Leaving Thailand For Good

[noddy77]

For a young wealthy internet super entrepeneur you have some very poor friends ??

Try for a change to start a topic with something positive to say about Thailand!

Good luck in Cambo, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

You know the old saying "For some there is always greener grass over the fence"..........till one gets there !

And you left your home country and found the grass not greener here? So your heading home? I think not. Thailand has the greenest grass I have found so far but who knows. Maybe it is greener elsewhere.

[NeverSure]

I've been in Chiang Mai for 8 months and last week purchased a one way ticket out of here. Will leave at the end of May. I've come to realize that it will take me years to become proficient in reading and speaking Thai language and I find the air pollution to be unacceptable. Will be heading to Mexico, where I get six months in country on arrival, an easy retirement visa, and I can purchase a home without putting it in the name of a national ( except in zones, mostly on the coast ).

Found the cost of living here to be quite reasonable, loved the food, the women, the Buddhist culture and could easily see myself coming back if Mexico doesn't work out.

-

The safest areas of Mexico at noon are more dangerous than the worst slums of Thailand at 3am.

Wouldn't be that much of an issue for me if I were single, but with young kids, forget it.

But best of luck with the senoritas!

You're kidding, right? Thailand is downright dangerous. There are areas of Mexico that are dangerous as they are the holdings of the drug lords. But for the most part Mexico is quite safe.

Gun murders per 100,000 people. Link

[JLCrab]

As per Post #58, the reason you would post a 500 word or so comment (I pasted it into MS word and word counted) is the same as why anyone else posts 500 or more word posts: You have nothing better to do with your time.

This is the Twitter 140 character post generation. Learn to say it quick or else no one is going to read it all.

[wooloomooloo]

Rather than listen to armchair economists, how about doing the math and decide whether you can withstand the turbulence of the markets and f/x, homeownership.

[britgent]

Viewing blogs of Cambodia. The seed is sown!

[MrWorldwide]

Neversure, I support your impending move to Mexico and I look forward to receiving regular updates on how your life pans out over there. Hell, I'd even drive you to the airport if it was within my power to do so - Bon Voyage !

Edit: can we hook homeownership up with a visa, too ? Thanks.

Edited March 25, 2013 by MrWorldwide

[homeownership]

As per Post #58, the reason you would post a 500 word or so comment (I pasted it into MS word and word counted) is the same as why anyone else posts 500 or more word posts: You have nothing better to do with your time.

This is the Twitter 140 character post generation. Learn to say it quick or else no one is going to read it all.

I have loads better things to do with my time, like copying, pasting and word counting posts and then telling people exactly how many words they have written and that they have nothing better to with their time.

FYI I dont do twitter but in response to your final comment, you didnt just read it but took the time to word count it.

In my book, that classes a post as being Noteworthy.

[roamer]

Thailand is a beautiful country, its people are welcoming and its culture is second to none. Perhaps I have painted a dark picture in my post reading through them, but I wanted to see if other have had the same thoughts and concerns as those like myself and friends have talked about, namely the change that is occuring in our home over the last 10 years or so.

Lets look at one of the main changes. in 2004, the Thai Baht was around 60-70 THB to the GBP (Pound), today its closer to 40-45 THB to the pound. This means as a Brit, you will get less for your money, therefore things to me are more expensive. (REGARDLESS TO WHETHER I CAN AFFORD IT OR NOT), I hesten to add.

Next is the rise in developments, a new train line from BKK airport to Praya Thai Station in Bangkok is undoubtly an improvemnet, in one of my visits I made it from the airplane doors to the hotel door (Formerly Siam City Hotel), in just 30 minutes, clearing customs in record time. Thats an improvement. Look at the developments in the roads around Chiang Mai, thanks in part to the former Thaksin Regime as he is a Chiang Mai man. (I have met him in person, seemed nice).

Again I think these developments are an improvement.

At night time, sitting in a loft apartment on Sukhumvitk Road it looks like the opening scene of Blade Runner, so advanced, so futuristic and so very different from 10 years ago.

Looking at islands like Koh Chang which are virtually unrecognisable from 10 - 15 years ago, again major changes.

The advancement of the Thai People is unstoppable or at least it seems to me to be unstoppable, but does all this development while great for transport and moving around do something else.

This "something else", is why I opened this topic, it wasnt to slate off Thailand, its my home (spirtual) at least, when I am there. One of the main reasons why I move to Thailand was for self reliance, cheap living, anonimity, the simple way of life all of which is being slowly erroded by this fast paced gold plated debt reliant development. I just hope it doesnt blow up in their faces like in the west.

