Thai Resident Application - Successful!

[bangkokburning]

So PR status allows you to own land own land, that's great. I thought that came only with citizenship.

Anyone cam own a business but I guess it removes a great deal of visa, paperwork and hassle.

Thanks, for that. For Mac I can see this value.

Haha - you the 'insider' "status" - too funny. Maybe we tattoo it on every PR forehead?

Edited October 18, 2012 by bangkokburning

[Mario2008]

PR does not allow to own land. Only Thai nationality allows you to own land.

Edited October 18, 2012 by Mario2008

[bangkokburning]

Thank you Mario, of course - you are just PR.

But could you own a corporation that owns property? I bet you could get away with that.

So it simply removes the visa requirement and allows a long uninterrupted stay BUT if you want to leave, that requires you check out - and pay and appears you may have to check in again which non o /m do not need to do.

But you are now an insider as opposed to all of us loser outsiders...

And if you are in business, there is seemingly benefit.

[Mario2008]

I'm not PR, I'm a mere mortal.

A company can own land and you can own (part) of a company, even without PR. The land is not yours and while it is done to start a company to own land, setting up a front company to own land can lead to confiscation of the land. (So far that hasn't happen as far as I know, but no guarentees for the future).

[DonW]

Then you don't stand much of a change.

You must be a credit to Thai society, one way of showing that is by working and and earning a good income in Thailand itself. It is a major issue in determining if you will get PR or Thai nationality.

So some 'English Teacher' or someone who works at a Non Imm Ed Visa mill is more of a credit to Thailand than a chap with a million quid and supporting a Thai family (not that I have). Seems a tad silly that.

[DonW]

So to answer my own question - there really is no good reason.

Just like I thought.

Citizenship, I understand, this is the biggest bunch of nothing.

Again can somrone spell out the benefit please without the ad hominum attack?

It's been done, numerous times already. If you think it's "nothing" to be able to own land, own your company, be free of visa and work permit hassles, and be a part of society with 100% rights rather than an outsider with less than 100%-- so be it.

I don't really know what more there is to say.

He is talking about PR not citizenship

[DonW]

And by the way - I dont think a farang with a Thai passport will ever be anything else other than a farang. You aren't Thai - you will always be regarded as a farang with a Thai passport.

The benefits I do not question. But accepted as a Thai member of society ? You're having a laugh.

Most places are similar (I'm a naturalised Brit) its the same here but its extenuated in nationalistic Thailand.

Edited October 18, 2012 by DonW

[DonW]

Essentially then, the only benefit to PR is no more visas - EVER.

You're scraping the barrel Gents by saying that you can join the Thai queue at the airport. I always join that Queue with the Mrs and when she isn't with me on entry I join and say I need to get home fast as herindoors is birthing ....always works.

And on exiting - there's never a queue and I dont wannna leave anyways.

[samran]

And by the way - I dont think a farang with a Thai passport will ever be anything else other than a farang. You aren't Thai - you will always be regarded as a farang with a Thai passport.

The benefits I do not question. But accepted as a Thai member of society ? You're having a laugh.

Sounds rather like sour grapes to be honest.

Thailand consists of lots of sub-societies - whether they be business circles, sporting groups, or local suburbs. In my experience, it is more than possible to be accepted into a range of groups without having to 'go native'. Passport or not.

Having said that, those who have gone to the effort of naturalisation have already found their bolt hold in Thailand - and are more than well accepted amongst those who matter to them.

[DonW]

And by the way - I dont think a farang with a Thai passport will ever be anything else other than a farang. You aren't Thai - you will always be regarded as a farang with a Thai passport.

The benefits I do not question. But accepted as a Thai member of society ? You're having a laugh.

Sounds rather like sour grapes to be honest.

Thailand consists of lots of sub-societies - whether they be business circles, sporting groups, or local suburbs. In my experience, it is more than possible to be accepted into a range of groups without having to 'go native'. Passport or not.

Having said that, those who have gone to the effort of naturalisation have already found their bolt hold in Thailand - and are more than well accepted amongst those who matter to them.

Sour grapes? No. Reality? Yes. Do you really think thaat Thais will regards you as a truen Thai, one of them - just cause you have a little red book?

