Remove Amalgam Fillings

[kannon99]

I had mine removed at DC1 Dental on Yenakat Road off of Sathorn. They used the dental dam and high powered suction. Did a really good job and no side affects from the removal. The pricing was decent too.

[piiguy]

Those would be mercury vapors that escape 24/7 from amalgam fillings as a result of body heat, food heat and mechanical friction from chewing, as measured in several experiments - I can dig out the papers if you wish.

The vapor then crosses into the bloodstream via the mouth mucosal tissue.

Thereafter mercury migrates to the vital organs, including the brain. In the brain it gradually transforms from organic to inorganic, meaning it cannot then cross back across the blood-brain barrier. (The only known substance that can chelate it out of the brain at that point is alpha lipoic acid, administered on a constant dose (not sporadic) basis.)

Brain mercury is linked with numerous neurological conditions.

I had read before, that it is better to leave in the old silver filings. When they are removed, dangerous gases can be released during the drilling out process. There are dentist who have special equiptment to catch those gases.

Which "gases" would these be ? elemental mercury ?.....evolution of elemental mercury in vapour form from liquid Hg is very dependent on temperature.

The fact the mercury itself is held with in an amalgam with silver,copper tin and tin forming a stable alloy, very difficult to understand where "gases" would come from ?.....if you took the amalgam itself and started heating it up significantly then yes would suggest you could possibly get elemental Hg vapour coming off ....but this is not what happens when you drill a filling out at the dentist.

I would suggest we are bordering on an urban legend or a clever market ploy by a dentist

Rather than me quoting reputable metallurgical studys on almagam filling...maybe try reading these:

http://ec.europa.eu/...enihr_o_016.pdf

http://prospect.rsc.org/metalsandlife/9.16b.pdf

I stand by my statement...lots of scare mongering and quackery around this issue

The SCENHIR study has been criticised on a number of grounds. Firstly, are dentists really qualified to do this kind of study, and as dentists are they unbiased? Or are they like the doctors who famously stood up in front of the congressional committee and swore that smoking did not pose a health risk. Mutter also complained that the committee failed to look at any autopsy studies and focused only on urine and blood measurements which are indicative only of recent exposure and are not representative of body burden. I would prefer to base my opinion on research done by toxicologists and biochemists.

In brief, his criticisms are :

(a) Dental amalgam is by far the main source of human total mercury body burden. This is proven by autopsy studies which found 2-12 times more mercury in body tissues of individuals with dental amalgam. Autopsy studies are the most valuable and most important studies for examining the amalgam-caused mercury body burden.

(( b ) These autopsy studies have shown consistently that many individuals with amalgam have toxic levels of mercury in their brains or kidneys.

© There is no correlation between mercury levels in blood or urine, and the levels in body tissues or the severity of clinical symptoms. SCENIHR only relied on levels in urine or blood.

(d) The half-life of mercury in the brain can last from several years to decades, thus mercury accumulates over time of amalgam exposure in body tissues to toxic levels. However, SCENIHR state that the half-life of mercury in the body is only "20-90 days".

(e) Mercury vapor is about ten times more toxic than lead on human neurons and with synergistic toxicity to other metals.

(f) Most studies cited by SCENIHR which conclude that amalgam fillings are safe have severe methodical flaws.

You can see the report in full at http://www.occup-med...45-6673-6-2.pdf

[Soutpeel]

The SCENHIR study has been criticised on a number of grounds. Firstly, are dentists really qualified to do this kind of study, and as dentists are they unbiased? Or are they like the doctors who famously stood up in front of the congressional committee and swore that smoking did not pose a health risk. Mutter also complained that the committee failed to look at any autopsy studies and focused only on urine and blood measurements which are indicative only of recent exposure and are not representative of body burden. I would prefer to base my opinion on research done by toxicologists and biochemists.

In brief, his criticisms are :

(a) Dental amalgam is by far the main source of human total mercury body burden. This is proven by autopsy studies which found 2-12 times more mercury in body tissues of individuals with dental amalgam. Autopsy studies are the most valuable and most important studies for examining the amalgam-caused mercury body burden.

