Tourism Ministry Revives Controversial Elite Card

[rubl]

Over the last eight or so yeas we have had the most interesting stories about this 'privilege' or 'elite' card. Here some of them. Note it's difficult to consolidate figures and come with a reasonably accurate profit/loss or even just expenses/income account. Poor taxpayer, poor me.

2006-09-13

"With all the changes in the immigration rules, I was wondering if the Elite Card would be a good option. All those hassles and formalities don't make me happy and I am looking for a quick and easy solution and don't mind paying a premium fee for a long term solution."

http://www.thaivisa....and-elite-card/

2006-12-23

"Thailand Elite Card :Government urged to continue TPC operation"

http://www.nationmul...ss_30022306.php

2011-04-30

"Thailand's "Elite Card" fiasco comes to an end"

http://www.aseanaffa...comes_to_an_end

2011-05-30

"Thailand's Elite Card complaint site planned"

http://sgtravellers....e-planned/630/2

[Soutpeel]

know the history. 5 year visa renewable for life = residency permit. Worth the 30K for many Chinese.

No... a visa is not a residency permit.....not even close, further it was never a 5 year visa either....there are no 5 year visa's in Thailand, didnt Thai Eliters have to visit immigration every year and pay THB 1900 or something for renewal ?

Must have been a busy day at all the 10 baht/hour internetcafes for all the ignorant posters here to spew their venom on a subject, they clearly know very little about.

I bought the card 2003, paid 1M bath. Ever since then I have heard from all the barstoolguys, that it was only a question about time before the card would be cancelled. Nine years on still alive and kicking (?). First a 3 year visa (passport expired) and after that 2 times 5 years. Current one expires 2016. So there ARE 5 year visas in Thailand! No yearly renewal, but like anyone else 3 months reporting. So so far visas with no headache for 13 years. Less than 80.000 a year. IMO money well spent. If the Thai taxpayers have to foot the bill for running the thing, couldn't care less I thaought i my naivity that my fellow expats should applaud that some farang are actually getting their moneys worth here. BTW this is not a second batch, just business as usual.

So guys order another beer and join your friends outside 7/11 and leave the TE to the cardholders and the Thai government.

so your telling me, if you stay in country for more than 90 days at a time, you dont have to pay immigration THB 1900 to extend your 5 year visa every 90 days ?....

semantics maybe, but believe the 5 year visa you talk about is actually extendable for upto 5 years, not quite the same thing, for a true 5 year visa you wouldnt have to do anything for 5 years other than do your 90 day reports, for my 1 year extension for work, i have to only visit immigration once a year to extend and then 90 day report, if not leaving country on business, but it appears you have to pay for an extension every 3 months ?...therefore IMHO not really a 5 year visa..

If you have spent the money and feel you have got value out of this then good for you, but I can think of better things to do with sums of money like this

So on that note, I shall go back to my THB 10/h internet cafe which is next door to 7/11

Edited August 29, 2012 by Soutpeel

[richard_smith237]

know the history. 5 year visa renewable for life = residency permit. Worth the 30K for many Chinese.

No... a visa is not a residency permit.....not even close, further it was never a 5 year visa either....there are no 5 year visa's in Thailand, didnt Thai Eliters have to visit immigration every year and pay THB 1900 or something for renewal ?

Must have been a busy day at all the 10 baht/hour internetcafes for all the ignorant posters here to spew their venom on a subject, they clearly know very little about.

I bought the card 2003, paid 1M bath. Ever since then I have heard from all the barstoolguys, that it was only a question about time before the card would be cancelled. Nine years on still alive and kicking (?). First a 3 year visa (passport expired) and after that 2 times 5 years. Current one expires 2016. So there ARE 5 year visas in Thailand! No yearly renewal, but like anyone else 3 months reporting. So so far visas with no headache for 13 years. Less than 80.000 a year. IMO money well spent. If the Thai taxpayers have to foot the bill for running the thing, couldn't care less I thaought i my naivity that my fellow expats should applaud that some farang are actually getting their moneys worth here. BTW this is not a second batch, just business as usual.

