Drunken-Driving Charge To Be Added In Ferrari Crash: Red Bull Heir

[LudovicThailand]

is this family pro-TS or anti-TS ? that can make a big difference in the final sentence, if any .....

[belg]

everybody knows how this is going to end up .... excile for the reach and famous

[ishan14]

life imprisonment without the possibility of parole ,is what these kind of people deserve.

[khunken]

No matter how fancy you want to label it, plain and simple it is not murder. it is vehicular manslaughter.

The reason for the murder charge is because he knew the police officer was stuck to the front of the car and he still did not stop for 64 metres, not the initial impact.

It is alleged he was doing 200km/h, I think taking 64 metres to stop is not unreasonable.

It has also been confirmed that he could not have accelerated to 200kmh on the short stretch of Sukhumvit road. The car would have been able to stop well within 64 metres and there are no skid marks at the scene which would indicate him slowing down at all.

So, we now know that he hit the policeman and dragged him for 64 metres with no evidence of stopping after driving down a stretch of road it would have been impossible to accelerate to 200kmh so he would have had more than enough time to stop (not that there was any evidence of him doing so). Is that labelled fancy enough for you?

The speed of the Ferrari at impact has NOT been confirmed - they are still working on it. I know that stretch of road well &, given little or no traffic, a Ferrari could reach that speed there. The Ferrari most likely has ABS which would account for the lack of skidmarks.

This is not a murder case - it is manslaughter.

Edited September 7, 2012 by khunken

[HerbalEd]

The ultimate legal test case..........

The powerful rich elite v The Police

If this had been just another regular Thai mown down then the case would have been brushed under the carpet.........but it's one of the BiB that's paid the price.

Thailand needs to know that the World will be watching this case.......this case will take on a life of it's own over the course of the next few months, Red Bull / Ferrari / Playboy / Police death.

This case is a big test for Thailand.........let's hope they are up to it.

Old matey in the Fezza will cop a 50,000b fine and no jail time.

Not this time. The whole world is watching ... as is the whole Thai nation. I think, hopefully, this time justice may well be done. Already a higher-up cop has been busted ... and now the drunk-driving charge.

[HerbalEd]

Minimum jail term of 3 years. Somehow I doubt it very much.

Boycott Red Bull at the Boycott Red Bull Facebook page.

I boycotted it long ago. Never drank the chemical brew, and never will.

[MaxYakov]

[ snipped Spoonman's original reply ]

The reason for the murder charge is because he knew the police officer was stuck to the front of the car and he still did not stop for 64 metres, not the initial impact.

It is alleged he was doing 200km/h, I think taking 64 metres to stop is not unreasonable.

It has also been confirmed that he could not have accelerated to 200kmh on the short stretch of Sukhumvit road. The car would have been able to stop well within 64 metres and there are no skid marks at the scene which would indicate him slowing down at all.

So, we now know that he hit the policeman and dragged him for 64 metres with no evidence of stopping after driving down a stretch of road it would have been impossible to accelerate to 200kmh so he would have had more than enough time to stop (not that there was any evidence of him doing so). Is that labelled fancy enough for you?

Who/what confirmed that it would have been impossible to accelerate to 200k m/h? Let's say it was less. How much less? 150k m/h? 120k m/h? Would it have made a material difference at even the lower speeds? A dump of the Ferrari's Event Data Recorder will probably settle this.

There was a 180k m/h +-30k m/h (estimated by digicam frame speed) Ferrari red light run in Singapore earlier this year. I know it is not the same situation, but the driver was able to accelerate into a green-turning-red light from several hundred meters away and broadsided a taxi that had immediately entered the intersection on his green. The broadside was captured on a digicam on the dash of a following taxi also entering the intersection (a very lucky man, since he would have been the victim if he'd entered alongside the broadsided taxi). Read the second comment that attempts to describe the approach to what he calls a 'stale' green light from the Ferrari driver's point of view:

http://www.post1.net..._speed_estimate

As far as whether or not the policeman was dragged:

On whether an offence of manslaughter or murder should be officially lodged against Worrayuth, Chumphol said there is not yet concrete evidence to indicate that Wichean was dragged under the Ferrari for a long distance.

"Intial [sic] autopsy results show that the conditions of the wounds and the uniform the victim wore do not suggest so," the chief added.