( These autopsy studies have shown consistently that many individuals with amalgam have toxic levels of mercury in their brains or kidneys.

© There is no correlation between mercury levels in blood or urine, and the levels in body tissues or the severity of clinical symptoms. SCENIHR only relied on levels in urine or blood.

(d) The half-life of mercury in the brain can last from several years to decades, thus mercury accumulates over time of amalgam exposure in body tissues to toxic levels. However, SCENIHR state that the half-life of mercury in the body is only "20-90 days".

(e) Mercury vapor is about ten times more toxic than lead on human neurons and with synergistic toxicity to other metals.

(f) Most studies cited by SCENIHR which conclude that amalgam fillings are safe have severe methodical flaws.

You can see the report in full at http://www.occup-med...45-6673-6-2.pdf

(a) Dental amalgam is by far the main source of human total mercury body burden

My understanding, that this is not true and in fact the main source is from fish.

Having working in industry were we were tested annually for Hg in Thailand, interesting to note that my Hg levels were far lower than some of my Thai collegues who did the same job at the time, interestingly I had amalgam fillings as well, some of these guys did not, but consistantly their levels were higher than mine, granted this is not a scientific study, one possible explanation they ate fish on a regular basis, which I did not.

Can we agreed to disagree there is not a definitive answer to this...you believe what you will, and I will believe what I will, I have had almalagm fillings for many years, and have absolutely not concerns and certainly not paranoid about the issue for them to be taken out.

Living in Thailand there is far more other cr*p in the air people are breathing in, which is most certainly doing more damage to their bodies than a few fillings in their mouth.

[piiguy]

ELEMENTAL MERCURY AND

INORGANIC MERCURY COMPOUNDS:

World Health Organization

Geneva, 2003

HUMAN HEALTH ASPECTS

Concise International Chemical Assessment Document 50

10

Table 1: Estimated average daily intake (retention) of inorganic mercury.

Intake (retention) (μg)a

Medium Mercury vapour Inorganic mercury compounds Reference

Atmosphere 0.04–0.2 (0.03–0.16)b 0c IPCS, 1991

Food: Fish 0 0.6d (0.06) IPCS, 1991

Food: Non-fish 0 3.6 (0.36) IPCS, 1991

Drinking-water 0 0.05 (0.005) IPCS, 1991

Dental amalgam 1.2–27 (1–21.6) 0 ATSDR, 1999

Total 1.2–27 (1–22) 4.3 (0.43)

These are the World Health Organization figures for mercury exposure. As you can see, dental amalgam exposure ranges from 1.2 microgram to 27 micrograms per day, fish only accounts for 0.6 micrograms, on average.

With regard to your lower urine levels, as Mutter states, urine and blood levels are not indicative of body burden, which can only be determined by biopsy or autopsy. Someone with low levels of mercury in their blood, can build up high levels in their kidneys, thyroid, liver, brain and other organs, particulary if they are a poor excretor due to genetics.

People with two ApoE4 genes have been shown to have a relative risk of 14.9 for developing Alzheimer's. Interestingly the difference between the the ApoE4, E3 and E2 genes occurs at two points where there can be a substitution of either cysteine or arginine. The ApoE4 variant has two arginines, the ApoE3 has a cysteine and an arginine, the ApoE2 has two cysteines, and is protective against alzheimers with a relative risk of 0.6.

Why is this interesting? Cysteine is an amino acid that contains a thiol (sulfhydryl group). Chelators of heavy metals have two thiol bonds which attach to heavy metals and remove them from the body. So the theory is that the ApoE2 variation is protective as it chelates heavy metals out of the brain, while people with the ApoE4 gene are at risk of Alzheimer's because they can't excrete heavy metals which then build up in the brain and the oxidative reaction leads to neuronal degeneration.

And indeed, high levels of mercury have been found in the brains of victims of Alzheimer's on autopsy.

[Robroy]

The EU study you cite has been thoroughly, utterly & entirely demolished in subsequent literature. (Once again, I can dig out cites if you insist.)

