English As Your Mother Tongue?

[exeter]

Perhaps they were looking for the Ivor Dewdney shop in Plymouth and got the wrong bus!

You are wrong about Ginsters, they are very popular in Iran, some people there are enriching them, Alahh or Mohhamid knows how.

Dewdneys pasties didn't used to be too bad, but still not as good as Philps IMO.

Should we have a poll on the best pasties?

Never seen Philips, unless its the place at Hayle, if it is another dissappointment.

[mrtoad]

Perhaps they were looking for the Ivor Dewdney shop in Plymouth and got the wrong bus!

You are wrong about Ginsters, they are very popular in Iran, some people there are enriching them, Alahh or Mohhamid knows how.

Dewdneys pasties didn't used to be too bad, but still not as good as Philps IMO.

Should we have a poll on the best pasties?

It's Warrens in Cornwall that used to be the best,and you can't expect the best Pasties in Devon

I alternate between Warrens and Philps these day's when I get back. But I will go for Philps. dam_n I'm feeling hungry.

[ludditeman]

Best pasties I had were always sold in Bath.

The pasties in Cornwall were rubbish, ingredients very low quality.

[pieandmash]

Yes I have, that will be the same Northumbria that did not join as part of England until 1237. So prior to that date the notion of being English is wrong.

In fact I believe the original copy of the Magna Carta ( 1215 ) ceded Northumbria to Scotland, however the Pope overturned it.

Now we are getting pedantic. I am not anti-English, far from it. The Magna Carta was the greatest document ever produced and it was solely an English achievement.

Going back on topic about the English language, I believe the official language at time of the Magna Carta was Norman French, the Normans were Norse Scandanavian by descent, they invaded a land which had a melting pot of Gaels, Angles, Saxons and various other ethnic mixes. At the time of the invasion the Western Isles of Scotland were under Norwegian control. The language of the Church at the time was Latin,

My point is, English is a mongrel language, but it is a truly beautiful mongrel language. It has taken influences from everywhere and adapted these influences for itself.

This ability to adapt and absorb is the English languages' greatest strength. We native speakers should be immensely proud of it, it is undoubtedly the most egalitarian language in the world, and possibly the most egalitarian instrument in human history.

Aye but I never mentioned English or England, you did, I said Sassenachs. The Northumbrians were Anglo Saxons, Sassenach is from the old Gaelic word for Saxon and was used for both Anglo Saxons in what is now England and those in what is now lowland Scotland.

Correct, but you were sleverring on about the Kingdom of Northumbria.

Please state exactly what it was I was "slevering" about in regards to the Kingdom of Northumbria ?

[MAJIC]

Perhaps they were looking for the Ivor Dewdney shop in Plymouth and got the wrong bus!

You are wrong about Ginsters, they are very popular in Iran, some people there are enriching them, Alahh or Mohhamid knows how.

Dewdneys pasties didn't used to be too bad, but still not as good as Philps IMO.

Should we have a poll on the best pasties?

It's Warrens in Cornwall that used to be the best,and you can't expect the best Pasties in Devon

I alternate between Warrens and Philps these day's when I get back. But I will go for Philps. dam_n I'm feeling hungry.

Try making your own at home (homemade is always the best).it's not that difficult,if you can get hold of imported frozen Pastry. Iceland maybe? or somewhere in Pattaya or Bangkok,will maybe have a source .I'm not much good at making pastry.

[pieandmash]

Incidently today the World Pasty Championships are being held:

Eden Project holds first World Pasty Championships

Cooks from around the world have arrived in Cornwall for the first World Pasty Championships.

The event, at the Eden Project, near St Austell, is celebrating the popular local delicacy, which was given protected status under EU law in 2011.

The pasty has been associated with tin miners in the county and was a part of many people's diets during the 18th Century.

The Oxford English Dictionary suggests it was first identified around 1300.

'Chunky and slow-baked'

Families in Cornwall have passed down the recipe for a Cornish pasty through the generations.

Judges will be looking for the best pasty made to the traditional recipe.

The Cornish Pasty Association, which is backing the competition, came up with the "genuine" Cornish pasty recipe as part of its successful Protected Geographical Indication (PGI) application.

