93-Year Old Australian Accused Of Sexually Assaulting 4 Young Thai Children

[DekDaeng]

Let him rot....the pig should have to crawl into court.

So according to you he is guilty as charged - these are allegations. Does an allegation automatically mean guilt??

Let the courts decide his guilt or innocence before you start with the hang em high posts. After all one day a person may make an allegation against you. Would you want that allegation perceived as guilt?

Yes, LET THE COURTS - don't let him off beforehand. He can plead for sympathy after the court rules, if he needs to. Give him as much sympathy as he gave the kids - if that is what the court finds.

[Rancid]

Let him rot....the pig should have to crawl into court.

So according to you he is guilty as charged - these are allegations. Does an allegation automatically mean guilt??

Let the courts decide his guilt or innocence before you start with the hang em high posts. After all one day a person may make an allegation against you. Would you want that allegation perceived as guilt?

Does that also apply to the wealthy drivers that kill people let off by the same courts? Of what value is such a verdict?

[joeboy123]

Am so glad am out of this sick place, even years after leaving, you still get the look of a sex offender when you say you lived in Thailand...The sad thing is Thai's also think thats what most of the farang are there for...All I can say is if any of you are planning to come back and live at home be prepared to be looked at in a bad way when you say you live in Thailand

[pumpuiman]

Let him rot....the pig should have to crawl into court.

"The Pig" ?????? Has he been convicted yet?

In my opinion he is guilty. Allowing lawyers to find loopholes in a blatently corrupt court system is not my idea of justice. The filthy pig possesed pornographic photos and jumped bail.

If you have money in this country, the law means nothing, you read about it daily...corruption is rampant here, top to bottom...fact.

If we were talking about a country with a system of checks and balances, I would let the system run it's course. Here? are you joking?

Do you actually believe that someone went to the trouble of falsifying all the evidence against him? He has made no such statement, why should I even entertain the thought?

He's a rapist pig and should suffer until dead.

again...my opinion.

[Metapod]

unfit for trial?

If you are fit enough to do the crime, you are fit enough to do the crime.

Let him die in prison.

[wilcopops]

I haven't read every word on this thread, but I have searched similar posts and there is something I find particularly disturbing.

I'd bet in this thread and ALL the others there is not ONE SINGLE POST that voices any concern for the victims. What does this indicate? They aren't interested, for some this is a seemingly good opportunity to delve into their own psyche and air any violent fantasies that are normally repressed.

- The truth of the matter is that this sort of thread is simply a "legitimised" way for undesirables to air their psychopathic and sadistic tendencies, a "virtual" blood bath of self gratification through schadenfreude, possible psychcosexual disorders and fantasies of inflicting pain upon others - and by the same people every time.

Edited March 5, 2013 by wilcopops

[Rimkok]

unfit for trial?

If you are fit enough to do the crime, you are fit enough to do the crime.

Let him die in prison.

For an alleged offence

[Nisa]

Agree but let the court prove it one way or the other. I am not making a judgement call on this and he is German not Australian by birth, not that that makes any difference.

So what was the point of mentioning it?

Being that so many people love to paint an entire people with one brush based on news accounts of a very few I guess it is important to some to be able to say it is German blood that caused this or if it was exposure to Australian culture. Stories like this are hard for many to deal with ... better when the story is about a Thai doing bad to a farang because then do we not only not need to consider the possibility of innocence of the accused but it makes it simple because we can blame it on being Thai as well as their culture

This topic is not about blaming anything on Thais or their culture. You continuously trot out this nonsense even when it has nothing to do with the Op. There are reports of Thai Pedophiles as well as Farang ones - both should be condemned for their actions, not their nationality.

Instead of getting your panties in a bunch and getting off topic by generalizing about my posting habits because of a single post you are quoting while deleting the posts I was replying (I added them back for proper context) that was clearly sarcasm (about people generalizing), not directed at you and a direct reply to posts about nationalities not being relevant (yet bringing them up) and which followed a post where two posters were bringing up Thais sexually abusing kids (http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/623501-93-year-old-australian-accused-of-sexually-assaulting-4-young-thai-children/page-6#entry6174736) ... why not read some of the other posts here and do a better job at comprehension because my post is clearly saying it is not about Thais (or any nationality) yet you seem to believe I am saying it is. And if you think my post was not on topic then how on topic do you think your post is about your generalizing about me?

