Thai Student Nazi Dress-Up Day Causes Outrage

[aechzen]

She was followed by a procession of pupils dressed as SS guards - brandishing plastic machine guns.

SICK, I'm lost for words but that is sick

not forget they show fashion , and perhabs the nazi style was a fancy style ,thai people like military style and the german in the 1930 -45 was the famouse military fashion style in this time.. they are not in heart and soul nazis (,maybe they dont like jews and farang,) And if not russia , usa ,france and british would was won the war, we would be talk all german ,and this to all farang teacher: please work a lot because !! Arbeit macht frei

if they would wear Pol pots Khmer Rouge style ,but looks not fancy

or the japan military style of the 1930 the kill a lot of chineses, looks no fancy too

but the most of farang knows hitlers nazi ,but the dont knows abouth asian wars

this is sad

my grandfather dies in a concentration camp in austria

he fall drunken from the guard wall

Edited September 27, 2011 by aechzen

[ralphlsasser]

It's sad that these children had no idea of the implications of these costumes, nor were aware of the acts committed by the Nazis. But we should ask ourselves, before we condemn the Thai educational system, how many secondary school pupils in the UK or anywhere in the west are aware for example of the Japanese actions in China throughout the 1930s?.

Also. the original report was in the Daily Wail! Try this:www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail

It's certainly taught in American schools.

[PattayaParent]

It's the Daily Fail <deleted>.

they're probably just regurgitating that old story from 2 years ago 'cos it's a slow news day.

[humonster]

Why are the sentences there twice? Why are the sentences there twice?

[ratcatcher]

Well I have met many Thais who think England and Germany are suburbs in London. London of course is in America

Actually it's in southern Ontario, Canada, which as we all know is that large blob on top of The Untied States of America.

[somchai jones]

Shock horror....those nasty Thais are at it again!

Surely it's obvious that these kids were doing this for the comic value in their ignorance? A poor choice of costume in my opinion for obvious reasons.

However, Allo, Allo - one of the most popular British sitcoms ever, was still running up until 1992 and had a reunion special episode as late as 2007.

It parodied Nazi officers occupying France and showed them in full Nazi regalia.

Also, anyone remember when Prince Harry turned up at a fancy dress party in 2005 dressed as a Nazi wearing a swastika armband?

Whislt there was initial outrage at his conduct, after he apologised for his gaffe, the general concensus was that the exhuberance and ignorance of his youth was to blame.

My point? Whilst I totally disagree with the choice of costumes that the students made, I certainly am not rushing forward to condemn them as evil.

Also, I'm not rushing forward to use this event as another excuse to slam Thailand.

The Daily Mail readers amongst the ex-pat populace here will do no doubt though. Oh well.....

[uptheos]

Do they know that if Hitler had his ways they'd be considered as second class monkeys on the scale of mankind?

This is a very important point you are making and one that should be drilled into the student's.

They would probably be slaves, exterminated or used for medical experiments.

[Arkady]

Perhaps the student got the idea from Captain Harry Pothead, third in line to the English crown

or this billboard from Pattaya in 2009 that reads, "Hitler is not yet dead"

I heard there is another Nazi Bar in Bangkok but not sure where. The last one in Silom Road in the 90s that featured waiters in SS uniforms was extremely popular but was eventually forced to change its name following protests from Jewish groups and the Israeli Embassy.

Edited September 27, 2011 by Arkady

[Ta22]

History is selective , and we choose to select what we want to see . or related to us ..

Don't let hate over run you , cos it would stop you from being kind and progress .

Human is really not as wise and caring as we all think , while a small collective soul of good doer try hard to better man kind .

many time we choose to forget history and pretend or only want to see one side of the story . DO not ingore or hate history . learn from it .

Many country did many wrong and many country try to white washes their wrong . but at the end of the days we share One earth .

Both wrong does not make one right .

Look at the world now , In Iraq Afghanistan

--------------------------------------------------

here some info i would like to share .

--------------------------------------------------

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_events_named_massacres

From history we see that seriously Human is to Blame . Learn from our mistake .

-----------------------------------------

http://www.unknownnews.org/casualties.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

---------------------------------

We call it Casualties or collateral damage Now .

[ralphlsasser]

i'm sick of reading this, i'm a 1960 generation, now we have 2011.

get over it.