It said an authentic pasty should have a distinctive "D" shape and be crimped on one side, never on top.

It added that the filling should be "chunky, made up of uncooked mince or chunks of beef with swede, potato and onion and a light seasoning" before being slow-baked.

Variations on the pasty taken around the world by expatriates can be found from Australia to California and Mexico.

Separate competitions in the championships, being held on Saturday, will look at alternative recipes hailing from different parts of the world.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-17244158

[Naam]

Isn't it also Muttersprache . . . or are you saying you;re one of those mixed-up Swiss who are disgustingly good at languages!!!! Oh, and Schwitzerduetsch doesn't count!!!!

But yes, English is quite simple compared

"Muttersprache" is indeed the correct German word for "mother tongue". whether i'm Swiss or German depends on the circumstances. i keep both passports in separate pockets and use them according to demand. and yes, i am disgustingly good at half a dozen languages. unfortunately my pronunciation of English does not meet, even after 33 years of trying hard, the expectations of my wife who's mother tongue is English.

[Naam]

Alahh or Mohhamid knows how

peraps one shood ask Tcheesus or Buttah for gidans on ginsters?

[nong38]

Perhaps anyone found not capable of speaking English, to a reasonable standard should be shot! An alternative might be to set up a branch of Pattaya PLC in the Falklands or Bournemouth, as a punishment!.

[Sing_Sling]

Isn't it also Muttersprache . . . or are you saying you;re one of those mixed-up Swiss who are disgustingly good at languages!!!! Oh, and Schwitzerduetsch doesn't count!!!!

But yes, English is quite simple compared

"Muttersprache" is indeed the correct German word for "mother tongue". whether i'm Swiss or German depends on the circumstances. i keep both passports in separate pockets and use them according to demand. and yes, i am disgustingly good at half a dozen languages. unfortunately my pronunciation of English does not meet, even after 33 years of trying hard, the expectations of my wife who's mother tongue is English.

I know the Swiss can have dual citizenship . . . but the Germans don't . . . yet I know a few who have both!

My brother was at the Consulate in Zurich for four years (lived in Adliswil if memory serves me correctly) and whenever he wanted to annoy me he would start speaking Schwizerduetsch

[IanForbes]

Perhaps they were looking for the Ivor Dewdney shop in Plymouth and got the wrong bus!

You are wrong about Ginsters, they are very popular in Iran, some people there are enriching them, Alahh or Mohhamid knows how.

Dewdneys pasties didn't used to be too bad, but still not as good as Philps IMO.

Should we have a poll on the best pasties?

The best pasties I've ever seen were on this

Perhaps they were looking for the Ivor Dewdney shop in Plymouth and got the wrong bus!

You are wrong about Ginsters, they are very popular in Iran, some people there are enriching them, Alahh or Mohhamid knows how.

Dewdneys pasties didn't used to be too bad, but still not as good as Philps IMO.

Should we have a poll on the best pasties?

The best pasties I've ever seen were on a tall, blonde Swedish miss who was pole dancing. She could hold two full glasses of beer right above her pasties. Quite a sight.

But, we are drifting off topic about our mother's national langage. I don't really see that it matters what language we speak. I'm quite tolerant of poorly spoken English if it comes from a foreigner, but a person born with English speaking parents should owe it to themselves to become somewhat proficient in having others understand what you are saying.

[Mossfinn]

The grammar police on here never quite grasp the importance of communication, whether it is correctly spoken, or written, it doesn't really matter, as long as it can be understood, even then, in many ways does it really matter, if incorrect and the individual wants to learn and the listening character can divulge a corrective response, then go ahead.

However, an internet forum is not the place in general, even if it is your native tongue to correct another, it is pure arrogance and usually stupid because it leaves you extremely open to redicule when you make a mistake and I assure you, you will.

A little bit like U.S fighter pilots in the early years of Vietnam, they got shot down a lot, but unlike those pilots that followed who got a lot better, the grammar police on here, those of the native English type, don't.

