work Permit was sorted out. It did not take the 3 months to do but I got them to put it off for a bit, it was a nice time to spend with my family between jobs and with the redundancy laws here, money was not a problem, another good reason to stay legal. Also, I'm on a married Visa now so could stay here legally between jobs.

3 - I do not drink and drive, I was a fireman back in Aus and have taken bodies out of cars, fortunately no kids in my time but others had to. There are enough idiots on the roads already.

4 - I do not own a house and do not own a business.

As some of the others have said, you are probably hanging around the wrong people. I have a special dislike for anyone who condones getting behind the wheel after drinking, but that is from seeing the end results of those actions and the innocent lives that can be wrecked by people who make this choice.

The people that are upset that they are doing the right thing on the Ed Visa and may be affected by a crackdown need to consider who is actually causing the problem, the ones abusing the system or the ones supporting Immigrations efforts to close the loopholes and turf them out? One person openly admits to abusing the Ed Visa, working without a permit in Thailand and not paying taxes here (I know, he says he pays taxes in Hong Kong, but he is working here in Thailand and should be paying them here), then says it does not affect anyone else so he should be left alone, but guess what, his actions may result in people who are here legally being deported due to those actions. More innocent peoples lives affected by a selfish few who feel that the laws do not apply to them?

[gk10002000]

I have made some reasonable efforts to learn Thai. Books, internet, local Thai restaurant staff here in the USA etc. Even though I do qualify for the 50 aged retirement visa, I almost went for the Ed Visa for one year because I did want to stay in Thailand that long and I did want to learn the language more intensely.

Anyway, my crude and incomplete and wrong on several counts transliteration of what the immigration official said: Big fish eat small fish.

Pla Yai Gin Kao Pla Noi! To which I would reply: Pla Noi, chok mai dee.

Cheers all.

[horsewell]

It's not really the role of the immigration officer to test Thai students. There should be some sort of testing requirement and re-testing at a different location, if the immigration officer is not satisfied. I'm currently on the second year single entry Non-Ed but been learning thai for just over 3 years now. I don't even know some [Thai] people speak English anymore... also, I ask the people selling things in the market to speak Thai to me, I don't even want to deal with unintelligible English. The tipping point (easier for me "try" to speak Thai than they try and speak English) came after about a year, however, I have a real interest. Spending many hours in conversation, flash card vocabulary lists.

Thai isn't that hard with a little diligence, even if you are learning Thai with small chat at a bar. For an education visa 4 hours of classroom time / week is small fry there will be plenty for time for tours, snorkelling, temple visiting... whatever floats your boat.

I've never been even quizzed by the Immigration officer but there is [probably] no need as I write my address in Thai script and respond to the cute assistants few questions in Thai...

There are lots of different visas that people can get to stay in the country and it's good that they are starting to make moves to remove the loop holes that allow people scam the visa system.

[wolf5370]

I have made some reasonable efforts to learn Thai. Books, internet, local Thai restaurant staff here in the USA etc. Even though I do qualify for the 50 aged retirement visa, I almost went for the Ed Visa for one year because I did want to stay in Thailand that long and I did want to learn the language more intensely.

Anyway, my crude and incomplete and wrong on several counts transliteration of what the immigration official said: Big fish eat small fish.

Pla Yai Gin Kao Pla Noi! To which I would reply: Pla Noi, chok mai dee.

Cheers all.

"Gin Kao" means dinner - literally eat rice, so you can drop the "kao" (rice) part and you are there - nice answer though.

[jackdawson]

walked by walen last night and, looking up at the Times Square Building, noticed all the lights were burning and the classrooms were packed.

Guess the word is out.

On the board I could see "big fish eat little fish" (bla yai gin bla lek) (now is that so hard?)

guess i should set up one my girls selling hot coffee (or something stronger) to all those candle burning "students"

[Bakseedaa]

The answer was yes so the officer looked at a nearby fish tank and said in Thai, 'The big fish eat the little fish." The foreigner looked at him without a clue. The officer smiled and picked up a big red stamp and stamped "CANCELLED" on the remaining portion of the current visa and told the fellow he would not again receive an Education visa," Barry reported.

