What's different about Chiang Mai?

[aTomsLife]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

So what's different about Chiang Mai? Is it its police force, its lower cost of living, its Lanna heritage? Why do places like Phuket and Pattaya attract so many Thais looking to exploit tourists, while visitors to Chiang Mai tend to come and go without issue?

[Chiangmai Foxy]

Phuket and Pattaya has Beaches,thus attracting more drunken undesirables shall we say.

[aTomsLife]

Plenty of drunken backpackers around CM. Though there certainly is less of a P4P scene. The thing is, many of the crimes in Phuket involve vacationing families. Even some of the hotel operators can be shady characters.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

People in Phuket and Pattaya are complete amateurs in covering it up.

[Thailand]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

People in Phuket and Pattaya are complete amateurs in covering it up.

What in particular is being covered up here?

[WinnieTheKhwai]

But seriously, two things:

* Phuket and Pattaya have local Farang oriented newspapers / publications that do nothing but report crime and freak accidents. This makes it seem like it happens there more than in places without reporters for English publications that are permanently stationed at police stations to write down all the crap that happens. Note that I'm not saying that Pattaya and Phuket are on the same level of crap as everywhere else, just that a moderately elevated crap-level is FAR more reported on. And for some reason, crap that involves foreigners resonates highly with other foreigners; Thai newspapers show horrific stuff all day long, but it generates a big yawn (if anything) among expats. But as soon as it involves a foreigner, that's 20+ pages in the Thaivisa news section. Many more foreigners live in / visit Phuket and Pattaya, so they're more likely to be involved, meaning you (we) notice it more. You'll notice it on this forum too. "Thai man found dead in moat": <yawn>. Versus "Farang girl found dead in moat": "OMG CONSPIRACY!, UNSAFETY!, *@#*($ THAIS!", ITS A COVER UP!, POLICE BEING IDIOTS, THEY CARE ABOUT DOGS MORE THAN FARANGS!, RAAAAAAAAAA!!" (and 20 more pages of that; same one-paragraph news story.) Now guess which one you remember.

* Phuket and Pattaya are places with a relatively small local population, people who's families are from the area, with all the social structures and social control that comes along with it. There are relatively a lot of migrants, fortune seekers, hustlers, poor people, illegal immigrants, Farangs of questionable stature, tourists in general and other riff-raff, who are there by themselves or with peers, without any family or established social structures keeping them in check. And as a tourist destination they attract a more party-oriented crowd, with many who are almost actively trying to get into trouble.

Both developments (press and migrants), are occurring in Chiang Mai too, more and more. However the original native population is much larger than for Pattaya, Phuket (and Samui, etc.), so overall it's probably still a somewhat better society than the places you mention. However, there is also no doubt that it's not a quiet village anymore.

Edited July 31, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[WinnieTheKhwai]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

People in Phuket and Pattaya are complete amateurs in covering it up.

What in particular is being covered up here?

Sense of humor.

[Thailand]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

People in Phuket and Pattaya are complete amateurs in covering it up.

What in particular is being covered up here?

Sense of humor.

[masuk]

Agreed, Chiang Mai seems a pleasant place to live. There hasn't been a shooting in the main street in a week or so.

BTW: Has anyone heard how the victim is getting on? (from the Nimmanheiman incident)

Best wishes to him.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Agreed, Chiang Mai seems a pleasant place to live. There hasn't been a shooting in the main street in a week or so.

And you only took note of that one because it involved a foreigner.

[aTomsLife]

Agreed, Chiang Mai seems a pleasant place to live. There hasn't been a shooting in the main street in a week or so.

I don't just mean the truly egregious crimes like this:http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/657539-american-man-killed-in-krabi-son-severely-injured/.

I'm saying that even the tuktuk culture in CM is tame and relatively civilized, at least in my experience. (e.g., about 100 baht from night bazaar to Nimmanhemin late at night). It seems only the guys parked in front of Zoe try to take the piss.

[heybruce]

But seriously, two things:

* Phuket and Pattaya have local Farang oriented newspapers / publications that do nothing but report crime and freak accidents. This makes it seem like it happens there more than in places without reporters for English publications that are permanently stationed at police stations to write down all the crap that happens. Note that I'm not saying that Pattaya and Phuket are on the same level of crap as everywhere else, just that a moderately elevated crap-level is FAR more reported on. And for some reason, crap that involves foreigners resonates highly with other foreigners; Thai newspapers show horrific stuff all day long, but it generates a big yawn (if anything) among expats. But as soon as it involves a foreigner, that's 20+ pages in the Thaivisa news section. Many more foreigners live in / visit Phuket and Pattaya, so they're more likely to be involved, meaning you (we) notice it more. You'll notice it on this forum too. "Thai man found dead in moat": <yawn>. Versus "Farang girl found dead in moat": "OMG CONSPIRACY!, UNSAFETY!, *@#*($ THAIS!", ITS A COVER UP!, POLICE BEING IDIOTS, THEY CARE ABOUT DOGS MORE THAN FARANGS!, RAAAAAAAAAA!!" (and 20 more pages of that; same one-paragraph news story.) Now guess which one you remember.

