International community to resume nuclear talks with Iran

[Pedzie]

Netanyahu played Obama like a fiddle and got him to all but guarantee an attack should sanctions fail. Now he just has to figure out a way to insure the sanctions fail. How do you prove a negative?

They are already failing. Iran has no intent to give up developing nukes. He does not have to do anything other than let history take its course.

As a counterpoint to some of the war mongers on here, why not let Iran have her nukes ???

They could not be used without her total devastation, could they ??

And again, Israel has, so why not the rest ??

Exactly what I said on previous posts, a nuclear Iran would be a safer bet than a Israeli attack on Iran, the regime in Tehran aren't that crazy to fire upon Israel the moment it has the capability.

Netanyahu should have more respect for It's main ally, the US. Israeli intelligence and the Pentagon both say that an attack on Iran would not be wise. If they did attack the oil prices in the US and everywhere else would go through the roof, Netanyahu doesn't seem to care about this?? Iran has the capability to at least severely disrupt oil shipments through the Hormuz straights, if this happened over a prolonged period of time then food prices along with everything else would sky rocket, not a good thing with devastated economies in Europe etc!!

Netanyahu is quite simply the most dangerous man on the planet at this moment in time!

[Pedzie]

Been to Tehran and seen all this first hand have we? "Complete chaos" in the world is 100% guaranteed if they are attacked, that's a fact.

The regime in North Korea is what I would call utterly crazy, not in Iran, you'll no doubt disagree with this right!

[midas]

? "Complete chaos" in the world is 100% guaranteed if they are attacked, that's a fact.

The regime in North Korea is what I would call utterly crazy, not in Iran, you'll no doubt disagree with this right!

unfortunately for the rest of us Pedzie, not everyone has your foresight

“The entire lake will become a killing field…the Gulf will run red with American blood.” — Military specialist Mark Gaffney.

http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2012/02/armageddon-approaches/#ore-12803

[midas]

on the other hand further delays by Israel and America may actually suit them

" It is of interest to note that the US is busy working on a new generation of laser defense to counter the sophisticated anti-ship missiles possessed by Iran ( i.e. the Sunburn and The Satan )

However, these are still in process of development. This gives Iran a relative advantage if it is attacked now rather than later. Ironically, the longer America and Israel delay in attacking Iran, the better their chances of successfully countering the retaliatory measures they can expect from Iran."

Edited March 12, 2012 by midas

[philw]

the regime in Tehran aren't that crazy to fire upon Israel the moment it has the capability.

They are ruled by a death cult that wants the 12th Mahdi (the anti-Christ to Christians) to be brought forth by causing complete chaos in the world. They are that crazy.

There are mad American religious groups that believe something similar..........

Notably the Christian far right.

I doubt if the population of Iran ( about 77 million ???? ) believes what you describe above but there's about 40 million Americans who believe in the 2nd coming and deny evolution..........

Just pointing out that the loonies are on the bus.........( who said that ??)

[Scott]

But this thread isn't about America.

[Pedzie]

? "Complete chaos" in the world is 100% guaranteed if they are attacked, that's a fact.

The regime in North Korea is what I would call utterly crazy, not in Iran, you'll no doubt disagree with this right!

unfortunately for the rest of us Pedzie, not everyone has your foresight

“The entire lake will become a killing field…the Gulf will run red with American blood.” — Military specialist Mark Gaffney.

http://www.theoccide...ches/#ore-12803

Regimes in the Middle East and elsewhere have a record of saying stuff like this, doesn't mean to say it's gonna come true! How many times has North Korea threatened the South with catastrophic attacks etc since the 1950's?

Is it just me who hears Russian & Chinese threats over attacking Iran?? 4 nuclear armed nations about to go to war over a nation "maybe" pursing a weapon, in defence of a nation who has 3-400 ILLEGAL nukes?? Hmmm.

Then there is the oil, as Ive stated, yeah lets totally mess up a big chunk of the worlds oil supplies in the process, oh not forgetting Iran's capability of striking the Saudi's oil fields! Lets strike them boys and deal with all this "minor" stuff afterwards, WW3 here we come :-)

For those warmongers on here whom have children, think about their future! There is a very good chance they won't have one if Iran gets attacked!

