Lengthy Electric Bill/Legal Question

[sunflowerblues06]

I checked out of my place yesterday, which I had stayed at for 3 months. At check out the room was found to be in the same condition as when I moved in, so I received my full deposit of 12,000 baht, minus the month's electric bill. The electric charges came to the paltry amount of 280 baht. The previous monthly electric bills were 850, and 1080. Considering that I used the air con. more frequently in April, I was expecting to pay around 1350. I therefore mentioned it to both the clerk and the manager, and stated that I should be paying more than 280. The manager waved her hand and said the bill was correct. I was pleased by this and chalked it up to karma, because when I arrived in February I gave the clerk 21,000 for the 20,400 bill, and realized a few hours later that the clerk had not given me the 600 baht change I was due, as I was in discussion with the manager at the time and had forgotten to ask for it when leaving the desk. I went down to talk with the clerk when I discovered the missing 600 baht but she told me there was nothing she could do. I asked if it was possible to check the accounting ledger book, and if she found the book in surplus of 600 baht, could she then give me what I was owed? She said no. I wasn't too upset, knowing it was my own fault for having walked away from the desk without collecting it.

I arrived in Bangkok today and found an email from the hotel, saying they had made a mistake with the electric bill, and could I please pay them a further 1064 baht. I remembered the 600 baht the hotel owed me, and saw that the positions had been reversed - now it was they who had made a mistake, as I had already checked out, with a signed receipt saying I had paid in full, and no longer in Chiang Mai. I decided that paying the bill was the fair thing to do, but at the same time was aware that the hotel had made no effort at compensation when I was the one who had been shorted. I wrote back, stating I was no longer in Chiang Mai, but was willing to pay for some of the bill. I explained that I had been shorted 600 baht when I had checked in, and was willing to pay the difference in what I now owed them (1064 - 600 = 464 baht), if they could advise me on how to pay them from Bangkok.

They responded that I could transfer the money to their bank, and that they had made another mistake in their billing computations, that the new amount I owed was now 1939, and minus the 600 baht they owed me (which they must have decided to agree to), could I please pay them 1059 baht. I find it doubtful that my electric bill would be almost double from the previous month, as I was mindful in my use of the air con., so concluded that the manager was padding the bill to recover the full amount of what was owed.

I responded that the 1939 amount is most likely a mistake due to it being almost double from the previous month's amount, and that as a compromise I would agree to pay 500 baht into their account, provided I could locate their bank in Bangkok, and figure out how to make a deposit into their account.

I don't have knowledge of contract law, so am wondering if I have a legal obligation to pay the full amount they are requesting, or, because I have a signed receipt from them, stating the amount of electrical charges to be 280 baht, that I paid in full, thus closing my account, means I have paid everything I should and the amount still owed to them, due to their mistake, cannot legally be collected.

I realize that Thai laws are different from my country, so I wanted to share the facts and get some feedback so that I can do the correct thing. I have read stories of farang making etiquette blunders and end up being in hospital (or worse) due to a drive by clubbing. I hope to avoid this fate, and at the same time, do the fair thing, if possible.

[brucestatham]

yes,here is the legal position of this in thailand .........

SOM NAM NAA

if you lost out due to your err,then thats that.

if the hotel lost out due to their err,then thats that.

however,the clerk/cashier responsible will be liable to give the cash they 'lost' back to their employee,probably.....

the clerk/cashier would keep that 600 b also,probably.

don't waste any more of your time on it,just ignore them,and forget about it.

however.............,you have just made a verbal agreement to repay them.......... no ,just forget about it and don't contact them anymore,unless you plan on staying there again.....

[ShopBoy]

not your fault

if you don't plan to stay there again just walk away and if you plan to head back there just pay them what you think is a fair amount i would go with the 1059 amount and deduct the 600

[MrBrad]

I agree with the others who said that at the time of checking out you paid what they asked for, and they didn't want to review the bill even after you told them it didn't look right.

But, as for ever staying there again, you'd be asking for trouble. Don't give them any opportunity to deal with you in the future.

You say that you want to pay them what you feel you rightfully owe, but they're not being honest in responding to your offer. It's peculiar how they now are willing to concede to their having shortchanged you on your first day. What goes around, comes around.

[PoodMaiDai]

Walk away.

SOM NAM NAA indeed.

Every now and then a falang wins in the land of smiles, scams, and shenanigans. Cherish this moment.

[CMSteve]

Technically you still owe the balance of the electric bill, assuming they are billing you the correct amount. Realistically, Karma is the only reason to follow up and pay it.

To pursue the payment through legal channels would cost more and take a lot of time, not nearly worth it on their end.