The second ref. is a book chapter without any information on author or book title - hardly convincing on its face. However it is apparently from the 1990s, and overlooks the evidence that had accumulated till then (albeit not conclusive). Moreover the science has moved on a lot since then. I.e. they know more stuff now, & the evidence is conclusive.

I think you need to read up on this subject before proceeding, as you're digging ever-larger holes for yourself.

Those would be mercury vapors that escape 24/7 from amalgam fillings as a result of body heat, food heat and mechanical friction from chewing, as measured in several experiments - I can dig out the papers if you wish.

The vapor then crosses into the bloodstream via the mouth mucosal tissue.

Thereafter mercury migrates to the vital organs, including the brain. In the brain it gradually transforms from organic to inorganic, meaning it cannot then cross back across the blood-brain barrier. (The only known substance that can chelate it out of the brain at that point is alpha lipoic acid, administered on a constant dose (not sporadic) basis.)

Brain mercury is linked with numerous neurological conditions.

I had read before, that it is better to leave in the old silver filings. When they are removed, dangerous gases can be released during the drilling out process. There are dentist who have special equiptment to catch those gases.

Which "gases" would these be ? elemental mercury ?.....evolution of elemental mercury in vapour form from liquid Hg is very dependent on temperature.

The fact the mercury itself is held with in an amalgam with silver,copper tin and tin forming a stable alloy, very difficult to understand where "gases" would come from ?.....if you took the amalgam itself and started heating it up significantly then yes would suggest you could possibly get elemental Hg vapour coming off ....but this is not what happens when you drill a filling out at the dentist.

I would suggest we are bordering on an urban legend or a clever market ploy by a dentist

Rather than me quoting reputable metallurgical studys on almagam filling...maybe try reading these:

http://ec.europa.eu/...enihr_o_016.pdf

http://prospect.rsc.org/metalsandlife/9.16b.pdf

I stand by my statement...lots of scare mongering and quackery around this issue

[Ijustwannateach]

While the rest of us are waiting for the experts to become more united- I am sure that for the most part, most dentists at least have been convinced that the threat/risk is very small. They are not monsters. Perhaps they have also been misled, but they do require a lot of scientific background and intelligence in their jobs and I am sure they know more about it than I do.

However, it is probably wise, with the alternatives common available today and all other things being equal, to have the non-mercury fillings when getting new work done- better safe than sorry. Eventually this process of replacing old, childhood fillings upon their breakdown will make my mouth mercury free anyway.

[Soutpeel]

I think you need to read up on this subject before proceeding, as you're digging ever-larger holes for yourself.

Not digging any deeper holes for myself...you have your opinion, I have mine, believe what you will....

It is very apparant there is no defintive answer on this subject, irrespective of what is cited from either camps

How interesting how there was no comment on my actual experience with Hg testing after working in an Hg enviroment....why is that ?...something you cant google to rip quotes from ?

As pointed out earlier amalagam fillings should be the least of peoples worries in Thailand considering some of the crap that being pumped into air, which I suspect is doing far more damage to people bodies than a bit of mercury in ones fillings

[piiguy]

I think you need to read up on this subject before proceeding, as you're digging ever-larger holes for yourself.

Not digging any deeper holes for myself...you have your opinion, I have mine, believe what you will....

It is very apparant there is no defintive answer on this subject, irrespective of what is cited from either camps

How interesting how there was no comment on my actual experience with Hg testing after working in an Hg enviroment....why is that ?...something you cant google to rip quotes from ?

As pointed out earlier amalagam fillings should be the least of peoples worries in Thailand considering some of the crap that being pumped into air, which I suspect is doing far more damage to people bodies than a bit of mercury in ones fillings

Actually, I did comment on your experience of urine testing in post #34

With regard to your lower urine levels, as Mutter states, urine and blood levels are not indicative of body burden, which can only be determined by biopsy or autopsy. Someone with low levels of mercury in their blood, can build up high levels in their kidneys, thyroid, liver, brain and other organs, particulary if they are a poor excretor due to genetics.