Hahaha - who said they didn't have a sense of humor?

Plaa yai, kin plaa lek..... did I pass... ? :jap:

[Bakseedaa]

All you people who are cheering this are absolute scum, you know that? At least people who use ED visa's are trying to do something to stay here legitimately.

Some of you lot forget that we are essentially all here for similar reasons, it's just that not all of us are lucky enough to have a job or be over a certain age so that we can get the visa we need...

You might laugh now while you have your comfortable retirement visa or whatever it is, but one day they'll clamp down on those as well - then perhaps you'll wish you weren't quite so gleeful about the struggles of the rest of us to stay here. Morons. Shameful

Hi Judge, what you say sounds ok... and if people genuinely try to learn, and fit in with society, I would agree with you, but go down lower Sukumvit and see all the coloured gentlemen selling ice and smack and Charlie, see all their bitches selling their ass, about 90% of those coloured bros and their bitches are here on ED visas...and those dudes Never attend any school.

[Amras]

If its such a xenophobic country and a bad place to be, then why are you here?

No, you are entitled to freedoms and to contribute or not in the country of your birth (and citizenship), there you get the freedom of choice, get to pick what you want to do etc.

There may or may not be guaranteed human rights in one's birth country.

Do you believe all countries are equivalent in this regard?

If you CHOOSE to move to another country, then you HAVE to ACCEPT their rules, their ways, their decisions, no matter if you like it or not. All foreigners are here BY CHOICE and allowed to stay here for the reasons we can through the VISA's that are available. Taking advantage of a situation and then complaining when it gets cut out is not a right, as we CHOSE to be here, we weren't forced.

One should obey the laws of the country where they are resident whether they are a citizen or not.

In a free country that believes in rights of the individual, 'their ways' do not have to be accepted by the individual unless one is unfortunate enough to move to a country having a totalitarian government. Anyone volunteering to move to North Korea?

By coming here and CHOOSING to stay here, you automatically have to accept how things are and obide [sic] by the rules that you accepted when you entered Thailand. If it was your home country, then it is different as you are entitled to voice your opinion as you haven't choosen to live there as it was your place of birth.

One is obliged to obey the laws in whichever country they are in - citizen or foreigner. Whether or not one is allowed to voice an opinion is dependent on the laws of the country. Totalitarian countries and countries with limited freedom of speech for both citizens and foreigners are more constraining. In Mexico, foreigners are forbidden from making political statements, and I wouldn't get too vocal even as a citizen of Mexico (example country).

Do you see what I'm getting at? Regardless of whether or not Thailand could, does or will benefit from letting foreigners stay here easier, it chooses to have these rules (and they are easier than most other countries), which you accepted when you chose to live here, knowingly as well.

Actually, this statement makes me wonder how many foreigners know Thai law as it applies to them ... and how it may differ as it applies to a Thai citizen (where and when it does).

You're(not aimed at you specifically) here by CHOICE, accept the situation or you can decide its not the place for you and go back home, where you can voice your dissatisfaction with the government in which you are a citizen.

Assuming, of course that their 'home' allows them to voice their dissatisfaction with the government even as a citizen. Care to move to Saudi Arabia?

Thailand owes us nothing and to expect anything else is pure arrogance. We 'owe' Thailand for allowing us the CHOICE to stay here relatively easy. They could make it a lot harder and thats the point.

Really? Would you like to compare the tourist industry of Thailand with that of North Korea and then prepare to answer why they are so different? Here's a quote on North Korean tourism from Wiki:

Organized by the state owned Korea International Travel Company, Tourism in North Korea is highly controlled by the government, and as such it is not a frequently visited destination — roughly 1,500 Western tourists visit North Korea each year, along with thousands of Asians. Tourists must go on guided tours and must have their tour guides with them at all times.

How about public safety? Does Thailand (or any other country) owe both the citizens and foreigners some level of safety? How about basic human rights such as an impartial justice system to both citizens and visitors? I'd be careful about use of terms such as 'pure arrogance' if I were you. I agree that Thailand should (for one thing) perform criminal background checks for all visitors and forbid entry to individuals with certain criminal backgrounds. How do you think that would affect tourist revenues?