Yes the world is a big place and I want to see as much of it as I can, no getting away from that desire but when I return, this place changes in a blink of an eye.

I was seeking to get your points of view on what has changed in Thailand for you in the past 10 years good or bad and is the bad enough to make you think about leaving or is it a "flash in the pan".

I hope I have clarified by opening post a little better, I certainly wish to thank everyone who "got" where I was coming from.

Yes you've clarified it.

" At night time, sitting in a loft apartment on Sukhumvitk Road it looks like the opening scene of Blade Runner, so advanced, so futuristic and so very different from 10 years ago."

When they were building it I would often sit enthralled at night watching these giant machines lifting these massive sections into place, with the welding sparks all over the place it looked then more like a scene from Dante's Inferno.

I think that was the start of my realisation just how much Thailand was going to change. However then the wealth was not so much in evidence, sights like Paragon with the Ferrari's and Maserati's were yet to come. Change was inevitable. How the change came about, the pro's and cons is another subject.

For some people, Thai or Farang, that change brings opportunities. For others, Thai or Farang, on a limited income it brings problems with rising costs and changing ways, it's not only the Farang that feels the pressures of trying to stretch the budget a little more. But let's be clear, if the exchange rate was as favourable as it was 5 years ago or even longer you would find far fewer of them thinking of reasons why they dislike LOS so much and thinking of reasons to up sticks and go." It's the economy stupid" and many of them don't have a stake in that economy.

I can see reasons why people might want to consider Cambodia or Burma, business reasons, but moving for the cost of living is pretty much desperation stakes because if your finances are that stretched then those ain't places where you want to be.

For what it's worth I've rarely encountered the "up & move" scenario with those who have learned to speak Thai. Yet on the other hand I've encountered many non-Thai speakers about to leave, then again they were about to leave 5 years ago, maybe current exchange rates will make them hold good on their promise.

[homeownership]

Rather than listen to armchair economists, how about doing the math and decide whether you can withstand the turbulence of the markets and f/x, homeownership.

You raise an excellent point.

When choosing to leave the UK as a permanent resident, I looked at various options and criteria as to where to settle.

My criteria for retireing is

1) Warm

2) Friendly locals

3) Low cost living

4) Self suffieciency

5) Rimping Supermarket (Just kidding)

Thailand is my view beats Malaysia, personally I find Malaysia very expensive but attractive. If Thailand become en-par with Malaysia then it is time for a serious review although I would miss my friends made here and my lovely home.

I have no plans to leave just yet, but always looking to leave if the F/X continues to decline to silly levels against the pound.

[homeownership]

Thailand is a beautiful country, its people are welcoming and its culture is second to none. Perhaps I have painted a dark picture in my post reading through them, but I wanted to see if other have had the same thoughts and concerns as those like myself and friends have talked about, namely the change that is occuring in our home over the last 10 years or so.

Lets look at one of the main changes. in 2004, the Thai Baht was around 60-70 THB to the GBP (Pound), today its closer to 40-45 THB to the pound. This means as a Brit, you will get less for your money, therefore things to me are more expensive. (REGARDLESS TO WHETHER I CAN AFFORD IT OR NOT), I hesten to add.

Next is the rise in developments, a new train line from BKK airport to Praya Thai Station in Bangkok is undoubtly an improvemnet, in one of my visits I made it from the airplane doors to the hotel door (Formerly Siam City Hotel), in just 30 minutes, clearing customs in record time. Thats an improvement. Look at the developments in the roads around Chiang Mai, thanks in part to the former Thaksin Regime as he is a Chiang Mai man. (I have met him in person, seemed nice).

Again I think these developments are an improvement.

At night time, sitting in a loft apartment on Sukhumvitk Road it looks like the opening scene of Blade Runner, so advanced, so futuristic and so very different from 10 years ago.

Looking at islands like Koh Chang which are virtually unrecognisable from 10 - 15 years ago, again major changes.

The advancement of the Thai People is unstoppable or at least it seems to me to be unstoppable, but does all this development while great for transport and moving around do something else.

This "something else", is why I opened this topic, it wasnt to slate off Thailand, its my home (spirtual) at least, when I am there. One of the main reasons why I move to Thailand was for self reliance, cheap living, anonimity, the simple way of life all of which is being slowly erroded by this fast paced gold plated debt reliant development. I just hope it doesnt blow up in their faces like in the west.

Yes the world is a big place and I want to see as much of it as I can, no getting away from that desire but when I return, this place changes in a blink of an eye.

I was seeking to get your points of view on what has changed in Thailand for you in the past 10 years good or bad and is the bad enough to make you think about leaving or is it a "flash in the pan".

