Differences Between Supermoto And Trail

[DrAzTiK]

Hi guys,

Sorry but I don't really see or understand the differences between a Trail and a supermoto?

http://www.keeway-thailand.com/

As you can see, Keeway sold the TX200 et the TXM200.

Can you explain me please ? Both bikes look very similar.

Edited March 29, 2013 by DrAzTiK

[wjmark]

Spot the difference!!!

Spokes vs mag wheels...

---

I think you would call both of these supermoto. Supermotos are basically trail-bikes that have the same front and rear wheel sizes - usually 17", and big fat sticky road tires on them...

A trail bike would have more aggressive off-road tires, and usually has different sized front and rear wheels.

In Canada I have this Qlink 200 supermoto. Here is a photo of the same bike - one is Trail, and one is SM...

Edited March 29, 2013 by wjmark

[pokerkid]

Spot the difference!!!

Spokes vs mag wheels...

---

I think you would call both of these supermoto. Supermotos are basically trail-bikes that have the same front and rear wheel sizes - usually 17", and big fat sticky road tires on them...

A trail bike would have more aggressive off-road tires, and usually has different sized front and rear wheels.

In Canada I have this Qlink 200 supermoto. Here is a photo of the same bike - one is Trail, and one is SM...

2009_Qlink_XF200_XP200a.jpg 2010-konker-ksm200.jpg

looks like a nice bike, can you tell a bit more about it. Like is it reliable ?

[DrAzTiK]

Yes I had already noticed the differents zize of whell and tyres. But in comparaison to the trail, what will be the use/advantage of a supermoto bike ? Is it possible to ride a supermoto on dirty roads ? Is it better on standard roads ? in town ? high speed?

Edited March 29, 2013 by DrAzTiK

[Rickster]

CRF250L = Trail

CRF250M = Super Moto (Motard)

Just an example for current day models...

Edited March 29, 2013 by Rickster

[Rolo Tomazi]

I'm a big supermoto fan even though I have never owned one! I've had lots of bikes over the years, Ninja 250, VTR250, CB360, Nighthawk 450, XS650, Sabre 750 (V4), K75, K100, ZX9R, Intruder 1400 and several others. Then one day I came across a used XR650L, never rode one before, bought it because it was a good deal. I had about five other bikes in my garage at the time and two weeks later I realized I've been riding the XR every day! That hasn't happened to any of the other bikes I bought, and I wondered why. The big enduro was tall, light extremely agile in city traffic, could beat heavy Harleys off the red light (those guys made a long face - their shiny, chromed-out cruisers couldn't keep up with a plastic dirt bike!). Even for day trips the bike was okay, no high speeds, of course. I then put on Pirelli MT60 which improved handling a lot and I could drift in second gear in 90* corners, letting the rear slide out a bit - tons of fun! That's waht the bike was about - fun! The Intruder was for show, the ZX9R was "cocaine on wheels", the Beemers were expensive, sophisticated machinery, the XS my oldie, I called it "The Tractor" because it was heavy, slow and vibrated; but sometimes just what I needed.

The enduro is roughly half street, half dirt, depending on which one you buy, it could be 70/30 either way. Many riders realized that the enduro is fun because of the tall seating position, the wide handle bar and the light weight and the soft suspension, even if you don't go off-road a lot. But the big front wheel and the knobby tires held the bike back on the street. Somebody must have put one and one together and decided that if you put street rims and rubber on the enduro it still has the advantages of the enduro. The bike now looked a bit ridiculous, the high front fender over the small wheel, as if someone had stolen the original wheels and the owner had substituted them with the cheapest wheels he could find. But the fad caught on, the bike handled much better on the street, there was plenty of street rubber to choose from for the 17" rims. Soon lots of bikers changed their DR650S or even a KLR650 to smaller wheels and the "supermotard" was born.

When I left the US I had to sell all the bikes and my trusty DR650SE was the last to go. It was the better urban warrior than the XR650L even with K&N filter, jetting and a Supertrapp slip-on. The XR650L was 50/50, it won the Baja 1000 several times right out of the box. The DR was about 70/30 Street/ dirt and that engine was a pearl!

Then the manufacturers saw what was going on and decided to get in on the game which is not a bad thing. Now they offer supermotos with stiffer street-oriented suspension, taller gearing for a higher top speed and better brakes.

So a supermoto is a good idea made better - a cross between street and dirt bike, then made more street-worthy.

[Richard-BKK]

A light supermoto bike is a marvelous tool for heavy traffic in Bangkok, you can flip, squeeze and accelerate out of any situation because the engine is often a bit more powerful than the bike actual requires. This with the smaller front wheel, which makes you much more leaning on the front wheel, gives you the ability to make extremely quick and sharp turns....

Okay that is the real supermoto or Motard, but you also have supermoto style motorcycles, in this category you find the Kawasaki D-Tracker 125 and 150, sadly the Lifan X-Plore200M, Keeway TXM200, Kawasaki D-tracker 250 and Honda CRF250M.