My guess is that the policeman hit the Ferrari's hood, then windshield at ( Ferrari minus motorcycle ) velocity and then was ejected either over the center or to the left side, being almost instantly accelerated to some fraction of Ferrari velocity in the process.

Edited September 7, 2012 by MaxYakov

[OzMick]

I think there may have been something lost in translation when he said the Ferrari was smoking. If you've seen "The Mask" you will know what I mean.

[Tanaka]

Another charge, another few thousand baht added to his check bin, hope Thailand realise this story has quite a substantial coverage in the International press.

The principals who will determine the outcome of this case all couldn't care less what the world thinks.

And why would they? Thailand is the world in their minds. No other country matters.

[SABloke]

So much talk about The Speed The Speed The Speeed. The speed is is irrelevant. He knowingly hit someone and drove away - THAT is relevant.

Now before you jump down my throat with , "Of course the speed is relevant, if he was only driving 30 that changes everything". Well, IF, he was driving a sensible speed (Let's say <60) He would have definitely had time to stop in under 60m, so in my opinion, he would be even more of a d*ck than he currently is made out to be.

Edited September 7, 2012 by SABloke

[chotthee]

The poor police need the cash.

What is the use of of the rich guy go to jail for a few years, and the poor police receive no cash?

[smedly]

A Ferrari like this needs less than 1/4 of a mile to achieve over 200kph or 120mph, or to put it another way it's about 8 secs, my bike will do 110kph in 1st gear in under 3 secs and reach 120mph/200kph in about 6secs, in saying that it doesn't matter what speed this guy was doing past 150kph - it is obviously way too fast for a city street and if he hits a motorbike at that speed the rider will most certaintly die unless he is very very lucky

There is no mention what direction the motorbike was going or speed but if he hit the windscreen of a car moving at over 100mph he will most certaintly have been flung into the air and projected quite a distance before coming to a stop - this would also happen to a pedestrian crossing the street

Two things that caused this accident - speed and possibly under the influence of drink or drugs, the cop has no blame in this whatsoever no matter if he was riding backwards blindfolded

I'm not sure we will hear much more about this going forward

[Baerboxer]

Driver must have been well sozzled if his blood sample still shows over the legal limit even though sample was taken 6 hours after the incident (reported yesterday).

The report here says he was over the limit when the accident occured - indicating that the level was calculated based on the level found several hours later. It doesn't indicate by how much he was over the limit. That would have been good to report.

[Baerboxer]

life imprisonment without the possibility of parole ,is what these kind of people deserve.

Do you know any country in the world which imposes sentences like this in these types of cases?

[MaxYakov]

A Ferrari like this needs less than 1/4 of a mile to achieve over 200kph or 120mph, or to put it another way it's about 8 secs, my bike will do 110kph in 1st gear in under 3 secs and reach 120mph/200kph in about 6secs, in saying that it doesn't matter what speed this guy was doing past 150kph - it is obviously way too fast for a city street and if he hits a motorbike at that speed the rider will most certaintly die unless he is very very lucky

There is no mention what direction the motorbike was going or speed but if he hit the windscreen of a car moving at over 100mph he will most certaintly have been flung into the air and projected quite a distance before coming to a stop - this would also happen to a pedestrian crossing the street

Two things that caused this accident - speed and possibly under the influence of drink or drugs, the cop has no blame in this whatsoever no matter if he was riding backwards blindfolded

I'm not sure we will hear much more about this going forward

Generally agree. There was a statement yesterday that the motorcycle was parallel to (and apparently fairly centered with ) the Ferrari at impact. There was also a photo showing the motorcycle positioned in front of the Ferrari, apparently in the same position it was in at impact. There was a statement that the motorcycle's exhaust pipe had gone straight into the Ferrari's bumper, I believe.

There was also apparently some speculation that the motorcycle had gotten on Sukumvit from Soi 47 in front of the Ferrari (that would have been be a left turn). This was discounted in an article yesterday in a statement that the motorcycle would have been hit diagonally (would not have had time to straighten-up or get parallel to the Ferrari's trajectory) had that been the case. This seems to me to be a matter of timing and which lane he intended to straighten-up in, but what the hay?

Without the detailed forensics reports and just these news articles its impossible to tell how it really went down ... and even then ...