No need to discuss this further but simply trying to help you understand the meaning of my post which I assumed would be pretty clear and understood as tongue in cheek ... especially with the help of the in my post and my reply being to a post with a .

Edited March 5, 2013 by Nisa

[ableguy]

He's an attractive older man and certainly has a debonaire style in how he dresses himself.

I could see how some Thai teenage girl could be drawn into that

Nice sense of humour but you should be locked up

[Thorgal]

"Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them."

Who took the pictures ? And yes, some info can be traced...on the picture files/folders in their properties : when created, size, etc...

Also there is something called an EXIF header, which some digital cameras add to an image (shot using the camera), which contains such information (such as make & model of the camera used for the image, the exposure setting, etc)

This data can be extracted from the images by using some freely available "exif readers" or "exif extractors".

These don't usually contain an author field, so it may not be much help in tracking down the originator. But at least the real owner's camera type/make/model...

I'm not convinced that an 90+ years man can mess with this kind of technology...and it could be a turning point for the ongoing investigation...

Nothing was posted/confirmed that he was posing "naked" with children and that "his" e-mail address out/in-going mails are related to "his" IP network address...

Not really clever or wise to try to open a digital war/conflict with an 90+ years old man...

Edited March 5, 2013 by Thorgal

[Fozfromoz]

I haven't read every word on this thread, but I have searched similar posts and there is something I find particularly disturbing.

I'd bet in this thread and ALL the others there is not ONE SINGLE POST that voices any concern for the victims. What does this indicate? They aren't interested, for some this is a seemingly good opportunity to delve into their own psyche and air any violent fantasies that are normally repressed.

- The truth of the matter is that this sort of thread is simply a "legitimised" way for undesirables to air their psychopathic and sadistic tendencies, a "virtual" blood bath of self gratification through schadenfreude, possible psychcosexual disorders and fantasies of inflicting pain upon others - and by the same people every time.

I guess until he is found guilty, they aren't victims.

[Nisa]

"Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them."

Who took the pictures ? And yes, some info can be traced...on the picture files/folders in their properties : when created, size, etc...

Also there is something called an EXIF header, which some digital cameras add to an image (shot using the camera), which contains such information (such as make & model of the camera used for the image, the exposure setting, etc)

This data can be extracted from the images by using some freely available "exif readers" or "exif extractors".

These don't usually contain an author field, so it may not be much help in tracking down the originator. But at least the real owner's camera type/make/model...

I'm not convinced that an 90+ years man can mess with this kind of technology...and it could be a turning point for the ongoing investigation...

Nothing was posted/confirmed that he was posing "naked" with children and that his e-mail address out/in-going mails are related to his IP address...

Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them. .. http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-93-on-asian-childsex-charges-20130305-2fhhs.html#ixzz2Mg0fw5RR

Karl Joseph Kraus was taken into custody Tuesday at his home near the northern city of Chiang Mai. Cops found video footage and 100 photographs of naked children, some posing with the elderly man. ... http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/karl-joseph-kraus-90-year-old-australian-arrested-charged-raping-sisters-thailand-article-1.185188#ixzz2Mg1RhrPc

Some photos showed the elderly man posing naked with other children, and police are trying to identify them and contact their families, Kritapol said. He said police were investigating if Kraus was part of a pedophilia network, noting many of the pictures were emailed overseas. http://www.whatsonxiamen.com/news13097.html

Edited March 5, 2013 by Nisa

[PoodMaiDai]

Yes let the court decide

but dont let the scum out while awating the court.

He will do it again, and again until he dies.

which cant happen soon enough, IMHO

The courts here do not decide anything. You have three options in Thailand:

1) Admit to the crime (even if you are innocent) and get a shorter sentence.

2) Deny the charges and have them give you the max sentence.

3) Pay your way out of it.

[LandofSmiling]

Let him rot....the pig should have to crawl into court.

So according to you he is guilty as charged - these are allegations. Does an allegation automatically mean guilt??

Let the courts decide his guilt or innocence before you start with the hang em high posts. After all one day a person may make an allegation against you. Would you want that allegation perceived as guilt?

Does that also apply to the wealthy drivers that kill people let off by the same courts? Of what value is such a verdict?