[piiguy]

Actually Soutpeel, my interest in mercury poisoning is not just theoretical or academic. For over thirty years I had intermittent bouts of painful mouth ulcers, lymphadenopathy, diarrhea, fatigue, excessive thirst, and insomnia, among other symptoms. I consulted many doctors and tried many different cures but none had any effect. Twenty five years ago I had my amalgams removed but didn't notice any beneficial effect. Over time the fatigue became constant and I developed constant sinus problems, more frequent urination, anxiety, balance problems and my insomnia worsened. I really felt life was not worth living.

Then a couple of years ago I came across chelation therapy and found out that mercury stays in your organs even after the amalgams are removed from your mouth. After chelating periodically over the past two years I feel 80 percent better and look forward to being 100 percent in the near future.

No doubt some people will claim "Placebo Effect", but that is a cop out. I have tried numerous approaches over thirty years without effect, so why would I suddenly experience the placebo effect.

For anyone who is interested in following up themselves I would suggest the frequent dose chelation group on yahoo to see how chelation is affecting a wide range of symptoms in people who have not been able to find help elsewhere.

[beammeup]

piiguy, how long did you chelate for, I have just started and have been detoxing for 5 days now, my sweet smells different and i developed a cold. I still have 10 amalgams do you think it is worthwhile chelating while i still have the fillings? I will be removing my amalgams over the next while one at a time.

[piiguy]

piiguy, how long did you chelate for, I have just started and have been detoxing for 5 days now, my sweet smells different and i developed a cold. I still have 10 amalgams do you think it is worthwhile chelating while i still have the fillings? I will be removing my amalgams over the next while one at a time.

Don't chelate if you have amalgams in your mouth. The chelator is in your saliva which takes more mercury out of the amalgams and redistributes it around your body. You can get much worse if you chelate with amalgams.Remove your amalgams and wait a few days before beginning chelation.

Which chelator are you using and what dosage? I use DMSA or DMPS plus alpha lipoic acid. I chelate in rounds of 3 to 5 days, take a break of a few days and chelate again. I have been chelating for almost two years. The safest method in my opinion is the Cutler protocol, which involves keeping a constant level of chelator in your blood stream so that mercury is not picked up and dumped in another part of your body. You can find more information on this at http://home.earthlin...dose_sched.html

[beammeup]

I am using coriander ALA, spirolina and food high in selenium. no drugs so I would have thought that the chelating would take place after the herbs were broken down in my stomach and enter my bloodstream.

[Soutpeel]

I think you need to read up on this subject before proceeding, as you're digging ever-larger holes for yourself.

Not digging any deeper holes for myself...you have your opinion, I have mine, believe what you will....

It is very apparant there is no defintive answer on this subject, irrespective of what is cited from either camps

How interesting how there was no comment on my actual experience with Hg testing after working in an Hg enviroment....why is that ?...something you cant google to rip quotes from ?

As pointed out earlier amalagam fillings should be the least of peoples worries in Thailand considering some of the crap that being pumped into air, which I suspect is doing far more damage to people bodies than a bit of mercury in ones fillings

Actually, I did comment on your experience of urine testing in post #34

With regard to your lower urine levels, as Mutter states, urine and blood levels are not indicative of body burden, which can only be determined by biopsy or autopsy. Someone with low levels of mercury in their blood, can build up high levels in their kidneys, thyroid, liver, brain and other organs, particulary if they are a poor excretor due to genetics.

Who said it was a urine test ?...I never said it was a urine test....it fact when I had this done in Thailand two separate tests were carried out on an annual basis namely... blood and hair follical....

[piiguy]

I think you need to read up on this subject before proceeding, as you're digging ever-larger holes for yourself.

Not digging any deeper holes for myself...you have your opinion, I have mine, believe what you will....

It is very apparant there is no defintive answer on this subject, irrespective of what is cited from either camps

How interesting how there was no comment on my actual experience with Hg testing after working in an Hg enviroment....why is that ?...something you cant google to rip quotes from ?

As pointed out earlier amalagam fillings should be the least of peoples worries in Thailand considering some of the crap that being pumped into air, which I suspect is doing far more damage to people bodies than a bit of mercury in ones fillings

Actually, I did comment on your experience of urine testing in post #34

With regard to your lower urine levels, as Mutter states, urine and blood levels are not indicative of body burden, which can only be determined by biopsy or autopsy. Someone with low levels of mercury in their blood, can build up high levels in their kidneys, thyroid, liver, brain and other organs, particulary if they are a poor excretor due to genetics.