Too many believe they have an inherent RIGHT to stay in Thailand because they are foreign and can support themselves and 'bring money into the country'. Well you/we don't and rightly shouldn't, just as for every other countries immigration which works exactly the same (or are even more picky about who they let into the country).

Really? How do you know how many believe they have an 'inherent RIGHT' to stay in Thailand under any assumptions?

Where do you get this idea, since it applies to almost no other situation ... except the USA and large parts of Europe. Maybe the loose immigration policies of Europe and the USA (and others) is leading people to believe it applies to Thailand as well. However, I've met several Burmese (using the persistent CIA name) in Thailand that have 'bought' their right to be resident and not through the Immigration Bureau.

Sorry, but you're missing my point.

I didn't mean it quite so literally AND I'd be fairly confident in saying that most people on here and the majority of 'farangs' in Thailand don't come from repressed, controlled countries without freedom of speech. So your point may apply in some in frequent situations, but in the majority I'd find your point a bit mute and purely for the sake of argument.

Even if a country believes in the rights of an individual that's ok, but my point is you have the choice to leave here, if you are not happy with the way things are. In your country of birth, its no so easy (can be impossible) to pack up and just move to another country. Hence your right to voice your dissatisfaction with the government etc.

Remember we are VISITORS here (well most of us, except those been given PR and Citizenship and then THEY have the right to voice their opinion/dissatisfaction, because Thailand has given them the right to stay permanently in Thailand, and along with that more 'rights' living here (and not just being a long term visitor like the rest of us (in the eyes of the law)).

We are not talking about tourism. We are talking about the right for foreigners to stay here long term purely because they want to. That's what I'm saying Thailand doesn't owe us. They don't owe us the right to just choose to stay here, the same as most other countries around the world. You can't just pick a country and decide to live there purely because you want to (Without a legitimate job, studying etc).

Thailand is relatively safe not just for tourists, but for Thai's too. So the effect flows on. Why is it incorrect to say some are arrogant to think they deserve the right to stay here purely if they want? Why is that an incorrect statement? Some on here have clearly shown that they do think this way by the posts they have made. They have shown that they believe that because they 'can support themselves', don't 'take anything from thais', that that should automatically entitle them the right to stay here.

In the eyes of the law (and as with most other countries) it doesn't. And to think that way IS arrogance on their behalf.

[jdinasia]

I'm sure it'll be great remembering this thread when you'll get caught!!

Have agreat day1

I am certain Richard won't get "caught" If you want to be a student in Thailand (thus qualifying you to have and keep an Ed visa) it is simple really.

After you pay your fee, attend class.

Currently you can do this for a long time ...The guy mentioned in the OP on his 7th straight year of Ed visas for learning Thai obviously failed that simple (very simple!) rule.

ehi go back in time and read it VERY CAREFULLY; YOU ARE ILLEGAL. Mr. micky Mouse!!!

Ummm nope. I am not "illegal", nor is my name "micky MOUSE" I am in Thailand on an extension of stay based upon employment as a director of a Thai company that was just renewed, and in fact haven't left Thailand since 2009 even for a trip back home. Too busy at work.

[whistleblower]

'Can you imagine the uproar in the UK if Pakistanis were flowing into the country on fake ED visas, staying forever and not learning a word of English?'

They dont need fake ED Visas!! but they still arrive in their masses! UK has a benefits system that people want to exploit, Thailand does not. I dont see why they make it so hard for people to stay long term. No one can 'sponge' of the state and if they have enough money to sustain themeselves whilst they are here, whats the problem??

Actually thinking about it, if they have the money why not buy a 'Thailand Elite' card that gives them a 5 year visa?..........................Oh wait that was another white elephant and doesnt exist anymore

[robertson468]

What impact would this have on folks attending classes at a distance via online methods, as some schools allow for? Guess as long as they're attending the classes, it doesn't matter the means by which they are attending, no?