Excellent observation my friend.

The double standards and hypocrisy of some people around these parts never fail to amaze me.

Some people are adamant that Mr. Kraus be considered innocent until proven guilty, to let the allegations play out in the justice system, etc.

Never mind simple1's excellent observation that Kraus absconded bail from Thailand in some convoluted plan to become expatriated back to Australia (he sure seemed well enough to jump bail). At least that's what Kraus states but he sat in Burma for weeks. Not to mention that Kraus' never explicitly and indignantly refuted all allegations against him, his main strategy of beating these allegations is by using the terminal illness ploy.

Yet these same people supporting Kraus, are the very same ones that are quick to judge as guilty a Thai individual accused of any crime. Just read any of the numerous threads that deal with Thai's accused of crimes, their pictures at a police station posted online. Automatic guilt is presumed. And of course a broad and tarred generalization of Thai society in general. And how the justice system in Thailand is so corrupt and the accused will pay their way out of punishment. The very justice system they now conveniently want the accused to stand court in. The list goes on and on.

[Rimkok]

Yes let the court decide

but dont let the scum out while awating the court.

He will do it again, and again until he dies.

which cant happen soon enough, IMHO

The courts here do not decide anything. You have three options in Thailand:

1) Admit to the crime (even if you are innocent) and get a shorter sentence.

2) Deny the charges and have them give you the max sentence.

3) Pay your way out of it.

At last somebody talking sense.

There is no way they will drop the charges photo's or no photo's. There will be too much loss of face. His only hope is to be released on "humanitarian grounds". There are too many people posting on here that are completely clueless to the way things work over here. If he had the money he would be out and cleared of all charges by now and we would never of heard of it. At his age he has probably not worked for 30 years and therefore like most of the old codgers wondering around Chiang Mai he's....skint. Thai courts are an absolute joke only a fool would believe otherwise.

[candypants]

He's an attractive older man and certainly has a debonaire style in how he dresses himself.

I could see how some Thai teenage girl could be drawn into that.

you mean you can hope

[candypants]

No need to discuss this further but simply trying to help you understand the meaning of my post which I assumed would be pretty clear and understood as tongue in cheek ... especially with the help of the in my post and my reply being to a post with a .

not sure which is worse, depending on emoticons to get your point across, or needing to explain them once you have.

[Rimkok]

I haven't read every word on this thread, but I have searched similar posts and there is something I find particularly disturbing.

I'd bet in this thread and ALL the others there is not ONE SINGLE POST that voices any concern for the victims. What does this indicate? They aren't interested, for some this is a seemingly good opportunity to delve into their own psyche and air any violent fantasies that are normally repressed.

- The truth of the matter is that this sort of thread is simply a "legitimised" way for undesirables to air their psychopathic and sadistic tendencies, a "virtual" blood bath of self gratification through schadenfreude, possible psychcosexual disorders and fantasies of inflicting pain upon others - and by the same people every time.

I guess until he is found guilty, they aren't victims.

Possibly not.

[FDog]

In most western countries if you are dying to unfit for trial then the courts won't bother with you. They just won't put you in jail.

They also tend to let you out if you have a life threatening illness.

If guilty it will probably be better for the hang em highs to have him kept in Thailand because if he went to Oz he would never be put in jail because of his age and illness.

[talk2sam]

these Old Australian men will not allow little kids to grow..pathetic.

[theajarn]

If the evidence is there and indeed there are those nasty photos and videos with him and his victims in it, then by all means... he will get what he deserves (and rightly so).

However, if everything has been cooked up, and the evidence is all hearsay, then I won't be so quick to judge the guy.

[blacksuitdandruff]

if at 93 i can still get it up

that might be a crime in itself.

[Thorgal]

"Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them."

Who took the pictures ? And yes, some info can be traced...on the picture files/folders in their properties : when created, size, etc...

Also there is something called an EXIF header, which some digital cameras add to an image (shot using the camera), which contains such information (such as make & model of the camera used for the image, the exposure setting, etc)

This data can be extracted from the images by using some freely available "exif readers" or "exif extractors".

These don't usually contain an author field, so it may not be much help in tracking down the originator. But at least the real owner's camera type/make/model...

