Buying A Discounted Condo - Any Advice?

[w11guy]

Is there any way to find out what prices condos have actually sold for in the past? I don't mean advertised prices, but the actual prices that the buyers paid. I'm interested to see the trend over the last 5 years, as I think this gives a good indication of where prices are heading. I read so much conflicting information in the press that it's difficult to make sense of. But one alarming thing I did read was that foreign buyers have drop from around 40% to under 20%.

What I'm considering is buying a 1-2 bed condo for mainly investment purposes. But if I buy a condo in an established building I need to know that prices are stable and not dropping. I have been in BKK for a year now and am starting to realise that there seems to be a real glut of both rental and sale properties. I saw 5-6 rental properties in a condo in Silom a few months ago and they had all been on the market for over 6 months. Prices seemed a bit high to me and I don't know why the owners don't just drop the prices and get them rented instead of leaving them empty. There are also some re-sales in my building and they seem to have been on the market for quite a while. So I'm getting the impression that the market is very oversupplied. Add to that the tens of thousands of condos being built and it seem like a property price crash could be on the way.

But back to my plans. I'm looking for somewhere that has at least a 20% discount. So maybe a desperate seller who needs the cash quickly. It also needs to be somewhere that will be fairly easy to rent and give at least 8% rental yield. There was one for sale in Silom at 70K per square meter but it was too big for me. Others in the building are on sale for 100k/sqm. But they're not selling at that price, so maybe 70K isn't as good a discount as it seems.

Condo needs to be a minimum of 50sqm, preferably 60+. For 2-bed, minimum of 70sqm. No studios.

Any ideas or comments on the above greatly appreciated. Anyone else in a similar situation or already done this? What worked and what didn't?

[JeffreyMcCollum]

I am not in Bangkok, but up north. Yes sales to Expats is way down over the last few years as the problems over seas has slowed things down.

however, sales to Thai, as well as Asians are up as things are booming here. Prices at my project are up over 40% in the last year or so.

[w11guy]

I am not in Bangkok, but up north. Yes sales to Expats is way down over the last few years as the problems over seas has slowed things down.

however, sales to Thai, as well as Asians are up as things are booming here. Prices at my project are up over 40% in the last year or so.

Things are definitely not like that in Bangkok. The market in both rentals and sales seems very stagnant to me. In rentals in particular there is a real glut of empty properties, with many empty for over a year.

Are you a developer? What kind of project do you have, when was it finished and how have you worked out the 40% price increase. Are you saying that a condo that sold for say 2m last year has just re-sold for 2.8m? Can you be a little more specific? What is driving the price? Lack of condos in the area? Who is buying them - Thais or foreigners? It must surely be a very big property bubble if prices are rising so fast. For me, there is far too much risk in buying such a place. But good luck with the project.

[PattayaPhom]

Good location and priced well, Pattaya is booming, many Russians and a good agent will also do the management for you...you dont have to get a 20% discount if the seller and agent market the property well. Of course this post will get the usual pesimists but thats not a a true reflection of Pattaya.

[w11guy]

Good location and priced well, Pattaya is booming, many Russians and a good agent will also do the management for you...you dont have to get a 20% discount if the seller and agent market the property well. Of course this post will get the usual pesimists but thats not a a true reflection of Pattaya.

I'm only interested in Bangkok, as that is where I live and I know the area fairly well. I don't buy property in areas I don't know. I've never even visited Pattaya, so there is no hope of me buying a property there. If prices are booming then it's usually (though not always) too late to buy. We all know what comes after a boom. You may be right, but this is certainly not for me.

One final point. I would rather buy property where there are also local buyers. In all areas of the world where there are too many foreign buyers, things can go bust very quickly indeed. What happens when the Russians leave? Who will be left to buy the property. Way too risky for what I'm looking for.

[PattayaPhom]

Good location and priced well, Pattaya is booming, many Russians and a good agent will also do the management for you...you dont have to get a 20% discount if the seller and agent market the property well. Of course this post will get the usual pesimists but thats not a a true reflection of Pattaya.