Yeh, I am a member of the Thai windsurf association. They dont think I am Thai though. I was joint best man at an MPs wedding, they dont think I am Thai though.

A farang will always be a farang. I am not saying its a bad thing, its just the way of the thing.

NewlylintedThai seems to have a need for acceptance. I understand that as a Khurd who is naturaised in Britian. I am still a Khurd with a Brit pasport. My wife will always be a Thai with a Brit passport. And Britian is way more accpeting of Foreigners into its society.

I just cant see ol' newlymintedthai bing introduced as 'Somchai our Thai friend' He'd be Somchai, our 'farang friend who speaks brilliant Thai and has lived in Thailand for decades'

No sour grapes just a grasp on the reality of living in a nationalistsic third world country. Accept it and live with it whereever you may be. He is accepted I am accepted. The passport makes no change to the commenon view held my the populace.

Cheers

[Time Traveller]

And by the way - I dont think a farang with a Thai passport will ever be anything else other than a farang. You aren't Thai - you will always be regarded as a farang with a Thai passport.

The benefits I do not question. But accepted as a Thai member of society ? You're having a laugh.

Sounds rather like sour grapes to be honest.

Thailand consists of lots of sub-societies - whether they be business circles, sporting groups, or local suburbs. In my experience, it is more than possible to be accepted into a range of groups without having to 'go native'. Passport or not.

Having said that, those who have gone to the effort of naturalisation have already found their bolt hold in Thailand - and are more than well accepted amongst those who matter to them.

Sour grapes? No. Reality? Yes. Do you really think thaat Thais will regards you as a truen Thai, one of them - just cause you have a little red book?

Yeh, I am a member of the Thai windsurf association. They dont think I am Thai though. I was joint best man at an MPs wedding, they dont think I am Thai though.

A farang will always be a farang. I am not saying its a bad thing, its just the way of the thing.

NewlylintedThai seems to have a need for acceptance. I understand that as a Khurd who is naturaised in Britian. I am still a Khurd with a Brit pasport. My wife will always be a Thai with a Brit passport. And Britian is way more accpeting of Foreigners into its society.

DonW, you asked earlier in this forum what is the benefits of becoming a citizen, NewlyMintedThai mentioned that you could work without work permit, own land or a company the same way as a native born thai could. Question answered.

You were the only person that then diverted the topic to mention or complain about "acceptance". Could it be that if you can't find acceptance in Thailand or Britain, then maybe you could try going back to Khurdland. You are what you imagine yourself to be.

Edited October 19, 2012 by Time Traveller

[DonW]

And by the way - I dont think a farang with a Thai passport will ever be anything else other than a farang. You aren't Thai - you will always be regarded as a farang with a Thai passport.

The benefits I do not question. But accepted as a Thai member of society ? You're having a laugh.

Sounds rather like sour grapes to be honest.

Thailand consists of lots of sub-societies - whether they be business circles, sporting groups, or local suburbs. In my experience, it is more than possible to be accepted into a range of groups without having to 'go native'. Passport or not.

Having said that, those who have gone to the effort of naturalisation have already found their bolt hold in Thailand - and are more than well accepted amongst those who matter to them.

Sour grapes? No. Reality? Yes. Do you really think thaat Thais will regards you as a truen Thai, one of them - just cause you have a little red book?

Yeh, I am a member of the Thai windsurf association. They dont think I am Thai though. I was joint best man at an MPs wedding, they dont think I am Thai though.

A farang will always be a farang. I am not saying its a bad thing, its just the way of the thing.

NewlylintedThai seems to have a need for acceptance. I understand that as a Khurd who is naturaised in Britian. I am still a Khurd with a Brit pasport. My wife will always be a Thai with a Brit passport. And Britian is way more accpeting of Foreigners into its society.

DonW, you asked earlier in this forum what is the benefits of becoming a citizen, NewlyMintedThai mentioned that you could work without work permit, own land or a company the same way as a native born thai could. Question answered.

You were the only person that then diverted the topic to mention or complain about "acceptance". Could it be that if you can't find acceptance in Thailand or Britain, then maybe you could try going back to Khurdland. You are what you imagine yourself to be.

