Thailand To Spend $68 Bn On Transport Projects

[IsaanUSA]

This is a pretty ambitious project for a government that can't even get busses running on Phuket for fear of Mafia attacks.

The national government is not trying to address busses in some province in the south.

This thread is about a national rail network that will be connected to several different countries and is being overseen by the national government.

[indyuk]

Picture puzzle:

Try and identify the difference between the two pictures.

You must be an American. None rational human being that is a guest of a foreign power makes a mockery of his hosts and himself in the same breath. Think about it.

[dcutman]

Picture puzzle:

Try and identify the difference between the two pictures.

You must be an American. None rational human being that is a guest of a foreign power makes a mockery of his hosts and himself in the same breath. Think about it.

Truth hurts for some(redshirt supporters) doesnt it?

Edited March 20, 2013 by dcutman

[indyuk]

I talk to many Thai women who moved from Isaan to Phuket to get the meager jobs doing massage and prostitution on the side (sorry, it's not such a hidden fact). They spend 14 hours going on a bus to Bangkok and then onward to their villages in Isaan. They can't get jobs they say back in their part of the country, so they must resort to leaving children and family behind and selling themselves for such low wages. This is one disenfranchised group in Thailand that should at least be addressed and helped, and by providing high speed rail to these areas so these people can begin and attempt to get out of the poverty and prostitution and exploitation, at least the Populist-leaning PM can begin to change the lifestyle of the impoverished in these exploited parts of the Thai population.

Do you really believe what you write? You "talk to" many prostitutes and they all have such a sad story.

Do you really think the current government are planning all of this to help alleviate poverty in rural Thailand? How many impoverished people do you think will be able to afford the train fares?

Maybe spending the money on a decent eductation system first might be a better start. But then people might start to ask questions and realize when they are being lied too.

The writer of the primary comment here-in is not well informed on how the Thai economy functions or the cultural and historical attributes of the Isanian folk that cause us to percieve the them to be driven toward prostitution, menial jobs and / or petty crime at a great distance from their village. The people at the bottom of a food chain have to feed upward in a traditionally oriental way. If you think about it carefully you (ME313) may come to understand these peoples of the Isan. And then you will also understand why the Isanian say coruption is OK if everybody gets (They mean 'takes') a peace of the action.

[indyuk]

Picture puzzle:

Try and identify the difference between the two pictures.

You must be an American. None rational human being that is a guest of a foreign power makes a mockery of his hosts and himself in the same breath. Think about it.

Truth hurts for some(redshirt supporters) doesnt it?

If you believe me to be a Red Shirt supporter you must be short of a slate or two. I am a slave to 'Law & Order' 'Justice & Peace', 'Human Rights' and above all 'Democracy'.

[indyuk]

Upgrading Thailand's infrastructure with a state of the art railway network is essential if Thailand wishes to become the conduit of Asean growth and a future world player in her own right. A modern rail network will pull the Thai economy forward as did the construction of the 'friendship roads' half a centuray ago. If history has taught us in the West anything it is that one simply cannot have a thriving economy with good infrastructure. The same logic applies to the wisdom of a great container port on the Burmese coast.

[dcutman]

Upgrading Thailand's infrastructure with a state of the art railway network is essential if Thailand wishes to become the conduit of Asean growth and a future world player in her own right. A modern rail network will pull the Thai economy forward as did the construction of the 'friendship roads' half a centuray ago. If history has taught us in the West anything it is that one simply cannot have a thriving economy with good infrastructure. The same logic applies to the wisdom of a great container port on the Burmese coast.

You are aware, country wide, fresh water sources are being polluted and rendered unusable at an alarming rate. The Gulf of Thailand is becoming so polluted, many large areas are void of any life,

Only 10% of raw sewage generated is properly treated and disposed of.

Only 36% of garbage and solid waste is properly disposed of.

Only 20% of hazardous waste generated is properly treated and disposed of.

All of the above has a national budget of 0.1% of gdp and most of the untreated waste is illegally dumped or pumped in to natural waterways

I would agree a modern (freight) rail network is needed. But building a high speed passenger rail network before the above infrastructure is dramatically improved on, is insanely stupid, IMO.

[Ricardo]

Upgrading Thailand's infrastructure with a state of the art railway network is essential if Thailand wishes to become the conduit of Asean growth and a future world player in her own right. A modern rail network will pull the Thai economy forward as did the construction of the 'friendship roads' half a centuray ago. If history has taught us in the West anything it is that one simply cannot have a thriving economy with good infrastructure. The same logic applies to the wisdom of a great container port on the Burmese coast.

I think you probably meant to say "without good infrastructure" here ?

The question IMO is whether a high-corruption high-speed domestic passenger-railway is more important, than the Chinese-proposal for a high-speed freight-railway from Southern-China via Thailand to Singapore, or the under-funded much-delayed SRT-plan to upgrade/double its basic-network currently underway ?

I would suggest that Thai politicians are attempting to confuse/blend the three different schemes into one. Which carries the risk of paying for the most-expensive one, but getting the cheapest/least-beneficial one, in the end.

But potential-passengers have votes, freight doesn't.

[Thereisnoif]

Upgrading Thailand's infrastructure with a state of the art railway network is essential if Thailand wishes to become the conduit of Asean growth and a future world player in her own right. A modern rail network will pull the Thai economy forward as did the construction of the 'friendship roads' half a centuray ago. If history has taught us in the West anything it is that one simply cannot have a thriving economy with good infrastructure. The same logic applies to the wisdom of a great container port on the Burmese coast.