I'm also 1960's born; and when something as massive as this was happens in history, I hardly think "get over it" is the appropriate response. Just as a matter of interest what nationality are you and how many people in your family were affected?

I was born right after WW11 and I remember my father telling me the horrible stories of what the Germans did. We should NEVER forget. If talking about it makes cmsally sick, he should look at the pictures that are available. THEN he would have something to get sick about.

Edited September 27, 2011 by ralphlsasser

[tigerbeer]

some well known western countries also have shit education systems with them not knowing anything about other countries, let alone the history of their own country. certainly not exclusive to Thailand.

[Card]

I see brainless farangs wearing German WW2 helmets on their big penis extenders in Pattaya all the time. Still, the consolation is that they won't give much protection if they fall off head first.

Edited September 27, 2011 by Card

[smokie36]

Kid 1: Let's wear something outrageous that they'll never forget!

Kid 2: I have an idea..........

Simple as that.

They know what it represents all right but they don't have parents or grandparents who lived through and experienced war first hand, therefore have no real idea of the depth of anger such imagery provokes.

Same as most western kids nowadays I suspect.

[SAffer]

i'm sick of reading this, i'm a 1960 generation, now we have 2011.

get over it.

I guess there would be an outcry if the students dressed like Count Dracula too right? I mean, we can't go around saying that only the Nazis are taboo now can we?

[yugobrian]

I am really tired of the anti-Thai posts which re-occur with regularity in these forums. Thai students don't know European history. Well, I can assure you that European and American students don't know Asian history. So the difference is what? And if you've lived in Thailand for even a short period, you should know that the swastika does not mean Nazi Germany - so no, the BTS clerk is not a Nazi sympathizer. He's just hoping for some good luck and, at the amount of money he makes, he needs some.

On the other hand, parading before the school in uniforms of whatever kind (German, French, English, American) carrying toy machine guns is another issue.

[robokop]

Wow, people are shocked, and with good reason. These same kids and others throughout Thailand and other countries are exposed to the unaware praising of a well known murderer,Che Chevera. T-shirts of Chevera are on display for sale all over, yet no outrage over the honoring of a butcher leader from Cuba. Chevera, and Marxist, was the right hand man for Fidel Castro and was personally responsible for the murder and executions of hundreds of Cubans, yet people wear his T shirts, many not having a clue who the person on their t-shirt really is, the same as the students at the Thai school. I have asked numerous people over the years if they knew who the person was that was shown on the t-shirt they were wearing-none knew is was the butcher of Cuba, Che Chevera. So let us not be so quick on condemming these students while many in our presence unknowingly praise a butcher of people, Che Chevera

Or as many say'Che who?"

[cmsally]

i'm sick of reading this, i'm a 1960 generation, now we have 2011.

get over it.

I'm also 1960's born; and when something as massive as this was happens in history, I hardly think "get over it" is the appropriate response. Just as a matter of interest what nationality are you and how many people in your family were affected?

I was born right after WW11 and I remember my father telling me the horrible stories of what the Germans did. We should NEVER forget. If talking about it makes cmsally sick, he should look at the pictures that are available. THEN he would have something to get sick about.

Whoa hang on a minute. I was replying to someone else called "huuwi". He was the person it made sick. For me it is the contrary, I said:

"I'm also 1960's born; and when something as massive as this was happens in history, I hardly think "get over it" is the appropriate response. Just as a matter of interest what nationality are you and how many people in your family were affected?"

[anon7867763]

i'm sick of reading this, i'm a 1960 generation, now we have 2011.

get over it.

Ditto , if anyone dresses up for fun as Ghengis Khan or Idi Amin its totally acceptable so why not as a Nazi ?.The teachers kids surely didn't mean any harm.

[AbdulJabaar01]

Not again......

Fuhrer furore! Thai student Nazi dress-up day causes outrage

Foreign parents and teachers appalled by the costumes

Thai teachers 'did not understand' the controversy

School asked to put the Holocaust on the curriculum

Was there not a similar incident a few years ago concerning students dressing up like Nazi’s? What ever happened?

Now, the school I work at start out each day, with the country’s flag raising ceremony. The song they use sounds almost identical to the Nazi Germany’s song.

Thai’s are taught to be Nationalist from the first day they enter school. – Thai Nazi’s.

Overall, Nazism (National Socialism) isn’t a bad idea. It works in some ways, but concerning the holocaust – not good.