I'm only interested in Bangkok, as that is where I live and I know the area fairly well. I don't buy property in areas I don't know. I've never even visited Pattaya, so there is no hope of me buying a property there. If prices are booming then it's usually (though not always) too late to buy. We all know what comes after a boom. You may be right, but this is certainly not for me.

One final point. I would rather buy property where there are also local buyers. In all areas of the world where there are too many foreign buyers, things can go bust very quickly indeed. What happens when the Russians leave? Who will be left to buy the property. Way too risky for what I'm looking for.

Surely you must know the leglislation about quotos for Thais/Foreigners. Pattaya is one of the few places in Thailand that have both. Best stick to BKK if that is the area/market you know. If you want investment, why not buy some cheap Thai rooms in Om Noi or Bang Khae, always rented at 1,500 or so a month....cant get a better local market than that if you are really serious.

[w11guy]

Good location and priced well, Pattaya is booming, many Russians and a good agent will also do the management for you...you dont have to get a 20% discount if the seller and agent market the property well. Of course this post will get the usual pesimists but thats not a a true reflection of Pattaya.

I'm only interested in Bangkok, as that is where I live and I know the area fairly well. I don't buy property in areas I don't know. I've never even visited Pattaya, so there is no hope of me buying a property there. If prices are booming then it's usually (though not always) too late to buy. We all know what comes after a boom. You may be right, but this is certainly not for me.

One final point. I would rather buy property where there are also local buyers. In all areas of the world where there are too many foreign buyers, things can go bust very quickly indeed. What happens when the Russians leave? Who will be left to buy the property. Way too risky for what I'm looking for.

Surely you must know the leglislation about quotos for Thais/Foreigners. Pattaya is one of the few places in Thailand that have both. Best stick to BKK if that is the area/market you know. If you want investment, why not buy some cheap Thai rooms in Om Noi or Bang Khae, always rented at 1,500 or so a month....cant get a better local market than that if you are really serious.

I'm looking specifically for 1-2 bed condos. Not at all interested in cheap rooms and other such things. Don't care whether they are good investments or not. I'm looking for something specific and in Bangkok only. Yes, I know all about quotas. I'll leave all these great deals for you. I don't mind you taking all the profit at my expense. LOL. I've seen it all before.

[Darrel]

"Is there any way to find out what prices condos have actually sold for in the past? I don't mean advertised prices, but the actual prices that the buyers paid."

Ah, that document would make interesting reading, at least in Pattaya.

The answer is "no", and for good reason.

[Darrel]

...... Pattaya is booming, many Russians and a good agent .............

Three jokes in under ten words.

You're really good.

[w11guy]

"Is there any way to find out what prices condos have actually sold for in the past? I don't mean advertised prices, but the actual prices that the buyers paid."

Ah, that document would make interesting reading, at least in Pattaya.

The answer is "no", and for good reason.

I was hoping there'd be something like we have in the UK where you can just check paid prices online. A very valuable asset that stops estate agents claiming that they have sold at higher prices than they have actually sold at.

[samran]

Prices seemed a bit high to me and I don't know why the owners don't just drop the prices and get them rented instead of leaving them empty.

Cause most of the properties are owned by cashed up rich folk who would rather sit on an empty place than sell it below their perceived price.

As long as they don't have a mortgage they are scratching to service, and have good cash flow elsewhere, these places are effectively 'off' the market unless you are prepared to meet the price....or lucky enough to come across a distressed sale.

[w11guy]

Prices seemed a bit high to me and I don't know why the owners don't just drop the prices and get them rented instead of leaving them empty.

Cause most of the properties are owned by cashed up rich folk who would rather sit on an empty place than sell it below their perceived price.

As long as they don't have a mortgage they are scratching to service, and have good cash flow elsewhere, these places are effectively 'off' the market unless you are prepared to meet the price....or lucky enough to come across a distressed sale.