I'm not convinced that an 90+ years man can mess with this kind of technology...and it could be a turning point for the ongoing investigation...

Nothing was posted/confirmed that he was posing "naked" with children and that his e-mail address out/in-going mails are related to his IP address...

Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them. .. http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-93-on-asian-childsex-charges-20130305-2fhhs.html#ixzz2Mg0fw5RR

Karl Joseph Kraus was taken into custody Tuesday at his home near the northern city of Chiang Mai. Cops found video footage and 100 photographs of naked children, some posing with the elderly man. ... http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/karl-joseph-kraus-90-year-old-australian-arrested-charged-raping-sisters-thailand-article-1.185188#ixzz2Mg1RhrPc

Some photos showed the elderly man posing naked with other children, and police are trying to identify them and contact their families, Kritapol said. He said police were investigating if Kraus was part of a pedophilia network, noting many of the pictures were emailed overseas. http://www.whatsonxiamen.com/news13097.html

Can you define the acceptable 'degree of nudity' to be excluded for sexual assault with minors like this case ?

Your tabloid links are unfortunately too subjective to the case.

There's no link with the naked children on the 100 pictures and the parents who told first the police they suspected abuses were occurring when the girls lost interest playing outside. The parents remain without hard evidences of their initial accusations.

And again,if the old German didn't took all the pictures or partially himself, we have a totally different case...

My point is that the digital evidences/footage is not really linked to people of his generation.

Edited March 5, 2013 by Thorgal

[louialive]

"Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them."

Who took the pictures ? And yes, some info can be traced...on the picture files/folders in their properties : when created, size, etc...

Also there is something called an EXIF header, which some digital cameras add to an image (shot using the camera), which contains such information (such as make & model of the camera used for the image, the exposure setting, etc)

This data can be extracted from the images by using some freely available "exif readers" or "exif extractors".

These don't usually contain an author field, so it may not be much help in tracking down the originator. But at least the real owner's camera type/make/model...

I'm not convinced that an 90+ years man can mess with this kind of technology...and it could be a turning point for the ongoing investigation...

Nothing was posted/confirmed that he was posing "naked" with children and that his e-mail address out/in-going mails are related to his IP address...

Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them. .. http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-93-on-asian-childsex-charges-20130305-2fhhs.html#ixzz2Mg0fw5RR

Karl Joseph Kraus was taken into custody Tuesday at his home near the northern city of Chiang Mai. Cops found video footage and 100 photographs of naked children, some posing with the elderly man. ... http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/karl-joseph-kraus-90-year-old-australian-arrested-charged-raping-sisters-thailand-article-1.185188#ixzz2Mg1RhrPc

Some photos showed the elderly man posing naked with other children, and police are trying to identify them and contact their families, Kritapol said. He said police were investigating if Kraus was part of a pedophilia network, noting many of the pictures were emailed overseas. http://www.whatsonxiamen.com/news13097.html

Can you define the acceptable 'degree of nudity' to be excluded for sexual assault with minors like this case ?

Your tabloid links are unfortunately too subjective to the case.

There's no link with the naked children on the 100 pictures and the parents who told first the police they suspected abuses were occurring when the girls lost interest playing outside. The parents remain without hard evidences of their initial accusations.

And again,if the old German didn't took all the pictures or partially himself, we have a totally different case...

My point is that the digital evidences/footage is not really linked to people of his generation.

Your last line made me laugh. How could he be taking the photos if he is in them? Also are you saying an old person can't use a digital camera/video camera etc

[chuck_s]

Give him life in prison, with hard labor, which shouldn't be long for him.

[Greer]

jonclark #5

"Let the courts decide his guilt or innocence before you start with the hang em high

posts. After all one day a person may make an allegation against you. Would you want

that allegation perceived as guilt?"

A Belgian Roman Catholic Bishop has admitted child abuse but has not been brought before

a Court. How does that fit in with "Let the courts decide his guilt or innocence ..."?

Actually it has nothing to do with a court until he is arrested and brought to the court (by the police), at which time THEN the court decides - courts don't go out catching people, even after admitting guilt in some crime - that's the job of the police.

There is no wish to protect child molesters either (I have three young children) but there is a demand that justice prevails - obviously we all expect that if a person is found guilty of a crime, they will be punished according to the law - that is always our wish and we certainly hope it is the wish of every person. It naturally goes hand in hand with this process, that the innocent walk free.

