Hasn't the minimum wage pushed up prices!

[theblether]

It doesn't matter of the wage is relatively low at 300 baht per day, it sets off an inflationary spiral which we are seeing already. Fair comment that it doesn't matter to most of us, but it does matter to those that thought they would be better off but are now paying too much for basics.

They'll be back looking for even more money, the manufacturers start heading for Cambodia, the service industries start to do with less staff, unemployment increases, social unrest, and bingo. A recipe for disaster.

Right, so you were happy with employers paying workers whatever pittance they felt appropriate for a day's work ? Really not sure why a multi-millionaire like yourself would even be concerned by this, blether, Somewhere between your first-class flights and five-star hotels, why would you give a toss about prices at the 7-11 ?

I answered the OP, a thing you should attempt to do.

So feel free to tell the assembled company what the advantages to Thailand are of setting off an wages inflationary spiral.

[GuestHouse]

"Setting off an Inflationary Spiral" - Say it often enough and it might seam as if it is true.

It is not.

Thailand's Government Policies and Monopolies within Thailand's economies are forcing prices up - the global promotion of bio-fuel is taking land out of food production and forcing up food prices globally.

A Bht300/day pay rise does not put Bht300/day extra per day into people's pockets, it raises the minimum to Bht300 and then only for those earning less then Bht300 AND only in the provinces where the policy is enacted.

If the Bht300/day minimum wage is having any inflationary impact it is most likely to be secondary from suppliers using it as an excuse to hike prices.

As for work moving elsewhere - Wage cost is only a small part of the equation - quality and productivity are far more a consideration.

The low wage, make it cheap mentality of many Thai manufactures is their biggest enemy in the world of trade competition.

Edited June 27, 2013 by GuestHouse

[maxme]

It doesn't matter of the wage is relatively low at 300 baht per day, it sets off an inflationary spiral which we are seeing already. Fair comment that it doesn't matter to most of us, but it does matter to those that thought they would be better off but are now paying too much for basics.

They'll be back looking for even more money, the manufacturers start heading for Cambodia, the service industries start to do with less staff, unemployment increases, social unrest, and bingo. A recipe for disaster.

Right, so you were happy with employers paying workers whatever pittance they felt appropriate for a day's work ? Really not sure why a multi-millionaire like yourself would even be concerned by this, blether, Somewhere between your first-class flights and five-star hotels, why would you give a toss about prices at the 7-11 ?

I answered the OP, a thing you should attempt to do.

So feel free to tell the assembled company what the advantages to Thailand are of setting off an wages inflationary spiral.

It's all about pleasing the masses. They think that's easier to give people what they want than to change what the party stands for. When it comes to Thai politics, it's reversed logic.

[theblether]

^^ Totally right, look what happened to Greece among others by trying to please the masses, if the country can't afford it then it will eventually result in default.

[Pormax]

The day after the raise in minimum wages, our home delivered drinking water went from 15thb to 18thb......just to begin with.

I think that's a middleman thing, we are still paying 10 baht....................

Yes my wate has remained at 10B but then I collect myself 6 bottles every 2 weeks.

I do think the minimum wage has increased prices a little plus I find now that the locals who were quite willing to work for 300B a day now ask for 400B. This is to be expected I suppose. People know 300B is the minimum they should get paid for a days work so they think they can now ask and maybe get more.

I have no problem with this as it is still ridiculous cheap labour.

Wage increases will always drive up prices.

[i claudius]

It is the same everywhere, the people who will notice the increased costs the most are the ones that are reliant on the minimum wage. The other ironic problem with this are the lay-offs from the companies who were previously paying under minimum to continue output as before. So you now have a case where workers who were paid under the minimum are now no longer being paid at all.

There is also the temptation for some companies to employ workers from neighbouring countries who will happily work for less and keep them off the books.

