Changes Proposed To Uk Spouse Visa Rules

[7by7]

Thanks for the comment, Samran. Unfortunately there are too many who prefer to believe what the Daily Mail and similar rags tell them than the truth.

Elliss,

If British by birth then this citizenship can never be removed; although one can renounce it if one wishes.

If British through naturalisation, this can only be removed if one is convicted of an extremely serious criminal offence; terrorism or treason for example. Although, again, it can be renounced if one wishes to do so.

[meatboy]

i have just read two of the last four posts they must have come from a uk.gov.spokesman because they are nothing but bs.you can post the rules but are they ever implamented.just give me all that i have paid in the pot and they can keep my pension £116 pr week for 44years of stamps and tax.and samran i havent had another drink :jap:

[7by7]

Thanks for the comment, Samran. Unfortunately there are too many who prefer to believe what the Daily Mail and similar rags tell them than the truth.

i have just read two of the last four posts they must have come from a uk.gov.spokesman because they are nothing but bs.you can post the rules but are they ever implamented

Q.E.D.

If you believe the rules are never implemented, try getting onto a flight to the UK or turning up at a UK port of entry with a visa national who does not have the appropriate UK entry clearance!

just give me all that i have paid in the pot and they can keep my pension £116 pr week for 44years of stamps and tax.

So presumably you have never in your entire life used anything provided by the government and paid for by the taxpayer.

Educated in private schools, not in state schools.

Never received any form of NHS treatment. No GP, no dentist, no prescription medicine; nothing.

Never claimed unemployment or sickness benefit; tax credits or child benefit.

Stayed at home your entire life and so never traveled anywhere within the UK using roads paid for by the taxpayer. Ditto public transport subsidised by the taxpayer.

Then there's the security provided you by the police, ambulance and fire brigade. Even if you've never had to actually use them, they've always been there if you needed them.

I could go on, but there is no point in attempting to argue with a closed mind.

[meatboy]

Thanks for the comment, Samran. Unfortunately there are too many who prefer to believe what the Daily Mail and similar rags tell them than the truth.

i have just read two of the last four posts they must have come from a uk.gov.spokesman because they are nothing but bs.you can post the rules but are they ever implamented

Q.E.D.

If you believe the rules are never implemented, try getting onto a flight to the UK or turning up at a UK port of entry with a visa national who does not have the appropriate UK entry clearance!

just give me all that i have paid in the pot and they can keep my pension £116 pr week for 44years of stamps and tax.

So presumably you have never in your entire life used anything provided by the government and paid for by the taxpayer.

Educated in private schools, not in state schools.

Never received any form of NHS treatment. No GP, no dentist, no prescription medicine; nothing.

Never claimed unemployment or sickness benefit; tax credits or child benefit.

Stayed at home your entire life and so never traveled anywhere within the UK using roads paid for by the taxpayer. Ditto public transport subsidised by the taxpayer.

Then there's the security provided you by the police, ambulance and fire brigade. Even if you've never had to actually use them, they've always been there if you needed them.

I could go on, but there is no point in attempting to argue with a closed mind.

what about all the taxes my parents paid,what about what i paid,income tax,nis,road tax,vat,council tax i could go on but there is no point in trying to get someone to understand that i am a tax payer to.

[samran]

But have your worked in Thailand meatboy?

[meatboy]

But have your worked in Thailand meatboy?

no never but thailand has had a lot of my wealth and some blood aswell.

[samran]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

[StreetCowboy]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

It's OK; I paid enough tax for me and meatboy together. And I spent some of what little was left repatriating money to the UK, to offset the few pennies the grocer was able to send back to his village in Islamabad. Actually, I bought one of my properties off a chap with a coloured-sounding name, and regretted it since.

SC

[meatboy]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

now i am confused are you and 7by7 joined at the head or is it my welsh upbringing.oh and what planet are you on?

[phutoie2]

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

So the tax I am paying on my current car loan, tax on insurance, VAT on house and food bills, not to mention restaurants counts as non contribution, duh.

[samran]

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

So the tax I am paying on my current car loan, tax on insurance, VAT on house and food bills, not to mention restaurants counts as non contribution, duh.

well according to the definition of meatboy and a few others, clearly it isn't enough. Does it pay for all the infrastructure and services (direct and indirect) that the Thai government provides you? As a Thai citizen, I think not. You are a leech. Taking and not giving.