I read an interesting article that outlined just what you said. But these were rental properties, so even if they don't have mortgage, etc, they are still losing money by not renting. Even if they are super rich, it still makes more sense to have rent coming in than not. But other rentals are VERY negotiable.

Edited August 12, 2011 by w11guy

[samran]

Prices seemed a bit high to me and I don't know why the owners don't just drop the prices and get them rented instead of leaving them empty.

Cause most of the properties are owned by cashed up rich folk who would rather sit on an empty place than sell it below their perceived price.

As long as they don't have a mortgage they are scratching to service, and have good cash flow elsewhere, these places are effectively 'off' the market unless you are prepared to meet the price....or lucky enough to come across a distressed sale.

I read an interesting article that outlined just what you said. But these were rental properties, so even if they don't have mortgage, etc, they are still losing money by not renting. Even if they are super rich, it still makes more sense to have rent coming in than not. But other rentals are VERY negotiable.

Been there, done that.

I know some of these people though. They are happy not to set a precedent (and can afford it). They also tend to get the price that they DO want, and hence holding out offers a better return than dropping their pants in panic.

[Darrel]

A very valuable asset that stops estate agents claiming that they have sold at higher prices than they have actually sold at.

Indeed. And discourages vendors from fixing absurdly high asking prices.

Both being among the reasons why it isnt likely to happen here any time soon. Transparency regarding property prices would upset a lot of people here, I think.

I have made good use of the register in the UK.

[xylophone]

Quote by W11guy, "I read an interesting article that outlined just what you said. But these were rental properties, so even if they don't have mortgage, etc, they are still losing money by not renting. Even if they are super rich, it still makes more sense to have rent coming in than not. But other rentals are VERY negotiable".

Hmmm, sense and Thailand = an oxymoron as far as this sort of thing goes. Many, many empty apartments, shop houses,rooms and abandoned projects here, but still the building goes on at a fast pace. No rhyme nor reason to it.

[w11guy]

Quote by W11guy, "I read an interesting article that outlined just what you said. But these were rental properties, so even if they don't have mortgage, etc, they are still losing money by not renting. Even if they are super rich, it still makes more sense to have rent coming in than not. But other rentals are VERY negotiable".

Hmmm, sense and Thailand = an oxymoron as far as this sort of thing goes. Many, many empty apartments, shop houses,rooms and abandoned projects here, but still the building goes on at a fast pace. No rhyme nor reason to it.

But that's true all over the world, and certainly in the UK and Europe. In the last UK housing boom there were thousands of empty apartments, yet developers kept building more and more. Same in Bulgaria, same in Ireland, same in Spain, same in lots of places. So definitely not a Thai thing.

I think people on these forum are to quick to knock things in Thailand and claim they are a Thai problem, when in fact the same problem exists worldwide.

Doesn't look like I'll get any sensible answers to my original post. I suppose this was the wrong place to ask.

[Darrel]

Doesn't look like I'll get any sensible answers to my original post. I suppose this was the wrong place to ask.

Which part of my answer wasnt sensible?

The answer is "no, there is no way of finding out how much property actually sells for".

What else do you want to know?

[samran]

Doesn't look like I'll get any sensible answers to my original post. I suppose this was the wrong place to ask.

Which part of my answer wasnt sensible?

Perhaps this bit?

Hmmm, sense and Thailand = an oxymoron as far as this sort of thing goes.

Pretty offensive. Hardly true.

The stereotype is that Thai's are either stupid or money hungry so and so's expert at ripping you off. You can't be both.

[PattayaPhom]

The OP states he wants a 20% discount...so even if a condo is 50% less than the others advertised would he still demand a 20% discount just for the sake of it?...He moans about greedy vendors and landlords yet he is happy to pay 70K sqm for a 50sqm condo and wants AT LEAST 8% yield, so probably 10%....that then equates to a monthly rental of almost 30K a month for a 50sqm condo........hmm...whats that saying...talk about calling the kettle black. Sometimes a real bargain does appear as the seller is desperate but just to want a 20% discount befor even contemplating anywhere seems a bit inappropriate.