The list starts with the least powerful and ends with the most powerful, while fans of the Kawasaki D-Tracker 250 and fans of the Honda CRF250M will rightfully claim that their bike is more powerful than the other, as they are actual very similar in performance...

What is a “real” supermoto motorcycle? While the ideas are often a bit confused, for me and for enough others a real supermoto is roughly a 4-stroke motocross motorcycle on road tires and 17" wheels... for instance a real 250cc supermoto will produce near or over 40 horsepower...

So back to the real world, for supermoto style riding the first 3 motorcycles (Kawasaki D-tracker 125 and 150 and the Lifan X-plore200M) will likely not produce enough power to be fun to ride supermoto style. While the Keeway TXM200 is also not the powerhouse of Thai motorcycle business it is a border issue... for some it's powerful enough while for others its a bit underpowered... (probably if your weight is like an average Thai you will also have fun on the first 3 motorcycles).

The Honda CRF250M and Kawasaki D-Tracker 250 provide enough power, with the Kawasaki you first have to disable the limiter (which is very easy)....

Edited March 29, 2013 by Richard-BKK

[NomadJoe]

Supermoto or Supermotard is motorcycle racing on a circuit that alternates between three types of track: flat track, motocross and road racing, usingmotorcycles designed for that purpose. Supermoto was originally conceived as something like an all-star game, in which the best riders from the three separate genres of motorcycle racing could temporarily leave their normal race class to come together and compete for the title of best all around racer. Today supermoto is a distinct genre of its own and riders in the other classes do not routinely cross over into supermoto.

Races are commonly held on road racing or medium sized go-kart tracks with an off-road section in the infield. Most supermoto race tracks have atarmac size of 50-75% and the remaining percentage of the course is off-road. The dirt sections are usually constructed of packed clay and feature motocross style obstacles like bermed corners and jumps. This type of racing is also very portable in that an entire track can be constructed anywhere there is a large area of open asphalt and an availability of dirt. Supermoto races have also been successfully held in busy urban centers using closed city streets for the road course and a vacant lot for the dirt sections.

The motorcycles used are frequently custom-created combinations of off-road motorcycles and road-racing wheels/tires, known as 'supermotard' bikes. Riders also wear a combination of road race and offroad equipment, normally road racing leathers and motocross helmets and boots. Unlike normal motorcycle racing, the emphasis lies on slower speeds—typically less than 100 mph (160 km/h)— on short, technical tracks. Here, where flat-out acceleration and high top-speeds are less common, rider skill can more easily overcome a disparity in machine performance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermoto

Trail —A trail bike is a dual-purpose bike, made for on-road and recreational off-road riding. A trail bike may resemble an enduro bike, but since a trail bike is not intended to be used for competition, it may be (i) less rugged, and (ii) equipped with more road legal equipment, such as indicators, mirrors and extra instruments.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Types_of_motorcycles

[wjmark]

In Canada I have this Qlink 200 supermoto. Here is a photo of the same bike - one is Trail, and one is SM...

2010-konker-ksm200.jpg

looks like a nice bike, can you tell a bit more about it. Like is it reliable ?

Not bad. I bought it second hand (with 700km on it) from a woman in another province. She told me that it was a little hard to start when cold.

When it arrived, I could see that the kick-start (it has electric too) had been worn from so many attempts to start it!

It wouldn't even start when I got it.

Changed the spark-plug, and it starts first time every time.

I put about 2000km on it last summer and BOY WAS IT FUN!!!

It is pretty underpowered (maybe 15hp) and sounds a little tinny, but other than that it was a hoot. Bad roads, curbs, dogs, small cars - this thing goes over all of them!

Construction quality is ok. The welding is decent, but not beautiful. There are a few surface rust bits already (cheap chrome), and all the rear lights stopped working about a week before I left! And a plastic panel broke too easily...

Also, I couldn't get the battery out for winter. Took the side panel off, unhooked the leads, and...

I spent 3 hours trying to get the <deleted> battery out of the <deleted> bike. It would have come down to me having to remove the <deleted> carb, <deleted> air box, and a whole bunch of <deleted> bracketing just to get near the <deleted> battery. So I didn't.

I took a small hack-saw blade and cut the <deleted> small bracket that held the <deleted> battery. (Let's see how TV handles that <deleted> outburst!!!)

Decent bike. Ok build. And some really stupid design. But runs fines and is super fun. Does about 115-120 maxed out...

QLINK is a Suzuki-partnered company, and it does get reviewed favorably (compared to other Chinese bikes...). People call the motor "bulletproof".

Of course, I'd still rather have the Honda 250 motard, although it is taller than the QLink.

Here is my actual bike:

See the gold anodized aluminum rim? The other side of the rim is almost fully black! The rear wheel rim is fully black on both sides. You can actually see on the gold rim where the black anodizing ran out!!! QUALITY CONTROL???!!!

I wear it like a badge of honour...

Edited March 29, 2013 by wjmark

[wjmark]

I don't know what style you would call my bike in Thailand, but it sure is fun too - climbs anything!