Well, 'Timetraveller', that you for telling me how the discussions have progressed and what I have asked and what responses were reeived. Fortunately I dont have the Downs gene so had kind of kept up - though thank you for stating the bleedin obvious.

Should I go back to Khurdland? Well, how progress of you. Perhaps you should raise the same at your next BNP case study meeting.

If only we are what we imagine ourselves to me. You, a timetraveller, Somchai is indeed a woman and the poster is indeed a Thai man. However, I live in this world and this time.

I await your next philosophical insight.

[DonW]

Oh, and I didn't ask what the benefits were of becoming a citizen. IF you are stuggling to keep up just shout if you need a more correct version of the running commentary.

[bangkokburning]

So you need a wp, you need to buy re-entry,does not entitle you to own land and costs 100k.In twenty years you will be even money. Any less is a loss + your time and any legal fees. If you don't include an annual.re-entry looks like thirty or more years.

Great!

Funny, given the flooding, corruption and underlying political problems; I'm thinking more about an escape hatch rather than some more glue to keep me here. This place has a very uncertain future - nothing has been resolved.

Again, there is not real net gain and that is why the question is constantly deflected. I can see those with money to burn putting down 100k, but 200k that is a total waste of money.

BTW I used the Thai queue at the airport in/out more than a few times prior to marriage with my gf. No problems.

What is hilarious is that every retiree with a million in the bank and a Thai spouse does not have PR status - because Thailand does not have a retirement program. This program is only related to work.

Like another poster stated - I rather like my visa runs.

A bird went in seach of a cage - Kafka

Edited October 20, 2012 by bangkokburning

[bangkokburning]

Time traveler - your comments do not appear to be correct. I beleive it was stated a wp is still needed and as Mario pointed out, PR cannot own land based upon that status.

[Dork]

Time traveler - your comments do not appear to be correct. I beleive it was stated a wp is still needed and as Mario pointed out, PR cannot own land based upon that status.

For someone that has no interest in PR you have an awful lot to say about it.

[camerata]

Again, there is not real net gain and that is why the question is constantly deflected. I can see those with money to burn putting down 100k, but 200k that is a total waste of money.

The advantage for a single guy under 50 years old is that if he loses his job and work permit he won't be summarily kicked out of the country. It's hard to put a monetary value on that. A married guy can always fall back on the Non-Imm O visa while he looks for a new job.

[Theboy]

What I find annoying is the 5,700 Baht I have to pay every year to get my (multi) re-entry stamps

[ubonjoe]

If you were still on extensions of stay it would be the same price if you deduct 1900 baht for the extension. Plus you could also deduct the time and cost of doing 90 day reports.

[samran]

What I find annoying is the 5,700 Baht I have to pay every year to get my (multi) re-entry stamps

Thats when you go for citizenship I guess....

[Time Traveller]

What I find annoying is the 5,700 Baht I have to pay every year to get my (multi) re-entry stamps

There's something that bangkokburning can also argue about - that PR entitles you to pay more for your annual re-entry permit!

[richard10365]

I just noticed this thread. Congratulations Mac. I think you're the type of foreigner that Thailand is looking for. You help others speak Thai, you provide Thai people jobs, you pay your taxes, and you don't cause any problems in Thailand. I would say you deserve this. Keep up the good work!

[pistachios]

I'm speechless. I thought the advantages of this permanent residency were on par with the difficulty to obtain it, but it's actually a very expensive scam.

So you spend 200,000THB plus arguably other fees, spend countless hours to produce tons of paperwork, wait years to be finally acknowledged by the government as permanent resident. In my mind a permanent resident is someone who will possibly live all his life in a country. but for the Thai government you're still an underclass human being.

You now officially live here forever, but you still need to ask permission to work with those outdated work permit, even though you obtained that PR thanks to previous WP! Do they really expect you to stop working once you get PR? How stupid is that?

You also still need to ask permission to live the country! Is this north Korea?

And even after you showed your commitment to living in this country, by paying an outrageous fee, tons of taxes, learning the language, etc. you still can't buy a piece of land to build your house! That's so generous.

So for this price you get the privilege to not having to do retarded and frequent visa runs. Basically getting scammed just to avoid another scam. Congratulations!