For some, life will always be a struggle

Another poster to hit the nail on the head ,i have no problem at all with poor folk getting a decent wage and the inflation i am sure hardly affects us expats at all ,but the really poor get nothing from a minimum wage ,it did not help in the west and it will not help here ,the rich just cut staff and the few measly baht the poor get is wiped out by rising prices ,also the ones who were already on 300 or so a day want more ,it happened in the UK and it is happening here ,just go on any building site as well and see how many are Thai workers and how many are Cambodian (or polish in the Uk ) in the UK the low paid just went on the dole here they will get nothing ,so many people never think these things through.

[theblether]

"Setting off an Inflationary Spiral" - Say it often enough and it might seam as if it is true.

It is not.

Thailand's Government Policies and Monopolies within Thailand's economies are forcing prices up - the global promotion of bio-fuel is taking land out of food production and forcing up food prices globally.

A Bht300/day pay rise does not put Bht300/day extra per day into people's pockets, it raises the minimum to Bht300 and then only for those earning less then Bht300 AND only in the provinces where the policy is enacted.

If the Bht300/day minimum wage is having any inflationary impact it is most likely to be secondary from suppliers using it as an excuse to hike prices.

As for work moving elsewhere - Wage cost is only a small part of the equation - quality and productivity are far more a consideration.

The low wage, make it cheap mentality of many Thai manufactures is their biggest enemy in the world of trade competition.

You're joking, seriously. I have never seen as naive a post as this from you Guesthouse, and naam, hang your head in shame.

This is a Greek style policy, throw money at it and bury your head in the sand. What else does Thailand have in common with Greece? A ridiculously low tax base, endemic corruption, and avoidance.

What does it not have that the Greeks had? Union strength and recourse to the courts to solve labour disputes in a timely fashion. Can you seriously see 14 lower end employees dragging their Thai Hi-So employer into the courts? Aye right.

There's more holes in this policy than a worn out sieve, it's a calamity.

I happen to know an adult woman of 37 who is working full time in a local higher end restaurant, she was getting paid 4000 baht a month, she quit this week as the promised pay rise never came. I could name you more examples. The fear of unemployment, the fear of NO INCOME AT ALL is causing an untold level of hurt for the working class, and regrettably they are suffering most due to price inflation.

Command economies don't work. They always destroy those they were meant to help in the end.

[GuestHouse]

So someone earnkng Bht 250 a day gets a raise to Bht 300 a day (and only if they live in certain provinces) - this is going to wreck the Thai economy.

Yeh right.

Wake ip and smell the rotting rice!

[thaicbr]

So someone earnkng Bht 250 a day gets a raise to Bht 300 a day (and only if they live in certain provinces) - this is going to wreck the Thai economy.

Yeh right.

Wake ip and smell the rotting rice!

Your behind the times. All provinces get the 300b min wage.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

[theblether]

So someone earnkng Bht 250 a day gets a raise to Bht 300 a day (and only if they live in certain provinces) - this is going to wreck the Thai economy.

Yeh right.

Wake ip and smell the rotting rice!

Oh aye every economy can afford a 20% increase in wages just cos the Prime Minister said so.

Naturally every company can afford a 20% increase in it's wage bill

Oh and the people who were on 300 baht a day previously are happy to not get an increase, delighted they are.

I can't be bothered, you obviously don't know what your talking about.

[kannot]

The day after the raise in minimum wages, our home delivered drinking water went from 15thb to 18thb......just to begin with.

Gosh, Id' rather drink my own urine that pay that................of course Im "taking" it too

[GuestHouse]

TB it is not a 20% hike in all salaries - its a 20% hike in the salaries of the lowest earners.

I know rhis might mean you have to pay your maid a bit more than you could otherwise get away with but please quit peddling the lie that this policy is ruining the economy and the cause of the inflation ALL economies are facing.

It is not !

[kannot]

So someone earnkng Bht 250 a day gets a raise to Bht 300 a day (and only if they live in certain provinces) - this is going to wreck the Thai economy.

Yeh right.

Wake ip and smell the rotting rice!

Your behind the times. All provinces get the 300b min wage.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

Yes but you ask around and see how many actually get it, I know of many who are on 200 a day, probably too afraid to say anything for fear of job loss.

Ive got a couple of Myanmar workers on 270 a day each but have free rice/ house / electric/ motorbike and fuel, local Thais doing the same job I know of on 200 + free accommodation only.

