Thai govt faces rice rage

[waza]

Still want communism? Most of them probably have a Che Guevarra sticker on their old and rusty pick-up. Stop expecting anything from the government, he always do something to fool.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me thousands of time, i like it! (Thai version)

No usually its Serpico.

[newermonkey]

Why are these hypocrites not wearing their customary and provocative RED uniforms?

[Angeledge777]

Still want communism? Most of them probably have a Che Guevarra sticker on their old and rusty pick-up. Stop expecting anything from the government, he always do something to fool.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me thousands of time, i like it! (Thai version)

No usually its Serpico.

Well, I have never seen Serpico with a military hat and a star on it.

[Bagwan]

Chart Thai Pattana, if the push comes to shove, will not rock the Government's boat. They will opt to keep shtum and carry on guzzling at the trough.

The people appearing in the photograph of the original post looks very well dressed for rice farmers. Just saying; make of it what you will.

[longway]

just a question:

if a crop is not viable for the farmer, why don't they change to a crop that gives them a good return in stead of leaching on tax payers money

do any of those ever pay one baht of tax ?

splitting bangkok off from the rest of the country financially, would be a start, not ?

bangkok is not growing rice, but middle class are the only one paying for all this PTP crap ... poor don't pay taxes and rich avoid them or are a part of the pocket filling scam artists

We need the rest of Thailand, because the majority of Thai workforce are not in agriculture, they are in services/manufacturing since about 5 years ago.

We also need to treat all Thais as an asset, they are potentially our future earning power.

The problem is when you have moronic policies which are shortterm and unsustainable as many have repeatedly stated since rice pledging began to promise over market prices, you encourage people to engage in pointless endeavours; in fact people have switched from other crops to rice!

Fresh water, globally, is a scarce resource. To use it to grow rice, then incur the costs of this stupid pledging scheme and associated financing/storage costs with an end result to just let the rice rot as is happening now, should be a crime against humanity, as long as there are people without food. By interfering with the free market, PT are not only damaging a substantial world resource, but worse still, they are failing their voter base who need schooling, education, value add mind sets and transparency.

If the aim of a business is to deliver longterm, sustainable returns to shareholders, what is the charter of a government? To burn through our cash so they can line their pockets?

It is indeed true that around 6-8m Thais pay income tax (myself included) mostly funding the rest - the unemployed, the poor, the elderly, etc - this is the social contract which I am (and other tax payers) are more than happy to do if there is a longterm benefit. All Thais pay some tax via VAT, but this is again somewhat proportional meaning that higher income earners also pay more VAT and more luxury taxes.

I am not particularly happy to pay for first car, rice pledging; ok for universal healthcare and education. Other taxpayers can chime in.

At a guess the main 'tax' the poor have levied on them, is VAT, the lottery - both the legit one and the underground one, and the tax on booze and cigarettes.

The sooner they stop this idiotic stupid market distortion and go back to the rice guarantee floor price, the sooner we can get on with productive rice farming.

I'm not convinced on rubber (we have quite a few rai in our family growing rubber now) is any more 'clean' once the government gets their filthy paws on it even though this particular case was I think thrown out already:

http://www.transparency-thailand.org/eng/index.php/2012-11-02-04-15-03/81-oag-asked-to-indict-45-in-saplings-case

The reality is the majority of rice farmers would be better to give up and go do something else. Subscale small size rice farms is one of the best predictors of poverty and in turn, the various social and societal ills. Move these farmers to something else (which the billions of rice pledging could easily have paid for) and we would have way more productive members of society.

It sickens me that there are posters who still want to subsidise rice farmers to continue with a stupid way of life using taxpayer money to do so only to throw away all the hard work of those same farmers (which is what will happen to most of the pledged rice); it would be the same as the government offering ever larger and larger subsidies for telegram companies to compete with mobile phones. Ever larger subsidies to the builders of the Datsun 120Y so they could keep selling cars with no aircon or safety to compete against a modern Nissan March. For the Vic 20 maker to compete against the Ipad.

The definition of idiocy is doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result. We've gone through this all with TRT 1, TRT 2, PPP and now PT. For the love of god, come up with just 1 decent new idea we can actually support you on!!! It's the same ideas churned out again and again. For the same benefits of skim, corruption and graft. Play a new tune please!

I'm not a fan of this rice pledging scheme, but I think that there should be subsidies for small scale farmers, even though it is economically unproductive. My thoughts run along the lines of maintaining social stability, small scale farming is something that is dying out and fewer young people are joining their parents on the farm, and it will die out on its own in the medium to long term.

However if you don't subsidise these small scale endevours in a country like thailand where there is inadequate social welfare you will force the sale of these small family plots and it will cause substantial upheavals in the rural community and create very justified feelings of discontent and ill will as large land owners take over even further than they have now, over a very short space of time.

I know I am being a bit fuzzy, but these issues go well beyond pure economics IMO. I hope I am making my point understood. This particular rice pledging scam IMO is the worst of all worlds, but subsidies in general for small scale farmers is by no means a bad thing.

BTW, I remember seeing a chart somewhere where Bangkok and the surroundings contribute 40% of GDP, but receive 70% of government expenditure. Where as Isaan contributed 20% to GDP but received 5% of government expenditure. My recollection of the exact numbers maybe off, but bias is still valid. I think, even though some that 70% is distortion due to the way Bangkok is the organisational centre of the country and so its natural that alot of government costs are in Bangkok, much more government resources need to go to the provinces.