By comparison, in Singapore you can get PR basically for free after just a few years working there, process takes only a few months, then you can enter or leave the country as you wish and take any kind of job freely.

[samran]

I'm speechless. I thought the advantages of this permanent residency were on par with the difficulty to obtain it, but it's actually a very expensive scam.

So you spend 200,000THB plus arguably other fees, spend countless hours to produce tons of paperwork, wait years to be finally acknowledged by the government as permanent resident. In my mind a permanent resident is someone who will possibly live all his life in a country. but for the Thai government you're still an underclass human being.

You now officially live here forever, but you still need to ask permission to work with those outdated work permit, even though you obtained that PR thanks to previous WP! Do they really expect you to stop working once you get PR? How stupid is that?

You also still need to ask permission to live the country! Is this north Korea?

And even after you showed your commitment to living in this country, by paying an outrageous fee, tons of taxes, learning the language, etc. you still can't buy a piece of land to build your house! That's so generous.

So for this price you get the privilege to not having to do retarded and frequent visa runs. Basically getting scammed just to avoid another scam. Congratulations!

By comparison, in Singapore you can get PR basically for free after just a few years working there, process takes only a few months, then you can enter or leave the country as you wish and take any kind of job freely.

Rather pessimistic?

- if you lose your job you can stay

- work permits are more of a formaility

- re-entry permits for PR are not limited to Thailand. Australia has return resident permits. No one is stopping you from leaving.

- 200K is $6000. Hardly expensive on a global basis. Half price if you are married.

- you can get a loan to buy a condo.

Most importantly though, this is a step for most to citizenship. So PR isn't an indefinite state for most. And with citizenship, comes the benefits.

That is the way the system works. It suits many. It will always annoy some.

[Mario2008]

off topic comment deleted.

[Dork]

I'm speechless. I thought the advantages of this permanent residency were on par with the difficulty to obtain it, but it's actually a very expensive scam.

So you spend 200,000THB plus arguably other fees, spend countless hours to produce tons of paperwork, wait years to be finally acknowledged by the government as permanent resident. In my mind a permanent resident is someone who will possibly live all his life in a country. but for the Thai government you're still an underclass human being.

You now officially live here forever, but you still need to ask permission to work with those outdated work permit, even though you obtained that PR thanks to previous WP! Do they really expect you to stop working once you get PR? How stupid is that?

You also still need to ask permission to live the country! Is this north Korea?

And even after you showed your commitment to living in this country, by paying an outrageous fee, tons of taxes, learning the language, etc. you still can't buy a piece of land to build your house! That's so generous.

So for this price you get the privilege to not having to do retarded and frequent visa runs. Basically getting scammed just to avoid another scam. Congratulations!

By comparison, in Singapore you can get PR basically for free after just a few years working there, process takes only a few months, then you can enter or leave the country as you wish and take any kind of job freely.

Despite recently becoming a PR myself, I have to admit that your analysis is reasonably fair. Anyone taking a first glance at what is required to get PR compared to the benefits it confers will baulk. And yes, some of the ongoing bureaucratic requirements for a PR to maintain their life here are pretty stupid.

But to compare PR in Thailand to (say) Singapore is futile because none of the people reading this thread want to live in Singapore for the rest of their lives.

For someone that has made Thailand their home, has invested financially, committed a substantial part of their life and plans a future here then they just want the most secure status they can get which translates to either Citizenship or PR. Since Citizenship doesn't work for everyone, that leaves PR. For this group of people, the cost/benefit ratio of PR is still acceptable however unfavourably it may compare to other countries.

It's tiresome to constantly read the same negative posts here one after the other. If PR seems like a bad deal to you, then it is. And it's not going to change anytime soon.

[kma2050]

Ok well thanks for the explanation. I thought that what you have just received was "Thai Citizenship" not just residence. Where you can vote, collect the pensions etc but this is new news for me. This took 6 years and now you also need to apply for citizenship?

I am confused however congrats on your status (I think.)

PS: Can someone then explain what the difference is in Citizenship and this Permanent residence?

Easy, with permanent residency you do not need a visa of any kind anymore, you come and go as you please.

Only once every 5 years have to check in at the police department.

Not many more advantages, still need a workpermit if you want to work etc. Still cannot own land...

