Hamas, Israel reach agreement on prisoner swap for captured soldier Shalit

[philw]

This is nothing to do with the 'Israeli's being there for their Soldiers. This deal could easily have been brokered 4 years ago. This deal has now been struck for purely political motives. Palestine is now on the table at the UN for what will ultimately boil down to observer status. The Israeli's clearly do not want that and have now pulled an ace from out of their sleeves to be seen as playing 'fair and above board', willing to go that extra mile as it were. The terrorists that will be released are effectively under lock and key anyway in Palastine. The wall is built and there is no free travel between zones. No big deal and a big score for Israel in front of the UN. Simples really! It does not matter what the country is, never ever give credit to any Government for doing something in the interest of a single citizen. There is always something else behind the decision. This decision is quite plain to see.

Cynical but probably correct, i suspect.

Phil

I apologize for the cynicism but I honestly believe that this is the way it is. That poor lad could have been freed from Hamas years ago. He has been kept until an opportunistic moment presented itself. Still, whatever the ultimate reason I am delighted for him that he will soon be reunited with his family.

Yes, I agree.

I hope it goes well, he gets home in one piece and eventually all the insanity stops.

[Jingthing]

This is nothing to do with the 'Israeli's being there for their Soldiers. This deal could easily have been brokered 4 years ago. This deal has now been struck for purely political motives. Palestine is now on the table at the UN for what will ultimately boil down to observer status. The Israeli's clearly do not want that and have now pulled an ace from out of their sleeves to be seen as playing 'fair and above board', willing to go that extra mile as it were. The terrorists that will be released are effectively under lock and key anyway in Palastine. The wall is built and there is no free travel between zones. No big deal and a big score for Israel in front of the UN. Simples really! It does not matter what the country is, never ever give credit to any Government for doing something in the interest of a single citizen. There is always something else behind the decision. This decision is quite plain to see.

Excuse me, but the deal was between HAMAS, which is running GAZA and the Israelis, brokered by Egypt. This wall you speak of is on the west bank, NOT Gaza. Your logic of the connection to the UN is quite buggered considering HAMAS is on record as opposing the Abbas led UN state recognition effort.

[GentlemanJim]

This is nothing to do with the 'Israeli's being there for their Soldiers. This deal could easily have been brokered 4 years ago. This deal has now been struck for purely political motives. Palestine is now on the table at the UN for what will ultimately boil down to observer status. The Israeli's clearly do not want that and have now pulled an ace from out of their sleeves to be seen as playing 'fair and above board', willing to go that extra mile as it were. The terrorists that will be released are effectively under lock and key anyway in Palastine. The wall is built and there is no free travel between zones. No big deal and a big score for Israel in front of the UN. Simples really! It does not matter what the country is, never ever give credit to any Government for doing something in the interest of a single citizen. There is always something else behind the decision. This decision is quite plain to see.

Excuse me, but the deal was between HAMAS, which is running GAZA and the Israelis, brokered by Egypt. This wall you speak of is on the west bank, NOT Gaza. Your logic of the connection to the UN is quite buggered considering HAMAS is on record as opposing the Abbas led UN state recognition effort.

Whatever!

The logic is nothing to do with Hamas, they are very happy. It is to do with Israel. You did actually read what I wrote didn't you?

Edited October 13, 2011 by GentlemanJim

[Jingthing]

So you make points which are totally wrong and it's whatever. Thanks for that.

Anyway, congrats indeed to Gilad Shalit and his family. He's a cutey. Actually I realize that sounds flippant, buts its hard to imagine that the passion in Israel and internationally would have been so great if the prisoner had been physically ugly, fat, or old. Fact of life I guess.

Edited October 13, 2011 by Jingthing

[GentlemanJim]

*edited out*

So according to you, Israel and the international community negotiated for the release of this soldier because he looked cute!!!! So had he been short fat and ugly you would have seen the international community allow him to languish in captivity for ever more?

Back to topic! The reason for the negotiated release of the soldier is political, nothing less, it assists Israel's case with the UN.

Edited October 13, 2011 by Scott
deleted quote edited out

[Jingthing]

It doesn't change anything in the UN.

Would you like to release the underpant bomber, you may find him quite cute?

You seem to trying real hard now to be offensive. Comparing dreamboat Shalit, a young man simply serving his country in his national service, to a man who tried to blow up an airplane of innocents.

Edited October 13, 2011 by Jingthing

[GentlemanJim]

It doesn't change anything in the UN.

Would you like to release the underpant bomber, you may find him quite cute?

You seem to trying real hard now to be offensive. Comparing dreamboat Shalit to a man who tried to blow up an airplane of innocents.

It changes a lot in the 'majority vote'!! Get to know your stuff.

I am not trying to be offensive in the least. It seems your criteria for releasing someone is that they look cute! Your words not mine! Fat and ugly stay inside, no parole do not pass Go! Cute! Well that's the perfect excuse for a completely Gay international attempt and negotiation to release you! Do you ever take a long hard critical look in the mirror in the mornings Jingthing?

[Jingthing]

I was suggesting, and I hold to it, that a big reason Shalit became so famous was that he was an attractive poster child. That's a reality any PR person or media savvy person will tell you is normal. What stories get publicity? Tends to be ones with an attactive victim, like the pretty girl who went missing in Aruba.

To wit ...

I am not the only person who noticed this guy is a looker. The world noticed. And yes, it DID make a difference.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4134413,00.html

There is no other choice

Op-ed: People will be killed as result of Shalit deal, but what other choice do we have?

Haim Misgav

Published: 10.12.11, 08:36 / Israel Opinion

Gilad Shalit is the child of us all. We encountered his young, handsome face at every turn. I don’t think there was even one person who remained indifferent; not even one person who did not wish to see this sweet child returning home. The debate was, and remains at this time, over the price.

