Engagement + Marriage

[nami]

Hi all there,

I started dating my girlfriend, and then moved to live together. We have been living together for almost 1 year now. At the beginning she told her mother she was with me and then her mom started pushing her into marriage, it was like the mother was worrying about her getting pregnant and me running away and I told her I was not ok to rush about getting married until we knew each other better. She tried to hold her family but, with so much pressure coming from the mother, she finally told them we were not together anymore.

It's been a long time since she visited them, and this is mainly or partly because she can not bring me to the village as it would spark gossips around making the family to loose face. In April, one of her best friends' brother will become a monk and she want to bring me along. This is a childhood friend from a village close to her own. She asked me if we should go to meet her parents and then the story began again: She wants me to buy some gold or give them money as a sign of engagement, so we can tell them we will marry when ready and that we need time to save money for sin sod.

She told me I should bring like 20k and 2 baht gold. My salary is just 70k and the family are Issan rice farmers with no land. My point is that is not that easy for me to save that much money in 2 months. I told her and she suggested to give them 20k in april, then come back for mother's day in august and bring them the gold. She then asked about sin sod telling me I should pay 200k, I told her it was a lot of money and got offended when I say 100k should be ok. I actually did a big mistake telling her I read on TV that 50k is ok for a high school educated girl from a poor family; she got very angry and upset :S At the end she agreed on 150k + 2 more baht gold.

She told me most of the local people who got married in the village are paying 200k. In fact, the boyfriend of this good friend of hers is going to pay 300k for sin sod. I don't really know how people with standard Thai salaries can pay that amount; and she says the people are not borrowing the money for showing. This last bit I believe it since I am 99% confident the family will keep all the money, so no use on borrowing it.

I would sure appreciate any sensible comments on this. I love her and she is really nice and good to me but all this issue is really a pain in the a$$. The thing that makes me worry is she telling me if I love her why I can't do this for her when every Thai with lower salary can do for their girlfriends. I think she is honest with me but I think I am already smelling what it's coming from the family (mother) in the future. Looks like she always need to show face, and me being a farang is not going to be of much help (for me).

BTW I am 33 and I already helped the family by paying 25k to the bank for the last 5 due loan payments for the new house they built, and for which my girlfriend will finish paying in 30 years or so. They stop paying the bank and the gf was the one who got the loan and who the bank called the last day. She even cried sometimes about her mother asking for more money when she sent the 3-4k every month out of her 10k salary. I think they borrowed money from a loan shark with those crazy interest and are unable to pay back.

I trust my gf but I think the family is going to bring us a lot of trouble. Actually the strongest arguments we had have been because of the pressure they are putting into her. At some points she (with my help) thought of cutting ties with them but then backed up worrying about them calling her friends asking why she changed her phone and making her loose face for being a bad daughter.

What do you guys think? I need some outsiders opinions. And please be gentle on me as this crap is starting to affect me :S

[transam]

Unfortunately if a farang '' millionaire'' comes on the scene it is like winning the lottery for some folk. If me, reading your stuff, l would put my cards on the table and stick to it. They will always talk big money others have paid and in most cases it is nonsense, borrowed money for show at the wedding. If you buy gold they will sell it after the village have all seen it, l got the T-shirt.

[TommoPhysicist]

Don't give her money, don't give her family money.

If you start giving, it will never be enough, they will always want more.

Oops, I see you are already paying, 25k for a house ........

Is it your house?

Would you pay for a gfs parents to build a house in your home country?

If you are paying for the house, shouldn't the house and chanote at least be in your gfs name?

Don't be silly, listen to those of us who have already made these mistakes and learnt from it, you don't have to repeat our mistakes.

Spend your money on things for you, your family and your future.

Her family are a money pit you can never fill up.

Edited March 4, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[Mario2008]

Look here for advice: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/85581-sin-sod-an-explanation/

[nami]

Thanks for replying transam :-)

By sticking to my cards you mean being inflexible on the amount? I don't want to give a bad impression or being rude, but I also don't want to pay more than I can afford without struggling.

[bigbamboo]

Unfortunately if a farang '' millionaire'' comes on the scene it is like winning the lottery for some folk. If me, reading your stuff, l would put my cards on the table and stick to it. They will always talk big money others have paid and in most cases it is nonsense, borrowed money for show at the wedding. If you buy gold they will sell it after the village have all seen it, l got the T-shirt.

Tell her that since the worldwide financial crisis hit there's no such thing as a rich farang any more.

[transam]

Thanks for replying transam :-)

By sticking to my cards you mean being inflexible on the amount? I don't want to give a bad impression or being rude, but I also don't want to pay more than I can afford without struggling.

The main thing is YOU are not taken advantage of. Over the years l have seen many guys want to show the cash and taken for a ride and even laughed at behind their back. They are your purse strings, nobody else's. Difficult l know but start as you mean to carry on. If you show weakness regarding YOUR cash you will be in for a rough ride, believe me.

[nami]

@Mario, I read that one before (and several others) but I still feel I need to hear outsiders opinions.

@Tommo After reading so many stories here, I feel you are quite right. I am afraid the family will keep asking without end, and I have enough with my own finances as to help on a constant basis. I can help on occasions but that's different. I wouldn't give anything to any gf family in the west. About the 25k, gf got a loan then become guarantor for another one for the parents to pay. They failed to pay for many months and last day bank call her so I step in; as I said, I have no problem in helping when needed, but this case already shows they cannot be trust with money issues.
While your comment is exactly what I would feel more comfortable with (ie not giving money to family), I am afraid this would cause so much trouble between us and probably even between her and her family if she finally understood my point.