This neglect opened the way for Thaksin to capture their imagination and loyalty.

Edited June 25, 2013 by longway

[NongKhaiKid]

More horse trading behind the scenes it seems as it's being reported the leader of Chart Thai Pattana is now supporting the reduction of the rice pledge to B12,000 yet only hours they were attacking the government for going ahead with it.

How can any of this be taken seriously as they are all too busy securing their own position and future to worry about the country.

[webfact]

UPDATE
Farmers assured of paddy price review by Friday
By Digital Media



BANGKOK, June 25 – Farmers from 15 provinces rallied at Government House today and set a seven-day deadline for the government to retain its earlier pledging price of paddy at Bt15,000 per tonne.

The government has announced a reduction of the rice subsidy from Bt15,000/tonne to Bt12,000/tonne, effective June 30.

Representatives of three rice farming associations and farmers from 15 provinces called on the government to purchase paddy at Bt15,000/per tonne until the end of the 2013 second harvest in September and for the southern region in November. Harvesting in the South is two months behind other regions.

Minister to the Prime Minister’s Office Varathep Rattanakorn and Commerce Minister Boonsong Teriyapirom received the protest letter and said the farmers’ proposal would be raised in the meeting of the National Rice Police Committee (NRPC) by the end of the workday on Friday.

Mr Boonsong promised to do his best in alleviating the farmers’ plight but emphasised that the issue must be reviewed by the NRPC.

Farmers vowed to rally in Bangkok again if their demand was not met. (MCOT online news)


-- TNA 2013-06-25

[bigbamboo]

More horse trading behind the scenes it seems as it's being reported the leader of Chart Thai Pattana is now supporting the reduction of the rice pledge to B12,000 yet only hours they were attacking the government for going ahead with it.

How can any of this be taken seriously as they are all too busy securing their own position and future to worry about the country.

Nobody takes Chart Thai Pattana seriously.

[Thai at Heart]

The fact is, farmers are subsidised all over the world, and if the whole agribusiness market was a completely fair market, many would go out of business.

However, it is a strategically important issue to be able to guarantee food supply nationally, and globally, so unless EVERYONE drops all subsidies, there is a logic in giving something to Thai farmers. However, giving it in the way it has been done is not the right way, and there is massive corruption that means the farmers don't get the lions share.

Thailand, should accept that it may not necessary to continue to chase the title of largest exporter, when the crop is obviously not financially viable.

Indeed.

But at some point you need to draw the line. If Thai rice was sold on quality (it isn't) and if the yields were improving (they aren't) and if there was consolidation in the industry (this one there is at a landowner level) and better division and improvement of labour (there isn't) then you wouldn't have what various rice experts have described to be as 'a ticking timebomb' when the current generation of rice farmers depart this world for Thailand, because rice farming, despite all the subsidies in Thailand, is no longer a particularly attractive business for much of the country, when they can work in a factory.

Otherwise, it's a question of how much do we pay rice farmers to grow rice, so we can just throw it away, which is the situation we have now, this is not a subsidy, it is a gift for standing in mud and using water to produce rotting manure.

Hence why I reckon in 10 years time, all of the prime rice land will have been purchased by the massive Thai Agribusiness conglomerates and they will run it like a a plantation with mechanisation. It is the way it will go, inevitably. The subsidies need to be sustained until this occurs.

The overwhelming volume of what is sold for export is generic white rice from the central plains. The really valuable stuff is only small in volume, but can sustain families for longer, I reckon.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[finnomick]

I am confused. Yes, I know, it doesn't take much.

So, The Nation reports on the subject " Rice-pledging Scheme ". They headline " Govt faces rice rage ". They then go on to report and I quote " A group claiming to represent farmers from many provinces gathers outside Government House yesterday to voice support for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and her government " end quote.

So these farmers representatives have converged on Government House to hurl rage at the PM and her government by voicing their support. HUH ?

[whybother]

I am confused. Yes, I know, it doesn't take much.

So, The Nation reports on the subject " Rice-pledging Scheme ". They headline " Govt faces rice rage ". They then go on to report and I quote " A group claiming to represent farmers from many provinces gathers outside Government House yesterday to voice support for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and her government " end quote.

So these farmers representatives have converged on Government House to hurl rage at the PM and her government by voicing their support. HUH ?

"A group claiming to represent farmers from many provinces"

I don't think these are the farmers that are protesting the reduction in the pledge price.

Edited June 25, 2013 by whybother

[gemini81]

You voted for them into office...suckers.

[finnomick]

I am confused. Yes, I know, it doesn't take much.

So, The Nation reports on the subject " Rice-pledging Scheme ". They headline " Govt faces rice rage ". They then go on to report and I quote " A group claiming to represent farmers from many provinces gathers outside Government House yesterday to voice support for Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and her government " end quote.

So these farmers representatives have converged on Government House to hurl rage at the PM and her government by voicing their support. HUH ?

"A group claiming to represent farmers from many provinces"

I don't think these are the farmers that are protesting the reduction in the pledge price.

I do see your point they do not look much like farmers to me, however........

do you think that there were two groups of farmers massed in Bangkok, one outraged at the cut in rice pledging, and one supporting the government ? I think perhaps the Nation should have printed two seperate reports.