You're wrong about the UN. Whatever happens will proceed unchanged. We know it won't make it past the security council, if needed the US will veto it. As far as the floor vote for the status upgrade, we know if that happens, that the Palestinians will win a big majority.

It seems to me you want to make a linkage that simply doesn't exit.

Edited October 13, 2011 by Jingthing

[GentlemanJim]

I was suggesting, and I hold to it, that a big reason Shalit became so famous was that he was an attractive poster child. That's a reality any PR person or media savvy person will tell you is normal. What stories get publicity? Tends to be ones with an attactive victim, like the pretty girl who went missing in Aruba.

You're wrong about the UN. Whatever happens will proceed unchanged. We know it won't make it past the security council, if needed the US will veto it. As far as the floor vote for the status upgrade, we know if that happens, that the Palestinians will win a big majority.

It seems to me you want to make a linkage that simply doesn't exit.

Well you must be right Jingthing. Toodle pip and I hope your continued belief in the fact that the Soldier was released due to an international agreement that he looked cute comes to fruition. "1027 Hamas terrorists released in exchange for a cute soldier who now has a contract with GM, Vogue and Uphill Gardeners weekly ...Grrrrrr " .

You are always right Jingthing, in everything ok! Now just a small space for the last word to be yours, as always ........................................................

[Scott]

Excessively argumentative posts, off-topic posts and personal discussions have been removed.

Please stay on topic.

[SAffer]

The key objective for any government contemplating negotiations with terrorists is not simply to end violence but to do so in a way that minimizes the risk of setting dangerous precedents and destabilizing its political system.

[Scott]

Inflammatory post removed.

[Steely Dan]

This is nothing to do with the 'Israeli's being there for their Soldiers. This deal could easily have been brokered 4 years ago. This deal has now been struck for purely political motives. Palestine is now on the table at the UN for what will ultimately boil down to observer status. The Israeli's clearly do not want that and have now pulled an ace from out of their sleeves to be seen as playing 'fair and above board', willing to go that extra mile as it were. The terrorists that will be released are effectively under lock and key anyway in Palastine. The wall is built and there is no free travel between zones. No big deal and a big score for Israel in front of the UN. Simples really! It does not matter what the country is, never ever give credit to any Government for doing something in the interest of a single citizen. There is always something else behind the decision. This decision is quite plain to see.

Excuse me, but the deal was between HAMAS, which is running GAZA and the Israelis, brokered by Egypt. This wall you speak of is on the west bank, NOT Gaza. Your logic of the connection to the UN is quite buggered considering HAMAS is on record as opposing the Abbas led UN state recognition effort.

If there is any link to the UN vote then perhaps it's to do with the U.S courting Hamas in order to marginalize Abbas to punish him for going to the UN. I know, it sounds like folly to me but stranger things have happened.

http://www.debka.com/article/21374/

By procuring the release of 1,000 Palestinians from Israeli jails, Hamas has outperformed is rival, the Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas as the lead champion of the Palestinian cause. After defying the Obama administration by applying for UN recognition for Palestinian statehood, Abbas is now getting his punishment.

[Jingthing]

It is true that both Abbas and Hamas are now on the US shit list, and both with good reason. I don't think its really a matter of courting Hamas though per se as a plot to foil the UN bid attempt, which is going ahead slowly either way. The reason Hamas opposes the Abbas UN statehood bid is because they aren't satisfied with anything short of total victory over Jewish Israel.

Edited October 14, 2011 by Jingthing

[Riely]

Since 2004, 183 Israelis have been killed in terror attacks carried out by terrorists who were released from prison.

http://www.jpost.com....aspx?id=241520

Of course, but the Israelis are there for their soldiers, even if they have to let convicted terrorists off the hook to get their men back.

Convicted by whom? A jury of their peers? Give me a break. Anyway I'm happy for the Palestinians, I hope at least a fair number of that 1000+ are healthy freedom fighters ready to carry on the struggle. Gods know they need all the help they can get.

[Riely]

Some of the terrorists serving life sentences might have a life ending "accident" after they are released. I think this is bad news for Israeli soldiers as more will be targeted for kidnapping now that Hamas sees what they can get for one.

This isn't the first time there has been a lop-sided prisoner swap. It is just concrete proof that Palestinians are worth a tiny fraction that of Israelis. It also shows that the civilised side in this is willing to go to extreme lengths to free one man, while the other side couldn't care much about their own people. How else can it be interpreted?

How else can it be interpreted?

That the Palestinians are better negotiators.

That the Israelis are sick of spending money on Palestinian prisoners.

That the Palestinian prisoners aren't really considered terrorists and should never have been jailed so setting them free is neither here nor there but if Israel can gain an Israeli prisoner in exchange then why not try it.

That Israel has an inflated view of their own worth.

That Israel thinks a Palestinian is not worth much.

Who cares? If both sides are happy why are you complaining?

VERY well said very well said. Especially the last 3 statements. Really sums up the nature of the beast there. A people who think they are "The Chosen Race of God" doing what they will to people they feel to be their lessers and wondering why they won't cooperate.

[Wallaby]

Since 2004, 183 Israelis have been killed in terror attacks carried out by terrorists who were released from prison.

http://www.jpost.com....aspx?id=241520

Of course, but the Israelis are there for their soldiers, even if they have to let convicted terrorists off the hook to get their men back.

Convicted by whom? A jury of their peers? Give me a break. Anyway I'm happy for the Palestinians, I hope at least a fair number of that 1000+ are healthy freedom fighters ready to carry on the struggle. Gods know they need all the help they can get.

And it seems the Palestinians are more there for their freedom fighters by getting over 1000 of them released. Obviously they can't have been 'real' terrorists.

[cdnvic]

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