I hope I have clarified by opening post a little better, I certainly wish to thank everyone who "got" where I was coming from.

Yes you've clarified it.

" At night time, sitting in a loft apartment on Sukhumvitk Road it looks like the opening scene of Blade Runner, so advanced, so futuristic and so very different from 10 years ago."

When they were building it I would often sit enthralled at night watching these giant machines lifting these massive sections into place, with the welding sparks all over the place it looked then more like a scene from Dante's Inferno.

I think that was the start of my realisation just how much Thailand was going to change. However then the wealth was not so much in evidence, sights like Paragon with the Ferrari's and Maserati's were yet to come. Change was inevitable. How the change came about, the pro's and cons is another subject.

For some people, Thai or Farang, that change brings opportunities. For others, Thai or Farang, on a limited income it brings problems with rising costs and changing ways, it's not only the Farang that feels the pressures of trying to stretch the budget a little more. But let's be clear, if the exchange rate was as favourable as it was 5 years ago or even longer you would find far fewer of them thinking of reasons why they dislike LOS so much and thinking of reasons to up sticks and go." It's the economy stupid" and many of them don't have a stake in that economy.

I can see reasons why people might want to consider Cambodia or Burma, business reasons, but moving for the cost of living is pretty much desperation stakes because if your finances are that stretched then those ain't places where you want to be.

For what it's worth I've rarely encountered the "up & move" scenario with those who have learned to speak Thai. Yet on the other hand I've encountered many non-Thai speakers about to leave, then again they were about to leave 5 years ago, maybe current exchange rates will make them hold good on their promise.

Now this post was the reason I started this thread. Thank you so much.

[MrWorldwide]

Rather than listen to armchair economists, how about doing the math and decide whether you can withstand the turbulence of the markets and f/x, homeownership.

You raise an excellent point.

When choosing to leave the UK as a permanent resident, I looked at various options and criteria as to where to settle.

My criteria for retireing is

1) Warm

2) Friendly locals

3) Low cost living

4) Self suffieciency

5) Rimping Supermarket (Just kidding)

Thailand is my view beats Malaysia, personally I find Malaysia very expensive but attractive. If Thailand become en-par with Malaysia then it is time for a serious review although I would miss my friends made here and my lovely home.

I have no plans to leave just yet, but always looking to leave if the F/X continues to decline to silly levels against the pound.

If 'Malaysia' began and ended with KL, I would agree with you. Fortunately, it doesnt - for a teetotaller with no immediate plans to buy property, I consider the Butterworth-Ipoh corridor well worth further investigation : all I have to do is *become* a teetotaller !

[qdinthailand]

Cheap living, Thailand getting too expensive? From my 7y coming to Thailand, I can't agree with that. Thai food, rental cost (outside major tourist hubs), clothes from Thai markets etc. are still pretty much the same price and the only thing that makes it more expensive is the exchange rate.

Your British expats moaning about the Russians? Yeah, I can see that when the live in Pattaya / Phuket and are bother by non-English speaking people who come to the same pub where they sit from early morning to late evening complaining over their beers and that the beer price did go up...

Cambodia, Laos and Burma being more stable? Yeah...

>Cheap living, Thailand getting too expensive? From my 7y coming to Thailand, I can't agree with that. Thai food, rental cost (outside major tourist hubs), clothes from Thai markets etc. are still pretty much the same price and the only thing that makes it more expensive is the exchange rate.

Your British expats moaning about the Russians? Yeah, I can see that when the live in Pattaya / Phuket and are bother by non-English speaking people who come to the same pub where they sit from early morning to late evening complaining over their beers and that the beer price did go up...

Cambodia, Laos and Burma being more stable? Yeah...

If you think that prices have not gone up then you sure live in a different world to me. For example my favorite BBQ chicken shop on the outskirts of the closest small town has raised prices from 80 baht to 90 to 100 and then yesterday to 110 baht for a chicken over the last 3 years. This just an example. Ask anyone who has been here a while how the prices of noodle soup etc have also risen dramatically. Percentage wise some very dramatic increases.

Have you not seen how the price of hormones and anti-biotics have shot up in the past few years? Of course chickens are getting more expensive (as well as plumper, meatier...)

[MrHammer]

OP, I think I get where you are at.

I came to Bangkok for the first time 8 years ago and have been back several times. I remember some of the first times walking down Suk 11 where there would still be cheap internet shops and small massage places. Now, the 2-3 story buildings are replaced with 30 level condos and major hotels. There are young trashpackers drinking in the streets like it's Greece. Sofitel Hotel not far from there stands as a massive monument to wealth and progress.

