Tulsi joins the party of Common Sense

[webfact]

Apple's new device is iPhone 4S

San Francisco

Apple unveiled its first iPhone of the post-Steve Jobs era on Tuesday, but underwhelmed its fans with an update to the existing iPhone 4 rather than a widely anticipated iPhone5.

The so-called iPhone 4S will run on Apple’s A5 chip, which can also be found in the iPad 2. It features an 8-megapixel camera, improved battery life and two antennas to improve call quality. It will run Apple’s new mobile operating system iOS5 and feature what Apple called an "intelligent assistant" called Siri, which responds to voice commands and questions in English, French and German.

"What we really want to do is just talk to our device," Apple marketing chief Phil Schiller said, showing how the new device can read email messages and texts, find local restaurants, take dictation and answer questions such as "Should I wear a raincoat today?"

While the new device featured many improvements over the current iPhone4, Apple fans and investors had been expecting a completely redesigned smartphone to help the company combat the growing marketshare of phones running Google’s Android operating system.

-- The Nation 2011-10-05

[nikster]

Looking at the numbers, I don't think Apple is at all concerned with the "growing market share" of Android phones.

It's a solid update that makes a lot of sense - in particular, as a world phone, it will probably be the first ever iPhone that's available in all countries, on all carriers. A really big deal in China.

Lots of people will be disappointed it's not an even shinier, new form factor iPhone - but let's face it, the iPhone 4 is still the best looking phone out there - the others have in some cases caught up in features, but in design, definitely not. With the internal upgrades it's also positioned with the best of the Android phones. Blows all of them away in the battery life dept., and in software.

The only thing it really needs is an upgraded maps app.

Siri voice recognition is probably going to be the most amazing feature you'll never use... at least for me. It's amazing technology, for sure. Others don't even come close. But ... I just can't imagine using it... it would have to be 100% accurate, and I don't think it can be. If it's doing what I want 99% of the time - that's not good enough.

[4evermaat]

Apple’s new iPhone 4S doesn't look all that different on the surface from the iPhone 4 it replaces. But the latest iPhone unveiled by Apple at a press event Tuesday promises an improved processor, new wireless system, and more powerful camera, along with voice control capabilities.

The iPhone 4S is available in black and white. The 16GB version is $199, a 32GB model is $299, and the 64GB edition is $399—each with a two-year contract. They’ll be available for pre-order on October 7, with the phone shipping a week later on October 14 on AT&T, Verizon, and newcomer Sprint, in the U.S., Canada, Australia, U.K., France, German, and Japan. The iPhone 4S will be available in more than 70 countries by the end of the year, Apple says. In unveiling the new iPhone, Apple senior vice president of worldwide product marketing Phil Schiller said that the iPhone 4S keeps the same 3.5-inch 960-by-640 Retina display, glass on front and back, and stainless steel band. Inside, however, it’s all new: The iPad’s A5 chip is now inside the iPhone 4S—that’s the Apple-designed, dual-core processor. Schiller says it offers graphics performance up to seven times faster than the iPhone 4's single-core A4 processor, and CPU performance up to twice as fast. Schiller said that with the new internals in the iPhone 4S, “you really see it scream… in games.”

The improved performance in the iPhone 4S doesn’t come at the expense of battery life. Schiller said that for the first time on an iPhone, you can expect eight hours of talk time on 3G, 14 hours of 2G talk time, six hours of 3G browsing, nine hours of Wi-Fi, ten hours of video, and 40 hours of listening to music..........

full article at macworld

[surayu]

555....please excuse the pun

[4evermaat]

thought I put the url link there to macworld article:

http://www.macworld.com/article/162650/2011/10/apple_unveils_iphone_4s.html?lsrc=newsalert

[sfokevin]

Looking at the numbers, I don't think Apple is at all concerned with the "growing market share" of Android phones.

It's a solid update that makes a lot of sense - in particular, as a world phone, it will probably be the first ever iPhone that's available in all countries, on all carriers. A really big deal in China.

I don't think Apple felt the need to release a major design release right now... Shortly they will release iOS5 - This will turn everybody's iPhone into a new machine... All the buzz until Xmas will be in Apple's Magical iCloud

[surayu]

I don't think Apple felt the need to release a major design release right now...

I hope one day they will have that feeling and start producing a phone where if you need to take off the battery out of your phone, you will be able to do it without voiding the warranty or having to take it to an engineer...i am sorry if that is too much to ask for

Actually, the list of the things that for any other phone's owners are quite normal and just given for granted, are forbidden by the apple...