So guys order another beer and join your friends outside 7/11 and leave the TE to the cardholders and the Thai government.

so your telling me, if you stay in country for more than 90 days at a time, you dont have to pay immigration THB 1900 to extend your 5 year visa every 90 days ?....

semantics maybe, but believe the 5 year visa you talk about is actually extendable for upto 5 years, not quite the same thing, for a true 5 year visa you wouldnt have to do anything for 5 years other than do your 90 day reports, for my 1 year extension for work, i have to only visit immigration once a year to extend and then 90 day report, if not leaving country on business, but it appears you have to pay for an extension every 3 months ?...therefore IMHO not really a 5 year visa..

If you have spent the money and feel you have got value out of this then good for you, but I can think of better things to do with sums of money like this

So on that note, I shall go back to my THB 10/h internet cafe which is next door to 7/11

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else. No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

I'm on my second 5 year visa with the TE program and on the whole I have felt satisfied with it.

But, what bites is the cuts they have made in the privileges, lack of information regarding these reductions and the movement of the goal posts:

- The number of Golf courses has been reduced by more than half (this is the most annoying for me).

- The Airport transfer was altered from a 7 Series BMW to a Toyota Camry (not a big issue).

- Massage was altered to Thai Massage only (which I don't like).

What has continued:

- The 5 year Visa renewable for life.

- Fast track through immigration.

- Airport Transfers (Camry).

- Golf at some good courses (but now with limited choice).

- Massage (Thai massage only).

- Medical Cover (and free yearly full on medical).

I saw the economic viability in the Golf courses and calculated that the 1 Million Baht would pay for itself within 8 years. Thats now extended due to a reduction in the courses I like to play.

The 5 year Visa and Airport transfers continue to offer great convenience.

It's not actually a bad deal - Its just a shame that the program has been run so poorly and has received such negative press.

As far as I am concerned: I would like to see the program continue with re-established benefits - Given the latest news It appears this may become the case. With the continued operation of the program I will save money - The economic viability for the card holder continues.

[Reasonableman]

know the history. 5 year visa renewable for life = residency permit. Worth the 30K for many Chinese.

No... a visa is not a residency permit.....not even close, further it was never a 5 year visa either....there are no 5 year visa's in Thailand, didnt Thai Eliters have to visit immigration every year and pay THB 1900 or something for renewal ?

Must have been a busy day at all the 10 baht/hour internetcafes for all the ignorant posters here to spew their venom on a subject, they clearly know very little about.

I bought the card 2003, paid 1M bath. Ever since then I have heard from all the barstoolguys, that it was only a question about time before the card would be cancelled. Nine years on still alive and kicking (?). First a 3 year visa (passport expired) and after that 2 times 5 years. Current one expires 2016. So there ARE 5 year visas in Thailand! No yearly renewal, but like anyone else 3 months reporting. So so far visas with no headache for 13 years. Less than 80.000 a year. IMO money well spent. If the Thai taxpayers have to foot the bill for running the thing, couldn't care less I thaought i my naivity that my fellow expats should applaud that some farang are actually getting their moneys worth here. BTW this is not a second batch, just business as usual.

So guys order another beer and join your friends outside 7/11 and leave the TE to the cardholders and the Thai government.

So, in summary, if you were a Thai taxpayer, would you say it is worth investing another 500 million taxpayer Baht to make/keep you and others happy? The benefits to Thailand seem somewhat unclear to many.

[asiawatcher]

The Card had its place. Holders were given fast track at airport in and out, complimentary limo both ways, whisked thru immigration annually for Non Imm B, complimentary golf at participating courses and so on. It provided a service and as the funds were paid up front it was a cash cow to the Govt. Then the news broke that it was costing hundreds of millions of baht to administer.

How?

The so-called administration was blowing millions of baht when it was a very simple cash up front so they just hived it off, then they could not account for it. And of course Thaksin's ex was in charge of the process and administration so it does not take much to figure out what went wrong. Just another scam propagated by the scam master to line his own pockets. And now it will happen again?

Well someone voted for them, but since the voters don't consider it affects main stream poverty struck Thai's, they won't change anything. Just another way to syphon money sideways with no accountability. But Thai's ARE paying for it from the so called shortfall, coming from the taxes they paid the the Govt. And the cycle continues...