[w11guy]

Doesn't look like I'll get any sensible answers to my original post. I suppose this was the wrong place to ask.

Which part of my answer wasnt sensible?

The answer is "no, there is no way of finding out how much property actually sells for".

What else do you want to know?

Darrel/Samran - I wasn't referring to your answers, so I should have made that clear. I was hoping for more of an intelligent overall debate from people who have already invested in BKK, what worked, what didn't etc. But I feel the overall answers are mainly 'buy in Pattaya' because there are Russians there and don't expect anything sensible because this is Thailand. Not what I was hoping for. I have nothing against Pattaya, because i have never been there. And I don't think Thais create any worse property problems than people in other countries.

[w11guy]

The OP states he wants a 20% discount...so even if a condo is 50% less than the others advertised would he still demand a 20% discount just for the sake of it?...He moans about greedy vendors and landlords yet he is happy to pay 70K sqm for a 50sqm condo and wants AT LEAST 8% yield, so probably 10%....that then equates to a monthly rental of almost 30K a month for a 50sqm condo........hmm...whats that saying...talk about calling the kettle black. Sometimes a real bargain does appear as the seller is desperate but just to want a 20% discount befor even contemplating anywhere seems a bit inappropriate.

If you read my OP properly, you'll see that I'm looking for a discount of at least 20%, so this covers the 50% you mentioned. I have come up with this figure using my past experience and what I know other successful investors have done that has worked. It's not a cast iron rule, and of course I will look at any good opportunity. But I've only been in Thailand for about a year and I only invest in places I know. So I'm only interested in BKK. I'm sorry if that upsets you. If Pattaya is so booming and so great, then you don't need me, so invest there yourself and stop complaining.

I haven't moaned about greedy landlords and vendors at all. Can you actually read and comprehend English? I have just stated that I don't understand why some keep prices high and leave their properties empty instead of renting/selling them at a lower prices. This is just the law of supply and demand. I doesn't bother me at all that they properties are empty. I just think it would be better for them if they dropped the prices and made some money.

You don't seem to be able to comprehend that i am looking for something quite specific. My investing rules have worked quite well in a few countries so I see no reason for them not to work here. The 8% yield has to be there in a market like this, otherwise there is a danger that the investment will lose money. Many think that property prices in BKK could drop 10-20% in the next year or two, so a 20% discount is essential, just so that I don't end up in negative equity. If I can't get 8% yield, then there is no point buying because I can get close to that elsewhere without the hassle. Rental prices could easily drop a fair amount over the coming couple of years and an 8% yield could easily drop to 5-6%. Even with 8%, you end up with 4-5% after taking account of costs, void periods, etc. So if I started with a 5% yield and it dropped to 2-3%, then I could be making a loss after costs.

Others are free to invest how they want, but this is my money and my rules. I don't listen to what property developers and estate agent types say, as I have mostly found their advice to be sadly lacking. They are interested in selling property. My job is in investing my money according to my rules.

And by the way, I have seen a property at under 70k/sqm and that has a yield over 8%, but it is a very large 2-bed, so over my budget. So I know these bargains exist. But estate agent and property developer types would prefer that no-one knew these bargains existed, as then it is easier to flog their overpriced properties. In my opinion there are too many overpriced, poor quality condos for sale in BKK. to me, these aren't investment properties. And before you say it, it's nothing about greed. It's just an observation on the property market. Generally, property in BKK is much more expensive than comparable properties in major European cities if you compare to the average wage in that city. I can see no good reason for this and that leads me to the conclusion that property here is somewhat overpriced, which makes getting it at a minimum 20% discount pretty essential.

So apologies for not rocking up to Pattaya and handing over a wad of cash for your properties. You'll have to work a bit harder and get someone else to hand over their cash instead.

Edited August 13, 2011 by w11guy

[Darrel]

Doesn't look like I'll get any sensible answers to my original post. I suppose this was the wrong place to ask.

Which part of my answer wasnt sensible?

Perhaps this bit?

Hmmm, sense and Thailand = an oxymoron as far as this sort of thing goes.