* Phuket and Pattaya are places with a relatively small local population, people who's families are from the area, with all the social structures and social control that comes along with it. There are relatively a lot of migrants, fortune seekers, hustlers, poor people, illegal immigrants, Farangs of questionable stature, tourists in general and other riff-raff, who are there by themselves or with peers, without any family or established social structures keeping them in check. And as a tourist destination they attract a more party-oriented crowd, with many who are almost actively trying to get into trouble.

Both developments (press and migrants), are occurring in Chiang Mai too, more and more. However the original native population is much larger than for Pattaya, Phuket (and Samui, etc.), so overall it's probably still a somewhat better society than the places you mention. However, there is also no doubt that it's not a quiet village anymore.

All true, but I would add to this that, while there is drinking and sex for hire in Chiang Mai, it pales in comparison to the popular beach resorts. Also people going to the beach resorts expect to pay more, so they travel with fatter wallets. The places with the most drunk tourists with fat wallets naturally attract more criminals.

[Chicog]

Phuket and Pattaya are victims of their own success. They've both attracted gazillions of tourists who can't haggle and pay meekly for whatever, and that in turn has attracted the worst scum Thailand has to offer and spawned organised crime syndicates that reach the very top.

That in turn has empowered them to be completely brazen with their rip-offs and scams, because even if they are publicised globally (e.g. JJ, the pond scum that organises Phuket jetski scams) the authorities don't do a damn thing about it.

Whilst there is a bit of that around Chiang Mai, it is nowhere near on the same scale; you see nepotism and cronyism left right and centre, but on the whole it is far more civilised than the aforementioned capitals of sleaze and scum.

[Beetlejuice]

Because unlike Phuket and Pattaya that are geared up for tourists, Chiang Mai is seriously dead.

In Phuket and Pattaya that have vibrant adult entertainments, nightlife, bars and many establishments that attract Western tourists, there are large numbers of tourists ripe for exploration and being ripped off, but in Chiang Mai, although the official figures will try to tell you otherwise, there is a small amount of Western tourists, getting less year by year.

So to answer the OP`s question: there are less problems because there are a lot less western tourists and expats in Chiang Mai and not many venues for them to hang around at.

But, my son is a police officer in Chiang Mai, I mention this for the OP`s benefit, and I get to hear of a whole bunch of crap that happens here which most normally don`t hear about via official channels and the media. Chiang Mai is not as crime free as many may believe, although for reasons mentioned above, it is still a safer haven for farangs than in Bangkok and anywhere southwards of the country.

[hellodolly]

In places like Phuket and Pattaya, every day there are reports of tourists being ripped off, assaulted and sometimes much worse -- even murdered. Chiang Mai has no shortage of tourists, but one doesn't hear many if any horror stories like those coming out of the aforementioned places.

People in Phuket and Pattaya are complete amateurs in covering it up.

What in particular is being covered up here?

Sense of humor.

I thought you were talking about the jet ski scams.

By the way great article about the beaches and quantity of tourists.

Also the lack of English speaking news papers tends to make Chiang Mai look good. Of the two I am aware of there dosen't seem to be that much happening here.

[hellodolly]

Because unlike Phuket and Pattaya that are geared up for tourists, Chiang Mai is seriously dead.

In Phuket and Pattaya that have vibrant adult entertainments, nightlife, bars and many establishments that attract Western tourists, there are large numbers of tourists ripe for exploration and being ripped off, but in Chiang Mai, although the official figures will try to tell you otherwise, there is a small amount of Western tourists, getting less year by year.

So to answer the OP`s question: there are less problems because there are a lot less western tourists and expats in Chiang Mai and not many venues for them to hang around at.

But, my son is a police officer in Chiang Mai, I mention this for the OP`s benefit, and I get to hear of a whole bunch of crap that happens here which most normally don`t hear about via official channels and the media. Chiang Mai is not as crime free as many may believe, although for reasons mentioned above, it is still a safer haven for farangs than in Bangkok and anywhere southwards of the country.

Beg to differ I think Chiang Mai has much more to offer tourists than Pattaya and Phuket. Of course the beaches do enhance those two locations.

Other than that all they have to offer is night life. A great draw for the sex pat's. I wouldn't exactly call a sex pat a tourist.