We don't have hard evidence in front of us, we are not enrolled as party to the trail, and therefore we must simply limit our demands to an expectation of justice. If he is guilty, then yes he must serve the time and suffer that punishment, but that is not for us to say...simple as that.

[Greer]

Ever play count the perverts at Kad Suan Kaew? (Chiang Mai)

I was there yesterday and saw 2 old guys and one had the shortest shorts imaginable and loose around the thighs. looked like a bloody super mini skirt. I'm not saying he's a pervert, but I reckon he was about 75 and certainly didn't care that he was getting lots of looks......perhaps welcomed it!

stop it please, you blokes are firing up my ped antenna, its bad enough when i am in rural thailand, now i will be going to the supermarket and "high pants" harry, is in for the second look

I'm talking shorter and looser than this (who is NOT me by the way)

Uptheos, can I ask where this shot came from?

Is it from the UK or Thailand?

[Nisa]

"Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them."

Who took the pictures ? And yes, some info can be traced...on the picture files/folders in their properties : when created, size, etc...

Also there is something called an EXIF header, which some digital cameras add to an image (shot using the camera), which contains such information (such as make & model of the camera used for the image, the exposure setting, etc)

This data can be extracted from the images by using some freely available "exif readers" or "exif extractors".

These don't usually contain an author field, so it may not be much help in tracking down the originator. But at least the real owner's camera type/make/model...

I'm not convinced that an 90+ years man can mess with this kind of technology...and it could be a turning point for the ongoing investigation...

Nothing was posted/confirmed that he was posing "naked" with children and that his e-mail address out/in-going mails are related to his IP address...

Police allege they seized more than 100 photographs of naked children, including some with Mr Kraus posing with them. .. http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-93-on-asian-childsex-charges-20130305-2fhhs.html#ixzz2Mg0fw5RR

Karl Joseph Kraus was taken into custody Tuesday at his home near the northern city of Chiang Mai. Cops found video footage and 100 photographs of naked children, some posing with the elderly man. ... http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/karl-joseph-kraus-90-year-old-australian-arrested-charged-raping-sisters-thailand-article-1.185188#ixzz2Mg1RhrPc

Some photos showed the elderly man posing naked with other children, and police are trying to identify them and contact their families, Kritapol said. He said police were investigating if Kraus was part of a pedophilia network, noting many of the pictures were emailed overseas. http://www.whatsonxiamen.com/news13097.html

Can you define the acceptable 'degree of nudity' to be excluded for sexual assault with minors like this case ?

Your tabloid links are unfortunately too subjective to the case.

There's no link with the naked children on the 100 pictures and the parents who told first the police they suspected abuses were occurring when the girls lost interest playing outside. The parents remain without hard evidences of their initial accusations.

And again,if the old German didn't took all the pictures or partially himself, we have a totally different case...

My point is that the digital evidences/footage is not really linked to people of his generation.

Your last line made me laugh. How could he be taking the photos if he is in them? Also are you saying an old person can't use a digital camera/video camera etc

Old man had a computer, Old man uses email, maid says she saw old man emailing child porno, old man capable of making people believe he could teach English to kids and neighbors say old man drove a car right up until his arrest but the logical thing to assume is he incapable of pointing a very light weight device and clicking a button to take a picture of what is displayed on a display. Instead he would be more comfortable with a heavier device with many settings and adjustments which requires having a developing room or somebody to develop the images you probably don't want people to know you are taking.

[super22k]

How long ago did he "rape" these children? A man in his nineties raping four children? Surely,it is impossible. Especialy,if he has Prostate cancer. The Prostate is a gland that produces the liquid which makes the male sperm.

[Thorgal]

How long ago did he "rape" these children? A man in his nineties raping four children? Surely,it is impossible. Especialy,if he has Prostate cancer. The Prostate is a gland that produces the liquid which makes the male sperm.

The Old German is 'under charge' for sexual assault on minors.

He's still under police custody during police investigation, but still not 'under warrant'.

Sexual assault includes not only raping but also touching, torturing, filming, insinuating, etc...the victim.

Unfortunately, sexual assault can be confused or translated wrongly when an old single man provides fully innocent chocolate and language courses for kids...