[FarangTalk]

5 year visa, 90 day reporting, Elite Card holder, etc... The reality is that the rug can be pulled from under you at any moment, regardless of your own inflated opinion of yourself.

If you have and want to spend money, good luck to you but be prepared to lose it and anything you buy or invest in this country.

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Thaivisa Connect App

[Soutpeel]

whisked thru immigration annually for Non Imm B,

According to some posters this is not the case, you dont need to do anything for 5 years

and why a B visa ?....these visa's are not business visa's

Edited August 29, 2012 by Soutpeel

[Soutpeel]

So, in summary, if you were a Thai taxpayer, would you say it is worth investing another 500 million taxpayer Baht to make/keep you and others happy? The benefits to Thailand seem somewhat unclear to many.

I am a Thai tax payer and in its current form no...there would be some value in a system like this, but not the way it was set up

[Reasonableman]

So, in summary, if you were a Thai taxpayer, would you say it is worth investing another 500 million taxpayer Baht to make/keep you and others happy? The benefits to Thailand seem somewhat unclear to many.

I am a Thai tax payer and in its current form no...there would be some value in a system like this, but not the way it was set up

Yes, so am I, and is see little benefit in underwriting a commercial enterprise that runs at a loss, and then funding it again to the tune of 500 million Baht. What is the benefit to Thailand of this scheme? Can anyone clarify, please? Not to Elite cardholders, but to Thailand...

Edited August 29, 2012 by Reasonableman

[Ricardo]

Funny how nearly everyone who has something negative to say about the Card .... doesn't have one.

I myself looked at the Card, back in 2003/4, the 5-year-visa and right to hold land in my own name were attractive, but the latter benefit quickly was withdrawn, replaced with some nominee holding it instead (and I trusted the nominee I'd been married-to for over-a-decade more), and the visa-benefits would only reduce the hassle involved in living here, not on-its-own enough to justify GBP 14k (as it then was).

So if I don't have a card, it's because it wasn't really going to benefit me, all that much.

I don't play golf, don't have that much massage, and didn't need the hi-so treatment at-the-airport that much.

]Must have been a busy day at all the 10 baht/hour internetcafes for all the ignorant posters here to spew their venom on a subject, they clearly know very little about.

I bought the card 2003, paid 1M bath. Ever since then I have heard from all the barstoolguys, that it was only a question about time before the card would be cancelled. Nine years on still alive and kicking (?). First a 3 year visa (passport expired) and after that 2 times 5 years. Current one expires 2016. So there ARE 5 year visas in Thailand! No yearly renewal, but like anyone else 3 months reporting. So so far visas with no headache for 13 years. Less than 80.000 a year. IMO money well spent. If the Thai taxpayers have to foot the bill for running the thing, couldn't care less I thaought i my naivity that my fellow expats should applaud that some farang are actually getting their moneys worth here. BTW this is not a second batch, just business as usual.

So guys order another beer and join your friends outside 7/11 and leave the TE to the cardholders and the Thai government.

Glad to hear that you're happy with the deal you got.

My own annual visa-costs, to buy the right to live here with annual-extensions, are about B6k per-annum, quite a bit cheaper than B80k per-year up-front which you were happy to pay. From a cash-flow POV we clearly have different comfort-levels.

To buy a card now would cost me GBP 30k, which is simply not worth it, but as I said before, I'd look seriously at B100k for the visa itself, and the unlimited re-entry privilege. That's what the hassle-factor is worth to me personally.

I'll go back to my beer, and 10B/hour (these days ? seriously ? !) internet-cafe, now.

[Rockefeller]

Funny how nearly everyone who has something negative to say about the Card .... doesn't have one.

I have one. I notice other people with elite cards passionately justify to everyone else it made sense so they can feel good about themselves when in fact their logic is flawed. I can say in my experience I have received some great service, but also terrible service from Elite. I’d like to provide some balanced information about the benefits.

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else.

Wrong. The elite visa only permits 90 day stay on entry. A 90 day report does not cut it to stay longer and you know that so why post something misleading like this?