I mean, if an 'Asian' did the same thing back as you in the UK, the meatboy's of the world would be after that person as some sort of leech on society.

The hypocracy of it all is that the likes of meatboy and his ilk probably can't communicate at all in Thai to a level that even a 8 year old would use (and probably never bothered to learn), can't read or write in Thai, expects people to be able to speak English to him when he goes to a restuarant or a shop hangs about with other 'foreigners', eats strange foreign food most of the time and patronises strange foreign shops like foodland for weird food like sausages, steaks and marmite and imported beers. Watches foreign TV shows and foreign sport on TV beamed in from the UK.

He's done exactly the same thing that he's accused 'foreigners' in the UK of, taking all his cash out of the place instead of letting it circulate around there.

Now I realise I've just made a bunch of baseless assumptions. Some are probably accurate, some aren't. I've also used emotive language. But making false statements based on no fact seems to be par for the course in this thread.

So what is good for the goose is good for the gander.

now i am confused are you and 7by7 joined at the head or is it my welsh upbringing.oh and what planet are you on?

Same planet as you. Though I suspect our parents didn't drop us on our heads multiple times when we were children.

Edited November 20, 2011 by samran

[samran]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

It's OK; I paid enough tax for me and meatboy together. And I spent some of what little was left repatriating money to the UK, to offset the few pennies the grocer was able to send back to his village in Islamabad. Actually, I bought one of my properties off a chap with a coloured-sounding name, and regretted it since.

SC

Good one SC.

Can't trust those foreigners can we?

[GuestHouse]

I love these rants about the Old Country, the "I've never had anything out of the Government" is a peach.

How many expats ranting about the UK have in mind the idea of returning there if they ever need medical care that they can't afford in Thailand?

How many wind up returning to the UK having spent up in Thailand only to throw themselves on the welfare services they've ranted about so often?

A life long health insurance and welfare insurance that need not be paid for.

[thaibeachlovers]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

Being a bit OTT there Samran.

Many Thais never pay tax as they never earn enough, or they exist outside recognised employment ie hawkers etc. Are you saying they aren't entitled to use Thai infrastructure?

I never paid tax here, but I certainly put many hundreds of thousands of baht into Thailand, some of which ended up as tax. I certainly have no problem using the roads etc.

[thaibeachlovers]

I love these rants about the Old Country, the "I've never had anything out of the Government" is a peach.

How many expats ranting about the UK have in mind the idea of returning there if they ever need medical care that they can't afford in Thailand?

How many wind up returning to the UK having spent up in Thailand only to throw themselves on the welfare services they've ranted about so often?

A life long health insurance and welfare insurance that need not be paid for.

A sensible western government would recognise that it is far cheaper to give expats enough money to be able to live in Thailand and afford health care here, than it is to have them come back home and use excessively expensive ( I know that for a fact as I worked in the NHS and it totally wastes many, many millions of money every year ) home hospitals. Just imagine what will happen if all the expats in Thailand and other "cheap" countries go back to Britain and other welfare states- total chaos, and probably bankrupt the health budget.

Western governments should be thanking all of us that retire overseas and making it as easy to stay away as possible, but they don't. So the consequences of their ingratitude will be felt by all residents when the planes are full of sick ex expats returning for medical treatment.

My home government doesn't automatically pay my pension overseas, so if they don't agree to do so, guess where I'll be ending up!!!! Or do you think that I should just go and top myself?

[elliss]

How many wind up returning to the UK having spent up in Thailand only to throw themselves on the welfare services they've ranted about so often.

hear hear,

I AM BRITISH, get me out of here ,

along with my spouse and sprog.

those were the days my friend ,

we thought they would never end .

:jap:

[7by7]

Reading this thread again I am once more amazed at the number of people who think that it is OK for them to immigrate into another country, but not for foreigners to immigrate to their home country. Amazed at the number of people who think it is their right to have their foreign wife/husband/partner/whatever live with them in their home country, but not for others to do so.

Since 2001, 388 British military personnel have died serving in Afghanistan. If you look here you will see that quite a few of them have black or brown faces; the children or grandchildren of immigrants to the UK.

Whatever one believes about the rights and wrongs of the Afghan campaign, these people have served and died for the UK, and many more continue to do so. Yet there are posters here who seem to think that they should be kicked out of the country!