[Chicog]

In Phuket and Pattaya that have vibrant adult entertainments, nightlife, bars and many establishments that attract Western tourists, there are large numbers of tourists ripe for exploration and being ripped off

Yes, and they are normally ignorant, disrespectful, low-rent, beer-swilling, vest-wearing, obese slobs whose idea of exploring culture is smearing yoghurt over some "adult entertainer"s body and telling their mates in the pub what they did after that.

And it keeps that type of person out of Chiang Mai, which is two thumbs up from me.

[Torrens54]

My wife says it is all to do with the LANNA Culture and who am I to dispute that? She may string me up by my goolies, cut my beating heart from my body and eat it if I do.

[Beetlejuice]

In Phuket and Pattaya that have vibrant adult entertainments, nightlife, bars and many establishments that attract Western tourists, there are large numbers of tourists ripe for exploration and being ripped off

Yes, and they are normally ignorant, disrespectful, low-rent, beer-swilling, vest-wearing, obese slobs whose idea of exploring culture is smearing yoghurt over some "adult entertainer"s body and telling their mates in the pub what they did after that.

And it keeps that type of person out of Chiang Mai, which is two thumbs up from me.

More or less on the same lines as what I was saying.

And this is why there are lower crime rates against farangs in Chiang Mai, although these days I do miss the opportunities of smearing yoghurt over some "adult entertainer"s body and being able to boast about it afterwards. Banana flavour always used to be a favourite with little Ying at the Paradise bar.

[thrilled]

In my opinion Chiang Mai,Pattaya,or Phuket are anything to brag about. Ya can find trouble anywhere ya go.

[bristolgeoff]

i think it may be a long way to find a beach in chiang mai,that the tourist don,t come to visit or stay

[NCC1701A]

The people are different. Much more intelligent. It was obvious just looking around the plane from BKK to CMX.

[puukao]

CM is much cheaper, and has good energy when walking around. maybe it's infectious to other foreigners that visit. I agree the city can feel empty at 10 p.m., and maybe it's because people are more active in CM (hiking, exploring the mountains, etc...), or maybe people in CM stay for shorter periods of time than Phuket and are therefore nicer via feeling more like a tourist. who knows. Maybe the mix of foreigners is different in CM. more Chinese? I don't know. maybe Buddhist culture is more ingrained in CM. anyhow, if you are young and like to be active, CM is 1000x better than pattaya and Phuket. but I am sure CM has its fair share of crime. a foreigner that goes to pattaya, to me, goes for sex. a foreigner that goes to CM might go to study the language, learn to cook, explore the mountains, and then go for sex.

[Ajaan]

Plenty of drunken backpackers around CM. Though there certainly is less of a P4P scene. The thing is, many of the crimes in Phuket involve vacationing families. Even some of the hotel operators can be shady characters.

While I'm no fan of the backpacker crowd, they generally do not go out looking for trouble like the shaved-head, tattooed, douchebag farang hordes that flock to Pattaya, Phuket, etc., looking for trouble...no wonder the Thais, many of whom live by the same "laws" of thuggery, off them in great numbers.

[jpshanik]

I think they are good at hiding it. A while back I shared a room in Bumrungrad with a guy that was attacked in CM. walking back 2 blocks to his hotel, a truck with 5 guys stopped him, beat the hell out of him and shattered his ankle bone. Just for his money and watch. Didn't ask him for the money. Just beat the hell out of him. Had to fly down to Bkk with a shattered ankle. Those kind of things don't hit the news.

[masuk]

Agreed, Chiang Mai seems a pleasant place to live. There hasn't been a shooting in the main street in a week or so.

And you only took note of that one because it involved a foreigner.

it seemed to be the only report in the Thai Visa about a shooting.

[technologybytes]

Everything is a bit more laid back in Chiang Mai, including the criminals.

[Mr Brown]

Chiang Mai is a great place. But wait until the Russian Mob take a more vested interest in it. Then the situation will deteriorate dramatically.

[bigbamboo]

Chiang Mai attracts a different kind of visitor than Sodom and Gomorrah down south, both tourists and ex pats. The tourists come to see the 'real' Thailand and the ex pats tend to spend their time with their families not in bars.

The Thais are different too, mainly locals who are happy with the quieter pace of life up here.

[abrahamzvi]

I agree with practically all the comments. Most of them can be summarised in one sentence: It's the type of tourists that flock to Pattaya and Phuket ( and may I add that I do know of one or two places that one can enjoy a safe and very pleasant holiday with ones family in Phuket), who most certainly do not look for cultural attractions , but for other ones. The Chiang Mai tourists are a different breed, they may be back packers, but they mostly look for what Chiang Mai has to offer, beautiful gardens, most interesting Lana culture, cleaner streets and a astoundingly beautiful surroundings.