Edited March 12, 2012 by Pedzie

[midas]

? "Complete chaos" in the world is 100% guaranteed if they are attacked, that's a fact.

The regime in North Korea is what I would call utterly crazy, not in Iran, you'll no doubt disagree with this right!

unfortunately for the rest of us Pedzie, not everyone has your foresight

“The entire lake will become a killing field…the Gulf will run red with American blood.” — Military specialist Mark Gaffney.

http://www.theoccide...ches/#ore-12803

Regimes in the Middle East and elsewhere have a record of saying stuff like this, doesn't mean to say it's gonna come true! How many times has North Korea threatened the South with catastrophic attacks etc since the 1950's?

Is it just me who hears Russian & Chinese threats over attacking Iran?? 4 nuclear armed nations about to go to war over a nation "maybe" pursing a weapon, in defence of a nation who has 3-400 ILLEGAL nukes?? Hmmm.

Then there is the oil, as Ive stated, yeah lets totally mess up a big chunk of the worlds oil supplies in the process, oh not forgetting Iran's capability of striking the Saudi's oil fields! Lets strike them boys and deal with all this "minor" stuff afterwards, WW3 here we come :-)

For those warmongers on here whom have children, think about their future! There is a very good chance they won't have one if Iran gets attacked!

on March 20 the Iranian oil bourse will start trading oil in other currencies apart from the US dollar.

I predict things will be ratcheted up from then onwards

Edited March 12, 2012 by midas

[Morch]

Netanyahu played Obama like a fiddle and got him to all but guarantee an attack should sanctions fail. Now he just has to figure out a way to insure the sanctions fail. How do you prove a negative?

They are already failing. Iran has no intent to give up developing nukes. He does not have to do anything other than let history take its course.

As a counterpoint to some of the war mongers on here, why not let Iran have her nukes ???

They could not be used without her total devastation, could they ??

And again, Israel has, so why not the rest ??

Exactly what I said on previous posts, a nuclear Iran would be a safer bet than a Israeli attack on Iran, the regime in Tehran aren't that crazy to fire upon Israel the moment it has the capability.

Netanyahu should have more respect for It's main ally, the US. Israeli intelligence and the Pentagon both say that an attack on Iran would not be wise. If they did attack the oil prices in the US and everywhere else would go through the roof, Netanyahu doesn't seem to care about this?? Iran has the capability to at least severely disrupt oil shipments through the Hormuz straights, if this happened over a prolonged period of time then food prices along with everything else would sky rocket, not a good thing with devastated economies in Europe etc!!

Netanyahu is quite simply the most dangerous man on the planet at this moment in time!

So far Israel did not attack Iran, so actually nothing was done against the USA wishes. Not going forward with it might have many factors (such as capability and perceived outcome), considering USA reaction is definitely one of those.

That said, from the Israeli point of view, a nuclear Iran is a major threat to national security (or maybe even more than that - a threat to its existence). It is possible to debate how realistic this point of view is, but right now that's they way Israel sees the situation. I guess that when weighing between dealing with what is assessed as a threat to survival vs. a possible rise of oil prices, they sort of lean toward the former.

Iran can sure try to disrupt oil shipments in the gulf, and also attack oil fields and facilities of neighboring countries. I'm not sure to what degree it can carry that out, though, or how would they avoid not hurting their own economy in the process.

Netanyahu is many things, but "most dangerous" is not one of them. He is not known to be very decisive when it comes to taking action, rather the opposite. If Israel launches an attack it will not be because one man willed it. As far as I can tell there isn't even an agreement within Israel that such an attack is either feasable or will have a desirable outcome.

[Morch]

on March 20 the Iranian oil bourse will start trading oil in other currencies apart from the US dollar.

I predict things will be ratcheted up from then onwards

I assume (please correct me if I'm wrong) this would be relevant for new contracts and deals, not existing ones.With the sanctions limiting Iran's oil selling options - what real effects would such a move have?

[Morch]

Is it just me who hears Russian & Chinese threats over attacking Iran?? 4 nuclear armed nations about to go to war over a nation "maybe" pursing a weapon, in defence of a nation who has 3-400 ILLEGAL nukes?? Hmmm.

China didn't threat the USA over Iran. There's this quote doing the rounds on youtube, conspiracy websites blew it quite out of proportions. There was no official Chinese threat, though.