Thailand is definitely growing up. I think I will like it better, because Thailand becoming richer also means more foreign educated Thais and more international minded young Thais. That means that the average Thai might stop considering me 'falang, falang' and rather just judge me as a normal person. This is great! I'm also young myself, so I would be happy to easily find a good job or start a business.

I've also been to Japan and money didn't destroy Japan either.

But if you still want it rought and edgy, I'd say the Philipines is a better choice than Cambodia. They also speak English. A 'small' (just a million or two) chinese city might also be a good place to start over.

[MrWorldwide]

_{More expensive and plumper, you say ? Hmm - I think that's a different *kind* of 'chicken' .....}

_{(full marks to the Indonesians for using 'ayam' to refer to both chicken and working girls : is it really any different to calling them 'birds' ?)}

Edited March 26, 2013 by MrWorldwide

[NeverSure]

Neversure, I support your impending move to Mexico and I look forward to receiving regular updates on how your life pans out over there. Hell, I'd even drive you to the airport if it was within my power to do so - Bon Voyage !

Edit: can we hook homeownership up with a visa, too ? Thanks.

I have no intention of moving to Mexico. If I was going South, it would be Ecuador. It's just that Thailand is far more dangerous than Mexico if you stay out of the drug lord areas of Mexico. I posted the chart and the link.

As for your airport suggestion, I would drive so I could have my pickup. It's only perhaps 700 miles from me atm and all good freeway. You can hit it with a rock from San Diego, California.

A lot of N. Americans retire to Mexico and S. America because it is so close and Thailand is 30 hours en route.

Thailand is one of the most dangerous places in the world.

[MrWorldwide]

Ecuador ?

http://www.ecuador-travel.net/information.safety.htm

Guayaquil
major port and biggest city in Ecuador with more than 2 million inhabitants.

Guayaquil has a serious crime problem with violent crimes, like assault with weapons and also rape and murder are not uncommon. There exist also lots of petty crimes, like car robbery, pick-pocketing, break and entering and so on. Because of the crime increases, a few years ago it was put under state of emergency with military checks and curfew but those measures were lifted later on without much results. Avoid the poor areas of the city like El Guasmo completely and be watchful in the rest of the city.

The same with lesser degrees also applies to other bigger towns of the coast, like Manta, Esmeraldas, Babahoyo, Santo Domingo, Machala and others.

Quito
second biggest city and capital of Ecuador.

not as bad as Guayaquil but nevertheless robbery, pick pocketing, etc and even violent crimes are on the increase.

Old Colonial Center
is a part of the city, where poor people live. Avoid the center at night and in the daytime, watch out for pickpockets. If possible take as little as possible with you. If you take a backpack, carry it in front of you. Keep cameras in your hand and not hanging around your neck. Watch that you will not find yourself in crowds as that often is an opportunity for pickpockets.

Modern City Center (Mariscal area)
this area is dangerous late at night. Do not walk alone or in small groups but take a taxi if you have to get somewhere. Beware of drug dealers and do not buy from them. In the country exist harsh penalties for possession of drugs, even in small amounts (few years in crowded and not very comfortable jails). In the last years also there were violent robberies in popular bars of the area. Masked men with guns entered the nightspots and robbed customers and owners of all their belongings.

Trole Bus and Public City Transport
especially on the Trole Bus system there are pickpockets operating. Always keep your hand on your money and other documents and do not let yourself get distracted.

Traveling by Long Distance Buses

When traveling long-distance, do not get the cheapest buses but pay a dollar or two more for your own personal safety. Apart from being more comfortable, the more important things are that the more expensive buses are in better mechanical conditions and the drivers are better trained in conducting. Bus accidents are common due to bad and reckless driving and to the bad mechanical condition of especially older buses (faulty brakes, etc..)

At the bus terminals, always keep an eye on your belongings. Do not let yourself get distracted by anyone as that is often a ruse to snag your bags. Make sure that your bags will be stored inside the bus compartments and not on the roof.

Inside the bus keep an eye on your smaller belongings. Do not leave bags up on the rack or below your seats. Keep everything on your lap.

Special Warnings

Armed Robbery - Do not hike alone or in small groups in certain regions

This is one of the most unfortunate aspect of the rising crime in Ecuador as hikers sometimes get robbed at gunpoint in the middle of seemingly nowhere with even cases of rapes of women. The regions most dangerous for that are the ones around Otavalo, Lagunas Mojanda and Cuicocha and around Quito, especially the Pichincha area. There are also reports about assaults in the Chimborazo area. It is very difficult to predict what area to avoid as the criminals seem to move around and concentrate at certain regions for a period of time. So be aware that it can happen anywhere. Do not expect any help from police as in those areas there are not any.