Pretty offensive. Hardly true.

But not my quote anyway. So not really my fault, I think.

[samran]

But not my quote anyway. So not really my fault, I think.

You are correct.

Many apologies for attributing that to you. Need to get better with the multi-quoting!

[london]

The OP states he wants a 20% discount...so even if a condo is 50% less than the others advertised would he still demand a 20% discount just for the sake of it?...He moans about greedy vendors and landlords yet he is happy to pay 70K sqm for a 50sqm condo and wants AT LEAST 8% yield, so probably 10%....that then equates to a monthly rental of almost 30K a month for a 50sqm condo........hmm...whats that saying...talk about calling the kettle black. Sometimes a real bargain does appear as the seller is desperate but just to want a 20% discount befor even contemplating anywhere seems a bit inappropriate.

If you read my OP properly, you'll see that I'm looking for a discount of at least 20%, so this covers the 50% you mentioned. I have come up with this figure using my past experience and what I know other successful investors have done that has worked. It's not a cast iron rule, and of course I will look at any good opportunity. But I've only been in Thailand for about a year and I only invest in places I know. So I'm only interested in BKK. I'm sorry if that upsets you. If Pattaya is so booming and so great, then you don't need me, so invest there yourself and stop complaining.

I haven't moaned about greedy landlords and vendors at all. Can you actually read and comprehend English? I have just stated that I don't understand why some keep prices high and leave their properties empty instead of renting/selling them at a lower prices. This is just the law of supply and demand. I doesn't bother me at all that they properties are empty. I just think it would be better for them if they dropped the prices and made some money.

You don't seem to be able to comprehend that i am looking for something quite specific. My investing rules have worked quite well in a few countries so I see no reason for them not to work here. The 8% yield has to be there in a market like this, otherwise there is a danger that the investment will lose money. Many think that property prices in BKK could drop 10-20% in the next year or two, so a 20% discount is essential, just so that I don't end up in negative equity. If I can't get 8% yield, then there is no point buying because I can get close to that elsewhere without the hassle. Rental prices could easily drop a fair amount over the coming couple of years and an 8% yield could easily drop to 5-6%. Even with 8%, you end up with 4-5% after taking account of costs, void periods, etc. So if I started with a 5% yield and it dropped to 2-3%, then I could be making a loss after costs.

Others are free to invest how they want, but this is my money and my rules. I don't listen to what property developers and estate agent types say, as I have mostly found their advice to be sadly lacking. They are interested in selling property. My job is in investing my money according to my rules.

And by the way, I have seen a property at under 70k/sqm and that has a yield over 8%, but it is a very large 2-bed, so over my budget. So I know these bargains exist. But estate agent and property developer types would prefer that no-one knew these bargains existed, as then it is easier to flog their overpriced properties. In my opinion there are too many overpriced, poor quality condos for sale in BKK. to me, these aren't investment properties. And before you say it, it's nothing about greed. It's just an observation on the property market. Generally, property in BKK is much more expensive than comparable properties in major European cities if you compare to the average wage in that city. I can see no good reason for this and that leads me to the conclusion that property here is somewhat overpriced, which makes getting it at a minimum 20% discount pretty essential.

So apologies for not rocking up to Pattaya and handing over a wad of cash for your properties. You'll have to work a bit harder and get someone else to hand over their cash instead.

I read your response and I had to put my 2 cents worth in.

You state that you are "looking for a discount of AT LEAST 20%" on what I assume is the market price of a unit. This, frankly, is totally unrealistic. If units in Condo X sell for 4 million for the type you are looking for, no-one will sell for 3.2 million. It just doesn't happen here, based on my 15 years in Bangkok...or nearly anywhere else on the planet UNLESS the WHOLE development is heading south....then you wouldn't want to buy in at any price.

You then really have to determine what is a fair and reasonable price. Having invested in property for over 30 years, I have always found that buying at a fair and reasonable price leaves everyone feeling good about the sale and you are more likely to do well out of renting a unit that is not discounted, but a desirable investment.