If you are one of those posters, shame on you.

This thread has wandered so far off topic I was thinking of closing it' but I'm going to leave it open for the pure entertainment value; though one shouldn't really laugh at the ignorant.

[samran]

But you've never paid your fair share of tax.

So you've obviously not contributed enough to all the public infrastucture you use. The roads, the bridges, the telephone and electrical cables. The water pipes. Sewers.That subsidised petrol you fill up your tank with. The government underwritten guarantees of the toll roads you use.

Not chicken feed amounts either.

Do you really think as a foreigner you'd be turned away from a public hospital if you were admitted? And it would be free, or if not, heavily subsidised - on the same basis as everyone else. And don't forget the tax dollars which paid to train all those doctors and nurses which look after you.

Not that you'd contribute to any of this, but you sure have no problem using all of it.

Being a bit OTT there Samran.

Many Thais never pay tax as they never earn enough, or they exist outside recognised employment ie hawkers etc. Are you saying they aren't entitled to use Thai infrastructure?

I never paid tax here, but I certainly put many hundreds of thousands of baht into Thailand, some of which ended up as tax. I certainly have no problem using the roads etc.

I certainly love your bare faced stinking hypocracy - highlighting a platry 'contribution' to Thailand as justification for your stay , yet summarily dismissing those back in the UK who do the same (or 'appear' to do so because they happen to have brown skin), yet you don't know yet feel fit to pass judgement on.

You convientently seperate out certain public services which you deem not to be important, yet rail against others do have the temerity to use others such as health care, despite the fact they are probably eligble for it anyway. At the end of the day, they are all public services. Provided by the government. And in your case you at least admit, you haven't even paid.

The sad thing is that you like to think that you are different to them. Fact is you are no different, in fact probably a little worse as many westerners in Thailand simply fail to integrate - an act which if done back in the UK would be another sign of 'the country going to the dogs'. Speak, read and write much Thai do we?

Anyway, I give up. Debating you blokes is like shooting fish in a barrel.

By all means, close this one 7by7.

Edited November 20, 2011 by samran

[Totster]

I do not have time (actually I do, but can't be bothered) to read again through the whole thread, but I can't remember seeing anything about kicking people out, I may have missed it however, either by ignoring it or dismissing it for what it was.

I thought the main sentiment of the posters here is that the immigration laws should be tightened, along with benefit rules and such like, because as it stands the UK cannot sustain it as it is.

Now, Samran and others can take it to the extreme and claim double standards(I wonder if just playing devils advocate in some instances), whereas in reality it is nothing more than many other countries do already. I wonder for instance how many foreigners in Thailand hold a Thai passport after living here legally for 3 years ? Just one example.

Now with regards to this comment..

Reading this thread again I am once more amazed at the number of people who think that it is OK for them to immigrate into another country, but not for foreigners to immigrate to their home country. Amazed at the number of people who think it is their right to have their foreign wife/husband/partner/whatever live with them in their home country, but not for others to do so.

Extreme again. The issue is not that we don't want immigrants, but we need to be more careful and control it better.

Totster

[7by7]

Totser, there are those, like yourself, presenting reasoned arguments for controlling immigration to the UK.

There are others who are displaying their ignorance and prejudices.

Not too difficult to work out which group my, and Samran's, remarks are directed at, surely?

[samran]

Now, Samran and others can take it to the extreme and claim double standards(I wonder if just playing devils advocate in some instances),

mostly

[Totster]

(or 'appear' to do so because they happen to have brown skin), yet you don't know yet feel fit to pass judgement on.

For someone who thinks immigration can be spoken about without sounding racist, you certainly make a good job of implying it here.

totster

[samran]

(or 'appear' to do so because they happen to have brown skin), yet you don't know yet feel fit to pass judgement on.

For someone who thinks immigration can be spoken about without sounding racist, you certainly make a good job of implying it here.

totster

no, no, just taking what Travelman has already said:

Of course I wouldn't, so why do Britain's rulers think they should extend that courtesy to all the Asians that immigrate on family visas?

[Totster]

(or 'appear' to do so because they happen to have brown skin), yet you don't know yet feel fit to pass judgement on.

For someone who thinks immigration can be spoken about without sounding racist, you certainly make a good job of implying it here.

totster

no, no, just taking what Travelman has already said:

Of course I wouldn't, so why do Britain's rulers think they should extend that courtesy to all the Asians that immigrate on family visas?