Did Russia threat the USA? What...like warning that an attack will have dire consequences or something? Well, yeah...military actions often do. How does this amount to a WWIII threat is unclear.

Every now and then there's a Chinese general quoted regarding a WWIII scenario. I'm sure each superpower got some plans and thoughts about that. China starting WWIII, over Iran, vs. USA and the EU (about 50% of Chinese export markets, if I'm not mistaken)...yeah, makes perfect sense.

Russia got an image to maintain, and some of the quotes were just before the elections. No reason to think politicians over there are any different.

Both these countries and their leaders aren't wacko. Might have a different way of seeing things, but total destruction over Iran? Sorry, not seeing what they would gain from that.

Also not quite sure what you mean by "illegal nukes", though suspect an answer will be somewhat OT. While Israel certainly got a hold on USA politics and some influence over decisions (works both ways too), I think the main USA interests here are maintain control over oil. A nuclear Iran doesn't fit well with that.

Kinda interesting that apocalyptic posts on an imminent WWIII, based on very little facts, aren't considered "warmongering". Some of those almost sound like gagging for it to happen.

[Pedzie]

Is it just me who hears Russian & Chinese threats over attacking Iran?? 4 nuclear armed nations about to go to war over a nation "maybe" pursing a weapon, in defence of a nation who has 3-400 ILLEGAL nukes?? Hmmm.

China didn't threat the USA over Iran. There's this quote doing the rounds on youtube, conspiracy websites blew it quite out of proportions. There was no official Chinese threat, though.

Did Russia threat the USA? What...like warning that an attack will have dire consequences or something? Well, yeah...military actions often do. How does this amount to a WWIII threat is unclear.

Every now and then there's a Chinese general quoted regarding a WWIII scenario. I'm sure each superpower got some plans and thoughts about that. China starting WWIII, over Iran, vs. USA and the EU (about 50% of Chinese export markets, if I'm not mistaken)...yeah, makes perfect sense.

Russia got an image to maintain, and some of the quotes were just before the elections. No reason to think politicians over there are any different.

Both these countries and their leaders aren't wacko. Might have a different way of seeing things, but total destruction over Iran? Sorry, not seeing what they would gain from that.

Also not quite sure what you mean by "illegal nukes", though suspect an answer will be somewhat OT. While Israel certainly got a hold on USA politics and some influence over decisions (works both ways too), I think the main USA interests here are maintain control over oil. A nuclear Iran doesn't fit well with that.

Kinda interesting that apocalyptic posts on an imminent WWIII, based on very little facts, aren't considered "warmongering". Some of those almost sound like gagging for it to happen.

Ok, Russia & China will just sit back, the are preparing for war privately. Check on Google, there is lots of words from Putin on Iran etc, fair enough he may not be threatening war. Iran is close to Russia's border, at very least they will be severely angry with any attack, Putin even says that the consequences could be "unimaginable" what he means by this is anyone's guess, a sequence of events could transpire that leads up to a bigger conflict, all the ingredients are certainly there.

What I mean by illegal nukes, Israel has them in the 100's they are undeclared,not regulated or inspected by the IAEA, this makes them illegal under international law. Whilst Iran is being hounded for a perception of acquiring nukes, how many countries has Iran attacked in the past 30 years, how many has Israel attacked?

My wording of imminent WW3 maybe a bit over the top, I admit that. When an attack does proceed it will turn very ugly very quickly. No-one can guess the outcome, both China and Russia have lots invested in Iran.

You mention trade with the EU-US-China, agreed, very important to all concerned. When it comes to the Middle East and war, trade, like many other things will go out the window. Asia (including China) will be the worst affected from oil supply disruption, sure they'll just keep quiet about that.

My point is..An attack on Iran has to many variables, lots of things can go wrong, including the possibility of a wider conflict, even a world war, yes it can happen! its not worth the risk on the assumption Iran will fire at Israel the moment it get the bomb.

[chuckd]

"What I mean by illegal nukes, Israel has them in the 100's they are undeclared,not regulated or inspected by the IAEA, this makes them illegal under international law."

Which international law and from what jurisdiction? Please expand on your statement.

[flying]

Which international law and from what jurisdiction? Please expand on your statement.

