Traffic Growth In Chiangmai.

[TommoPhysicist]

A scan over the number plates in City area this morning, I would say at least 30% BKK, then another 20 or so % a mix of which I saw - Lamphun, Lampang, Uttaradit and Phit. (quite a lot), Krabi, Songkhla, Phrae, Chiang Rai.

I did the same yesterday in Nimman and indeed saw some BKK Mahanakon plates.... but not so many.

The thing is though that traffic is one of those things that runs easily until just that very small extra percentage of cars slows it down inordinately to a jam. Reduce the number just slightly and things go freely again.

Yep, if all foreigners were sent home, traffic in CM would be a lot faster.

BUT ..... do we really want Thais driving faster?

[Chicog]

I look forward to Motorcycle taxis arriving in Chiang Mai. They've made getting around Pattaya a doddle.

[cheeryble]

Only having a quarter of the directions moving at a time don't help.

Perhaps we could think the unthinkable and actually have two (opposite direction) lanes going at the same time same as everywhere normal in the world.

[rene123]

Vehicles being parked anywhere at any time is the major problem. Recently affluent Thais, who used to only own scooters, now buy cars and trucks without any place to park them. So, they just park anywhere they can without any thought about traffic. Service vehicles, songthows and those bloody silver vans feel it is their right to double and triple park along thorofares. Same goes for those huge tour busses. And, the local police just let it happen.

[true blue]

Vehicles being parked anywhere at any time is the major problem. Recently affluent Thais, who used to only own scooters, now buy cars and trucks without any place to park them. So, they just park anywhere they can without any thought about traffic. Service vehicles, songthows and those bloody silver vans feel it is their right to double and triple park along thorofares. Same goes for those huge tour busses. And, the local police just let it happen.

you will be advocating wardens and meters next,grow up this is thailand,not some political correct nanny state.

[jacktrip]

It's probably the energy of the place that's bothering you, and not the traffic per se.

The noise of motorbikes builds after awhile. So does the energy of the constant stream of festivals, people drinking, etc. It all seems to linger until the next one comes along. Massages don't work for long, neither does alcohol. Trips to nature, Pai etc. do work while I'm there and shortly thereafter.

It's much harder to reflect, relax or even read like I used to.

[rene123]

Vehicles being parked anywhere at any time is the major problem. Recently affluent Thais, who used to only own scooters, now buy cars and trucks without any place to park them. So, they just park anywhere they can without any thought about traffic. Service vehicles, songthows and those bloody silver vans feel it is their right to double and triple park along thorofares. Same goes for those huge tour busses. And, the local police just let it happen.

you will be advocating wardens and meters next,grow up this is thailand,not some political correct nanny state.

I'm not advocating anything. I'm just explaining the problem. If you want to drive a vehicle in Thailand then accept the consequences of traffic jambs. It's only going to increase. I ride a scooter and get by just fine. If I need to pack any luggage I'll hire a taxi and travel at not busy times of the day. Traffic problems are just one of the reasons I'm not living in Bangkok.

Edited December 10, 2012 by onthedarkside
insult removed

[Tywais]

I was driving to work on the canal road to the university and was thinking to myself how great the traffic was and no long lines at the canal/Suthep intersection. After driving into the university and also thinking how nice there were so few motorcycles, then arriving into my parking lot seeing only one car there - realized it was a holiday and had to drive back home. At least the traffic was light that way too.

[MESmith]

Driving back from Lampang at lunchtime, very heavy traffic, & slow going, heading south towards Kun Tan pass south of Lamphun. So at least a lot of the holiday traffic will be gone tomorrow, but I agree that generally, traffic is a lot more nowadays.

[rene123]

I was driving to work on the canal road to the university and was thinking to myself how great the traffic was and no long lines at the canal/Suthep intersection. After driving into the university and also thinking how nice there were so few motorcycles, then arriving into my parking lot seeing only one car there - realized it was a holiday and had to drive back home. At least the traffic was light that way too.

Thanks for the laugh, Tywais. I can identify.

And thanks to onthedarkside for editing my insult, but my red head dander got up when I was told to "grow up" by True blue. His remark was also an insult.

[chiangmaiexpat]

It is probably a combination of the mentioned factors.

In the long run this is worrying, though, because Chiang Mai is on its way to regular gridlocks. All the ingredients are present: fast urban sprawl, growing number of people and cars, poorly planned road network with overburdened main arteries, non-existing or dismal public transportation. Not exactly a new situation in Thailand (and in Asia).

Cheers, CMX

[MESmith]

It is probably a combination of the mentioned factors.