Kidnapping - Northern Amazon region bordering Colombia

This region is becoming now more problematic in terms of your personal safety. With the introduction of the 1.4 billion US sponsored Colombia Drug Plan, Putumayo, the Colombian province just north of Ecuador became one of the main targets of the eradication of coca plants. Putumayo is also becoming more and more a battleground between leftist FARC guerrillas, rightwing paramilitary units and regular Colombian military forces. All this has a spillover effect into Ecuador. FARC guerrillas and paramilitary fighters are using this part of the Ecuadorian Amazon basin since years as safe heavens and bases. Lago Agrio, also called Nueva Loja, the main town in the area is a major supply center for those forces. The first signs of safety problems were the kidnapping of mainly Canadian oil workers and later another 10 people, involved in the oil business got kidnapped. Some tourists followed later. Kidnapping is a huge business in Colombia and also has its hold in Ecuador. So be advised that those problems exist in this area along the Colombian border if you have the intention of visiting Lago Agrio and Cuyabeno National Park.

For a first-hand experience of a armed robbery in Cuyabeno click to forum.robbery.

Note: Those problems as described above are becoming now reality in other border areas of the country as well. Kidnapping was reported from Carchi province in the mountains and Esmeraldas on the coastal western side

[FarangTalk]

Then you know if you goto places like Cambodia or Burma, you'll be constantly hearing people complain that they can't get a proper English breakfast, or there's no good pizza shops in town, or it takes the utility company too long to turn the electric back on after a storm, or people don't speak enough English, and so on...

There's just no winning with some people.

No danger of not getting good pizza or an English brekky in Cambo; they are easy to find. Their English language skills are far superior to the Thais also.

[NeverSure]

Ecuador ?

http://www.ecuador-travel.net/information.safety.htm

Guayaquil

major port and biggest city in Ecuador with more than 2 million inhabitants.

Guayaquil has a serious crime problem with violent crimes, like assault with weapons and also rape and murder are not uncommon. There exist also lots of petty crimes, like car robbery, pick-pocketing, break and entering and so on. Because of the crime increases, a few years ago it was put under state of emergency with military checks and curfew but those measures were lifted later on without much results. Avoid the poor areas of the city like El Guasmo completely and be watchful in the rest of the city.

The same with lesser degrees also applies to other bigger towns of the coast, like Manta, Esmeraldas, Babahoyo, Santo Domingo, Machala and others.

Quito

second biggest city and capital of Ecuador.

not as bad as Guayaquil but nevertheless robbery, pick pocketing, etc and even violent crimes are on the increase.

Old Colonial Center

is a part of the city, where poor people live. Avoid the center at night and in the daytime, watch out for pickpockets. If possible take as little as possible with you. If you take a backpack, carry it in front of you. Keep cameras in your hand and not hanging around your neck. Watch that you will not find yourself in crowds as that often is an opportunity for pickpockets.

Modern City Center (Mariscal area)

this area is dangerous late at night. Do not walk alone or in small groups but take a taxi if you have to get somewhere. Beware of drug dealers and do not buy from them. In the country exist harsh penalties for possession of drugs, even in small amounts (few years in crowded and not very comfortable jails). In the last years also there were violent robberies in popular bars of the area. Masked men with guns entered the nightspots and robbed customers and owners of all their belongings.

Trole Bus and Public City Transport

especially on the Trole Bus system there are pickpockets operating. Always keep your hand on your money and other documents and do not let yourself get distracted.

Traveling by Long Distance Buses

When traveling long-distance, do not get the cheapest buses but pay a dollar or two more for your own personal safety. Apart from being more comfortable, the more important things are that the more expensive buses are in better mechanical conditions and the drivers are better trained in conducting. Bus accidents are common due to bad and reckless driving and to the bad mechanical condition of especially older buses (faulty brakes, etc..)

At the bus terminals, always keep an eye on your belongings. Do not let yourself get distracted by anyone as that is often a ruse to snag your bags. Make sure that your bags will be stored inside the bus compartments and not on the roof.

Inside the bus keep an eye on your smaller belongings. Do not leave bags up on the rack or below your seats. Keep everything on your lap.

Special Warnings

Armed Robbery - Do not hike alone or in small groups in certain regions

This is one of the most unfortunate aspect of the rising crime in Ecuador as hikers sometimes get robbed at gunpoint in the middle of seemingly nowhere with even cases of rapes of women. The regions most dangerous for that are the ones around Otavalo, Lagunas Mojanda and Cuicocha and around Quito, especially the Pichincha area. There are also reports about assaults in the Chimborazo area. It is very difficult to predict what area to avoid as the criminals seem to move around and concentrate at certain regions for a period of time. So be aware that it can happen anywhere. Do not expect any help from police as in those areas there are not any.