While it is true folks like North Korea & Israel break no laws/treaties as they are not signatories to them....

Yet by the same token the likes of Israel & North Korea should be the last ones to threaten any other country with enforcement of any treaties

already long broken by folks like the USA

I think basically what pedzie & many others have said is that Israel has some nerve telling others who can & cannot develop or who should have their nuclear ambitions inspected.....All the while they themselves???? Oh that is fine?

Edited March 12, 2012 by flying

[Jingthing]

Israel has not threatened to destroy the Islamic republic of Iran. Not equivalent situations. Iran as a nation state is not under existential threat. Israel is.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Jingthing

[flying]

Israel has not threatened to destroy the Islamic republic of Iran. Not equivalent situations. Iran as a nation state is not under existential threat. Israel is.

Actually it seems Iran is the ONLY one who is legitimately under such a threat. Israel has taken the term "existential threat" as their motto/excuse for many years/decades now. Yet they are the agressors of record.

[Jingthing]

Israel has not threatened to destroy the Islamic republic of Iran. Not equivalent situations. Iran as a nation state is not under existential threat. Israel is.

Actually it seems Iran is the ONLY one who is legitimately under such a threat. Israel has taken the term "existential threat" as their motto/excuse for many years/decades now. Yet they are the agressors of record.

You can't possibly be serious. When has Israel ever suggested their goal is the end of Iran as a nation (and to kick the Persians out of there)? Please lets approach this issue from a place of recognizing reality. It can't be denied that Iran has repeatedly stated their goal is the destruction of the Jewish state of Israel (to be "reclaimed" in its entirety by Muslim people. They chant -- death to Israel. No equivalency. Face the facts. Edited March 12, 2012 by Jingthing

[GentlemanJim]

Israel has not threatened to destroy the Islamic republic of Iran. Not equivalent situations. Iran as a nation state is not under existential threat. Israel is.

Actually it seems Iran is the ONLY one who is legitimately under such a threat. Israel has taken the term "existential threat" as their motto/excuse for many years/decades now. Yet they are the agressors of record.

You can't possibly be serious. When has Israel ever suggested their goal is the end of Iran as a nation (and to kick the Persians out of there)? Please lets approach this issue from a place of recognizing reality.

Why does Israel need to suggest it when they are making overt preparations to do it. Or is Israel and the US just going to go for regime change? Funny isn't that what the Iranian translation really said?

[Jingthing]

Not this again! Its not about ONE translation controversy! Iran is clearly on record to end the state of Israel as a Jewish state. That is not regime change, that goal is to destroy a nation.

[flying]

When has Israel ever suggested their goal is the end of Iran as a nation

Ah I see...it is ok for just one side to BS then?

Because that age old misinterpreted claim of wiping anyone off the map is just that....rhetoric BS

You & every other cheerleader knows it yet you continue to propagate it.

Truth is if we judge by action/fruits it is Israel who is aggressive/violent to its neighbors & this whole Iran/Nuke

claim is basically a diversion to the Palestinian conflict that is boiling over.

Here is a Israel Facing "Existential Threat" to read about....

Israel Facing "Existential Threat" From Within As Decmocracy Erodes

I am sure a cheerleader will ask for it to be removed but at least a few will gain from it.

Edited March 12, 2012 by flying

[Jingthing]

It's a cheap trick acting like this is about one incident of translation controversy. Because it's not. It's about the open policy of the regime of Iran towards Israel going on for many years now.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Jingthing

[flying]

It's a cheap trick acting like this is about one incident of translation controversy. Because it's not. It's about the open policy of the regime of Iran towards Israel going on for many years now.

Many years? Irans track record of over 200 years of not attacking any other country speaks for itself...

Sadly so does the opposite for Israel.............

Over the last 48 hours, Gaza has been bombed by Apache helicopters and F16 and V58 fighter planes. 18 civlians have been killed in Gaza City, Jabalya, Rafah, and Shejaaiya. In the latest attack on Jablya, 12-year old Aamer Asaleyah, was killed as a result of an Israeli air strike which targeted a group of children on their way to school

http://countercurren...rg/ag110312.htm

Again judge by the fruits/acts not the claims & then you will not even have to worry about false interpretations....

Edited March 12, 2012 by flying

[Ulysses G.]