Re the "High Prices" here: Thais just don't sell at a loss. Its a cultural fact. If they have bought a property for "x" amount, then I have yet to hear of any prepared to sell at a discount...even if they are in financial difficulty. That is not to say it doesn't happen, its just that I have never heard of it.

For all members of ThaiVisa who have been reading and contributing to the Real Estate forum, believe me, we have heard for the last 8 years from some that Bangkok property is set for a decline (or crash) of 10%, 20%, 30% !! It hasn't happened yet.

Sure, there is a possibility of it happening and many other things too, but its more likely to be a non appreciation in prices rather than a crash.

I am particularly interested in your 8% yield. "If I can't get 8% yield, then there is no point buying because I can get close to that elsewhere without the hassle"

Where have you/are you currently investing that gives you an 8% gross yield?

This is spectacular and I for one would be interested in hopping on board IF ITS IN REAL ESTATE. If its in Term Deposits etc, then that is a totally different investment strategy (that I have funds in already).

However, again, logically speaking, if an owner has a property that is yielding 6%, why would he be interested in dropping his price 20% giving the buyer a yield of 7.5% ? On your figure of 8%, based on a property with an asking price of say 4 million, at 3.2 million (20% discount) the yield is a remarkable 10%.

You also mention "I have seen a property at under 70k/sqm and that has a yield over 8%, but it is a very large 2-bed, so over my budget" Can I ask where? I would be interested IF it is CURRENTLY let at that figure.

I am also quite intrigued by your statement "Generally, property in BKK is much more expensive than comparable properties in major European cities if you compare to the average wage in that city" Really ?

The average salary here for an office worker is around 12,000 baht per month. These people would buy a condo for around 1- 1.5 million making it a multiple of under 7 times annual earnings for a 1 million baht apartment and around 10.4 times for a 1.5 million baht apartment, which are what this demographic buys. Certainly, I cannot think of a "major European city" where you can buy property at these multiples.

I think that you may be comparing what you perceive to be the wage here for people buying condos that YOU would be prepared to live in in comparison to what they actually buy.

For the record, I do own properties in Bangkok.

Frankly, from my experience, if you want to invest in anything, buy what you can afford and don't be greedy. By that I mean don't bargain down so much that the seller feels hard done by, and don't chase too high a return. Time will always look after that for you. It has always done so for me.

Good luck with your search.

[w11guy]

London - thanks for that detailed reply - it's very helpful. Here are some comments on the points raised.

First of all I don't think it's unrealistic to get a 20% discount. I know this is some time ago, but the first property I ever bought in London I offered over 25% below the asking price and my offer was accepted. The apartment had been on the market for over a year. I'm not saying this is at all common but it is what I am looking for. I may never find it, but I know plenty of people that have had similar discounts. It takes extra work to find these offers, but they are available. But if someone had a condo for sale for 5m baht, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't just say ok if I offered 4m baht. But there are plenty of distressed sellers around these days and they would rather get 4m than wait a year or two for 5m. I don't intend to beat them down on price and make them fee bad, but if they are offering a condo at 20% discount for a very quick sale, then I'm not going to offer more than they've asked just to make them feel better.

But herein lies the problem. As you have pointed out, Thais don't like to take a loss on their property, so if there are condos for sale for 5m and not selling and then a farang wants to leave Thailand and only wants 4m for his condo, then which price is 'real'. the 4m condo may be the true market price and may not be discounted at all. This also leads to another point that you raise about people always saying that property prices will drop but they never do. I tend to agree with you here, because it's just something that is always said. But if Thais never sell at a loss, then this gives a very distorted view of prices. If condos sold for 5m and then there was a property crash, but people still tried to sell at 5m, then it may not be obvious that there is a property crash. All this means is that sellers are asking inflated prices. This doesn't mean that the true value hasn't drop. For me, the real price is what you could realistically sell for if you need to sell fairly quickly, in say 3-6 months. If a 5m condo has been on sale for 2 years and still hasn't sold, then it is clearly not worth that much, even if the owner paid 5m for it and holds out for 10 years until they get it. From what I've seen myself there is a huge amount of unsold condos that have been empty for years. This to me means over supply and downward pressure on prices.