No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

Wrong. You must file an "APPLICATION FOR EXTENSION OF TEMPORARY STAY IN THE KINGDOM TM.7" every 90 days in addition to a 90 day report. You must pay 1900 baht per time. You must do this in person. The visa was never designed for people living in Thailand which creates many problems elite members don’t talk about such as not being eligible for a permanent driving license.

The Airport transfer was altered from a 7 Series BMW to a Toyota Camry (not a big issue)

This is an absolutely huge issue. The program is being funded again so why are we are still riding in Camry's instead of BMW's? What is the new funding being used for? What was the lifetime membership money we already paid used for? TPC has demonstrated time and again they only care about spending our dosh and saving their asses. They are doing nothing for us except cut our benefits meanwhile it’s business as usual for them. There may be no better example than their gigantic, immaculate facility in prime real estate in the heart of Bangkok. It is of absolutely no benefit to members. It’s our money they waste on themselves in their gigantic offices and grounds year after year meanwhile we are now squeezed into Toyota Camry’s. I am appalled any paying member can say this is not a big issue.

Massage was altered to Thai Massage only (which I don't like)

It makes sense if you consider their strategy is an up sell model. They just offer a low end teaser massage for elite members because the program is banking on members not being tightwads sticking to their coupons, but instead showing up at top of the line facilities and dumping cash for top of the line offerings.

Medical Cover (and free yearly full on medical)

The free yearly medical again is their up sell model. Let’s take BNH hospital as an example. They have 3 levels of checkups: classic, grande, and royal. Which one do elite members get free? classic only! They know members want the best medicals from the best hospitals. So again their strategy is to get you to the window where you will pay more money to the hospital for their thorough checkups.

Oh, and sorry to be the one to break the bad news, but the medical coverage benefit was completely cut from the program.

I would like to see the program continue with re-established benefits

Dream on…

[Soutpeel]

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else.

Wrong. The elite visa only permits 90 day stay on entry. A 90 day report does not cut it to stay longer and you know that so why post something misleading like this?

No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

Wrong. You must file an "APPLICATION FOR EXTENSION OF TEMPORARY STAY IN THE KINGDOM TM.7" every 90 days in addition to a 90 day report. You must pay 1900 baht per time. You must do this in person. The visa was never designed for people living in Thailand which creates many problems elite members don’t talk about such as not being eligible for a permanent driving license.

Thanks for confirming these two points as this is what I remembered reading somewhere...ie the visa was extendable upto 5 years, but you had to pay for extension every 90 days if not leaving the country

[maidu]

Who got the 1 rai of Thai property - as orginally promised to all card holders?

I didn't buy a card, but I secured several properties in Thailand. All are a lot more than 1 rai, beautiful rural places. Well, when I got them they were 100% weed choked as to be useless. But now (with a farang caring for the properties) they're like wonderful parks, with big trees, lawns, flowers, lovers' lanes, etc. I'm far from rich (about $1,500 year, no pensions or funny money), and I secured the properties for small cost. So, I got cheap land, made it beautiful, and didn't have to buy a bogus elite card to do it.

P.s. it's not all selfish development on my part, There are several hill tribe families residing on the properties for free, along with some work-exchange assistance from them. Like extended families. These are people who, in stark contrast to the 'elite card' types who PT and Thaksin are fixated about, are stateless. They were born in Thailand, but are essentially non-people as far as Thaksin and his elite card cronies are concerned. Their kids would not have been able to afford to go to school (grammar school is NOT FREE in Thailand, despite what the elitists tell us to believe), but I've assisted when possible, so now the several kids are in their early 20's, well adjusted, and making families of their own.

[AleG]

...

The Airport transfer was altered from a 7 Series BMW to a Toyota Camry (not a big issue)

This is an absolutely huge issue. The program is being funded again so why are we are still riding in Camry's instead of BMW's? What is the new funding being used for? What was the lifetime membership money we already paid used for? TPC has demonstrated time and again they only care about spending our dosh and saving their asses. They are doing nothing for us except cut our benefits meanwhile it’s business as usual for them. There may be no better example than their gigantic, immaculate facility in prime real estate in the heart of Bangkok. It is of absolutely no benefit to members. It’s our money they waste on themselves in their gigantic offices and grounds year after year meanwhile we are now squeezed into Toyota Camry’s. I am appalled any paying member can say this is not a big issue.

