Girlfriend's Name Or 30 Year Lease

[bobrcb]

I have spent a few hours going through various topics relating to house building in Thailand, and whilst I have gleaned a lot of new information, I am still undecided on the best way to proceed. Two years ago, I bought land in Nakhon Si Thammarat in my girlfriend's name, and recently we have prepared the land so that we can build a two-storey house next year. I will continue to live in England for most of the year and she would visit me in Bangkok when I come to Thailand, so the house is to provide comfort for her and her widowed father. I was aware that I could not own the land and that a foreign husband had virtually no rights over property in his Thai wife's name. I also knew of the forming of a company way of having some control over the property, but as I understand from some of the discussions, there appears to be different rules when a couple are not married. If indeed this is the case, I would appreciate advice on whether it would be in my best interests to arrange a 30 year lease in my name, if this is possible, or simply have everything in my girlfriend's name. If I arranged a lease, would my girlfriend automatically inherit the house after 30 years, or if I died, as it is on her land, or would she have to arrange a new lease? Assuming I am still alive in 30 years, (I would be 86), I would not bother on a new lease in my name, as I feel she would have earned the house, if she stays in contact that long. Despite the age gap, we have a good relationship and I have no doubts that she will continue to see me, as I provide her with a good monthly income enabling her not to have to work, so I am happy to spend this money on her. Whilst I trust her, there is always the possibility of family pressure to sell up and pocket the money, or she may die before me, so for these reasons, having some hold on the property might prove useful. I would welcome the advice of the experts out there.

Bobrcb

[Dragonman]

Hi bobrcb. You seem to have a good attitude when it comes to owning property in Thailand

You may have seen from some of my other posts that I don't like usufructs, superficies and rights of habitation, but in your case they seem ideal! If you established a usufruct on the land you would have the right to enjoy everything on the land for 30 years at least. I presume from your post that on your death you would like your girlfriend to have the house, and this would happen automatically, unlike superficies. The land and house would have very little initial value, as the usufruct would be registered at the Land Office. Hence she, or her family on her early demise, would not be able "to sell up early and pocket the money".

[Simmo]

Despite the age gap, we have a good relationship and I have no doubts that she will continue to see me, as I provide her with a good monthly income enabling her not to have to work, so I am happy to spend this money on her.

Think about what you've just said , does that sound like the basis for a successful long term relationship? Or is it simply a business transaction for you?. What happens when the next farang comes along that can "increase her income" while you're back at home.

Sorry I don't have any advice on your property, just the usual good advice on this board. "Don't spend/invest any money here you can't afford to throw away".

[GuestHouse]

My view is that you should not put any more money into this land/house until you have first addressed the following questions.

Firstly, why are you building an expensive two story house when a simple bungalow would suffice? (You are not living there).

You are not married, there is nothing to prevent your girlfriend, for any number of reasons selling up. This begs the question why are you investing anymore money in this property?

You are not living in the house. My bet is that your girlfriend will move in with her extended family and the house will effectively be lost to their use (regardless of if you have a lease). So again, why are you investing more money in the land/house?

My advice would be this, some of it is a bit late, but nevertheless others who have not yet made investments might yet be reading this post:

There are two principal reasons to buy a house in Thailand:

1. To set your girlfriend/wife/her family up in a comfortable home.

2. To provide yourself with a comfortable home in Thailand.

If your motives are to provide a home for your girlfriend/wife/her family then accept that you will not have control over the house, you will not live in the house (unless you are happy to live with the extended family). The house will be occupied and controlled by the family and hence your investment is tied up - It is lost.

If your motives are to provide a home for yourself in Thailand, first ask are you going to be in Thailand to live in that home? If the answer to that quesiton is no - Then RENT!

From where you are now, I would look at either, building a low cost bungalow. Or selling up and buying a low cost house. (Do the maths to figure out which is cheaper).

If you have any doubts regarding the relationship, and it sounds as if you do, then I would not put one more penny into this venture.

What I certainly would not do, is spend more money on an expensive 2 story house. You are merely lining someone else’s pockets.

As a first step I would (Depending on how much the land is worth) consider selling the land

and buying a pre-built. If the land is worth over say Bht700,000 you should be able to buy a

small town house of the kind most Thais would be delighted to own.

Broach that idea with your girlfriend and see what she thinks. If she accepts the sense of the

idea go ahead and sell/buy a smaller place. If she objects ask yourself ‘Why is she being so

free with your money?”

Edited April 4, 2006 by GuestHouse

[bobrcb]

Thank you for your prompt and varied replies.

Dragonman - I will read up about usufruct, which appears to solve any problem of inheritance.

Simmo - I am not a naive tourist, having visited Thailand more than 70 times since 1988. Indeed, it is me who should be grateful that my girlfriend wants to be with me, as she is fully aware I am married. Before making any long-term commitment, I gave her many opportunities to end our relationship, because I felt that she was wasting her life with me, but for whatever reason, she is happy to see me for 6-7 weeks per year, as my mia noi. In return, I want to make her life comfortable. After she returned to Nakhon Si Thammarat to look after her sick father, I found on a visit to the family, that she had been sleeping on the floor of a very small wooden building on stilts, which had no windows, door or toilet. She had never mentioned this. Once I found out, I arranged for her to rent a house pending her own house being built. Finally, I firmly believe that my girlfriend is different from the norm. Yes she likes beautiful things, but she comes from Nakhon Si Thammarat, where there are not too many distractions, and hardly a farang in sight. I have no objection to her visiting the local discos and karaoke bars, but she always takes her brother, who makes sure none of the local men get too close.

Guesthouse - I have noted your suggestion. Personally, having visited Nakhon Si Thammarat on two occasions, I have no desire to live there on a permanent basis. It rains for most of the year and there is very little entertainment. If I ever do move to Thailand, I would look at somewhere like Hua Hin. I will discuss your suggestion with her next visit, before we commit ourselves to building on her land. Maybe we could keep the land and buy elsewhere.

Bobrcb