But I think the problem here is that there is no reliable way to know what prices condos sold at. I'm pretty sure that what I read in the press is the prices on new condos, so those are advertised prices and not the prices that they were actually sold at. So how does anyone know if prices are going up or down? For example, if you bought a condo 5 years ago for 5m and you now think it's worth 7m, could you actually sell it for that price in 3-6 months? There has to be a way to exit the market.

All this kind of reminds me of some people who buy shares when they are £5, but when the price drops to £3 they claim they haven't lost any money because they won't sell them until they're above £5. And they will stick to this even if they own them for 20 years and die before selling them. LOL.

I will try to find the details of the condo I saw at a reduced price. I remember reading it and think it was interesting, but it didn't suit me, so I ignored it. It wasn't rented out though. I just worked out the yield by using current rental prices in the building. Of course, if there were no many empty units in the building it may not have been possible to let out at that price, or at all. I will definitely try to find it, but it was about 3-6 months ago so may be sold by now.

The first rental property I ever bought in the UK (in a dodgy area) had a yield of 25%. I know things have changed, but I think a yield as 5% isn't taking into account the true risk involved. Yes it may be ok for years to come, but when it ends people will realise that it wasn't so good after all. Maybe I am just more cautious than most. But if you're not getting 8-10%, then what's the point? Just seems to low to me for all the hassle involved.

I'm not getting 8% elsewhere. But my London property has a yield of 6-7%. I'd have to borrow against that to buy here, so no point borrowing to make 5% yield here. Especially with added currency risks, etc.

You have given me plenty to think about and maybe this isn't for me just yet. I'll do a bit more research and see what I come up with. I'm still at an early stage and still have my doubts about the market here. In particular, I read that farang buyers are down form around 40% to under 20% in the last few years. This is bound to have a big effect on farangs trying to sell, as there are less other farangs to buy their properties from them.

One final point. I did read about people buying condos in older buildings and renovating for resale or rent. Do you think this is a viable option?

[trogers]

I'm not getting 8% elsewhere. But my London property has a yield of 6-7%. I'd have to borrow against that to buy here, so no point borrowing to make 5% yield here. Especially with added currency risks, etc.

One final point. I did read about people buying condos in older buildings and renovating for resale or rent. Do you think this is a viable option?

It is possible to get over 8% net rental yield (after deducting maintenance and agency fee) for studio and 1-bedroom units if you buy into older projects and self-renovate them.

[KRS1]

Go into a bank and ask for a list of bank owned properties.

Look into the Srinakarin area, i have a condo that is for sale in that area and it is currently undergoing major development with bridges and widened roads as well as a tunnel and mini shopping mall. This area is booming for sure, and you will not lose.

[w11guy]

I'm not getting 8% elsewhere. But my London property has a yield of 6-7%. I'd have to borrow against that to buy here, so no point borrowing to make 5% yield here. Especially with added currency risks, etc.

One final point. I did read about people buying condos in older buildings and renovating for resale or rent. Do you think this is a viable option?

It is possible to get over 8% net rental yield (after deducting maintenance and agency fee) for studio and 1-bedroom units if you buy into older projects and self-renovate them.

Do you know a good place to start looking for these types of condos? Or is it a matter of just visiting some older buildings and asking what's for sale?

[w11guy]

Go into a bank and ask for a list of bank owned properties.

Look into the Srinakarin area, i have a condo that is for sale in that area and it is currently undergoing major development with bridges and widened roads as well as a tunnel and mini shopping mall. This area is booming for sure, and you will not lose.

By bank-owned properties, do you mean repossessions? What usually happens to repossessed properties in Bangkok - do they get auctioned or sold privately? What banks give out these lists? Sounds like it could be interesting.

[samran]

All banks do it, many have them on their websites.

Plenty of cr@p on them, but the odd gem.