...

Just a quibble, but now, and I guess that from a long time and maybe even from the beginning, this program is not running on the money from the card payment, but subsidized by all taxpayers.

It's really ironic how some, not you Rockefeller, gloat over being on state welfare and like to rub it in....

[thaicbr]

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else. No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

I'm on my second 5 year visa with the TE program and on the whole I have felt satisfied with it.

But, what bites is the cuts they have made in the privileges, lack of information regarding these reductions and the movement of the goal posts:

- The number of Golf courses has been reduced by more than half (this is the most annoying for me).

- The Airport transfer was altered from a 7 Series BMW to a Toyota Camry (not a big issue).

- Massage was altered to Thai Massage only (which I don't like).

What has continued:

- The 5 year Visa renewable for life.

- Fast track through immigration.

- Airport Transfers (Camry).

- Golf at some good courses (but now with limited choice).

- Massage (Thai massage only).

- Medical Cover (and free yearly full on medical).

I saw the economic viability in the Golf courses and calculated that the 1 Million Baht would pay for itself within 8 years. Thats now extended due to a reduction in the courses I like to play.

The 5 year Visa and Airport transfers continue to offer great convenience.

It's not actually a bad deal - Its just a shame that the program has been run so poorly and has received such negative press.

As far as I am concerned: I would like to see the program continue with re-established benefits - Given the latest news It appears this may become the case. With the continued operation of the program I will save money - The economic viability for the card holder continues.

question,, if you wanted to can you work in Thailand on this 5 year visa?

[steveromagnino]

Yes, so am I, and is see little benefit in underwriting a commercial enterprise that runs at a loss, and then funding it again to the tune of 500 million Baht. What is the benefit to Thailand of this scheme? Can anyone clarify, please? Not to Elite cardholders, but to Thailand...

It was never meant to benefit Thailand, it is meant to benefit specific individuals and a specific party because it is government funding in a fairly opaque area and not excessively massive, so can be easily given as a reward to one faction to run who skim something like 20% of the 500m a year straight up, and because it isn't billions of baht, no one complains too much. For the amount it costs people like me (Thai tax payers) the cardholders should be able to receive rolls royce pick ups and so on, but they don't because the skim is not only the cost of promoting the scheme (which is money down the toilet) but also in Thailand Elite funding a limo company to do the pick up drop offs at the cost of a BMW but actually skimming and providing a Camry.

While some card holders benefit from the scheme, you have to look at people who pay tax to fund it, it is an extremely bad deal for them.

Regarding benefits to Thailand given we are talking <5,000 people and Thai tourism is more like 12+ million they are a speck in a drop in the bucket. Benefits accruew primarily to the people running the scheme at the expense of the tax payers.

Which is the same case in virtually every major activity of the current government.

[richard_smith237]

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else.

Wrong. The elite visa only permits 90 day stay on entry. A 90 day report does not cut it to stay longer and you know that so why post something misleading like this?

No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

Wrong. You must file an "APPLICATION FOR EXTENSION OF TEMPORARY STAY IN THE KINGDOM TM.7" every 90 days in addition to a 90 day report. You must pay 1900 baht per time. You must do this in person. The visa was never designed for people living in Thailand which creates many problems elite members don’t talk about such as not being eligible for a permanent driving license.

Thanks for confirming these two points as this is what I remembered reading somewhere...ie the visa was extendable upto 5 years, but you had to pay for extension every 90 days if not leaving the country

Then I'm mistaken on this point: I always understood I did not have to leave Thailand every 90 days. I thought it was a simple report, I was never aware it would cost 1900 baht every 3 months.

I've never had to rely on this as I travel too much, which is one of the reasons I like the card saving so much time through immigration and ease of transport to and from the airport.

I wish it was called something else other than the Elite or Privilege card - The use of these words alone makes people hate what isn't a terrible system.

Just call it the Thai Card and it will remove the assumption that those who purchased it do not have a puffed up ego.

The Big question: Would I buy into the Thai Card again? No, they have removed too many of the benefits. I have a Wife who can pick me up from the Airport and fast track immigration comes with business class travel anyway.