The Iphone 4 is the one which take the cake anyway, a phone which stop working if you just touch the metal part of the case all around it, because a genius messed up with the internal antenna, great job Steve!

[nikster]

I don't think Apple felt the need to release a major design release right now...

Actually, the list of the things that for any other phone's owners are quite normal and just given for granted, are forbidden by the apple...

The Iphone 4 is the one which take the cake anyway, a phone which stop working if you just touch the metal part of the case all around it, because a genius messed up with the internal antenna, great job Steve!

did you read that somewhere?

The antenna issue was fixed a while ago - but the 4S apparently does one better and comes with 2 antennas for both incoming and outgoing, and the ability to dynamically switch antennas to the one with better reception. A first on any mobile phone. This should kill as far as reception is concerned.

One of the reasons the iPhone has the by far best battery life of any smartphone is that they're using all that space that you would normally need for battery latches, removable battery, mechanism to take it out and so on for... more battery. It's always a trade-off, and "more battery" is always the better choice. Goes for mobiles, and also computers. I don't know anyone who runs around with 2 batteries for their mobile. I once had 2 for my laptop and it turned out to be a waste because it then becomes an art to keep them both charged. An external charger would solve that - but how many people have both 2 batteries AND an external battery charger? Do you? I doubt it...

[surayu]

The antenna issue was fixed a while ago

The only way i know on how they find a fix for it, was to give you back all the money you spent for the purchase if you took back your phone in the first 30 days, so that means that all the unlucky people that would not find out the whom was the guilty one (the apple) for all those problems in the first 30 days would be stuck with the problem, while for all the others knowing about it but still wishing to buy it anyway, they did "fix" it by give you a plastic case so you would not be touching the metal, ahh ahh, yes a very professional choice

but how many people have both 2 batteries AND an external battery charger? Do you? I doubt it...

Well, that would be me (but also met many others that did the same), with my previouses Sony Ericsson and Nokia, now i would have to carry a whole set of technician's labs tools if i wanted to change the battery, so i don't, isn't that great? ohh and i forgot to add, i use to bring the charger also with me

[ThaiLife]

[nikster]

The antenna issue was fixed a while ago

The only way i know on how they find a fix for it, was to give you back all the money you spent....

Obviously you don't know enough, then?! Either way it wasn't much of a real world issue. Highest consumer satisfaction ratings by far, and most units sold should provide a pretty solid statistical background to that. Everything else is just opinions by people who don't actually have the phone - aka trolling.

Anyway this thread is about the 4S which has a completely new antenna.

Feel free to complain about the lack of swappable battery and external chargers though, that continues to be an ongoing non-issue for non-iPhone-owners... :jap:

[nikster]

+1 hehehe

I think iPhone 4 owners will be relieved. Now they can keep their phone and know they're not missing out... money saved! Only half kidding, it's nice when a product retains its value, and particularly nice and unexpected in a mobile phone that's over 1 year old.

Like I said I think the "revolution" in this one will be carrier availability. The fact that the market is flooded with Android devices selling everywhere and anywhere, and iPhones are comparatively hard to get, only from this or that dusty carrier shop, or grey market imports, is the iPhone's biggest disadvantage. A bit boring from a consumer perspective but exciting if you want to sell lots of units...

Oh, and software. But I don't dare to predict if that is really going to impact the average iPhone owner here in Thailand. Depends on how well it works and whether the features - cool as they are - are actually relevant in day to day life.

[surayu]

Obviously you don't know enough, then?! Either way it wasn't much of a real world issue. Highest consumer satisfaction ratings by far, and most units sold should provide a pretty solid statistical background to that. Everything else is just opinions by people who don't actually have the phone - aka trolling.

Anyway this thread is about the 4S which has a completely new antenna.

Feel free to complain about the lack of swappable battery and external chargers though, that continues to be an ongoing non-issue for non-iPhone-owners... :jap:

Ok, then you tell us why Apple actually taked those steps by either giving a full refund for the purchase or a free plastic cover, aknowledging the problem, obviously you know more then them as well....

Having the phone doesn't mean that you have to accept everything about it and even deny evidences(or call them facts if you prefere), who is really trolling here??? ehhrmm

[sfokevin]

I have never had a problem with reception or a dropped call on my iPhone 4... Maybe it's because I'm a lefty....