[fredtitmus]

My mother tongue is Dutch, but i do speak German, English, Thai (not enough), some French. I always thought many English were lazy learning other languages. But there are a fair amount of expats that speak good Thai who are English and i don't. So i adjusted that opinion.

i think the dutch speak very good english but why do most speak with a lisp? i remember psv coming to leeds utd and beating us 1-4 and at the end the psv fans were singing " always look on the bright side of life".There were about 2000 psv fans all singing a comedy english song,in english,all together in our stadium.they were taking the piss but it was funny and rather embarrasing at the same time.

[exeter]

My mother tongue is Dutch, but i do speak German, English, Thai (not enough), some French. I always thought many English were lazy learning other languages. But there are a fair amount of expats that speak good Thai who are English and i don't. So i adjusted that opinion.

i think the dutch speak very good english but why do most speak with a lisp? i remember psv coming to leeds utd and beating us 1-4 and at the end the psv fans were singing " always look on the bright side of life".There were about 2000 psv fans all singing a comedy english song,in english,all together in our stadium.they were taking the piss but it was funny and rather embarrasing at the same time.

Robin Van Persie is an eloquent speaker of English and put Liverpool to the sword yesterday.

Had some Dutch students with us at John Lewis some years ago, came for the language experience, spoke perfect English and excellent manners too.

[IanForbes]

The grammar police on here never quite grasp the importance of communication, whether it is correctly spoken, or written, it doesn't really matter, as long as it can be understood, even then, in many ways does it really matter, if incorrect and the individual wants to learn and the listening character can divulge a corrective response, then go ahead.

However, an internet forum is not the place in general, even if it is your native tongue to correct another, it is pure arrogance and usually stupid because it leaves you extremely open to redicule when you make a mistake and I assure you, you will.

A little bit like U.S fighter pilots in the early years of Vietnam, they got shot down a lot, but unlike those pilots that followed who got a lot better, the grammar police on here, those of the native English type, don't.

Good point, Mossy. It's sort of like the cliche about those living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. I only enjoy the grammar police when someone is flaming another member here and expects nothing back in return. There are always two ways of replying to another's topic. One accepts the other person's opinion and another likes to throw darts at anyone who disagrees with their personal viewpoints.

[villagefarang]

As others have pointed out, we all make mistakes. If you make a mistake and someone points it out, why not thank them and learn from it? Why all the belligerence and vengeful retribution?

Writers pay people to edit their work but here one gets that service free of charge. Why put all the burden on the reader to figure out what you meant to say? The fact we all make mistakes is no excuse for not trying harder. Misunderstandings occur even in the best of circumstances so why compound that with sloppy writing?

[MAJIC]

Best pasties I had were always sold in Bath.

The pasties in Cornwall were rubbish, ingredients very low quality.

Try the Steak ones,instead of mince.

[mrtoad]

Best pasties I had were always sold in Bath.

The pasties in Cornwall were rubbish, ingredients very low quality.

Try the Steak ones,instead of mince.

Correct

[StreetCowboy]

Best pasties I had were always sold in Bath.

The pasties in Cornwall were rubbish, ingredients very low quality.

Try the Steak ones,instead of mince.

The whole point about pasties is that they are made of the bits other pies left behind.

Steak pie 80% from the meat tune, 20% from th

Turns out its nowhere near Juniper Green.

I'd no idea you played golf.

Well obviously I don't, or I'd have known my greens better.

I always thought greens were spinach and the like...

SC

[autan]

...I

...

...

Independance is Unlikely to happen,the Scottish people know which side their bread is buttered.

Happily, whatever the decision, you will have no say in it whatsoever.

Unless he's a registered voter in Scotland.

I think when one registers for an overseas vote, one is counted within the consituency in which you were last registered, but I am not sure of that. It might make more sense to have a single overseas constituency...

SC

No i'm not a Registered Voter in Scotland as far as i'm aware of,but if I was eligable to vote,I would be more than happy, along with the majority of English People to vote for Scottish Independence.

But lets face it, it's really all about one mans Ego,and wheeling and dealing,with a weakened Westminster Government,than what's right for the Scottish People.

And in my view a Referendum is unlikely to be in favour of Independence,as previously stated."the Scottish People know what side their bread is buttered"

Independence for Scotland . . . are you insane man ?