[i claudius]

TB it is not a 20% hike in all salaries - its a 20% hike in the salaries of the lowest earners.

I know rhis might mean you have to pay your maid a bit more than you could otherwise get away with but please quit peddling the lie that this policy is ruining the economy and the cause of the inflation ALL economies are facing.

It is not !

Believe it or not ,but my wife has decided that as car wash prices have risen and the gardeners now have put their prices up ,we can do it ourselves ,and i am certainly not on the breadline ,but how many others think oh well lets do it ourselves?

Those of you who think a minimum wage will sort things out really do need a reality check ,but hey ho ,go on think what you like (i suppose wind power will solve all the worlds problems as well in your minds)

[theblether]

TB it is not a 20% hike in all salaries - its a 20% hike in the salaries of the lowest earners.

I know rhis might mean you have to pay your maid a bit more than you could otherwise get away with but please quit peddling the lie that this policy is ruining the economy and the cause of the inflation ALL economies are facing.

It is not !

Round and round the garden.......I Claudius has just given a perfect example of this policy back firing, it is back firing in more ways than that.

Incidentally, you'll find that the many people in CM were earning less than 250 baht a day so the increase is even more by percentage.

Anyway, I'm away to a dancing class, I've to teach them a Scottish dance for the big party tonight. This is going to be fun.

[GuestHouse]

Erm...... so prices were not going up before the minimum wage laws came into affect?!

[GuestHouse]

TB it is not a 20% hike in all salaries - its a 20% hike in the salaries of the lowest earners.

I know rhis might mean you have to pay your maid a bit more than you could otherwise get away with but please quit peddling the lie that this policy is ruining the economy and the cause of the inflation ALL economies are facing.

It is not !

Round and round the garden.......I Claudius has just given a perfect example of this policy back firing, it is back firing in more ways than that.

Incidentally, you'll find that the many people in CM were earning less than 250 baht a day so the increase is even more by percentage.

Anyway, I'm away to a dancing class, I've to teach them a Scottish dance for the big party tonight. This is going to be fun.

I claudius has given an example of how he is cutting back on services he doesn't want to afford.... which, as a point of note, is anti inflationary.

Not then helping the OP out then.

Edited June 27, 2013 by GuestHouse

[theblether]

The rate of increase has been noticeable. Anyway your disturbing my dance practise, cheerio,

[GuestHouse]

Incase you aren't aware, the government have a need to produce economic growth.

Sharing profits to low income workers is a very effective means of generating growth - They spend all their income on local goods and services - they don't stuff it in their mattress or spend it on imported cars (tax paid or not).

[GuestHouse]

The rate of increase has been noticeable. Anyway your disturbing my dance practise, cheerio,

Prices have gone up, but they've been going up for the whole twenty years + that I've been coming here.

No evidence at all that the minimum wage is the cause of Thailand's inflation - inflation which the rest of the worlds economies are experiencing..... incase you missed the point.

[MrHammer]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

[thaicbr]

The rate of increase has been noticeable.  Anyway your disturbing my dance practise, cheerio,  

Prices have gone up, but they've been going up for the whole twenty years + that I've been coming here. 

 

No evidence at all that the minimum wage is the cause of Thailand's inflation - inflation which the rest of the worlds economies are experiencing..... incase you missed the point. 

That's true but prices have risen at a sharper level in the last 2 years. It's only government price capping on essential items that make it seem better than it is. And those companies being capped on certain products are generally making it back on other non capped products. It will soon get worse with the impending collapse of the rice farming industry. There are only SO many customers for the rice.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

[MrHammer]

The rate of increase has been noticeable. Anyway your disturbing my dance practise, cheerio,

Prices have gone up, but they've been going up for the whole twenty years + that I've been coming here.

No evidence at all that the minimum wage is the cause of Thailand's inflation - inflation which the rest of the worlds economies are experiencing..... incase you missed the point.

That's true but prices have risen at a sharper level in the last 2 years. It's only government price capping on essential items that make it seem better than it is. And those companies being capped on certain products are generally making it back on other non capped products. It will soon get worse with the impending collapse of the rice farming industry. There are only SO many customers for the rice.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

What are you talking about collapse of the rice industry?