Kidnapping - Northern Amazon region bordering Colombia

This region is becoming now more problematic in terms of your personal safety. With the introduction of the 1.4 billion US sponsored Colombia Drug Plan, Putumayo, the Colombian province just north of Ecuador became one of the main targets of the eradication of coca plants. Putumayo is also becoming more and more a battleground between leftist FARC guerrillas, rightwing paramilitary units and regular Colombian military forces. All this has a spillover effect into Ecuador. FARC guerrillas and paramilitary fighters are using this part of the Ecuadorian Amazon basin since years as safe heavens and bases. Lago Agrio, also called Nueva Loja, the main town in the area is a major supply center for those forces. The first signs of safety problems were the kidnapping of mainly Canadian oil workers and later another 10 people, involved in the oil business got kidnapped. Some tourists followed later. Kidnapping is a huge business in Colombia and also has its hold in Ecuador. So be advised that those problems exist in this area along the Colombian border if you have the intention of visiting Lago Agrio and Cuyabeno National Park.

For a first-hand experience of a armed robbery in Cuyabeno click to forum.robbery.

Note: Those problems as described above are becoming now reality in other border areas of the country as well. Kidnapping was reported from Carchi province in the mountains and Esmeraldas on the coastal western side

Are you afraid of your own shadow? In any country, stay out of the crime ridden areas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Thailand

Ecuador seen as new retirement hot spot

"By Alina Dikik

NEW YORK | Wed Mar 7, 2012 12:05pm EST

(Reuters) - When Connie and Mark Pombo decided in 2010 to retire abroad, they searched for locations online. Ecuador seemed to have everything they wanted, so Mark, who had recently retired from the United Parcel Service, flew south to visit.

He was impressed. Three months later, the couple sold their Lancaster, Pennsylvania, home and packed their suitcases. Two years later, the Pombos live on a $600 monthly budget, which includes their $200 two-bedroom rental overlooking the Tomebamba River in Cuenca, a town in the sierra of the Andes Mountains."

[Scully]

Ever country is changing 99% for the worse, the world population is booming and poor people are desperately trying to reach the wealthy countries.

I would hardly call countries such a Burma stable and 99% of it is all hot air, thay will stay.

Thailand gets slagged off but it's done a lot right, the Thai's own their land so not too much speculation on land value. Strict work permits so the country isn't overflowing with immigrants. Thailand has made it's rules for Thai's and Thai's only and that's what gets on Westerners nerves, I wish they had the same rules in my home country. Instead it's oh let them all in they will contribute to the economy two years down the line passport, house and benefits and telling their fellow countrymen to come and join them.

Sorry I am having a morning rant, I hope you get my point anyway.

[JLCrab]

'Word Count' is an option on the MS Word toolbar. And sure I read your post. I made that post #64 at 5:19 AM here in LOS and, as I have read some of your other posts, I was hoping it would help me get back to sleep

Twitter BTW is a great writing challenge for anybody; just try to get something across (or stick it to someone) in 140 characters or less.

(The preceding sentence 138 characters)

As per Woody Allen, "Boy if life were only like this?'

Edited March 26, 2013 by JLCrab

[kevvy]

Thailand is a beautiful country, its people are welcoming and its culture is second to none. Perhaps I have painted a dark picture in my post reading through them, but I wanted to see if other have had the same thoughts and concerns as those like myself and friends have talked about, namely the change that is occuring in our home over the last 10 years or so.

Lets look at one of the main changes. in 2004, the Thai Baht was around 60-70 THB to the GBP (Pound), today its closer to 40-45 THB to the pound. This means as a Brit, you will get less for your money, therefore things to me are more expensive. (REGARDLESS TO WHETHER I CAN AFFORD IT OR NOT), I hesten to add.

Next is the rise in developments, a new train line from BKK airport to Praya Thai Station in Bangkok is undoubtly an improvemnet, in one of my visits I made it from the airplane doors to the hotel door (Formerly Siam City Hotel), in just 30 minutes, clearing customs in record time. Thats an improvement. Look at the developments in the roads around Chiang Mai, thanks in part to the former Thaksin Regime as he is a Chiang Mai man. (I have met him in person, seemed nice).

Again I think these developments are an improvement.

At night time, sitting in a loft apartment on Sukhumvitk Road it looks like the opening scene of Blade Runner, so advanced, so futuristic and so very different from 10 years ago.

Looking at islands like Koh Chang which are virtually unrecognisable from 10 - 15 years ago, again major changes.