Which would also blow a hole in the Immigration Officer's calculation of renewals verses new students, as online students don't need a seat in class. I also think it is very unfair to debar students who are attending classes at a school, because others are not attending classes. I have my doubts about the legality of this, particularly as a relatively junior officer appears to be dictating policy. I think TV should have investigated this further with the relavent authority, rather than setting off a hare that might well turn out to be only half truths. Or are you only into the "cut and paste journalism"?

[scania]

HAHAHAHAHA Exactly same as I was thinking hahahahaha you say "shai krab" and you get cancelled hahahahahaha

Pla yay geen pla lek

So what the answer?

[jdinasia]

What impact would this have on folks attending classes at a distance via online methods, as some schools allow for? Guess as long as they're attending the classes, it doesn't matter the means by which they are attending, no?

Which would also blow a hole in the Immigration Officer's calculation of renewals verses new students, as online students don't need a seat in class. I also think it is very unfair to debar students who are attending classes at a school, because others are not attending classes. I have my doubts about the legality of this, particularly as a relatively junior officer appears to be dictating policy. I think TV should have investigated this further with the relavent authority, rather than setting off a hare that might well turn out to be only half truths. Or are you only into the "cut and paste journalism"?

TVF is not journalism at all --- it is a forum.

It doesn't matter if you think it is unfair or not (it isn't fair to those abiding by the rules BUT...) If a school loses its license due to fraudulent practices it affects everyone.

[Trembly]

Well, we seem to have successfully got to the nub of the issue, having divided ourselves fairly neatly between two schools of thought:

1. The Illegals

I can do what I want so long as it doesn't affect you.

2. The Legals

If you're here, play by the bloody rules!

I doubt this thread is going to get much further than this impasse, but please someone wake me up if it does.

Wakeup Call!

The real 'nub' or should I use 'rub' is that Immigration is limiting foreigners to taking Thai language courses as a condition of residency whether or not the foreigner has any real interest or perceived or actual need to learn Thai. If a broader range of courses were allowed, then I don't think the fraudulent school issue would be as critical and the students could study, probably more enthusiastically, subjects the REALLY WANTED to learn.

When a bureaucracy attempts to impose it's desires (attempted social engineering, price controls, etc.) on individuals or markets ... let's just say that suboptimal things happen.

Now that you might be awake, you might pursue the issue of WHY the bureaucracy has set it up this way. This is where it really gets interesting, in my opinion. Suppose the USA (or any other country) offered student visas, but ONLY under the condition that the students study ONLY the predominant language of the country (or fill-in-the-blank other silly study limitation/constraint)?

Discussion beyond this probably becomes very non-PC. All I can say is that the 'big/little fish story' smells ... fishy to me and is fertile material for a 'Top 10 Responses to the Immigration Official's Fish Statement by the Farang'.

I'll go right to 1 (or is it #10?): Are we meeting here today to discuss fishtank ecology? (in perfect Thai, of course).

This thread needed to be lightened-up a little.

The only problem with your argument is that you can get an ED visa by studying anything you like at any accredited place of instruction that you like.

Mahidol University International College and Bangkok University International College (to name just two) have plenty of foreign students studying short courses as well as degrees.

There are also foreign students (notably from Lao, Cambodia and Vietnam) who are studying for degrees in Thai at universities all over the country. Guess what visa they have?

Edit : just for you . . . MUIC Diplomas of Spanish

Edited July 8, 2011 by Trembly

[jdinasia]

The only problem with your argument is that you can get an ED visa by studying anything you like at any accredited place of instruction that you like.

Mahidol University International College and Bangkok University International College (to name just two) have plenty of foreign students studying short courses as well as degrees.

There are also foreign students (notably from Lao, Cambodia and Vietnam) who are studying for degrees in Thai at universities all over the country. Guess what visa they have?

Edit : just for you . . . MUIC Diplomas of Spanish

You can add various other places that have school licenses such as Thai cookery classes and even a couple of Muay Thai camps ....

and

Webster Uni

Stamford Schiller

Chula

Thammasat

RU

CMU

I think even Silpakorn

PSU

etc etc etc