[richard_smith237]

question,, if you wanted to can you work in Thailand on this 5 year visa?

No. When I have worked in Thailand I have had to leave and re-enter Thailand on a Type B Non Imm visa and a apply for a work permit like everyone else.

In effect the 5 Year Visa is a 5 Year Tourist visa. And as Rockerfella mentioned: We need to apply in person for an extension every 90 days which costs 1900 baht (I was mistaken in my initial assumption that it is a 90 day report).

[richard_smith237]

Funny how nearly everyone who has something negative to say about the Card .... doesn't have one.

I have one. I notice other people with elite cards passionately justify to everyone else it made sense so they can feel good about themselves when in fact their logic is flawed. I can say in my experience I have received some great service, but also terrible service from Elite. I’d like to provide some balanced information about the benefits.

Service on the whole has been acceptable IMO with the exception of the removal of the Some of the Golf and Massage privileges. I wouldn't suggest this opinion is as passionate as some of the negative comments thrown at some of those / us who bought into the scheme.

I'd like to add at this point that its nothing about being elite, but simply buying into a service which showed promise - Realistically the phrase "too good to be true" should have cropped up in our pre-purchase assessment.

Its a 5 year visa with a required 90 day report, nothing else.

Wrong. The elite visa only permits 90 day stay on entry. A 90 day report does not cut it to stay longer and you know that so why post something misleading like this?

No need to leave the country or apply for extensions until the end of the 5 years.

Wrong. You must file an "APPLICATION FOR EXTENSION OF TEMPORARY STAY IN THE KINGDOM TM.7" every 90 days in addition to a 90 day report. You must pay 1900 baht per time. You must do this in person. The visa was never designed for people living in Thailand which creates many problems elite members don’t talk about such as not being eligible for a permanent driving license.

My misunderstanding, I've never needed the extension.

The Airport transfer was altered from a 7 Series BMW to a Toyota Camry (not a big issue)

This is an absolutely huge issue. The program is being funded again so why are we are still riding in Camry's instead of BMW's? What is the new funding being used for? What was the lifetime membership money we already paid used for? TPC has demonstrated time and again they only care about spending our dosh and saving their asses. They are doing nothing for us except cut our benefits meanwhile it’s business as usual for them. There may be no better example than their gigantic, immaculate facility in prime real estate in the heart of Bangkok. It is of absolutely no benefit to members. It’s our money they waste on themselves in their gigantic offices and grounds year after year meanwhile we are now squeezed into Toyota Camry’s. I am appalled any paying member can say this is not a big issue.

If it means sustainability of the program then I understand and accept why they switched from the 7 series to the Camry. Its not a biggie for me as I like the convenience of the transport and a Camry is hardly a tuk tuk. I don't care about the 'Eliteness' of a 7 series when a Camry provides a very similar service.

Massage was altered to Thai Massage only (which I don't like)

It makes sense if you consider their strategy is an up sell model. They just offer a low end teaser massage for elite members because the program is banking on members not being tightwads sticking to their coupons, but instead showing up at top of the line facilities and dumping cash for top of the line offerings.

For this reason I've stopped using the Massage Service. The excuse provided by TPC was that the Thai massage promotes Thailand where has the other massages do not. IMO the objectives were simply money saving. I consider I've paid for the massages in advance. One of my grievances is the movement of these goal posts.

Medical Cover (and free yearly full on medical)

The free yearly medical again is their up sell model. Let’s take BNH hospital as an example. They have 3 levels of checkups: classic, grande, and royal. Which one do elite members get free? classic only! They know members want the best medicals from the best hospitals. So again their strategy is to get you to the window where you will pay more money to the hospital for their thorough checkups.

I've used their medical check up at Samtivej (not in the last 2 years though) and found it to be extensive.

Oh, and sorry to be the one to break the bad news, but the medical coverage benefit was completely cut from the program.

I never required this service - but understand it has been removed but they still offer a TPC discount at the hospitals (hardly anything though is it !).

I would like to see the program continue with re-established benefits

Dream on… Isn't this what this who thread and opening news article about... I keep on hoping...