It's a really tricky situation to be in.

[TommoPhysicist]

Guarantor on a loan. When the loan defaults, the guarantor can either

1) pay or

2) lose any assets ...... property, vehicles or money in bank in their name for then next 10 years.

It's not a big deal for most Thais, they don't own much. But if you have purchased a car or m/c in her name, it will be claimed so watch out.

Are you really going to make all the payments on this house for the next 20 years?

If not stop throwing good money after bad.

PS. I've been down the gf/wife is guarantor road, don't pay it off.

Edited March 4, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[Totster]

Thanks for replying transam :-)

By sticking to my cards you mean being inflexible on the amount? I don't want to give a bad impression or being rude, but I also don't want to pay more than I can afford without struggling.

No matter what anyone says this is simply a matter between you and 'them'. If you are not comfortable doing something then explain to the family why and try and reach a more suitable agreement.

Remember this, showing frustration or 'putting your foot down' is not the way. The discussions should remain amicable and friendly, most of the time this whole charade is simply a way for the family to make a show of it, you may be able to show a certain amount of money and actually give them another amount..

Try not to quote what others have said can be done, make up your own mind what you want to do and try and reach an agreement with the family.

totster

[nami]

Thanks for replying transam :-)

By sticking to my cards you mean being inflexible on the amount? I don't want to give a bad impression or being rude, but I also don't want to pay more than I can afford without struggling.

The main thing is YOU are not taken advantage of. Over the years l have seen many guys want to show the cash and taken for a ride and even laughed at behind their back. They are your purse strings, nobody else's. Difficult l know but start as you mean to carry on. If you show weakness regarding YOUR cash you will be in for a rough ride, believe me.

I don't feel the money asked is crazy although not peanuts for me. I think I get your point, meaning I should be firm and be the one deciding when, how and what. For now, the thing I am not liking is all this rush, so I shoul stop it. So wish me luck with tonight argument ^^U

Thanks for replying guys ;-)

[TommoPhysicist]

I don't feel the money asked is crazy although not peanuts for me. I think I get your point, meaning I should be firm and be the one deciding when, how and what. For now, the thing I am not liking is all this rush, so I shoul stop it. So wish me luck with tonight argument ^^U

Thanks for replying guys ;-)

Don't argue, don't say no, correct answer is.

"I would love to help your parents, sorry no money this month, spent it already."

Repeat as and when required.

Thai way, avoid ever paying while never refusing.

Edited March 4, 2013 by TommoPhysicist

[beano2274]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

[transam]

I don't feel the money asked is crazy although not peanuts for me. I think I get your point, meaning I should be firm and be the one deciding when, how and what. For now, the thing I am not liking is all this rush, so I shoul stop it. So wish me luck with tonight argument ^^U

Thanks for replying guys ;-)

Don't argue, don't say no, correct answer is.

"I would love to help your parents, sorry no money this month, spent it already."

Repeat as and when required.

Thai way, avoid ever paying while never refusing.

Absolutely, Noooooooooooo arguments. Stay calm but in control. Remember, the ''game/goal'' here is for the ATM to pay for stuff.

[nami]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

Lol, I meant 200k + 2 gold to 150k + 2 gold. But this is just me talking with the girlfriend, no family involved yet...

[TommoPhysicist]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

Lol, I meant 200k + 2 gold to 150k + 2 gold. But this is just me talking with the girlfriend, no family involved yet...

200k + 2bht is for quite a catch.

Virgin under 25 years old + degree level education at the very least.

Most village girls are 50k tops (if cute).

[nami]

Thanks to all who replied, I will keep you updated.

[nami]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

Lol, I meant 200k + 2 gold to 150k + 2 gold. But this is just me talking with the girlfriend, no family involved yet...

200k + 2bht is for quite a catch.

Virgin under 25 years old + degree level education at the very least.

Most village girls are 50k tops (if cute).

27, high school. By no way a virgin. When we started dating she had just broken up with some other farang guy. The second month together we discovered the guy made her pregnant and, when told him, refused to pay for abortion. Maybe this would qualify for a discount if the family knew it :-P

[transam]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

Lol, I meant 200k + 2 gold to 150k + 2 gold. But this is just me talking with the girlfriend, no family involved yet...

200k + 2bht is for quite a catch.

Virgin under 25 years old + degree level education at the very least.

Most village girls are 50k tops (if cute).

27, high school. By no way a virgin. When we started dating she had just broken up with some other farang guy. The second month together we discovered the guy made her pregnant and, when told him, refused to pay for abortion. Maybe this would qualify for a discount if the family knew it :-P

You pay nothing. End of story. Second hand goods.

[TommoPhysicist]

You say you got her down from 200K to 150K + 2 baht gold, well 2 baht of gold is around 50,000 so you did not save anything there.

If you want her then pay the money, if you are not sure and think it is all about the money then get rid of her and her family, I think that house will be paid for by you in the end and not them, you are the foreigner.

Lol, I meant 200k + 2 gold to 150k + 2 gold. But this is just me talking with the girlfriend, no family involved yet...

200k + 2bht is for quite a catch.

Virgin under 25 years old + degree level education at the very least.

Most village girls are 50k tops (if cute).

27, high school. By no way a virgin. When we started dating she had just broken up with some other farang guy. The second month together we discovered the guy made her pregnant and, when told him, refused to pay for abortion. Maybe this would qualify for a discount if the family knew it :-P

Oh dear!

Serial farang hunter ......... to be avoided IMHO, don't pay anything.

[Mario2008]

And with that last comment this thread is closed.