Citizenship is one step up from that. You become a Thai citizen and will get every right/duty any other Thai citizen has (some with a delay, you only get voting rights after 5 years).

No restricted occupations (can become a tuk tuk driver if you so please), can own land, companies and so forth without any of the restrictions foreigners have. For all legal means and purposes you are the same as any other Thai national...

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Thaivisa Connect App

I am confused. So it takes 5-6 years to get permanent residency and then another 5 years for citizenship for foreigners, even though they marry a Thai girl ?

So to own a business in Thailand 100%, it would take me 10 years to be treated like a Thai and own a business; and own land 100% and a house 100% ??

That is way too harsh. I thought Thailand was trying to encourage business from Australians, not make it hard for them.

In Cambodia, there are no such restrictions - at least no way as harsh and far easier going, plus I can get a business visa for 12 months.

I think I may migrate and invest my Aussie dollars in Cambodia instead.

[yankee99]

Ok well thanks for the explanation. I thought that what you have just received was "Thai Citizenship" not just residence. Where you can vote, collect the pensions etc but this is new news for me. This took 6 years and now you also need to apply for citizenship?

I am confused however congrats on your status (I think.)

PS: Can someone then explain what the difference is in Citizenship and this Permanent residence?

Easy, with permanent residency you do not need a visa of any kind anymore, you come and go as you please.

Only once every 5 years have to check in at the police department.

Not many more advantages, still need a workpermit if you want to work etc. Still cannot own land...

Citizenship is one step up from that. You become a Thai citizen and will get every right/duty any other Thai citizen has (some with a delay, you only get voting rights after 5 years).

No restricted occupations (can become a tuk tuk driver if you so please), can own land, companies and so forth without any of the restrictions foreigners have. For all legal means and purposes you are the same as any other Thai national...

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Thaivisa Connect App

I am confused. So it takes 5-6 years to get permanent residency and then another 5 years for citizenship for foreigners, even though they marry a Thai girl ?

So to own a business in Thailand 100%, it would take me 10 years to be treated like a Thai and own a business; and own land 100% and a house 100% ??

That is way too harsh. I thought Thailand was trying to encourage business from Australians, not make it hard for them.

In Cambodia, there are no such restrictions - at least no way as harsh and far easier going, plus I can get a business visa for 12 months.

I think I may migrate and invest my Aussie dollars in Cambodia instead.

Yes you are confused. Get married get wp pay taxes 3 year apply for citizenship. Seems easy enough

[samran]

Ok well thanks for the explanation. I thought that what you have just received was "Thai Citizenship" not just residence. Where you can vote, collect the pensions etc but this is new news for me. This took 6 years and now you also need to apply for citizenship?

I am confused however congrats on your status (I think.)

PS: Can someone then explain what the difference is in Citizenship and this Permanent residence?

Easy, with permanent residency you do not need a visa of any kind anymore, you come and go as you please.

Only once every 5 years have to check in at the police department.

Not many more advantages, still need a workpermit if you want to work etc. Still cannot own land...

Citizenship is one step up from that. You become a Thai citizen and will get every right/duty any other Thai citizen has (some with a delay, you only get voting rights after 5 years).

No restricted occupations (can become a tuk tuk driver if you so please), can own land, companies and so forth without any of the restrictions foreigners have. For all legal means and purposes you are the same as any other Thai national...

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Thaivisa Connect App

I am confused. So it takes 5-6 years to get permanent residency and then another 5 years for citizenship for foreigners, even though they marry a Thai girl ?

So to own a business in Thailand 100%, it would take me 10 years to be treated like a Thai and own a business; and own land 100% and a house 100% ??

That is way too harsh. I thought Thailand was trying to encourage business from Australians, not make it hard for them.

In Cambodia, there are no such restrictions - at least no way as harsh and far easier going, plus I can get a business visa for 12 months.

I think I may migrate and invest my Aussie dollars in Cambodia instead.

Very off topic to the subject of PR - but the Australian Thai FTA allows Australian companies to own majority shares in a range of businesses in Thailand.

[DonW]

OP do you think that the reason yours took so long is due the reputation that Walen has with regards processing Thai visas for those who otherwise would struggle to stay long term?