Trying to hype up your shares in ITALIAN-THAI ?

[ginjag]

I talk to many Thai women who moved from Isaan to Phuket to get the meager jobs doing massage and prostitution on the side (sorry, it's not such a hidden fact). They spend 14 hours going on a bus to Bangkok and then onward to their villages in Isaan. They can't get jobs they say back in their part of the country, so they must resort to leaving children and family behind and selling themselves for such low wages. This is one disenfranchised group in Thailand that should at least be addressed and helped, and by providing high speed rail to these areas so these people can begin and attempt to get out of the poverty and prostitution and exploitation, at least the Populist-leaning PM can begin to change the lifestyle of the impoverished in these exploited parts of the Thai population.

What about some of these women choose a decent husband, be a housewife/ part time farm work. stay with your kids ladies, not much excuse, love between the husband and wife, NOT JUST SEX. as that doesn't work.

husband runs off, wife runs off ???? kids forgotten, "you see we had to sell our bodies to feed our kids" RUBBISH. sorry but thats my bad attitude.

[bigbamboo]

I think I said this before, but I'll say it again.

Borrowing per se is not bad for governments.

Borrowing for infrastructure creation that creates JOBS is a good thing (Singapore in the 1950's and 1960's is a good example. They used the borrowed money to grow new infrastructure that produced economic growth and new JOBS).

Borowing just to repay the interest bearing loans of already rich foriegn investors and not developing your own country with that borrowed money (i.e. Greece, Portugal, or Spain) is NOT a good thing.

Now IF the Thai government uses the borrowed money wisely to develop a high speeed infrastructure transportation systen THEN Thailand is well situated to act as a place where people and goods pass through to other Asean countries.

That could generate a lot of revenue and spur growth and new jobs in Thailand.

One caveat however, that requires a forward looking and non-corrupt government that will make intelligent use of that borrowed money.

Question: Is that actually possible in Thailand?

I'm not optomistic on that point.

Spot on.

The policy itself is good, the politicians aren't.

Edited March 20, 2013 by bigbamboo

[bigbamboo]

This is a pretty ambitious project for a government that can't even get busses running on Phuket for fear of Mafia attacks.

Fear of attacks on Phuket's new airport buses delays launch date

Airport Express 1, 2 and 3 ready for launch, but fear of violent attacks by tuk-tuk and taxi drivers has given leading

Phuket officials a moment of pause.

Clearly a top level meeting of Thailand's own 'Five Families' is required.

I know what you're wondering......... who are the other four?

[slapout]

I am waiting for one of the more astute members of the inner circle to propose a man made water way, suitable for cruise liners from Bangkok deep water port to Mai Sai.

[ginjag]

I think I said this before, but I'll say it again.

Borrowing per se is not bad for governments.

Borrowing for infrastructure creation that creates JOBS is a good thing (Singapore in the 1950's and 1960's is a good example. They used the borrowed money to grow new infrastructure that produced economic growth and new JOBS).

Borowing just to repay the interest bearing loans of already rich foriegn investors and not developing your own country with that borrowed money (i.e. Greece, Portugal, or Spain) is NOT a good thing.

Now IF the Thai government uses the borrowed money wisely to develop a high speeed infrastructure transportation systen THEN Thailand is well situated to act as a place where people and goods pass through to other Asean countries.

That could generate a lot of revenue and spur growth and new jobs in Thailand.

One caveat however, that requires a forward looking and non-corrupt government that will make intelligent use of that borrowed money.

Question: Is that actually possible in Thailand?

I'm not optomistic on that point.

Looks fine, easy to say borrow, A big Thai failure to resist. The infrastructure could be met in other ways--the rice wasted dosh--countless scams and expence incurred should be stopped maybe then Thailand would have money to start to begin.

2 and half Trillion---over 50 years to pay back ???? <deleted>. apart from what they have already got into debt with. they said it would create 500,000 new jobs Ha Ha.. from where ???? the government have just said they have near zero unemployment...so gonna use child labour or old people ??? or Burmese again. I think more scrutiny is needed.

[hhiser]

spend spend spend

when will the bubble burst

No gov't can continue this pace of spending

sooner or latter ... probably sooner ... bubble gonna go kaboom

This is investment, which is totally different to the kind of welfare spending that the West borrows for. Borrowing for investment is mostly good. Borrowing to pay people to sit around (like they do in UK, USA, EU) is always a lost cause.

What do you suggest - that Thailand stays as a developing country? This is great news for Thailand. The government should be commended for this move.

I talk to many Thai women who moved from Isaan to Phuket to get the meager jobs doing massage and prostitution on the side (sorry, it's not such a hidden fact). They spend 14 hours going on a bus to Bangkok and then onward to their villages in Isaan. They can't get jobs they say back in their part of the country, so they must resort to leaving children and family behind and selling themselves for such low wages. This is one disenfranchised group in Thailand that should at least be addressed and helped, and by providing high speed rail to these areas so these people can begin and attempt to get out of the poverty and prostitution and exploitation, at least the Populist-leaning PM can begin to change the lifestyle of the impoverished in these exploited parts of the Thai population.

@davejones I believe the problem lies with the inherent corruption in the Thai system. What percentage of the investment will be used to build and maintain the high speed railway and what percentage will go to the politicians. Plus, if you have lived here a while, you will notice many such projects have been started and then abandoned, but the money has already been spent.

@me313 What are you talking about? How can a high speed rail line they could not afford change their lives for the better?