Edited September 7, 2012 by MaxYakov

[farangbanok]

Since the behaviour of a person associated at a high level with the sole Ferrari distrubutor in Thailand brings the Ferrari name into disrepute , perhaps Luca Cordero di Montezemolo, Chairman of Ferrari, should seriously consider cancelling any current agreements on distribution.

He might be wise, also, to ensure that no members of the same family are associated in any way with the new distributor.

Edited September 7, 2012 by farangbanok

[Puyai]

The time has come. Time to make a stand for injustice and corruption!!!

BOYCOTT THE BULL AT:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Boycott-Red-Bull/310917865673962

[bigbamboo]

The ultimate legal test case..........

The powerful rich elite v The Police

If this had been just another regular Thai mown down then the case would have been brushed under the carpet.........but it's one of the BiB that's paid the price.

Thailand needs to know that the World will be watching this case.......this case will take on a life of it's own over the course of the next few months, Red Bull / Ferrari / Playboy / Police death.

This case is a big test for Thailand.........let's hope they are up to it.

Old matey in the Fezza will cop a 50,000b fine and no jail time.

Not this time. The whole world is watching ... as is the whole Thai nation. I think, hopefully, this time justice may well be done. Already a higher-up cop has been busted ... and now the drunk-driving charge.

Ah, the drunk diving charge. You'd think that would put the tin lid on the case but the latest twist is the claim by his lawyer that the accused was only drinking after the incident and not before, as you would if you'd just been involved in a fatal accident.

Shane Warne would be proud of spin like that.

[spirit47]

I hope he hit next time when driving drunken the ass of a truck...No brain, no style, no responsibility, these rich infants boring me.

[kirk0233]

One BiB gets killed and everyone is screaming !! Why are we not giving this kind of attention when the BiB Kill people, Extort money from people, Lie & Give False Evidents !!!! Should this kid go to jail Yes !! If you have lived here long enough you will know this will not happen !! Look at the girl who killed 9 students with her car !! anything happen to her of course not !! Even the BiB have their hands out waiting to get paid on this one ! Until the people of Thailand wake up and start demanding Justice for everyone not just the rich and hold the Police and the Government Responsible for their actions this country will remain a Joke in the Worlds Eyes ! And the Rich just keep getting Richer and the rest get craped on.

Have a Nice Day

I agree. I suspect the BIB are only adding charges to up the pay off.

[Nigel1500]

The ultimate legal test case..........

The powerful rich elite v The Police

If this had been just another regular Thai mown down then the case would have been brushed under the carpet.........but it's one of the BiB that's paid the price.

Thailand needs to know that the World will be watching this case.......this case will take on a life of it's own over the course of the next few months, Red Bull / Ferrari / Playboy / Police death.

This case is a big test for Thailand.........let's hope they are up to it.

Old matey in the Fezza will cop a 50,000b fine and no jail time.

I disagree ... the case has become so public that Thai people just wouldn't stand for anything less than some goal time. Not to mention the ramifications of getting away with killing a cop, a social injustice in any juridiction.

[candid]

The time has come. Time to make a stand for injustice and corruption!!!

BOYCOTT THE BULL AT:

http://www.facebook....310917865673962

I can only afford to boycott the Ferrari dealership. Think they will notice?

[Thai at Heart]

BTW it's Krating Daeng. Red Bull GmbH is an Austrian company, cofounded by Chaleo Yoovidhya. Red Bull is based on Krating Daeng, which is what you can find here in Thailand (and itself was developed from Lipovitan). In this case just trivia, same people, different drink.

Oh no, please don't tell the truth that red bull is a Japanese knock off with a farang marketing genius that built it?

[ttelise]

The real charges should be premeditated murder and "reckless" endangerment, since the driver "consciously" thought about immediately driving off with the motorcycle and human being attached to the front and/or windshield of the car. Notwithstanding the whole scheme of obstruction of justice, if such a thing exists in Thailand.

Another great post that show the level of intelligence of the TV forum poster. Why don't you look up what premeditated and "consciously" mean. I face palmed this stupid post and I can't believe people clicked like on it. Cause I seriously doubt your intelligence I will help you out.

"Premeditated" - Think out or plan (an action, esp. a crime) BEFOREHAND NOT during a crime

"Consciously" - Having an awareness of one's environment and one's own existence, sensations, and thoughts.