The advancement of the Thai People is unstoppable or at least it seems to me to be unstoppable, but does all this development while great for transport and moving around do something else.

This "something else", is why I opened this topic, it wasnt to slate off Thailand, its my home (spirtual) at least, when I am there. One of the main reasons why I move to Thailand was for self reliance, cheap living, anonimity, the simple way of life all of which is being slowly erroded by this fast paced gold plated debt reliant development. I just hope it doesnt blow up in their faces like in the west.

Yes the world is a big place and I want to see as much of it as I can, no getting away from that desire but when I return, this place changes in a blink of an eye.

I was seeking to get your points of view on what has changed in Thailand for you in the past 10 years good or bad and is the bad enough to make you think about leaving or is it a "flash in the pan".

I hope I have clarified by opening post a little better, I certainly wish to thank everyone who "got" where I was coming from.

blah blah blah my grandfather met hitler and he said he seemed like a nice man too. are all nerds the same as you ??? tell us , you are so rich , how have you helped the poor in this country you call home.

[rct99q]

Well if you like I can take the time to register with Thai Visa, verify the email and then just read posts by other people about the same old things.

Occasionally if I can be bothered I can even click on an advert to raise revenue for the site while reading other peoples posts

I can even if I have your permission that is write a politcally, socially correct post about something so inconsequential that no one not even myself can be bothered to read it, while ignoring all of the topics I have raised since being a member.

Yes you might not like content, yes it will provoke an argument, yes they will make you think and yes you will find the need to call me a troll and why, because I am unconventional and I have an opinion and a voice and unlike others I will speak and not be herded.

I wont be offensive to anyone and I will always tell the truth, even it its hard for you to hear.

Instead of speculating on this...why don't you be a test case study. Move to Cambodia for one year, keep a detailed journal every day. What is the price of this, what is the price of that. Check out the medical system, education system, politics, price of women (for the less endowed member so TV), report back to us in one year.

I think this is a remarkable opportunity for you to be "the one" who could explain all for everyone. Don't ask, do!!

[rct99q]

Ecuador ?

http://www.ecuador-travel.net/information.safety.htm

Guayaquil

major port and biggest city in Ecuador with more than 2 million inhabitants.

Guayaquil has a serious crime problem with violent crimes, like assault with weapons and also rape and murder are not uncommon. There exist also lots of petty crimes, like car robbery, pick-pocketing, break and entering and so on. Because of the crime increases, a few years ago it was put under state of emergency with military checks and curfew but those measures were lifted later on without much results. Avoid the poor areas of the city like El Guasmo completely and be watchful in the rest of the city.

The same with lesser degrees also applies to other bigger towns of the coast, like Manta, Esmeraldas, Babahoyo, Santo Domingo, Machala and others.

Quito

second biggest city and capital of Ecuador.

not as bad as Guayaquil but nevertheless robbery, pick pocketing, etc and even violent crimes are on the increase.

Old Colonial Center

is a part of the city, where poor people live. Avoid the center at night and in the daytime, watch out for pickpockets. If possible take as little as possible with you. If you take a backpack, carry it in front of you. Keep cameras in your hand and not hanging around your neck. Watch that you will not find yourself in crowds as that often is an opportunity for pickpockets.

Modern City Center (Mariscal area)

this area is dangerous late at night. Do not walk alone or in small groups but take a taxi if you have to get somewhere. Beware of drug dealers and do not buy from them. In the country exist harsh penalties for possession of drugs, even in small amounts (few years in crowded and not very comfortable jails). In the last years also there were violent robberies in popular bars of the area. Masked men with guns entered the nightspots and robbed customers and owners of all their belongings.

Trole Bus and Public City Transport

especially on the Trole Bus system there are pickpockets operating. Always keep your hand on your money and other documents and do not let yourself get distracted.

Traveling by Long Distance Buses

When traveling long-distance, do not get the cheapest buses but pay a dollar or two more for your own personal safety. Apart from being more comfortable, the more important things are that the more expensive buses are in better mechanical conditions and the drivers are better trained in conducting. Bus accidents are common due to bad and reckless driving and to the bad mechanical condition of especially older buses (faulty brakes, etc..)

At the bus terminals, always keep an eye on your belongings. Do not let yourself get distracted by anyone as that is often a ruse to snag your bags. Make sure that your bags will be stored inside the bus compartments and not on the roof.

Inside the bus keep an eye on your smaller belongings. Do not leave bags up on the rack or below your seats. Keep everything on your lap.