[Card]

i'm sick of reading this, i'm a 1960 generation, now we have 2011.

get over it.

I'm also 1960's born; and when something as massive as this was happens in history, I hardly think "get over it" is the appropriate response. Just as a matter of interest what nationality are you and how many people in your family were affected?

Get overit, you are lucky to be here to make that comment.

The problem is that thai education does not cover world history that happened over the hills and far away, why did they not pick japanese flags and uniforms? Probably did not want to remember the occupation perhaps or their parents thought Japanese would not be a good idea and leave it at that, dont ask questions!!

Do agree about the fashion bit though and its true that the Swaztika was also a good luck sign, just not too lucky for Adolf thank you very much.

The German and Japanese people today are very different people to the ones of the WW2 time and it must be difficlut and embarassing for them too.

Re: the Japanese - they didn't consider themselves occupied during WW2 and they always maintained good relations with the occupying forces - they still have a memorial to the fallen Japanese soldiers in Northern Thailand. After all, it was the Japanese who helped them recover some territory lost to the French colonists and the biggest memorial to that conflict is the Victory monument in Bangkok. But if u ask ANY Thai, even those (as I did) running the Military museum in Bangkok, what the Victory monument is all about, they won't have a clue, literally.

[Arkady]

Do they know that if Hitler had his ways they'd be considered as second class monkeys on the scale of mankind?

This is a very important point you are making and one that should be drilled into the student's.

They would probably be slaves, exterminated or used for medical experiments.

Indeed. Thais were classified as "coloureds" under apartheid in South Africa. No doubt Hitler would have viewed them no differently from his Afrikaner brothers.

[mitrapaap]

I can remember seeing a Swastika badge on the shirt of a BTS station cashier/clerk a few months ago. You can see them on bags , T-shirts, Even on the painted company buses that are everywhere, Clearly WW2 was something missing from the ciriculum in Thailand

The swastika is a religious symbols, don't mix it up with the nazi swastika. See the link in my earlier post.

While I agree with you and may want to give them some credit on the swastika and their ignorance about the european side of world war two, plastic machine guns are NOT a religious symbol nor are army or SS uniforms. So the question is how can they pretend using the swastika as a religious symbol and not as the german "Hakenkreuz" while at the same time dressing in the german's uniform and carrying plastic guns. It just doesn't add up.

A very sad incident. Not because it shows ignorance of european history (how much do we learn about Asian history in school?)but because it is ununderstandable for me how kids can find it fancy and/or funny to dress in military uniforms and holding guns. That is the real issue in my humble opinion. And even though I'm not German, I think it would be good to given the Germans a break from their own history. No need to stir it up again and again through such silly actions. Even the worst history should sometime become history.

[doji]

This is seen as insensitive to *western* culture, ... et alors? WWII for Thailand was all about Japan, not Germany and the holocaust.

Now for a catholic school, certainly the teacher(s) following the students' work should have known better.

It is a good lesson for the Thai students in cultural sensitivity, but the outrage seen here is, perhaps, overdone. (IMHO).

Others have made good points, Japan/China/1930s, religious symbols, etc...

True at that....WWII was all about Japan. To the thais, what happened at Nanking is more shocking than the holocaust.

I wonder, how many westeners, kids or adults, have even heard of the name Nanking.....talking about the knowledge of world history from their education system...hmm

Edited September 27, 2011 by doji

[DiamondKing]

Perhaps the student got the idea from Captain Harry Pothead, third in line to the English crown

or this billboard from Pattaya in 2009 that reads, "Hitler is not yet dead"

I heard there is another Nazi Bar in Bangkok but not sure where. The last one in Silom Road in the 90s that featured waiters in SS uniforms was extremely popular but was eventually forced to change its name following protests from Jewish groups and the Israeli Embassy.

Just be thankful of the freedom of speech you have to refer to him with those derogatory terms cause you know where you would be if you did the same to the Thai Monarchy.

DK

[visionary]

I think that the students were trying to make a valid point. There is little or no difference between Hitlers Nazis and todays UN and Euro- American imperialist atrocities. When the final death tolls of our atrocities in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and other nations are tallied, future generations will consider Hitlers atrocities nominal compared to ours.

[Thai at Heart]

I have just asked 4 Thai teaching colleagues ( all fairly young in age) what their understanding/knowledge of Nazis / Atrocities / Jews is.