Maybe a "Wave-Tracker"?

[NomadJoe]

^ The Thai's have a name for those but I don't recall it.

[wjmark]

Yes I had already noticed the differents zize of whell and tyres. But in comparaison to the trail, what will be the use/advantage of a supermoto bike ? Is it possible to ride a supermoto on dirty roads ? Is it better on standard roads ? in town ? high speed?

I'm no expert (either on road, or dirt), but think that the motards are basically street bikes. People took dirt bikes and put really sticky fat road tires on them, and used them like dirt bikes on the street!

The fat tires do work on dirt and gravelly roads, just because of the size, but I think they will still basically wallow around in any kind of loose dirt, sand, etc. And I am pretty sure they can't climb rocks particularly well. But I didn't do any real dirt riding on mine.

I am sure people with D-Trackers can tell you a lot more about their dirt-riding capabilities...

What some people do is keep the same bike, and just change wheels. Have a pair of 17" for the road, and an 18"/21" set for off-road.

I do know that some of the big super-motards are amongst the fastest and best-handling road-racing bikes in the world.

In some ways they handle road racing better than the super sports-bikes.

[denkiblue555]

Supermoto = Motocross bike (as jumps/multiple surfaces are often involved)

with 17"s, or/and often 16.5" on the front.

450cc seems to be the most popular class.

Single cylinder aside from the Apes really.

Here is one of my faves:

[denkiblue555]

^^ also bigger front rotor etc too....

[Rolo Tomazi]

Supermoto = Motocross bike (as jumps/multiple surfaces are often involved)

with 17"s, or/and often 16.5" on the front.

450cc seems to be the most popular class.

Single cylinder aside from the Apes really.

Here is one of my faves:

The above KTM is obviously track-only. But generally I would classify a supermoto like the Tracker or the CRF250M as a street bike, not even as an enduro or a dual-sport.

It may look off-road but the 17" wheels make it a street bike in my book. Lots of fun in the city but I would not take it off-road. Maybe light dirt roads or packed unpaved surface, but not real dirt.

[denkiblue555]

^^ For sure track only (not street legal)

but no probs in 'a bit of' dirt

a couple of fun pics...

Many similar bikes are street legal in Oz for example, and make for wicked sumo conversions:

KTM EXC450

Honda CRF450x

Yamaha WR450F

Kawasaki KLX450R

And even this out-of-the-box street-legal sumo - Husqvarna SMR449!

The KLX250S/D-Tracker & The Suzuki DRZ400/KLX400 are probable the most common street 'copies' I guess??

At least they measure service intervals in kilometers, the other ones mentioned above are measured in hours - which certainly isn't for everyone on the street!

Edited March 30, 2013 by denkiblue555

[DrAzTiK]

Thank you guys, I understand better what supermoto is now.

I have also read on internet that a supermoto bike need more maintenance in comparaison to others kind of bikes... Can you confirm and tell me why ?

Edited March 31, 2013 by DrAzTiK

[denkiblue555]

Thank you guys, I understand better what supermoto is now.

I have also read on internet that a supermoto bike need more maintenance in comparaison to others kind of bikes... Can you confirm and tell me why ?

Short answer is that they (MX/enduro) are race bikes - and most race bikes/cars to my knowledge would have maintenance intervals measured in hours due to high performing parts which are very light-weight and help produce loads of power.

There is a mountain of great info on Supermoto Junkie dot com - well worth checking out!

[Richard-BKK]

There is also bit more service needed on supermoto bikes compared to motocross bikes, this due to the rear-wheel power delivery. On a dirtbike the power flows from the rear wheel into a sand, gravel, or dirt surface – with this if you apply to much power a good amount will be lost by wheel spin in the loose surface. On a supermoto bike most surfaces are much harder and much more grippy... if you open the throttle hard, just before your front wheel is starting to move up the countershaft (the shaft of the front sprocket) gets an extra beating. The same happens when you aggressively downshift to do some tight corners, on a dirt track the dirt will take away a good amount of this energy, but on a hard road surface all that power comes back on the countershaft...

Modern sportsbike have solved this problem with the use of a slipperclutch, but a slipperclutch on a motocross bike is a bit useless...

To make it clear, the problem only applies to REAL supermoto bikes, so NOT the Kawasaki D-Tracker 125 and 150, Lifan X-Plorer 200, Keeway TXM200, Kawasaki D-tracker 250 or the Honda CRF250M... as this are only supermoto style bikes...

[wantan]

^

Exactly, the OP was talking about a Keeway in the first post. There won't be any difference in servicing the TX200 compared to the TXM200. Its just a different styling. They are not made for racing, real off road riding or any other "real hard stuff"

[DrAzTiK]

^

Exactly, the OP was talking about a Keeway in the first post. There won't be any difference in servicing the TX200 compared to the TXM200. Its just a different styling. They are not made for racing, real off road riding or any other "real hard stuff"

Yes, that was my opinion but I wasn't sure, thank you for make it clear