In the long run this is worrying, though, because Chiang Mai is on its way to regular gridlocks. All the ingredients are present: fast urban sprawl, growing number of people and cars, poorly planned road network with overburdened main arteries, non-existing or dismal public transportation. Not exactly a new situation in Thailand (and in Asia).

Cheers, CMX

At least we have the ring roads

[rene123]

It is probably a combination of the mentioned factors.

In the long run this is worrying, though, because Chiang Mai is on its way to regular gridlocks. All the ingredients are present: fast urban sprawl, growing number of people and cars, poorly planned road network with overburdened main arteries, non-existing or dismal public transportation. Not exactly a new situation in Thailand (and in Asia).

Cheers, CMX

At least we have the ring roads

That WAS good planning. There are many cities that haven't planned as well. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada did not plan as well. Vancouver is congested and constricted. They didn't make allowances for growth in the Fraser Valley. Getting off the main east-west highway and going through Surrey to the ferry terminal at Tsawwassen is a convoluted nightmare.

[hellodolly]

Just wait until the big new mall is finished at Rincom intersection. Completion is said to be late 2013.

Oh Boy

Maybe it could help some of Huay Kaew traffic if people shop there and don't go to KSK.

ksk closing when new mall opens,its called progress,all this traffic,live with it,its happening in nearly every city around the world.

what proof can anyone offer that KSK is closing when the new mall(s) open? I agree, there will be less of a rush to get to airport central plaza and KSK if there are more/better malls spread out around the greater CM area.... but who said anything about KSK closing?

Lastly: an interesting attempt at a traffic solution, if you ask me... don't need more people to drive to the malls and cause congestion... bring a mall to them! coming soon, near you.

supposedly it's announced or at least considered that the Central Dept store in KSK will close because they are going into the new mall. No idea about the Tops.

If they were to lose those two large tenants then will be interesting to see what happens from there.

The large central department store will not close as there is still ten years on their lease to the best of my understanding. Rimping os gping to be a ttenant in Promacade so Tops will not be going there. As long as the KSK is open when these new shopping centers come on line it will be like a oasis in a dessert for the Central and Tops shoppers. Parking will be easy there.

Myself walking mostly have noticed in the last three years when for no apparent reason there is traffic clogged every way I go. Then for no apparent reason it goes back to normal.There are nights when I am sure every one who owns a car is out and driving around the city.

Can't say alot about N

[Rasseru]

Cage drivers be frustrated, scooter riders be relaxed.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Leases have lots of clauses like early termination with a payout or partial payout etc. Heck for that matter it might just be a 10 year option.

Anyone have any more info?

Being so close to both I guess I would like to see KSK continue as it is now.... Why not?

Maya is the shopping center at Rincome due to complete by late 2013.

Edited December 10, 2012 by CobraSnakeNecktie

[mesquite]

It's interesting to note that probably all cities in SE Asia are suffering from growing pains: Saigon, Phnom Penh, Udon Thani, Pattaya to name but a few. The only real solution is to simply put up with it. There's no place to run to anymore.

[NancyL]

I've got to agree with Dolly on the subject of how long will Central remain at KSK. Of course, everything could change in a moment, but it's also my understanding that Tops and Central signed a 30 year lease with the management of KSK and there is still 10 years remaining on those leases. That's why Tops chose to do a major upgrade to their store last year. Central Dept store at KSK is very profitable on a sq.meter basis, so there isn't any reason to terminating the lease early.

In short, what I heard, was that Central wasn't "happy" to remain at KSK, but they would continue to operate Central Dept store and Tops because they made more money than the costs associated with breaking their leases.

(Meanwhile, note to self in 2020 diary "Look for a new place to live")

Edited December 10, 2012 by NancyL

[BuddhaMind]

As for those saying "move if you don't like it", I'm sorry I didn't know we couldn't make negative observations or complaints about things in Chiang Mai, does traffic now fall under Lèse Majesté? Talk to Thais. they make the same observations and many want some sort of mass transit option as well.

No Artemis, the OP, in his last line said, "time to move upcountry?" Which I gathered to mean, was an option he was considering if the traffic conditions worsened. I suggested he take it further and move OUT of the country. It was not a blatant "move if you don't like it" comment.

Though seriously, I couldn't agree more that Thailand is more reactive than proactive. The 100K car idea is what it is, a nice way to help some Thais buy cars and for dealerships to sell cars, etc etc., but it certainly doesn't help the congestion that appears throughout this country. A friend of mine teaches English at a large temple nearby. This temple is also a large orphanage. The monks found some used rubbers inside the public bathroom. Their response? Close the bathroom. Talk about reactive. Geez.