You have inside knowledge?

Thailand has been the worlds leading exporter of rice until the stupid rice scheme, so how exactly do you arrive at a rice crash?

[Rust Never Sleeps]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

The Thai workers in the rice paddies and sugar cane plantations contribute more to society than the economists,financial analysts,stockbrokers of this world.

These people sitting in their air-conditioned offices are the parasites.

[GuestHouse]

Here's a problem with the argument that a minimum wage costs jobs.

The same arguments were made when the UK introduced a minimum wage - No such job losses occurred - the economy actually grew.

And for the record - inflation has accelerated everywhere these past two years - it's a global economic problem - it is not something creatd by Thailand's minimum wage laws.

[theblether]

Here's a problem with the argument that a minimum wage costs jobs.

The same arguments were made when the UK introduced a minimum wage - No such job losses occurred - the economy actually grew.

And for the record - inflation has accelerated everywhere these past two years - it's a global economic problem - it is not something creatd by Thailand's minimum wage laws.

The economy grew because of excess money supply, easy credit, the minimum wage cost jobs.

[GreenSnapper]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

The Thai workers in the rice paddies and sugar cane plantations contribute more to society than the economists,financial analysts,stockbrokers of this world.

These people sitting in their air-conditioned offices are the parasites.

That's exactly what Pol Pot said. And then he acted accordingly.

Some of you illusionary kids shall learn a minimum in history.

Edited June 27, 2013 by GreenSnapper

[MrHammer]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

The Thai workers in the rice paddies and sugar cane plantations contribute more to society than the economists,financial analysts,stockbrokers of this world.

These people sitting in their air-conditioned offices are the parasites.

That's exactly what Pol Pot said. And then he acted accordingly.

Some of you illusionary kids shall learn a minimum in history.

Exactly. The romantic idea of workers 'taking over' has failed miserably everywhere. In the 70s, co-op and worker owned businesses sprang up everywhere. NONE exists today, for the simple fact that the workers discovered they couldn't lead and operate an advanced process such as business.

Get this into your minds: Civilization is advanced by the booksmart not by the manual laborers. I know this is a very uncomfortable statement for most leftists.

That is not denigrating the people who do manual labor at all. Everyone has their productive place in society, but the simple fact is that if you start thinking that the average joe smoe should lead a corporation/city/country, then you end up with Zimbabwe, South Africa or Cambodja.

[smooth expat]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

Absolute rubbish. There is no proof that minimum wages causes unemployment. It will only cause inflation for the rich, who are overpaid anyways.

[MrHammer]

Here is the problem with minimum wage and unions.

You might say, that it is only a small sum, but consider a factory hiring 500 employees, it adds up. Or consider the fact that many around the minimum wage do jobs for people that aren't strictly nessecary but adds to quality of life such as cleaning etc.

At some point, which is different for everyone, you're not going to pay someone to clean, but do it yourself instead. Not because 100 baht more will break your budget, but because other price increases all together makes you cut back.

The time you spent on cleaning can't be spent on working, so you take money out of the economy or if you didn't work, you can't spend while you're cleaning. Plus the cleaning lady won't get any money. The net result is a negative on the economy.

Now with a minimum wage, some people are not going to be worth that minimum wage. It is that simple. If you can't earn back what you pay someone in wages of course you're not going to hire them.

Eventually the growing number of unemployed will lead to demands for more welfare and jobless payments. And then my friends, is the country on the downwards spiral into populist socialist dictatorship as we have it in Europe.

Unions are little more than mafia enterprises on labor these days. They made sense 100 years ago when security was absent in the workplace, but today, they're useless parasites on productive people.

Absolute rubbish. There is no proof that minimum wages causes unemployment. It will only cause inflation for the rich, who are overpaid anyways.

Yes there is. It is a very basic foundation of economics that everyone agrees upon.

The problem with economics is that people without any studies on the subject feel they are qualified to comment. Sure, give your opinion, yet perhaps you shouldn't be as strong headed.