Special Warnings

Armed Robbery - Do not hike alone or in small groups in certain regions

This is one of the most unfortunate aspect of the rising crime in Ecuador as hikers sometimes get robbed at gunpoint in the middle of seemingly nowhere with even cases of rapes of women. The regions most dangerous for that are the ones around Otavalo, Lagunas Mojanda and Cuicocha and around Quito, especially the Pichincha area. There are also reports about assaults in the Chimborazo area. It is very difficult to predict what area to avoid as the criminals seem to move around and concentrate at certain regions for a period of time. So be aware that it can happen anywhere. Do not expect any help from police as in those areas there are not any.

Kidnapping - Northern Amazon region bordering Colombia

This region is becoming now more problematic in terms of your personal safety. With the introduction of the 1.4 billion US sponsored Colombia Drug Plan, Putumayo, the Colombian province just north of Ecuador became one of the main targets of the eradication of coca plants. Putumayo is also becoming more and more a battleground between leftist FARC guerrillas, rightwing paramilitary units and regular Colombian military forces. All this has a spillover effect into Ecuador. FARC guerrillas and paramilitary fighters are using this part of the Ecuadorian Amazon basin since years as safe heavens and bases. Lago Agrio, also called Nueva Loja, the main town in the area is a major supply center for those forces. The first signs of safety problems were the kidnapping of mainly Canadian oil workers and later another 10 people, involved in the oil business got kidnapped. Some tourists followed later. Kidnapping is a huge business in Colombia and also has its hold in Ecuador. So be advised that those problems exist in this area along the Colombian border if you have the intention of visiting Lago Agrio and Cuyabeno National Park.

For a first-hand experience of a armed robbery in Cuyabeno click to forum.robbery.

Note: Those problems as described above are becoming now reality in other border areas of the country as well. Kidnapping was reported from Carchi province in the mountains and Esmeraldas on the coastal western side

could you please summarize...stopped reading after E....

[bangkockney]

Thailand is one of the most dangerous places in the world.

Absolute nonsense, no matter how you look at it.

[FunFon]

bangkockney, on 26 Mar 2013 - 13:55, said:

Absolute nonsense, no matter how you look at it.

-

Not absolute but relatively speaking I agree.

Personally I don't care about the overall danger levels statistically, just to my own odds of running into violence myself.

The fact that I don't drink or take drugs, am rarely on the roads or in high-risk areas like Pattaya and Phuket, don't mess around with powerful people's wives, daughters or businesses, and do my best to tread softly don't get into conflicts with people are all factors in my favor.

As a result I feel much safer personally in Thailand than I would living in inexpensive areas of large urban areas back home.

And unlike many other places, being a foreigner I believe makes me safer than what the locals experience, not at higher risk as in much of Latin America including Mexico.

[NeverSure]

Thailand is one of the most dangerous places in the world.

Absolute nonsense, no matter how you look at it.

Gun murders per 100,000 people. Ecuador didn't make the list. Thailand's rank is more than double the US. Link

Edited March 26, 2013 by NeverSure

[FunFon]

Gun murders per 100,000 people.

-

But how is this relevant for farang?

Lots more of us dying in drunken brawls or getting tossed off balconies by pimps and drug dealers in Pattaya than gunfights.

Just avoid the dangerous contexts here, easy enough to do and it's safe as houses.

IMO.

[Yahooka]

Then you know if you goto places like Cambodia or Burma, you'll be constantly hearing people complain that they can't get a proper English breakfast, or there's no good pizza shops in town, or it takes the utility company too long to turn the electric back on after a storm, or people don't speak enough English, and so on...

There's just no winning with some people.

You never heard about Happy Pizza in Cambodia,then ??

[Berkshire]

Thailand is one of the most dangerous places in the world.

Absolute nonsense, no matter how you look at it.

Gun murders per 100,000 people. Ecuador didn't make the list. Thailand's rank is more than double the US. Link

Classic. Only a simpleton would look at this list and conclude what you have. So tell me, do you REALLY believe that the USA is more dangerous than Mexico? More dangerous than the freakin PI? Get real.

Those of us who live in Thailand know that the real unrest is in the south. If that was eliminated from your little factoid, Thailand wouldn't be in the top 50. You know that. Same as the US--those of us who have lived there know that the danger is predominantly in the urban areas, inner cities. Small town USA is not the same as South Central LA.

You're intentionally misleading...which is not at all surprising.

[FunFon]

But over 80% of the US population lives in cities. It certainly is a dangerous place wrt to violent crime, particularly compared to all the other similarly "developed" countries.

Perhaps not as dangerous as Mexico for a visiting anglo, but for Mexicans I'd say usually much more so.

All depends on whose ox is getting gored doesn't it?

Edited March 26, 2013 by FunFon