[bangkok blue]

Traffic is getting out of control slowly! Will be absolute chaos when the new cinema/mall opens next year at rihncom junction. It won't improve until the local gov grows some balls and builds a decent monorail, or subway.

[Sparkles]

At the recently concluded 10 day Motor Expo in Bangkok a reliable souce reports that some 80,000 new orders had been taken far exceeding the expected 50,000.

Many of these sales were attributed to the 100,000 baht discount scheme, ie supposedly first time buyers. While only a small perecentage of these vehicles will end up in CM traffic issues are here to stay. Even if a public transport system was fast tracked it still will be chaotic here in years to come.

[elektrified]

I look forward to Motorcycle taxis arriving in Chiang Mai. They've made getting around Pattaya a doddle.

LOL they've been here for years. Although not that many considering...

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Traffic is getting out of control slowly! It won't improve until the local gov grows some balls and builds a decent monorail, or subway.

I hear that a lot, but for a relatively small town like Chiang Mai, with very diverse centers when it comes to residential areas, business areas and entertainment areas, where would you actually make a subway or monorail go? (Not a rhetorical question, it's an interesting challenge)

And that's assuming for argument's sake that it would balance costs vs benefits within the next hundred years.

(BTW, this is just interesting/entertaining brain gymnastics of course; this being a town that can't get a bus service organized.)

Edited December 11, 2012 by WinnieTheKhwai

[onthedarkside]

Time to remove some of the insults being thrown about. 3 posts removed.

[PlanetX]

The density is definitely increasing to the point where its difficult to weave in and out with the motorbike - cars are doing the BKK "lets turn 3 stalled lanes into 6"

[BlackArtemis]

As for those saying "move if you don't like it", I'm sorry I didn't know we couldn't make negative observations or complaints about things in Chiang Mai, does traffic now fall under Lèse Majesté? Talk to Thais. they make the same observations and many want some sort of mass transit option as well.

No Artemis, the OP, in his last line said, "time to move upcountry?" Which I gathered to mean, was an option he was considering if the traffic conditions worsened. I suggested he take it further and move OUT of the country. It was not a blatant "move if you don't like it" comment.

Though seriously, I couldn't agree more that Thailand is more reactive than proactive. The 100K car idea is what it is, a nice way to help some Thais buy cars and for dealerships to sell cars, etc etc., but it certainly doesn't help the congestion that appears throughout this country. A friend of mine teaches English at a large temple nearby. This temple is also a large orphanage. The monks found some used rubbers inside the public bathroom. Their response? Close the bathroom. Talk about reactive. Geez.

Didn't think it was the OP who was suggesting "don't like it? Move". But we are also forgetting that this devalues a lot of current vehicles. People who paid 300-400k for a used civic 2 years ago, now have to contend with people who bought a newer city. should be interesting to see the secondhand market in 2-5 years

[hellodolly]

Traffic is getting out of control slowly! It won't improve until the local gov grows some balls and builds a decent monorail, or subway.

I hear that a lot, but for a relatively small town like Chiang Mai, with very diverse centers when it comes to residential areas, business areas and entertainment areas, where would you actually make a subway or monorail go? (Not a rhetorical question, it's an interesting challenge)

And that's assuming for argument's sake that it would balance costs vs benefits within the next hundred years.

(BTW, this is just interesting/entertaining brain gymnastics of course; this being a town that can't get a bus service organized.)

My thoughts exactly. As for a doable bus service you would have to have a very large number of them to fill all the needs of the population. Also they would have to run on reliable time. That in it's self would be a major problem.

In addition you would have to make the idea attractive to Thai's. Not that sure there is a lot of foreigners willing to give up their air con vehicles.

I do think a proper bus service that was reliable would cost extremely high as those things don't come cheap but it would be cost effective a lot faster than any other system's. Part of it would be large parking lots in the outlying areas where every one could park and get a ride to any part of the city. Possibly have to transfer buses but that is the way it is in Seattle. There they even have a free bus in the down town zone.

[Loaded]

Traffic is getting out of control slowly! Will be absolute chaos when the new cinema/mall opens next year at rihncom junction. It won't improve until the local gov grows some balls and builds a decent monorail, or subway.

I think you've completely missed why there are so many cars on the road - the government wants people to drive cars.

[Joop50]

Chiang Mai games, more than 10.000 visitors recording my wife.

Today were cycling games, one site of the canal road was unavailable.

700 stadium is full in use.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Joop50

[NeverSure]

I think you've completely missed why there are so many cars on the road - the government wants people to drive cars.

"- the government wants people to drive buy cars."

No offense mate. Who are the higher ups making the profit on these cars, and on gasoline, and insurance, and bank interest, and... ??

Just wonderin' is all...