Right, understood

totster

[samran]

Right, understood

totster

slegehammer to crack nuts.

[StreetCowboy]

Totser, there are those, like yourself, presenting reasoned arguments for controlling immigration to the UK.

There are others who are displaying their ignorance and prejudices.

Not too difficult to work out which group my, and Samran's, remarks are directed at, surely?

I couldn't really establish any consensus on this topic.

Is the consensus that the UK should tighten up immigration, and stop us bringing our wives home, or relax immigration, so that we and our neighbours can bring in their wives and girlfriends and parents and grandparents?

Should we expect staff in Starbucks to speak English or Bengali or whatever, or should we all be learning Thai? Then Chinese, then Malay, then Swahili or wherever the next job takes us?

Should we be throwing out all the Burmese and Poles, or employing them on building sites and to clear the rubbish off the sides of the road and work like trojans in the kitchens, so that we can enjoy a cheaper cost of living?

I think there was a general consensus that we should show no compassion for refugees, and they should all be deported back to the desert they came from, or any other desert, who cares? Except for that Afghani boy that got hit by rocket and needed hugely expensive surgery, and then was awarded a scholarship to boarding school, because he was plucky and had a well-educated sponsor.

I think we generally concluded that immigrants sending money back to their families was a bad thing, but us spending money overseas was a good thing. And that the amount of VAT and other consumption taxes that we pay in Thailand is sufficient contribution to enjoy whatever services we and our dependents can, but that dependents of people who work in the UK should not necessarily be entitled to such services.

SC

[Totster]

Is the consensus that the UK should tighten up immigration, and stop us bringing our wives home, or relax immigration, so that we and our neighbours can bring in their wives and girlfriends and parents and grandparents?

I think immigration can be tightened easily without impacting on legitimately married people from living in the UK. I personally do not think that parents, grandparents, aunties, uncles, family pets etc of those foreign spouses should have any other rights in the UK apart from visiting/tourism.

Should we be throwing out all the Burmese and Poles, or employing them on building sites and to clear the rubbish off the sides of the road and work like trojans in the kitchens, so that we can enjoy a cheaper cost of living?

Nothing to do with cost of living IMO, and has no effect on it. It's all down to the greed of the companies employing them.

I think there was a general consensus that we should show no compassion for refugees, and they should all be deported back to the desert they came from, or any other desert, who cares? Except for that Afghani boy that got hit by rocket and needed hugely expensive surgery, and then was awarded a scholarship to boarding school, because he was plucky and had a well-educated sponsor.

I think the point here is that why do refugees travel through 3 or 4 countries that could easily give them a better life to get to the UK

totster

[samran]

I think we generally concluded that immigrants sending money back to their families was a bad thing, but us spending money overseas was a good thing. And that the amount of VAT and other consumption taxes that we pay in Thailand is sufficient contribution to enjoy whatever services we and our dependents can, but that dependents of people who work in the UK should not necessarily be entitled to such services.

SC

should we start a new thread now where all these blokes can chime in about if it wasn't for their monetary contributions Thailand's economy would fall into a heap?

[ludditeman]

I still think we should just let anyone live anywhere they like.

Welfare is the problem, and the cure is to get rid of welfare for everyone.

Free health care, yep give it to everyone, but make it really shitty, so everyone pays private.

Edited November 20, 2011 by ludditeman

[7by7]

Totster, I think that StreetCowboy's tongue was firmly in his cheek when he wrote the post you quote.

Personally, I think it was a concise and humourous summation of the ignorance displayed by some.

I think the point here is that why do refugees travel through 3 or 4 countries that could easily give them a better life to get to the UK

Because they believe the propaganda that they will all get free houses and buckets of money when they get here, perhaps.

When they do arrive, they find that they are sadly very wrong!

Incidentally, I do a lot of work for a certain Royal Borough's highways department. It seems that nearly all of their street cleaners are Eastern European. When I asked someone high up in the organisation if this was true or not he said it was. He said that when they advertise vacancies they get no applications from British people. They do sometimes get British people sent to them from the Job Centre, but they refuse any job offer. Why? British people think sweeping the streets is beneath them!

I do wonder, though, what life must be like in Poland if sweeping the streets of London is a better option!