Who said it was a urine test ?...I never said it was a urine test....it fact when I had this done in Thailand two separate tests were carried out on an annual basis namely... blood and hair follical....

Sorry, my mistake. In any case blood and urine are not good indictators of body burden as I said. People with low levels of Hg in their blood can build up high levels in their organs over years. Hair tests give a better indication of long term exposure, but there can be a high incidence of false negatives. Again what shows up in your hair is what is being excreted. If you have a genetic disposition to poor excretion of heavy metals, you can have a lot in your organs but doesn't show high levels in the blood, urine or hair. Children with severe autism often have no Hg in their hair, but they have precoproporphyrin in their urine, which is a specific marker for mercury poisoning.

[piiguy]

I am using coriander ALA, spirolina and food high in selenium. no drugs so I would have thought that the chelating would take place after the herbs were broken down in my stomach and enter my bloodstream.

Chelators are absorbed in the stomach and enter the blood stream and the rest of your body (including your saliva). It really isn't a good idea to chelate with amalgams in place. ALA can cross the blood brain barrier and take mercury into the brain, depending on the relative concentrations of Hg in the blood and the brain. You will come across a lot of conflicting advice regarding chelating, so it is best to do quite a bit of research first and make your own decision. Selenium is ok as it combines with mercury to form a relatively non- toxic compound. Many people on the forum I mentioned have had serious problems using natural chelators such as coriander which have taken a long time to resolve.

[beammeup]

Ok I have just spent the afternoon reading about it. Yes there is conflicting info. the one argument though was that the mercury travels freely into the brain anyway whether you are using chelators or not. I am going to give it a rest for a while anyway and do more research.

[piiguy]

If you would like to look at other people's experience of various chelators check out

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/Chelation_products.html#chlorella

[Robroy]

I agree with Piiguy that chelating with amalgams in place can be quiet dangerous.

Even if you didn't believe all the evidence was in on this subject, getting them out is surely wise on the precautionary principle.

I have tried chelating on irregular/sporadic doses & spun myself out pretty badly.

I also think the constant dose is the way to go. Have been doing that for 7 months, & no side-effects.

Ok I have just spent the afternoon reading about it. Yes there is conflicting info. the one argument though was that the mercury travels freely into the brain anyway whether you are using chelators or not. I am going to give it a rest for a while anyway and do more research.

[MisterMan]

I found a local dentist that removed one for me today. She used a rubber dam and hi flow suction. Did a great job. 10 more to go. I am using coriander, ALA, Spirulina instead of Chlorella and sunflower seeds for the selenium for the self administered chelation therapy, all cheap and easy.

Southpeel, I went to that link and though interesting one of the studies he uses was not very convincing towards his argument. Here are the last 2 paragraphs

The scientists found that the surfaces of metal fillings seem to lose up to 95 percent of their mercury over time. Loss of potentially toxic mercury from amalgam may be due to evaporation, exposure to some kinds of dental hygiene products, exposure to certain foods, or other factors.

The scientists caution that "human exposure to mercury lost from fillings is still of concern."

Update us when you get the rest out..

[tombkk]

I have been thinking about having my amalgam fillings replaced, too. Having read this topic (so far), I think I will wait until they deteriorate and fall out by themselves (one already did).

If amalgam releases mercury into the bloodstream, it did so over the past 40 or more years, and there is hardly any left in the fillings.

If mercury damages the brain, I wonder where I would be without these fillings, as I completed two master's degrees in the last decade.

These fillings are ugly though, and I can't wait for them to fall out so that I can have then replaced with the white stuff.

[Macosie]

Hi all. I'm also planning to have the amalgam removed. Some of my fillings are 30+ years old.

I'm wondering what options the dentists gave you? The white stuff is good for about 5 years. I'm more interested in either gold or ceramic. Anyone have either done here?

I'd also be interested in the cost of the local dentist vs the dentists who cater to the expat community.