If you don't believe in Karma.....

Edited May 2, 2012 by CMSteve

[jamesbrock]

I agree. Let it go. Unless you're planning to go back.

If it were me, the insolent wave of the hand when you tried to make good would be more than enough to want to teach her a lesson in humility. Had she accepted that she may have made an error then, instead of trying to save face, she would have her money now.

Also, the fact that the bill went up a second time - up by exactly 600 baht - after conceding that she owed you 600 baht, shows that she is stupid as well as dishonest.

[sunflowerblues06]

Thanks for replies, good advice not to stay there again when I find myself back in Chiang Mai. I am going to pay them 500 baht if I can locate their bank, all should be equal (in karma dept), and hopefully that will be the end of it.

[haybilly]

I must say --I thought that I was going to read about some big money rip-off--I wouldn't lose too much sleep over what is effectively a few hundred baht.

[naboo]

Given their response to your offer to pay, ignore them. Some Nam Naa as has been said. This is their Karma payback, nothing to do with you.

Plenty of places around to offer honesty in response to yours.

[skippie999]

for a guy who is paying 20.000 baht per month and can afford it, this is a lot of talk for 1000 baht only. But if you checked out the stay is totally paid and forget about it. They came with the middle finger to you and so you do. They are used to it. so have a good sleep and spend the money to orphans or something to release your bad feeling. Even if you go back there don't care because these companies don't have memories. There is no legal consequence because what is 1000 baht? These buildings make mistakes every day. most people just pay the amount asked and do not even think if it is good or wrong. just simply forget about it and they will put the money on another bill.....

[eyecatcher]

The irony: for the same reason I wont buy an electric car....potentially overcharged.

[mjsansai]

Karma Karma yeah, if you lived in NYC for six months you would know what to problem is not too many boys from NYC around here,

[Maestro]

Keep a printout of your email correspondence with the hotel. If you get their account details, transfer 500 Baht, which was your latest offer, to them and keep the receipt. Carry these documents with you whenever you exit Thailand.

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[Thighlander]

How much were the ripping you off per unit? I was staying at The Royal Guest house once, forgot my change on a breakfast for two. Ask for it 12 hours later, and it was there sitting in a tray. Also, was overpaid by 1000 in Hua Hin at an exchange...they tracked me down at the hotel, the next day. Had to pay them back. How anyone agrees to pay 8 thb per unit of electric is beyond me. It's 4 in the States, and less than 4 in Thailand (might have gone up a notch). It would also be a very cold day in Hell before a gave them two months deposit.

[maps424]

I'm amazed you can be ok that they clearly ripped you off when you arrived, yet still want to "be nice" and not do it back to them.

I can't get my head around that thought at all.

[hellodolly]

Thanks for replies, good advice not to stay there again when I find myself back in Chiang Mai. I am going to pay them 500 baht if I can locate their bank, all should be equal (in karma dept), and hopefully that will be the end of it.

You are taking the moral high road good for you.

[Beetlejuice]

To the OP:

Email the hotel/guesthouse, whatever, and ask them to email you a copy of your electricity bill.

If it is an official bill from the electric company, then offer to pay the bill deducting the 600 baht you were not given back as your change. Keep a copy of that bill, request their bank details, pay the money into their bank and keep the bank stamped copy of the paying in slip.

If the bill copy appears like a photoshop job or does not pertain to your name or room or something that have put together, than ignore their demands and block the hotel from your email, then forget it. Do the same if they refuse to acknowledge that you were owed 600 baht.

They will not take any legal action against you, would not be worth their while, but it will mean that you would not be welcome at that hotel anymore, and if that does not worry you, than there is no problem.

[Tywais]

This topic is over one year old so would hope the OP has it all worked out by now.

[vivek130205]

No matter which ever part of this world one comes from, everyone can easily judge what's right and what's wrong. they didn't pay you back 600 now tell them that when you asked them to recheck the bill and the lady denied cuz maybe they wanted 2 ripoff 600 THB as they know that many foreigners wouldn't care about this sum of money. had they re checked the bill when you requested them to do probably the difference miscalculation could have been fixed. The reason why a small percentage of people try to rip off farangs is cuz we are scared. you have tourist police, Thai police nod moreover till the time you don't hurt someone's emotional or religious sentiments willing and hard they won't pounce back. this is thailand not any 3rd world country where anyone can do what so ever they feel like. you are right, had I been at ur place I would have taken them for a ride.

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[vivek130205]

This topic is over one year old so would hope the OP has it all worked out by now.

Omg. didn't realise that.

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[jackr]

Right click on email, hover junk email, click add sender's domain to blocked senders list.

Only give out email to friends/family.