Iran's record on state-supported terrorism speaks for itself and their record of having hateful terrorist organizations like Hezzbolah and Hamas do their bidding means that they are a criminal regime that can not be allowed to develop nuclear weapons.

[Scott]

This thread is not going to be about ANY translation. It's not going to be about out of context remarks about Israel and it's not going to be about the wonderful and stellar historical past of the Persian people--and no we won't blame Alexander the Great for corrupting them.

Stay on topic or you WILL get a suspension.

Clues: "International Community" ; 'talks', nuclear.

[midas]

on March 20 the Iranian oil bourse will start trading oil in other currencies apart from the US dollar.

I predict things will be ratcheted up from then onwards

I assume (please correct me if I'm wrong) this would be relevant for new contracts and deals, not existing ones.With the sanctions limiting Iran's oil selling options - what real effects would such a move have?

James Corbett, editor of independent news website “The Corbett Report,” thinks the oil embargo may even play to the country’s benefit.

“The further Iran is pushed into a corner, the more their position will straighten over time as they develop alternative routes out for their oil exports,” he said.

“As we have seen in recent days they [iran] have been scrambling to establish exchanges in other currencies including their local currencies, even asking India to trade in Japanese Yen,” Corbett pointed out, “So we could see really a fundamental shift in the entire dynamic of this energy export economy.”

http://rt.com/news/iran-eu-sanctions-oil-419/

[midas]

Iran's record on state-supported terrorism speaks for itself and their record of having hateful terrorist organizations like Hezzbolah and Hamas do their bidding means that they are a criminal regime that can not be allowed to develop nuclear weapons.

Iranians would justifiably describe the activities of forces opposed to them as being terrorists also.

" terrorism is often a tactic committed by the actors as part of a geo-political agenda."

Edited March 13, 2012 by midas

[exeter]

The plain fact is that if Iran is going to try and develop nuclear weapons, it will and there is nothing we do to stop it, it can be put back in time but they will succeed, the world will have to get used to that fact. If all the sites were destroyed they can rebuild and start again, if they are intent on acquiring the technology.

I am not saying I am happy with it I am not, t will make the world a far more dangerous place.

The sanctions dont seem to be having the effect as hpoed for, Iran will still export to countries who will turn a blind eye to it and deal in a way that has not been the norm, oil dynamics will change.

The world watches and waits for the next move by a leadership that is turbulent to say the least and we must not take it that the current leadership represents the people of that country there is clearly a lot of oppostion to them, any military conflict would, however, unify the country and against any aggression, patience is required.

[Pakboong]

Which international law and from what jurisdiction? Please expand on your statement.

While it is true folks like North Korea & Israel break no laws/treaties as they are not signatories to them....

Yet by the same token the likes of Israel & North Korea should be the last ones to threaten any other country with enforcement of any treaties

already long broken by folks like the USA

I think basically what pedzie & many others have said is that Israel has some nerve telling others who can & cannot develop or who should have their nuclear ambitions inspected.....All the while they themselves???? Oh that is fine?

The Simington act comes into play with certain of these countries. No US foreign aid can be given to any country who does not sign the NNPT.

Edited March 13, 2012 by Pakboong

[Jingthing]

Yes, Iran is determined now to move towards being a nuclear power, but that doesn't necessarily mean yet that they will achieve that. There might be a regime change, or a determination the price isn't worth it, etc. I would also rate it likely, but it's not over until it's over.

[chuckd]

Which international law and from what jurisdiction? Please expand on your statement.

While it is true folks like North Korea & Israel break no laws/treaties as they are not signatories to them....

Yet by the same token the likes of Israel & North Korea should be the last ones to threaten any other country with enforcement of any treaties

already long broken by folks like the USA

I think basically what pedzie & many others have said is that Israel has some nerve telling others who can & cannot develop or who should have their nuclear ambitions inspected.....All the while they themselves???? Oh that is fine?

Israel is ineligible for US foreign aid as the Symington Act prohibits American aid being given to any country who has not signed the NNPT. Doesn't seem like a lot of attention is payed to this particular law.

The US is probably giving money to many countries that have not signed the NNPT.

That doesn't answer my question posed earlier about which international laws Israel has broken by allegedly possessing nukes.