As for the battery that is a non issue too.. I would point out that 99% of the phones that have batteries that you can remove also have a chincy plastic cover to go wonky and a sim card slot behind the battery which is a PAIN IN THE ASS!!!

The one thing I don't understand is if the 4s is seven times faster than the 4 why couldn't they get Flash to run on it?

Edited October 6, 2011 by sfokevin

[nikster]

I have never had a problem with reception or a dropped call on my iPhone 4... Maybe it's because I'm a lefty....

As for the battery that is a non issue too.. I would point out that 99% of the phones that have batteries that you can remove also have a chincy plastic cover to go wonky and a sim card slot behind the battery which is a PAIN IN THE ASS!!!

The one thing I don't understand is if the 4s is seven times faster than the 4 why couldn't they get Flash to run on it?

+1

Flash: I think the 7 times faster is the graphics card - the processor is 2x faster. At a time when the whole web develops away from Flash, it's not a big deal anyway. I think Apple's lost interest a long time ago... maybe due to their negative experiences with Flash on the Mac. Which still sucks, by the way.

[EvilDrSomkid]

So, when is the 4S coming to Thailand and what will it cost?

[Kernow86]

So, when is the 4S coming to Thailand and what will it cost?

I read that the regular 4 will get upgraded to run on new software. Will the price of the 4 be reduced in Thailand?

[EvilDrSomkid]

Right, after googling a bit, looks like December at the earliest and at similar prices to the 4.

[EvilDrSomkid]

So, when is the 4S coming to Thailand and what will it cost?

Will the price of the 4 be reduced in Thailand?

Probably.

[Tywais]

Samsung targets iPhone 4S sales ban in France, Italy

(Reuters) - Samsung Electronics said it will file patent-infringement claims in France and Italy to ban the sale of Apple's new iPhone less than a day after it was unveiled, intensifying a legal battle between the two top brands.

It will also file legal cases in other countries to stop the sale of the iPhone 4S after further review, the South Korean maker of Galaxy smartphones and tablets said in a statement.

Samsung has emerged as a credible challenger to Apple's mobile devices and the two companies are battling over patents in courtrooms around the world. They have sued each other in 10 countries involving more than 20 cases since April.

Reuters

-- Reuters Oct. 05, 2011

[nikster]

So, when is the 4S coming to Thailand and what will it cost?

Will the price of the 4 be reduced in Thailand?

Probably.

Definitely.

It will be a whole lineup - my prediction based on the current prices:

3GS - cheapest 14k

4 - 8GB - next cheapest - 18k

4S - 16, 32, and 64 GB 22k, 26k, ???

[jybkk]

Looking at the numbers, I don't think Apple is at all concerned with the "growing market share" of Android phones.

Considering the latest patent war Apple is waging against Samsung, I'd say they are pretty concerned. Thinking they are safe would be a big mistake.

Nokia then RIM, once kings of their own market, did treat competition with contempt and I would be very surprised to see Apple repeat that.

Now the reason why this release is so conservative is still up to speculation.

Few theories I've heard here and there:

• They are having some trouble with the iPhone5 and prefer take some time to iron out the issues rather than ship something not perfect
• They want 4G technology to be really stable in the US and keep the iPhone5 until then, giving the iPhone4S for customers to wait a bit longer
• They want to milk the iPhone4 platform as much as possible

But the timing of the announcement of Steve Jobs' death is striking. It could be a complete coincidence, but I wouldn't be surprised if they planned a minor release so as not to mix-up big announcements with sad events.

All-in-all, I'm expecting a release with much more dramatic changes in a few months, rather than the usual yearly cycle.

[nikster]

Yeah the S is for "Steve"

Anyway I don't think anybody "planned" Jobs' death, may he RIP.

The patent war with Samsung is getting out of hand but I genuinely believe it is being waged in order to prevent others - not just Samsung - from blatantly copying Apple. Apple wants to make that harder.

As for the conservative release - well if the iPhone 5 was ready I am sure they'd ship it, so sure, it's clearly not ready. They did the same thing with the 3G and 3GS though so maybe it's just the general strategy. It's hard to assess the market when people are ripping devices out of your hands as fast as you can make them. Do they need an iPhone 5? Probably not as long as they're still selling every iPhone 4 they make, and are still struggling with demand.

One problem has been market presence - this is where Android utterly wipes the floor with Apple - any little shop has a plethora of Android devices, you can get multiple models on all carriers, from all vendors, etc. Apple likes to control its sales - they only sell via authorized dealers, their own stores, and partner carriers. With Android it's free for all.