Two gave the comments Dictator, Fascists, Military and Genius. When asked about what they knew of atrocities and the Jews, hey just shrugged and said they did not know much at all really.

And that was it end of conversation with Thai English Language Teachers.

Just about sums up the fact that the Thai teachers in Chiang Mai were totally oblivious to the extent of the offence that this would cause, but then they did not know what the students were doing by parading the uniforms,and why should they really, when it is not taught in the schools and probably never has been an issue for the Thais who, as I maybe naively understand , where largely unaffected by the Germans during WW2. So why would the kids of today fully understand the implications and feel the need to carry out an in depth research on the subject. After all, the Thais in education ( and their teachers before them) are well known for copying and rote learning in their academic studies, so when they see pics of german soldiers, in what many people over time have openly acknowledged as very stylish, smart uniforms, they do not know any different, other than to copy the images without delving into what its consequences are exactly.

Maybe this ignorance on the part of many Thais at many academic levels does need to be addressed, but in my opinion if you try to convince them of their ignorance, you will find yourselves banging your heads against brick walls. After all you cannot convince them that the corruption which is so endemic in their own country is what is largely holding their own country back in 3rd World status, so why would they worry about something that happened largely in a part of the world far far away and such a long long time ago.

All very true. However, the issue is that the idea of racial superiority has been so well debunked, and the patent atrocities it has caused mean that people should be aware of its dangers for a society, a country, a region or the world. Of course, we won't go down the road of wondering why we are now going down the road in Thailand wondering why it is perceived that so many in Thailand largely look down their noses at those from the north east who are ethnically Laos shall we?

Why should they care? Because exterminating people on the basis of ethnicity is basically evil, morally sick, and something that as a rule shouldn't be celebrated. This isn't unique to Europeans, it is something that all human beings should understand.

[Maseratimartin]

It's sad that these children had no idea of the implications of these costumes, nor were aware of the acts committed by the Nazis. But we should ask ourselves, before we condemn the Thai educational system, how many secondary school pupils in the UK or anywhere in the west are aware for example of the Japanese actions in China throughout the 1930s?.

Also. the original report was in the Daily Wail! Try this:www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail

If nobody would care it would not be a problem...come on...it's over...why make always a drama of it?

Wearing a shirt with the US flag is also ok. Forgot the vietnam war? ....or the two atomic bombs on Japan? Is this better?

The oil war in Irak?

Everybody has dirt on his fingers...

Why should they not do what holliwood movie maker can do in their movies?

I do not say it was ok what happened...but look in the future and stop whining!

[Arkady]

Re: the Japanese - they didn't consider themselves occupied during WW2 and they always maintained good relations with the occupying forces - they still have a memorial to the fallen Japanese soldiers in Northern Thailand. After all, it was the Japanese who helped them recover some territory lost to the French colonists and the biggest memorial to that conflict is the Victory monument in Bangkok. But if u ask ANY Thai, even those (as I did) running the Military museum in Bangkok, what the Victory monument is all about, they won't have a clue, literally.

The Japanese also supported the Thai seizure of territory in British Burma over the border from Mae Sai. Field Marshall Pibul, Thai leader during the war years and post-war period, was a big fan of the European and Japanese fascist movements, as was Aung San Su Kyu's father in Burma - he spent part of the war in Japan.

The idea of changing the country's name from Siam to Thailand in the late 30s was part of this nationalist mindset which claimed the Burmese territory on the grounds that "Tai Yai" who speak a Thai dialect live there. They were unfortunately not so inclusive towards other ethnic groups in Thailand. Malays in the South were treated as untermenschen, as is still the case today, and discriminatory measures were also enacted against the Chinese which have proved far less successful.

Edited September 27, 2011 by Arkady

[andrewdrummond]

Do they know that if Hitler had his ways they'd be considered as second class monkeys on the scale of mankind?

This is a very important point you are making and one that should be drilled into the student's.

They would probably be slaves, exterminated or used for medical experiments.

Indeed. Thais were classified as "coloureds" under apartheid in South Africa. No doubt Hitler would have viewed them no differently from his Afrikaner brothers.

As expected the Simon Wiesenthal Center in LA has now reacted

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/view-story.php?sid=445

[A_Traveller]

Link to Simon Wiessenthal Centre statement [27 September]

Regards

PS See Mr Drummond was in parallel.

Edited September 27, 2011 by A_Traveller