THIS WOULD MEAN HE INTENTIONALLY SOUGHT OUT TO HIT AND KILL THE COP AND THAT IS A RIDICULOUS ACCUSATION

Haha, might consider you own advise. Premeditation can be formed in an instant.

This can be a confusing concept to lay people and some states have modified the Pattern Jury Instructions to avoid confusion, but it is still technically the law. Convictions under that instruction are routinely affirmed.

I could give many examples, but I already provided a simple relevant one before. If after impact, this guy heard police officer screaming for help or to stop and he made a decision to eliminate the witness, that is premeditation formed an instant.

Not saying this is the facts. I am simply pointing out you guys don't understand the legal concepts of mens rea necessary for various degrees of homicide.

Edited September 7, 2012 by ttelise

[Banzai99]

=> EVERY day there are HUNDREDS/THOUSANDS of drunken Thai drivers on the roads, police included..... they have to give them the same charge ! the roads would be much more safe !!!!

Hundreds / thousands of drunken Farangs on Thai roads too.

[Spoonman]

The real charges should be premeditated murder and "reckless" endangerment, since the driver "consciously" thought about immediately driving off with the motorcycle and human being attached to the front and/or windshield of the car. Notwithstanding the whole scheme of obstruction of justice, if such a thing exists in Thailand.

Another great post that show the level of intelligence of the TV forum poster. Why don't you look up what premeditated and "consciously" mean. I face palmed this stupid post and I can't believe people clicked like on it. Cause I seriously doubt your intelligence I will help you out.

"Premeditated" - Think out or plan (an action, esp. a crime) BEFOREHAND NOT during a crime

"Consciously" - Having an awareness of one's environment and one's own existence, sensations, and thoughts.

THIS WOULD MEAN HE INTENTIONALLY SOUGHT OUT TO HIT AND KILL THE COP AND THAT IS A RIDICULOUS ACCUSATION

If after impact, this guy heard police officer screaming for help or to stop and he made a decision to eliminate the witness, that is premeditation formed an instant.

Who told you that ?

Ohh that's right it is pure speculation on your behalf. the offense is vehicular manslaughter. end off.

[ttelise]

The real charges should be premeditated murder and "reckless" endangerment, since the driver "consciously" thought about immediately driving off with the motorcycle and human being attached to the front and/or windshield of the car. Notwithstanding the whole scheme of obstruction of justice, if such a thing exists in Thailand.

Another great post that show the level of intelligence of the TV forum poster. Why don't you look up what premeditated and "consciously" mean. I face palmed this stupid post and I can't believe people clicked like on it. Cause I seriously doubt your intelligence I will help you out.

"Premeditated" - Think out or plan (an action, esp. a crime) BEFOREHAND NOT during a crime

"Consciously" - Having an awareness of one's environment and one's own existence, sensations, and thoughts.

THIS WOULD MEAN HE INTENTIONALLY SOUGHT OUT TO HIT AND KILL THE COP AND THAT IS A RIDICULOUS ACCUSATION

If after impact, this guy heard police officer screaming for help or to stop and he made a decision to eliminate the witness, that is premeditation formed an instant.

Who told you that ?

Ohh that's right it is pure speculation on your behalf. the offense is vehicular manslaughter. end off.

If you read the very next sentence you edited out in your quote, you would have answered your own question.

I said I was not implying facts and don't know what happened. Just one of many examples or hypotheticals that could supply mens rea for first degree murder in an instant.

Why the need to edit quotes and intentionally take things out of context?

[Credo]

It makes very little difference if they charge him with Drunk Driving. They can add all the charges they want, but it is for nothing if there is going to be real penalty.

They did some of the same thing to the gal in the expressway van crash. A lot of charges, but little penalty.

All those charges make things sound good. It sounds like the police are doing their job, but I fear it will only be an exercise in judicial foolishness at the end of the day.

[MaxYakov]

The time has come. Time to make a stand for injustice and corruption!!!

BOYCOTT THE BULL AT:

http://www.facebook....310917865673962

I can only afford to boycott the Ferrari dealership. Think they will notice?

One less oily nose print on the window? Maaaaaybe! Naaaaah!

Edited September 7, 2012 by MaxYakov

[personchester]

I wonder whether the father of 'Boss' was also involved in trying to persuade the family employee to take the rap for his son. If so, can he also be charged with a crime?

Yes he can, but will not.