Anyway they're always walking a fine line between making their phone more widely available and more attractive, and being able to fill orders...

Case in point: Pre-orders for the iPhone 4S started a few hours ago and the Apple store is more or less down - once you get to payment, things stop working. It's a challenge to scale sales for Apple...

[jybkk]

[...]

The patent war with Samsung is getting out of hand but I genuinely believe it is being waged in order to prevent others - not just Samsung - from blatantly copying Apple. Apple wants to make that harder.

[...]

Case in point: Pre-orders for the iPhone 4S started a few hours ago and the Apple store is more or less down - once you get to payment, things stop working. It's a challenge to scale sales for Apple...

There are good chances that you are right, but I would be more prudent.

Pre-orders have always been good for Apple and can't really be an indicator of the success (see the release of the "Cube", first weeks sales were crazy, then it all vanished)

I feel this release will later be seen as some kind of tipping point. The moment where the competition (mainly android but not only) has leveled up with Apple on all the crucial points.

I really believe the patent war declared by Apple is an admission of their worry rather than an attempt to protect their intellectual propery (after all, iOS5 has borrowed a lot from the competitors, and it would be pretty hypocritical from Apple to say they are the only ones who innovate).

The Germany design patent has to be one of the most ridiculous illustration of the farce that is the patenting system... Apple managed to basically patent anything rectangular with a glass front, and uphold it.

[nikster]

Disagree - look at tablets designed before and after the iPad - the competition is clearly copying Apple's designs.

Same for the iPhone - look at phones before and after. Notice something? Right. They all look like iPhones now. Except Microsofts Windows Phone which apparently went to lengths to look nothing like an iPhone. Doesn't seem to succeed in the market though.

That said, copying successful products, and taking design clues from others is normal in any industry. Of course they would. The court cases are about what's OK and what isn't and I have to agree that the laws used to fight this battle are for the most part simply idiotic. Unfortunately.

I think Samsung vs Apple is a bit like a divorce battle: Samsung made most of the core components of the iPhone and iPad, then started producing their own copycat devices... now they're throwing the lawyers at each other...

[jybkk]

I think we will agree to disagree.

There's a thin line between inspiration and copying. All sides are constantly playing around it, Including Apple.

When I read your answer, it sounds like Apple is the only one innovating and the other ones are only good at copying them. I'm not going to lecture you about innovation in design and technology, but once you start to look for who copies who, it's a chicken and egg situation. The only indisputable fact about the iPhone and iPad is that they brought to the masses technologies and solution that were so far relatively confidential.

Now it's up to you to continue thinking that 2011 is "the year of the copycats", but if you look carefully, it looks as if the copycat isn't the one we expected.

[nikster]

When I read your answer, it sounds like Apple is the only one innovating and the other ones are only good at copying them. I'm not going to lecture you about innovation in design and technology, but once you start to look for who copies who, it's a chicken and egg situation. ...

A chicken and egg situation?

Look at the pictures and make up your own mind:

iPad

iPhone

^ with the iPhone it was particularly blatant. Apple showed it off 6 months before release. At that time there was no touch screen phone on the market that worked without a stylus. there was also no capacitive touch screen phone on the market. Blackberry was very popular (so Android aped it instead of the iPhone)

After that presentation Nokia first said it couldn't be done; then they publicly announced their intention to copy it. Google meanwhile just worked away on Android and changed it from a BB-like OS to an iPhone-like OS....

Please note that I am not saying that this kind of copying should be illegal - I am not. I am just saying it was pretty much a one way street...

Edited October 8, 2011 by nikster

[snorkelador]

How can Apple claim they came up with a touch screen, when they use available technology developed by a different company? That this company happens to be Samsung makes the argument even funnier. Apart from that the idea of touch screens, including sliding stuff around was shown in various movies years before. Somebody just had to make it happen and that was more hinging on hardware than software. As to design claim, having a thin black frame around a display and a one button under it, is kind of really minimalistic and not really pushing the envelope to me. Done in a nice way, good finish and all yes, but having a patent on such a simple concept seems a bit of a stretch of imagination to me.

The reason the iPhone 5 has not been released yet is very simple: Samsung would have shot it down, due to patent infringements. Those legal battles are going both ways - surprise, surprise.

Regarding the picture of the before and after iPad, that joke getting a bit old, isn't it. There was another device before the iPad that was kept a bit more minimalistic. 9 years later