We can't have a return to the weekend brawling north of the border we saw prior to the 1600's or so. No that wont do. You might wipe each other out of existance and then poor lads like me from Preston with my Thai Wife, will be forced no doubt under duress, to move somewhere like . . . . . Glasgow or worse Aberdeen . . . . or hell itself, Inverness.

No independence won't do, I am sorry it has come to this but I hereby declare that upon the very second Scotland delares indendence from the rest of the UK, that I surrender to the Scots. Yes the City and Boroughs of Preston, indeed Northern England surrender as an occupied territory.

God dam_n it Man, we wont let you go it alone. Think of the children. Please dont leave us alone. WEEP WEEP.

</TONGUE IN CHEEK>

NO REALLY DON'T LEAVE US.

[IanForbes]

I STILL say the best pasties are the ones on that Swedish super model. I always wondered if I could pluck them off with my tongue.

[keestha]

Sorry I didn't read the thread - just barging in, reacting only to the poll result. It didn't surprise me that native speakers outnumber non native speakers 6 to 1. Myself, I speak English and German equally fluently, my native language is again another one. Here in Thailand, I noticed that German speakers are often ill informed about things like visas and work permits - they are cut off from the main flow of information, which is in English, like this forum for instance.

Edited March 7, 2012 by keestha

[transam]

I STILL say the best pasties are the ones on that Swedish super model. I always wondered if I could pluck them off with my tongue.

Steady, steady, get a grip man. You got me thinking about it now. .

[oldsailor35]

English is my mother tongue,I am eternally great full for this,that said lots of people would struggle with my broad Norfolk accent see below.

http://m.youtube.com...h?v=nnioP0T_3Ao

Many years ago i used to travel around Norfolk quite a lot, and found it one of the "ugliest dialects" in the whole of England. awful awful awful !

[oldsailor35]

To lambast a person who speaks English as their 2nd language is appalling. The language police on here should be ashamed of their dictatorial little selves.

Agreed...We should all spend a little time in the week educating our less fortunate TV members in the joys of the English language, I am of course referring to those members who hail from places like Scotland, US, Wales, Liverpool, Newcastle and finally those poor unfortunate soles who come from Birmingham...

Don't Birmingham people speak Hindi ?

[oldsailor35]

I always get a laugh out of Thais who apologize for not speaking English fluently. With a big smile on my face I tell them they are smarter than me because I can only speak a tiny bit (nig noi) of Thai. That seems to make their day. Unless you use a language constantly it is very easy to forget it. When I was in university I took French language to a point where I was having dreams in French. But, that was a long time ago and have never spoken it since. Consequently, I have to think really hard just to make a simple sentence in French. My hearing is bad ever since I was in an explosion 50 years ago, and it's only gotten worse. I have to go into a totally quiet room if I want to speak on a cell phone. Consequently, I find it very hard to hear all the subtle differences in the Thai language.

I went to sea at a young age. is that why i kept getting wet dreams ?

[oldsailor35]

English is very easy to learn to a certain level where you can communicate any thought pretty easily and comprehensibly, easier than riding a bicycle. Someone who fails at this is either very lazy or an extreme narcissist.

Any language is easy to learn in the right environment.

Its the attitude of the listener that is important. Most English speaking people are very tolerant and supportive of people struggling to speak English.

I have seen Thais, Europeans etc. openly ridicule people trying to speak their language. Most English speakers would not do this, and beyond that, they would make an effort not to laugh as to offend someone when they make a funny mistake.

I think English is an easy language to speak badly - meaning that you can get your meaning across even with poor pronunciation, poor grammar and limited vocabulary. Chinese, on the other hand... There are so many homonyms, and so many words separated only by their tones...

SC

The English get so many homonyms..............is that the same as Thai's getting so many Ladyboys ?

[Sing_Sling]

Sorry I didn't read the thread - just barging in, reacting only to the poll result. It didn't surprise me that native speakers outnumber non native speakers 6 to 1. Myself, I speak English and German equally fluently, my native language is again another one. Here in Thailand, I noticed that German speakers are often ill informed about things like visas and work permits - they are cut off from the main flow of information, which is in English, like this forum for instance.

They shouldn't be as there are many German-language forums around with lots of useful information